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Sales-Age HW sales in Spain: PS5 166K; XBS 46K

mckmas8808

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Even though XSS is doing 512p, I would pick it over the switch, even last gen Xbone over the Switch. The Switch market is very different and games there barely compete with indie games on PS4/5. It's like saying that Tencent is competing with Sony, which its full focus is cellphones.

That's not fair. Nintendo is making a lot of BIG games on the Switch that are real "games"! Lets not do that to Nintendo. Don't treat them like they make 3 year old kiddie games.
 

mejin

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Good to see at least one successful next gen hardware.

I mean look at the softwares sales.
 
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Arioco

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Could Sony have sold more if they had the supply?

At some point this supply situation will improve itself and we will see what the real ratios are. Kind of hard to say which one is more popular without them.


Yes, definitely SONY could've sold way more. It's been almost impossible to get a PS5 since launch and it's still very difficult. Many people are still waiting for supply. But in fact getting a Series X hasn't been easy either, so I'm not sure how much of a difference it would've made.
 
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Nintendo is winning by their term, doesn't mean others are losing. Xbox is directly competing with Sony, Steam, Epic Games, but traditional home console has been Sony's turf since 1994, undisputed.
Undisputed how? In sales numbers? People forget that 50 million of PS2's LTD were sold after the PS3 came out, so in terms of LTD trajectory it was somewhat similar to PS1, though it did have a stronger start for obvious reasons.

Marketshare and revenue? Well, I mean the 360 happened. PS3 was in more global markets and in many of those had much higher marketshare but collectively it barely ever maintained total marketshare over 360 (in terms of consoles sold, and on that note it never had marketshare advantage over the Wii), and in the largest growing market that mattered most at the time (United States), it was getting absolutely beaten by both Microsoft and Nintendo. Even the final LTD #s for PS3 are only a few million more than 360's, and that's with Microsoft cutting off 360 production earlier than Sony did PS3, having a direct correlation on said numbers.

Software library size? Well that is one area we can agree they have been mostly undisputed in, though they didn't have an out-and-out larger library from the jump of 1994. Especially with Japan region included PS1 and Saturn had very similarly sized libraries, it wasn't until around 1997 or so where the PS1's library of games readily outstripped Saturn's in terms of sheer number of titles.

In terms of 1P quality? Yeah this is an area Sony definitely were not leading from the jump starting 1994. Their launch Japanese PS1 1P games were rather abysmal actually, compared to Sega who had universally well-received games like Daytona, VF and Panzer Dragoon more or less out of the gate. Even with 1995 and into 1996 Sony's 1P content, while it got better, wasn't necessarily in the same league as Sega's with the Saturn or at the same frequency, and review scores from magazines of the period (I've done a lot of reading of these, particularly Next Generation Magazine) confirm this. They did have standouts at this point like Crash, Jumping Flash and Twisted Metal (and arguably Warhawk), but also more average fare like Jet Moto and Motor Toon Grand Prix, and actual bad games like Hermie Hammerhead. A lot of Sega's Saturn output from the '94-'96 period either reviewed better at the time, or hold up better today.

In fact it's maybe a bit controversial but I think Sony's 1P (purely 1P, as in studios they owned outright under their publishing arm) in PS1 gen wasn't clearly better than Sega or Nintendo's and in several instances both of them had better games overall. Nothing from Sony's 1P that gen was as industry-defining as Mario 64 or OoT, led the industry in its respective genre with new standards on home console like VF2 or was as artistically poignant as say Panzer Dragoon Saga...outside of Gran Turismo and Parappa (Parappa/UmJammer are certainly artistic but not poignant in a sophisticated sense TBH).

Sony wouldn't start doing that with some regular consistency until PS2.
 
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Eanox

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I don't even know what gen the Switch competes with.

🤷‍♂️

You can say that it's a current gen console but then it's missing out on a ton of games due to lack of power. It's why I find it strange to compare it to the XSX and PS5.

