Halo |OT13|

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Mar 2, 2011
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Halo 4 has had an overwhelmingly negative reaction from the hardcore community due to its adoption of CoD systems in the multiplayer such as loadouts, perks, instant respawn, and personal ordnance (aka point streak rewards) because they add random and unpredictable elements to the sandbox and cause major balance issues.

There are tons of other issues and bugs and glitches as well. An example of this is that ingame file browser, which allows us to view screenshots, films, custom maps and gametypes, has not worked since launch and there is no ETA on when it will become more than an error message. Bungie had hosted an online version of this on their website during their Halo 3 and Reach days, and you could even queue up files to download automatically the next time you started the game. This service is now gone as well.

Halo 4 is also the first Halo game with matchmaking that lacks any kind of ranking that is determined by skill - there's no arena or league playlist or anything like that, just keep playing and getting XP.

There was also recently an issue where Microsoft accidentally made the first map pack free for everyone who played in the first two weeks the game was out, and they had to revoke it via a title update. Title updates reset the system that uses game history to determine host, so laggy matches galore for many of us.

The campaign has become more focused on linear firefights and corridors rather than open areas and exploration, "because we wanted to do what Call of Duty does," according to a developer interview. The cutscenes have really bad audio compression.

Spartan Ops replaced Firefight, which was Halo's take on a horde mode. Firefight was highly customizable, Spartan Ops sacrifices that to tell a linear story. We were promised brand new environments, of which we got a few, but the majority of chapters take place in areas recycled from campaign and multiplayer, most of which are repeated several times. The mission design is almost always to kill enemies, press a button, and repeat until it ends. Sarah Palmer, your Spartan commander and narrator so to speak, is the most grating and one-dimensional character Halo has offered, though perhaps that's intentional.

The list goes on. The monthly challenge, a sort of completable goal that gives lots of XP when finished, has been the same every month since launch. Campaign theater and scoring have been removed. Spartan Ops has no theater either. Killcams don't work in any sort of accurate way. Many of the options in custom games are either missing or don't work. Several objective gametypes that were franchise staples, such as 1 Flag CTF and Assault, no longer exist. Microsoft has some kind of deal with Virgin Gaming, so there is no MLG playlist with competitive settings, nor are there any MLG tournaments in the near future.

Welcome to Halo 4, egghead.
 
Dec 26, 2006
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Isolation and Uncaged are better 4v4 maps than Adrift and Abandon.
Abandon is brutal, no arguement.

Adrift I think is really effected by AA's - moreso than many others. The layout in Isolation, and many others in Halo 3 and Reach, are just awful and that's why they're bad. Overall I do like Adrift's layout, but things in Boltshot, Camo, and PV just severely impact that map an awful lot. Curious how it'd play under MLG rules or something without AA's/personal loadouts. Solace is one that is not designed very well -- what happened to getting symmetrical maps in a game that uses 2-flag and Oddball as its premier objective gamemodes?

I suppose we should just be used to getting mediocre to bad maps, especially with these nuisances impacting the layout. Haven I've had terrible spawn problems with lately. Though mostly, it's probably safe to blame insta-spawns, although in general it hasn't been very good.
 
Soo... How soon is this TU? I know it's early 2013 but I'm kinda sick of Boltshot by far...
Guaranteed to be at least by the time the February DLC rolls around, as they'll need to TU the game anyway to add the DLC achievements. I'm going to guess that any sandbox change is just going to be included in that patch, because it makes more sense to put the work into a single TU than rushing to put one out then another one only weeks later.
 
Guaranteed to be at least by the time the February DLC rolls around, as they'll need to TU the game anyway to add the DLC achievements. I'm going to guess that any sandbox change is just going to be included in that patch, because it makes more sense to put the work into a single TU than rushing to put one out then another one only weeks later.
That make sense. I guess we will have to wait a little longer ..
 
Nov 8, 2011
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Have they even acknowledged or commented on most of the issues? I'm not really following the entire thing, but from what I've seen Frankie post that "the game has issues" in here without really going into details.
 

Moa

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Guaranteed to be at least by the time the February DLC rolls around, as they'll need to TU the game anyway to add the DLC achievements. I'm going to guess that any sandbox change is just going to be included in that patch, because it makes more sense to put the work into a single TU than rushing to put one out then another one only weeks later.
Games don't need to TUs for achievements to be added any more, Reach's Noble & Defiant DLC are a quick example.
 

