I can't stand the micro transactions in dmc5

Jul 31, 2015
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#1
Ruins an otherwise good game. I'm always being brought to the store in order to purchase more orbs it's bs. It's obvious the new retry system was created in order to entice you to purchase orbs. This isn't as big an issue in the easier difficulty but this is sure to be an issue on harder modes.

Also for context I've already beaten the game and I'm playing it on harder difficulties now. I still recommend you get it but I'm not going to put my head in the sand about the micro transaction when it affects game play directly.
 
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Likes: Musky_Cheese
Sep 17, 2005
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#3
I don't care about micro transactions at all in games, but I was asking my wife how come I don't see much brought up about the fact that you can Pay to Win in DMC5 and yet anything EA has with cosmetic MTX gets just destroyed by gamers. It has never been about MTX, it's about what company that does them.
 

Golgo 13

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Jun 14, 2014
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#5
I agree that micro transactions are bullshit, and DMC5 would be a better game without them.

However, I don’t see how they “ruin” this particular game. The things you can purchase are Red Orbs for abilities, right? And yes you can use Red Orbs for continues but isn’t there a bunch of Gold Orbs (which allow you to resurrect with full health) being given out by other players, and just for logging into the game?

Also, aside from that, you can always just continue from a checkpoint, correct? Or do the higher difficulties not allow you to use checkpoints?
 
Jul 31, 2015
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#6
Wait there's micro transactions in this?
Capcom had them turned off for reviewers so it would fly under the rather it seems to have worked.

I don't care about micro transactions at all in games, but I was asking my wife how come I don't see much brought up about the fact that you can Pay to Win in DMC5 and yet anything EA has with cosmetic MTX gets just destroyed by gamers. It has never been about MTX, it's about what company that does them.
If Ea i pulled this i swear there would be uproar. But it's capcom during their renaissance and dmc5 is a well made game. For me micro transaction are non negotiable when they affect gameplay. Orbs are crucial to the gameplay of dmc5
 
Sep 17, 2005
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Damn. I was just going to buy this tonight. I’ll pass for now.
Don't let MXT crap change the fact that it is a stellar game so far it seems. Tons of great reviews so far, this is just a good talking point about peoples outrage to things that in the end are optional. Don't miss out on a great game because of something so petty and small
 
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#12
The OP kind of makes it sound like there’s a gun to your head forcing you to buy orbs. I haven’t given MTX a thought and I have played for 12 hours so far

I don't care about micro transactions at all in games, but I was asking my wife how come I don't see much brought up about the fact that you can Pay to Win in DMC5 and yet anything EA has with cosmetic MTX gets just destroyed by gamers. It has never been about MTX, it's about what company that does them.
One is single player vs EA’s numerous multiplayer shooters?
 
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Likes: BizarroPete
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#14
Just as I expected the ridiculous argument used is that if you don't suck and put in the time this won't be an issue. Hilarious hearing this from people who still haven't even beaten the game on the regular difficulty.

The micro transactions become enticing when you're fighting a hard boss and you spend all your orbs on expensive skills/arms/upgrades and you're forced to decide between giving up and restarting or continuing on for a small fee. People who pay micro transaction can theoretically restart at a boss as many times as they want if they pay the cash.

I don't plan on ever paying for the mxt in this game regardless but I'm baffled that some people defending this crap. Why remove the healing items that have worked perfectly fine in the past if not for this? Why did capcom have these turned off for reviews?
 
Likes: zenspider
Aug 9, 2014
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#16
Literally beat DMC 5 over an hour ago. 20 hours of play time. Didn't need any micro-transactions at all and until seeing this topic, forgot they were even in the game. And no, micro-transactions don't ruin this game. That only applies to online games where it's not fair competitively.

If anyone needs to purchase a micro-transaction for DMC 5, it's not the game that's bad, it's the player.
 
Feb 16, 2018
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#20
What? The game gives you so many red orbs anyways, in fact I reckon it's more generous than any of the previous games.

I don't have an issue with the microtransactions here, it's only for the most laziest of players.
 
Sep 25, 2015
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#21
This is ridiculous. What's to stop you from restarting at the last checkpoint, trying again, and learning the encounters that are giving you trouble as you might have done in any DMC game from 3SE onwards? On-the-spot revives are a privilege, not a right.

We're not in the dark ages of DMC1 where a death means restarting the level from square one anymore. The checkpoints are sensible and work just fine. You're getting caught up in the fact that the UI offers to take you to the store if you try to revive or buy something without having enough red orbs. Wanna know how to solve that? Don't click the button.

People who pay micro transaction can theoretically restart at a boss as many times as they want if they pay the cash.
Literally every boss has a free checkpoint right before it.