I agree that it's an incredibly successful console for Nintendo. And in pure numbers it's already sold the XSX and the PS5 by a ton. But is it correct to compare it to those two systems?
Nintendo fans are always nitpicking when it comes to this conversation.
Switch is always in PS5 and Xboxs generation.
WiiU is PS4 ands Xbone gen.
If Switch will not outsell PS4, this will change into PS5 vs Switch.

OT. Good for both consoles. Spain is still a Sony land even with it being sold out all the time.
 
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Seriously though, it will be interesting to see how sales play out as consoles become more available. I think Microsoft may have made a mistake investing so much in the Series S.
 

Bo_Hazem

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Undisputed how? In sales numbers? People forget that 50 million of PS2's LTD were sold after the PS3 came out, so in terms of LTD trajectory it was somewhat similar to PS1, though it did have a stronger start for obvious reasons.

Marketshare and revenue? Well, I mean the 360 happened. PS3 was in more global markets and in many of those had much higher marketshare but collectively it barely ever maintained total marketshare over 360 (in terms of consoles sold, and on that note it never had marketshare advantage over the Wii), and in the largest growing market that mattered most at the time (United States), it was getting absolutely beaten by both Microsoft and Nintendo. Even the final LTD #s for PS3 are only a few million more than 360's, and that's with Microsoft cutting off 360 production earlier than Sony did PS3, having a direct correlation on said numbers.

Software library size? Well that is one area we can agree they have been mostly undisputed in, though they didn't have an out-and-out larger library from the jump of 1994. Especially with Japan region included PS1 and Saturn had very similarly sized libraries, it wasn't until around 1997 or so where the PS1's library of games readily outstripped Saturn's in terms of sheer number of titles.

In terms of 1P quality? Yeah this is an area Sony definitely were not leading from the jump starting 1994. Their launch Japanese PS1 1P games were rather abysmal actually, compared to Sega who had universally well-received games like Daytona, VF and Panzer Dragoon more or less out of the gate. Even with 1995 and into 1996 Sony's 1P content, while it got better, wasn't necessarily in the same league as Sega's with the Saturn or at the same frequency, and review scores from magazines of the period (I've done a lot of reading of these, particularly Next Generation Magazine) confirm this. They did have standouts at this point like Crash, Jumping Flash and Twisted Metal (and arguably Warhawk), but also more average fare like Jet Moto and Motor Toon Grand Prix, and actual bad games like Hermie Hammerhead. A lot of Sega's Saturn output from the '94-'96 period either reviewed better at the time, or hold up better today.

In fact it's maybe a bit controversial but I think Sony's 1P (purely 1P, as in studios they owned outright under their publishing arm) in PS1 gen wasn't clearly better than Sega or Nintendo's and in several instances both of them had better games overall. Nothing from Sony's 1P that gen was as industry-defining as Mario 64 or OoT, led the industry in its respective genre with new standards on home console like VF2 or was as artistically poignant as say Panzer Dragoon Saga...outside of Gran Turismo and Parappa (Parappa/UmJammer are certainly artistic but not poignant in a sophisticated sense TBH).

Sony wouldn't start doing that with some regular consistency until PS2.

Typing a lot doesn't change solid facts.




Now take out handhelds and focus on traditional home consoles.
 
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Spidey Fan

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The problem with handhelds is power. That's where the issue with Gamepass might come in. We all know that streaming games isn't something that works for most people.
If amd can put graphic cards on mobile it might be possible, considering mobile market is growing rabidly more than consoles. just 10 years ago, it was nokia. and now you have an iPhone 12, Samsung galaxy 10 that is like mini computer. You can use Galaxy 10 as a mini computer. Tried on my s9, and it was nice experience.
 
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Typing a lot doesn't change solid facts.




Now take out handhelds and focus on traditional home consoles.

So you didn't understand any of the stuff I mentioned, because it's beyond your understanding of gaming history? It's okay to admit it Bo ;) ; nothing I said contradicts the chart but part of understanding data is to also know the context behind it and what events shaped it.