Tashi

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Jun 16, 2008
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Have they even acknowledged or commented on most of the issues? I'm not really following the entire thing, but from what I've seen Frankie post that "the game has issues" in here without really going into details.
Pretty sure they said they would rather just get the patch out and then discuss the changes rather than announce it ahead of time. Just in case something goes wrong I believe. It sucks not knowing what's coming down the line but I still have faith.
 
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Pretty sure they said they would rather just get the patch out and then discuss the changes rather than announce it ahead of time. Just in case something goes wrong I believe. It sucks not knowing what's coming down the line but I still have faith.
I remember they hold off putting the list of changes in the TU online so people couldn't exploit anything until the patch hit. Seems really odd, if you just keep the list fairly vague when it comes to exploits you can easily avoid this issue. Keeping silent only makes it seem like they're not listening which leads to frustration.
 

Tashi

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I remember they hold off putting the list of changes in the TU online so people couldn't exploit anything until the patch hit. Seems really odd, if you just keep the list fairly vague when it comes to exploits you can easily avoid this issue. Keeping silent only makes it seem like they're not listening which leads to frustration.
Very true. They definitely could be vague, drop some hints and give some hope. Good point.
 
Games don't need to TUs for achievements to be added any more, Reach's Noble & Defiant DLC are a quick example.
Reach was set up to do that. Certain Affinity even said Defiant was worked on before Reach even shipped. So they knew the DLC was coming. Bungie also knew they were working on "DLC-Big", "DLC-Small", and "DLC-Invasion".

Otherwise, unless the achievements are already programmed in, you have to patch to get new achievements due to the way the achievement system works. There's hooks and shit you have to add.

tl;dr Reach doing that was a one-off, and they ended up TUing more achievements in for Anniversary anyway. No point in rigging up a Reach-style system if you're planning on aggressively TUing the game in the first place.
 

Moa

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Reach was set up to do that. Certain Affinity even said Defiant was worked on before Reach even shipped. So they knew the DLC was coming. Bungie also knew they were working on "DLC-Big", "DLC-Small", and "DLC-Invasion".

Otherwise, unless the achievements are already programmed in, you have to patch to get new achievements due to the way the achievement system works. There's hooks and shit you have to add.

tl;dr Reach doing that was a one-off, and they ended up TUing more achievements in for Anniversary anyway. No point in rigging up a Reach-style system if you're planning on aggressively TUing the game in the first place.
Suppose that makes sense, thanks.
 
Suppose that makes sense, thanks.
You can also tell the difference in the style of achievements. Bungie set it up so the map packs acted as software keys for the achievements and let them unlock on any map (unless they were something like the Breakpoint one).

343's Anniversary achievements were only obtainable on the specific maps from the map pack, and added achievements for Defiant that were only available to unlock if you owned Anniversary BUT were still only unlockable on Defiant maps.. so it was a combination "you have to be on the map" + "you have to have a different map pack as a software key". Absurd.
 
You can also tell the difference in the style of achievements. Bungie set it up so the map packs acted as software keys for the achievements and let them unlock on any map (unless they were something like the Breakpoint one).

343's Anniversary achievements were only obtainable on the specific maps from the map pack, and added achievements for Defiant that were only available to unlock if you owned Anniversary BUT were still only unlockable on Defiant maps.. so it was a combination "you have to be on the map" + "you have to have a different map pack as a software key". Absurd.
Do you know how achievement triggers are implemented? Are they patched into the game code, or do they run on some kind of watcher thread which queries the engine every so often?
 

op_ivy

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Goddamn people weren't kidding about dexterity. Being able to reload a lot faster has saved my life a ton today.
huh, i ditched it for ammo a long time ago. its pretty damn rare i run out of ammo in my clip during a gun fight. i suppose now though, it would be pretty unusual to run out of DMR ammo mid match what with most people using it - but i can i give up my personal ordnance abundance of ammo with that perk for faster reloads...?
 
huh, i ditched it for ammo a long time ago. its pretty damn rare i run out of ammo in my clip during a gun fight. i suppose now though, it would be pretty unusual to run out of DMR ammo mid match what with most people using it - but i can i give up my personal ordnance abundance of ammo with that perk for faster reloads...?
I was an ammo user too but as mentioned you never run out of DMR ammo in the game. So there is always plenty of that around. Reloading though man when you are taking on 2 plus guys and you have to reload it comes in handy without a doubt. I actually come out of a lot of 2 on 1's now thanks to it.
 

op_ivy

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I was an ammo user too but as mentioned you never run out of DMR ammo in the game. So there is always plenty of that around. Reloading though man when you are taking on 2 plus guys and you have to reload it comes in handy without a doubt. I actually come out of a lot of 2 on 1's now thanks to it.
i'm probably in the minority, but i love the perks in halo 4. there are quite a few that are VERY nice to have and 2 months latter i'm still experimenting with whats best and switching to various loadouts mid-match to better optimize them. i think this is fun, sue me.
 