Not to mention that the game piles free revives on you like nobody's business. You'd get maybe three in a playthrough if you were lucky in 3 / 4, but this time round I finished my first run with 14 of the damn things and never spent a single red orb on the game over screen.

Damn. I was just going to buy this tonight. I’ll pass for now.
I'll second @Dthomp - don't let the OP's embarrassing hot take ruin the game for you. It's outstanding, and the microtransactions are an unfortunate footnote that can easily be ignored to give yourself a fair death-and-retry experience reminiscent of the more recent titles in the series.
 
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#24
I don't think it shows its head unless you're say ignoring how many orbs a move cost and it prompts you to purchase more from the store? That happened to me once. 100,000 red orbs for $1.99 (they also have blue orbs too). Meh.. not a big deal if you were already use to gaining larger amounts of red orbs by actually playing the game.

DMC4:SE had DLC for skill points and blue orbs. Same conditions here. If you wanted to maximize Nero/Dante/Vergil/Trish/Lady in DMC4:SE you had those options.

How impatient are players in 2019? Listening to some younger kids, they don't have anything nice to say during the loading screen. How long can they wait to get more moves in an action game? Loading screens and high red orb requirements might follow the same logic. People don't want to farm 56,000 red orbs when they just spent 100,000 or whatever on a couple moves. It's impatient and it probably serves for new players and today's players who want the core game without having to grind for a very long time.
 
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Jan 27, 2018
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#25
Damn. I was just going to buy this tonight. I’ll pass for now.
Main reason i'm not buying.
Yes. The painfully SLOW game over screen is very, very obvious in what it tries to do...
The microtransactions are done on a less intrusive level than tomb raider. You really have to look for them.

The game was clearly built around not needing to buy orbs, ever. The devil Hunter difficulty is pretty darn easy for a DMC game. The human difficulty is probably a cakewalk.

There is a weapon for Dante you can use to farm red orbs at rates of 100k/5 minutes in chapter 13.

There is absolutely no reason to have to buy orbs unless you are so impatient. Learn to be good at the game or use chapter 13 to farm, but don't crap on this game for no real reason, it's really a great game it would be a shame for people to miss out on it due to bad information.
 
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The problem is that I don't want to use orbs, I want to restart from checkpoint. But they made the game over sooooo slow just to have a bigger incentive to use the revive options.
 
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#28
I have read that other companies have done that before, turning off microtransactions in review copies, its such a shady and scummy thing to do. A little bit of my inner child dies when i read stuff like that.
Who cares about honesty when immediate profits are on the line?
 
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#29
The microtransactions are done on a less intrusive level than tomb raider. You really have to look for them.

The game was clearly built around not needing to buy orbs, ever. The devil Hunter difficulty is pretty darn easy for a DMC game. The human difficulty is probably a cakewalk.

There is a weapon for Dante you can use to farm red orbs at rates of 100k/5 minutes in chapter 13.

There is absolutely no reason to have to buy orbs unless you are so impatient. Learn to be good at the game or use chapter 13 to farm, but don't crap on this game for no real reason, it's really a great game it would be a shame for people to miss out on it due to bad information.
Partially i'm avoiding on principle, but when the word farm is used I raise an eyebrow.

I've got enough classic action games so Im not in a hurry to reward capcom. Maybe i'll play dmc5 special edition next gen with all dlc and more ;)
 

Fbh

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#30
Finding out about them some months ago definitely lowered my excitement for the game.
Though from what I'm seeing in this thread the whole orbs system doesn't feel more grindy or annoying than in previous games


I don't care about micro transactions at all in games, but I was asking my wife how come I don't see much brought up about the fact that you can Pay to Win in DMC5 and yet anything EA has with cosmetic MTX gets just destroyed by gamers. It has never been about MTX, it's about what company that does them.
I honestly haven't seen a lot of people "destroying" EA for cosmetic microtransactions. The last time where it felt like truly everyone was giving them shit was with Battlefront 2, and it's pretty obvious why people take more issue with Pay2Win microtransactions in multiplayer games than single player ones.

Also, I don't own the game but from what I've read it feels like a well made and complete experience. A lot of recent EA stuff has felt like it has been released in an incomplete or broken state which will obviously hurt the goodwill people have towards them.
 
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#31
Not once in my playthrough did I encounter one. I only died during boss battles and I restarted from the checkpoint which is right before it. By the end i had over 15 gold orbs anyway. If you can't beat a boss without a revive you are doing something wrong.
 
Likes: Bryank75
Feb 2, 2018
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#32
Partially i'm avoiding on principle, but when the word farm is used I raise an eyebrow.