You said they were undisputed since 1994; that was factually incorrect. I stated why. Nothing in the chart contradicts what I said, just like nothing what I said contradicts the chart. But you can't boil stuff like this down to a single chart graphic or buzzline, either. It's disrespectful to the history of the medium and the impact all the players had, ,regardless of outcomes. Because they all influenced each other one way or another.
 
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Bo_Hazem

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Why am I getting vibes that Nintendo winning negates Xbox not winning?

I love Nintendo more than Xbox, but would rather buy Xbox Series S, or even Xbox One over it. Switch is just its own market with Wii, PSP, PS Vita. Another chart for reality check. Xbox best console can't beat Sony's worst console. So yes, for home consoles it's undisputed since 1994.

 
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MrA

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Mar 9, 2020
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Xbox series S is still in stock at amazon. Series x is sold out. Extremely likely Series s demand will decrease as the time goes on.
if they hadn't been annoying and gimped the ram, the series s would have been perfect as a 1080p machine for a few years, I know I didn't buy one because I know that missing 6 will start to cause havok eventually, had one in the cart, they wouldn't sell out but decided not to because I know that is going to end up killing its usefulness.
 

MvCSpiderman

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Undisputed how? In sales numbers? People forget that 50 million of PS2's LTD were sold after the PS3 came out, so in terms of LTD trajectory it was somewhat similar to PS1, though it did have a stronger start for obvious reasons.

Marketshare and revenue? Well, I mean the 360 happened. PS3 was in more global markets and in many of those had much higher marketshare but collectively it barely ever maintained total marketshare over 360 (in terms of consoles sold, and on that note it never had marketshare advantage over the Wii), and in the largest growing market that mattered most at the time (United States), it was getting absolutely beaten by both Microsoft and Nintendo. Even the final LTD #s for PS3 are only a few million more than 360's, and that's with Microsoft cutting off 360 production earlier than Sony did PS3, having a direct correlation on said numbers.

Software library size? Well that is one area we can agree they have been mostly undisputed in, though they didn't have an out-and-out larger library from the jump of 1994. Especially with Japan region included PS1 and Saturn had very similarly sized libraries, it wasn't until around 1997 or so where the PS1's library of games readily outstripped Saturn's in terms of sheer number of titles.

In terms of 1P quality? Yeah this is an area Sony definitely were not leading from the jump starting 1994. Their launch Japanese PS1 1P games were rather abysmal actually, compared to Sega who had universally well-received games like Daytona, VF and Panzer Dragoon more or less out of the gate. Even with 1995 and into 1996 Sony's 1P content, while it got better, wasn't necessarily in the same league as Sega's with the Saturn or at the same frequency, and review scores from magazines of the period (I've done a lot of reading of these, particularly Next Generation Magazine) confirm this. They did have standouts at this point like Crash, Jumping Flash and Twisted Metal (and arguably Warhawk), but also more average fare like Jet Moto and Motor Toon Grand Prix, and actual bad games like Hermie Hammerhead. A lot of Sega's Saturn output from the '94-'96 period either reviewed better at the time, or hold up better today.

In fact it's maybe a bit controversial but I think Sony's 1P (purely 1P, as in studios they owned outright under their publishing arm) in PS1 gen wasn't clearly better than Sega or Nintendo's and in several instances both of them had better games overall. Nothing from Sony's 1P that gen was as industry-defining as Mario 64 or OoT, led the industry in its respective genre with new standards on home console like VF2 or was as artistically poignant as say Panzer Dragoon Saga...outside of Gran Turismo and Parappa (Parappa/UmJammer are certainly artistic but not poignant in a sophisticated sense TBH).

Sony wouldn't start doing that with some regular consistency until PS2.
I like how people keep pretending Microsoft announced 360 numbers and continue to use old numbers that were when sony was behind and went quiet.

Also lol at Daytona and VF being well received on Saturn. Both those games were considered terrible rushed ports.

Also Crash wasn't 1p.
 
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MvCSpiderman

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I love Nintendo more than Xbox, but would rather buy Xbox Series S, or even Xbox One over it. Switch is just its own market with Wii, PSP, PS Vita. Another chart for reality check. Xbox best console can't beat Sony's worst console. So yes, for home consoles it's undisputed since 1994.