Tashi

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i'm probably in the minority, but i love the perks in halo 4. there are quite a few that are VERY nice to have and 2 months latter i'm still experimenting with whats best and switching to various loadouts mid-match to better optimize them. i think this is fun, sue me.
And you probably haven't unlocked all of the specializations yet either.

I'm finally going to unlock stability today. Will probably do a video on the differences between old style Halo, new style and then new style with stability. I'll just make observations on it rather than input my own opinion.
 

op_ivy

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And you probably haven't unlocked all of the specializations yet either.

I'm finally going to unlock stability today. Will probably do a video on the differences between old style Halo, new style and then new style with stability. I'll just make observations on it rather than input my own opinion.
true, though most of the additional ones i have no expectation of using. i'm working towards finally getting stability myself after putting it off. i think it will be a part of my btb loadout (also used on complex, strange enough...).

ones i cycle through; ammo, firepower, mobility, dexterity, stealth, and requisition. oh, and pioneer with my weapon grind loadout when i'm in a match against shitty players. yeah, you just got rocked by my carbine bitches.
 
As a fan these past two months of Halo have been really weird, I can only imagine what people at 343 each think.
I have no doubt that it has to suck for them. Do I believe they came in and said hey let's piss off half the community? Of course not. I believe them when they all say they came to 343 because they love Halo. I know that if I was in their position I'd be very upset and angry right now if I had put my heart and soul into a game and it had divided the community like this. I'd probably lash out the way Josh Holmes has at times to be honest.

Now I'm sure there is a lot we aren't seeing that went on behind the scenes. I have no doubt that Microsoft had their hands in the middle of everything. That's the price 343 will pay though for being a Microsoft studio through and through. They will always be at the whim of some executive who thinks he knows better then they do. So at the end of the day I do feel sorry for everyone at 343. I really do.
 
Apr 22, 2010
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Perks shouldn't have affected Power Weapons. It says something that my initial reaction to the perks was "343 isn't dumb enough to make them affect power weapons..."


Dexterity, Ammo, Stability on the sniper...
Agreed. I was truly shocked when I found out Ammo affected ordnance weapons and not just starting weapons, cause I just assumed it was obvious to not have them affect ordnance weapons.

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Monthly challenge the same third month in a row, and once again one of the War Games weeklies is a daily challenge...How can basic stuff like this still be going on?
 
Nov 8, 2011
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Tight maps are great for competitive play, Adrift CTF is perhaps the best competitive experience I've got from this game, I'd play it all the time but....

Naturally I assume you do not like Haven, Guardian or The Pit?
1) Incredibly tight maps like Adrift don't make for great competitive play.

2) Haven nor Guardian nor The Pit is even close to being as narrow as Adrift.
 
Apr 15, 2007
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The Pit is not a narrow map, it's two great expanses separated by a wall. Comparing it to Adrift is nonsense. Adrift's claustrophobia inducing, almost.

Guardian's also a map that's characterised by the sight lines stretching across the map because of the large, open centre arena. Whilst there are tight spaces on Guardian, you're nearly always able to affect a duel taking place on the opposite side of the map, through a jump, or a grenade, or most of the time a long sight line.
 
As far as hallway maps go, Adrift is relatively well done if used in the right gametypes. I mean, it's no Orbital. But it's still a hallway map and suffers from the same fundamental problems that those designs tend to. Depending on how people play it, it also facilitates camping worse than almost any map I've ever seen (thankfully, that hasn't become too common in objectives in my experience).

That I think it is one of the better small-scale CTF maps in the shipping game is more an indictment of the game's map quality for objective play than anything. My kingdom for something approaching even Neutral Bomb Zealot.

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Haven I think can stand with the good maps in any other Halo game, and I suspect Meltdown could too if it was utilized properly (here's some cool bases with a teleporter and some neat flag routes...uh, go play Slayer I guess?). Longbow is in the same boat, though I'm a little less confident in it due to the extreme importance of B base. The rest are kind of middling.
 
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