I've got enough classic action games so Im not in a hurry to reward capcom. Maybe i'll play dmc5 special edition next gen with all dlc and more ;)
One thing that must be said about the word 'farm' is that its entirely a player used term and it's used to refer to the best place to find a valuable player resource; the red orbs, that is located by players. Not to mention that you shouldn't need to farm because one of DMC's, as a series', selling point is the replayability that it offers due to each mission being something around 15 - 30 minutes in length and the gameplay being fun and addictive. If you are playing DMC like the devs entailed then even something as archaic as 'farming' for red orbs should be fun.
 
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#33
Partially i'm avoiding on principle, but when the word farm is used I raise an eyebrow.
There are novelty endgame unlockables for each character that cost around 3mil orbs each, which are the only things I can see someone needing to farm for. You get enough orbs in normal gameplay to buy all the moves by the end of your second playthrough if you aren't frittering them all away on revives

Plus the Faust hat's payout scales with upgrades, so it all balances out quickly enough.

I've got enough classic action games so Im not in a hurry to reward capcom. Maybe i'll play dmc5 special edition next gen with all dlc and more ;)
I mean fair enough, you're obviously not obligated to buy it if the presence of any MTs crosses a line for you.

They're probably not going to go away though, as much as I'd like that to happen, so Capcom gets big rewards from me for keeping the genre alive. Can't be letting Platinum have all the fun.
 

ArchaeEnkidu

Vincit qui se vincit
Jan 30, 2018
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#34
Ruins an otherwise good game. I'm always being brought to the store in order to purchase more orbs it's bs. It's obvious the new retry system was created in order to entice you to purchase orbs. This isn't as big an issue in the easier difficulty but this is sure to be an issue on harder modes.

Also for context I've already beaten the game and I'm playing it on harder difficulties now. I still recommend you get it but I'm not going to put my head in the sand about the micro transaction when it affects game play directly.
You only get brought to the store if you try to buy something when you don't have enough red orbs. I have only ever been brought there *once* and I backed out immediately. Mission 13, use Faust to grind red orbs. You can get millions in very little time allowing you to buy all the skills you need. Once you get all the skills, you really have no reason to ever use red orbs again unless you need to buy Gold Orbs - which you probably shouldn't regardless.

I get more orbs at a faster rate in this game than I did in the previous games. The only reason you would ever have to spend money in this game is if you are dumb or outright lazy. There is never a need to spend money as you get orbs so easily.
 
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Sep 9, 2018
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#35
Been watching a playthrough of this, and yeah i didnt rally notice the microtransactions, they didnt get in the way anyway.
Having said that, Microtransactions shouldn't even be in a $60 retail release anyway. The whole point of microtransactions is you download a free to play game, and they make mney from microtransactions. Microtransactions being in a $60 retail game goes against what they are even for, and simply shouldnt be there imo.
 
Likes: blackjon24

DjMystix

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Jun 8, 2009
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#36
I completed the entire game without even noticing the microtransactions (its basically $2 for 100,000 orbs). You get plenty of Golden orbs and I never even used red orbs for revival anyway. I think this is a excellent game, please do not let something incredibly tiny and harmless get in your way to getting this game.
 
Likes: Fliviuart
Jul 31, 2015
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#38
Main reason i'm not buying.
You hate micro transactions that much? I still think it's worth buying i just don't think we should be telling capcom we are ok with micro transaction

Been watching a playthrough of this, and yeah i didnt rally notice the microtransactions, they didnt get in the way anyway.
Having said that, Microtransactions shouldn't even be in a $60 retail release anyway. The whole point of microtransactions is you download a free to play game, and they make mney from microtransactions. Microtransactions being in a $60 retail game goes against what they are even for, and simply shouldnt be there imo.
That's all I'm trying to say. I don't want to see it. I'm always done my second playthrough i have not used any micro transaction it just doesn't belong in dmc or any action console game for that matter
 
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Jul 31, 2015
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#39
You only get brought to the store if you try to buy something when you don't have enough red orbs. I have only ever been brought there *once* and I backed out immediately. Mission 13, use Faust to grind red orbs. You can get millions in very little time allowing you to buy all the skills you need. Once you get all the skills, you really have no reason to ever use red orbs again unless you need to buy Gold Orbs - which you probably shouldn't regardless.

I get more orbs at a faster rate in this game than I did in the previous games. The only reason you would ever have to spend money in this game is if you are dumb or outright lazy. There is never a need to spend money as you get orbs so easily.
I'm not trying to grind/exploit I'm playing the game normally and I'm almost done my son of sparda playthrough. This game has way more things to upgrade so I'm not exactly swimming in red orbs. My issue is not getting red orbs i'm getting through this game just fine. The fact that you can throw money at this game to make it laughably easy is my problem.
 