So we are just making up 360 and Xbox One numbers now? Is this VGchartz? Also where Atari?
 
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JackMcGunns

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France and Spain are Sony land even if there was enough inventory. The UK on the other hand usually favors Xbox. I wonder what the figures there are like :pie_thinking:
 

Zeroing

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The world that’s not US/UK - Sony
The world - Nintendo
US/UK - Microsoft

there
It’s all due to the constant Xbox focus on English speaking countries… and the biggest gaming news websites are American and they will always are biased towards American companies.

I was surprised how Sony managed to gain market share in USA with the PS4. There was always constant media articles praising Xbox one and it’s policies, choices etc.

the rest of the world doesn’t work like that… so can we all agree it’s a cultural thing?
 

Zeroing

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Portugal hates Xbox. It's been widely available since launch, I heard.
I can say it is true! You can order online and get it in 1 to 2 weeks.

Xbox doesn’t care about Portugal só Portuguese don’t care about it….

Out of curiosity i heard some reports of people in Portugal casualy walking into a store and asking if there was a PS5 avaible and they had a dozen bundles avaible for the MSRP (about 600ish euros with controller and game i think).

Guy explained that the store changed policies and was selling bundles only, people who was on waiting list were asked if they wanted or not and most declined the bundle offer, thats why it was store avaible.

Another anedoctal, for a couple weeks you can get a Xbox series X for shippng within 2-3 business day from the same major retailler.
I and my friend went into stores and no they did not, not even bundles. Maybe depends on the city it was.

I even joked some time ago here saying I saw a real PS5 but I couldn’t touch it. It have a text saying you need to order one at the help desk.
 

Tmack

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I love Nintendo more than Xbox, but would rather buy Xbox Series S, or even Xbox One over it. Switch is just its own market with Wii, PSP, PS Vita. Another chart for reality check. Xbox best console can't beat Sony's worst console. So yes, for home consoles it's undisputed since 1994.


PS2 still the undisputed king.... One has to remember that it sold 150mi+ when gamming market was much smaller and generations were shorter.
 
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I like how people keep pretending Microsoft announced 360 numbers and continue to use old numbers that were when sony was behind and went quiet.

???

EDIT: Never mind, I get what you're saying there.

Also lol at Daytona and VF being well received on Saturn. Both those games were considered terrible rushed ports.

Virtua Fighter sold pretty much 1:1 with Saturn in Japan and the fanbase enjoyed it a ton and it got strong reviews from Japanese gaming outlets of the time. VF Remix (which by the way is still VF1) was itself very well-received from Japanese and Western gaming outlets, so that point still stands.

Daytona as a port on Saturn had bad glitches on the graphics but the actual gameplay was pretty faithful to the arcade original, that was something pretty much every review of the time praised: the gameplay accuracy to the arcade version.

Also Crash wasn't 1p.

1P in the sense it was published by Sony and made exclusive to PS1, but it doesn't fit my following description of 1P I stated afterwards, fair enough. Though due to that, you actually helped strengthen my point in the paragraph above the one where I specified what context 1P was being discussed throughout that post.

PS2 still the undisputed king.... One has to remember that it sold 150mi+ when gamming market was much smaller and generations were shorter.

It sold roughly 100+ million (just a little more than 100 million) during its commercial life when it was Sony's marquee gaming console (2000-2006). The additional 50 million came post-PS3 release, and that was at a time when the gaming market was rapidly growing in size.
 
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yurinka

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Is it still 100% sold out? Early on numbers feel more like allottment measures than anything. Though I'm pretty sure PS5 will maintain a lead in Spain no doubt.
I double checked it now and at least on their online stores, since some months ago Series S are always available in all major retailers: Game, Fnac, Carrefour, Media Markt, El Corte Inglés.

PS5 and Series X instead are sold out and new shipped units get sold out super fast, specially PS5 (less than 5-10 minutes). Looking at numbers, PS5 gets more units shipped.

PS5 selling ~3.5x the Xbox Series units is a higher difference must be bigger than the worldwide one, but it's a smaller distance than we usually see here. Many times we see stuff like 7x, 10x, 11x, so Xbox Series seems to be have a better market share in Spain than at least recent Xboxes. Even if it's the 4th European market, Spain is Sonyland, not representative of the rest of the world. And the numbers aren't representative of the Spanish demand, because they would sell a ton more PS5 and Series X if available, so the ~3.5x isn't representative, not even for Spain.
 
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FunkMiller

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I love Nintendo more than Xbox, but would rather buy Xbox Series S, or even Xbox One over it. Switch is just its own market with Wii, PSP, PS Vita. Another chart for reality check. Xbox best console can't beat Sony's worst console. So yes, for home consoles it's undisputed since 1994.


Anyone thinking Sony aren’t utterly dominant, should also take a look at this rather brilliant YouTube video:

 
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Esppiral

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As a Spaniard myself those numbers are really impressive for Xbox this is Sonyland aftear all.
 

Tmack

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Undisputed how? In sales numbers? People forget that 50 million of PS2's LTD were sold after the PS3 came out, so in terms of LTD trajectory it was somewhat similar to PS1, though it did have a stronger start for obvious reasons.

That`s absolutely wrong.

By ps2 era things were MUCH different than now. We didnt had worlwide releases and third world countries lagged behind by a lot.

When ps3 released the ps2 was stil the de-facto current gen in for many years to come in most parts of the globe.
 

MvCSpiderman

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???

EDIT: Never mind, I get what you're saying there.



Virtua Fighter sold pretty much 1:1 with Saturn in Japan and the fanbase enjoyed it a ton and it got strong reviews from Japanese gaming outlets of the time. VF Remix (which by the way is still VF1) was itself very well-received from Japanese and Western gaming outlets, so that point still stands.

Daytona as a port on Saturn had bad glitches on the graphics but the actual gameplay was pretty faithful to the arcade original, that was something pretty much every review of the time praised: the gameplay accuracy to the arcade version.



1P in the sense it was published by Sony and made exclusive to PS1, but it doesn't fit my following description of 1P I stated afterwards, fair enough. Though due to that, you actually helped strengthen my point in the paragraph above the one where I specified what context 1P was being discussed throughout that post.



It sold roughly 100+ million (just a little more than 100 million) during its commercial life when it was Sony's marquee gaming console (2000-2006). The additional 50 million came post-PS3 release, and that was at a time when the gaming market was rapidly growing in size.

If the PS3 was more successful at the start I doubt PS2 would have gotten that 50.

As for VF reviews mentioned the problems, remix was a rapid response so Sega felt the need to address them. Daytona also had mixed reviews and didn't sell as well as they hoped unlike VF.

They both needed more time, but honestly the launch window was not very attractive all around. Neither was PS1's mind, but they had an edge.
 

Yoboman

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Miles Morales is proof that Sony dont need this cross gen nonsense

If the games are good they will hold a high attach rate for a long time to come

You may not get burst out of the gate with 5 million for a few more years but these games will end up being evergreen like Nintendo games while Switch userbase grew
 
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If the PS3 was more successful at the start I doubt PS2 would have gotten that 50.

Agreed.

As for VF reviews mentioned the problems, remix was a rapid response so Sega felt the need to address them. Daytona also had mixed reviews and didn't sell as well as they hoped unlike VF.

VF Remix wasn't a rapid response so much in development, tbh; Pandamonium Reviews (excellent retro Saturn Youtube channel) has a feature on VF Remix and mentions that VF Remix was already being demoed backstage at E3 1995, in private. The game apparently has a build date of May 1995 or something like that, so it was more or less ready to go to press even at the time of that E3.

However, Sega of America probably wanted people to double-dip hence why they still released the original port when Remix was practically ready anyway. As for Daytona, I know a lot of reviews slammed the graphical side of things (and a lot of erroneous quotes spawned from it, like some from an EA executive at the time), but they all at least gave it props for playing faithful to the arcade original.

They both needed more time, but honestly the launch window was not very attractive all around. Neither was PS1's mind, but they had an edge.

Yes, Saturn launch window was obviously rushed. PS1's edge was they didn't rush their American launch so the launce lineup had time to be properly marketed and polished up.

That`s absolutely wrong.

By ps2 era things were MUCH different than now. We didnt had worlwide releases and third world countries lagged behind by a lot.

When ps3 released the ps2 was stil the de-facto current gen in for many years to come in most parts of the globe.
Everything...literally EVERYTHING you just said proves my point :LOL:

"We didn't have worldwide releases" Yep, which meant people in regions the PS3 wasn't available or was too expensive once it did become available, they probably gravitated to the PS2 instead.

"Third world countries lagged behind by a lot" Yep, which means most of those additional 50-something million PS2s sold post-PS3's launch were.in said countries.

"When PS3 released the ps2 was still the de-facto current gen in for many years to come in most parts of the globe." Yep, so guess where those additional 50-something million PS2's post-PS3's launch were sold?
 
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ethomaz

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PS5 is outselling Xbox Series by just ~3.5:1
Last gen Ps4 was outselling Xbox One by ~10:1
Not the same exactly perdido but it was 7:1.



BTW PS5 has more 4 months to reach these 360k numbers from PS4 at same period but it seems a bit hard.

The fact PS5 still have supply issues while PS4 was already being sold to everybody that wants it makes it hard.
 
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prinz_valium

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Not the same exactly perdido but it was 7:1.



BTW PS5 has more 4 months to reach these 360k numbers from PS4 at same period but it seems a bit hard.

The fact PS5 still have supply issues while PS4 was already being sold to everybody that wants it makes it hard.
Yeah. It's 10:1 ltd now. It was lower at the start of the beginning and the gap increased over time
 
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Woopah

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Switch is competing with Android and iOS, and it's losing there.
Saying Switch competes with mobile devices is like saying PlayStation competes with PCs. The comparison doesn't make sense.
Can't imagine someone picking up a switc high llgh if they want to play current gen games. I guess that's the issue that I'm having.
There were a lot of games on PS2 that weren't on GameCube, but those devices still competed.
That`s absolutely wrong.

By ps2 era things were MUCH different than now. We didnt had worlwide releases and third world countries lagged behind by a lot.

When ps3 released the ps2 was stil the de-facto current gen in for many years to come in most parts of the globe.
Nothing you said contradicts there point. PS2's sales came from it long legs rather than crazy crazy high numbers
 
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Arioco

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I see this comment for every country (at least when comparing just PS to Xbox).

Where is XboxLand?


I don't know if there's any Xboxkand anymore, but in the PS360 era the United States and the UK were Xboxland. In the US 360 sold 60% more than PS3 and I'd say things were more equal even in Europe. Too bad Microsoft left that path long ago.
 
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There were a lot of games on PS2 that weren't on GameCube, but those devices still competed.

True but it's hard for me to just stay with a Switch because I would miss out on a ton of games. The same can't be said about the XSX and the PS5.

The Switch is a great companion console though. I just wish Nintendo would start releasing Nintendo Selects again.
 

Woopah

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True but it's hard for me to just stay with a Switch because I would miss out on a ton of games. The same can't be said about the XSX and the PS5.

The Switch is a great companion console though. I just wish Nintendo would start releasing Nintendo Selects again.
I agree that a lot of the big Western AAA games miss Switch, I just don't think that's a valid reason to say they don't compete. Switch, PS4, PS5, Xbox One and Xbox Series are all dedicated video game devices.
 
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I agree that a lot of the big Western AAA games miss Switch, I just don't think that's a valid reason to say they don't compete. Switch, PS4, PS5, Xbox One and Xbox Series are all dedicated video game devices.

Looking at it like that the Switch has a pretty big lead over the other two. But I don't think Sony or Microsoft have to worry about due to the amount of games that won't come to the switch. There's plenty of reasons to use the other two.