ArchaeEnkidu

Vincit qui se vincit
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#40
I'm not trying to grind/exploit I'm playing the game normally and I'm almost done my son of sparda playthrough. This game has way more things to upgrade so I'm not exactly swimming in red orbs. My issue is not getting red orbs i'm getting through this game just fine. The fact that you can throw money at this game to make it laughably easy is my problem.
Having red orbs doesn't make the game easier. Having all the moves doesn't make the game easier. You still need to know how to *play* the game. You need to know how to string those combos together to maximize damage and style. You need to know when to dodge, when to parry, and when to DT. The only thing that could be considered "pay to win" would be to buy gold orbs and even then you get so many for free by simply playing the game, logging in each day, and finding them in the world.
 
Likes: Zaffo
Feb 18, 2009
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#41
I don't care about micro transactions at all in games, but I was asking my wife how come I don't see much brought up about the fact that you can Pay to Win in DMC5 and yet anything EA has with cosmetic MTX gets just destroyed by gamers. It has never been about MTX, it's about what company that does them.
Because it's a japanese game, and a niche one at that. Not enough people are researching/into this game to make waves about that.
 
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#42
Having red orbs doesn't make the game easier. Having all the moves doesn't make the game easier. You still need to know how to *play* the game. You need to know how to string those combos together to maximize damage and style. You need to know when to dodge, when to parry, and when to DT. The only thing that could be considered "pay to win" would be to buy gold orbs and even then you get so many for free by simply playing the game, logging in each day, and finding them in the world.
Why do you think they changed the old system? Why do you think the game magically allows you to go straight from the death screen to the store? Why do you think capcom turned the mxt off during review time? Instead of players having to get better at the game they can now just throw money at it. Even without much gaming skills by reviving themselves an unlimited amount time they will eventually brute force through it. Honestly it takes some legitimacy out of this game as a character action game.

As for the move unlocks it irks me in a different way. I do have fun playing the game and unlocking moves but it's lame as hell that joe blow can just throw money and earn everything that took me hours in a matter of seconds it takes to enter his credit card info .
 
Jun 13, 2018
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#43
But they made the game over sooooo slow just to have a bigger incentive to use the revive options.
To be honest the slow death screen is there in 4 as well as far as I remember.
Why do you think capcom turned the mxt off during review time?
Everyone knew about the micro-transactions well ahead.
Instead of players having to get better at the game they can now just throw money at it.
And the game penalizes you for it just like in previous games.
 
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ArchaeEnkidu

Vincit qui se vincit
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#44
Why do you think they changed the old system? Why do you think the game magically allows you to go straight from the death screen to the store? Why do you think capcom turned the mxt off during review time? Instead of players having to get better at the game they can now just throw money at it. Even without much gaming skills by reviving themselves an unlimited amount time they will eventually brute force through it. Honestly it takes some legitimacy out of this game as a character action game.

As for the move unlocks it irks me in a different way. I do have fun playing the game and unlocking moves but it's lame as hell that joe blow can just throw money and earn everything that took me hours in a matter of seconds it takes to enter his credit card info .
You still have to get better if you want the high scores, the trophies, and the unlocks that come with beating the harder modes. Throwing endless money to buy red orbs and gold orbs isn't going to make Dante Must Die or Hell and Hell modes ANY easier. That is no different than chipping at a stone wall with a plastic spoon. You may be able to make some headway, but you will lose out on a lot of time and money.

And cool, let that person spend money. You also have the ability of using the games core mechanics (the Faust weapon) to grind ridiculous amount of red orbs in very little time - even from normal play.
 
Likes: Shifty.
Jan 22, 2014
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#45
We're not in the dark ages of DMC1 where a death means restarting the level from square one anymore. The checkpoints are sensible and work just fine. You're getting caught up in the fact that the UI offers to take you to the store if you try to revive or buy something without having enough red orbs. Wanna know how to solve that? Don't click the button.
Context is everything. Capcom are preying on customer frustration. This is very clearly something they've focus tested (and more importantly, something they've seen implemented quite often in the mobile games industry).

Capcom is offering you something when you're angry/annoyed/frustrated, and most importantly, when you're full of adrenalin and likely to make a silly decision based on emotion and not logic.

It's manipulative.

But even ignoring the manipulation aspect, the bigger issue is the snowball effect.

First it's instant revives to avoid frustration, next thing it's "special" ammo or finishers, next thing you know basic consumables are chargable, etc.

Publishers have proven time and time again that if you give them an inch, they'll take a mile. It always gets worse, the tactics always get more predatory, and the games always suffer as a result.
 
Sep 25, 2015
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#46
Context is everything. Capcom are preying on customer frustration. This is very clearly something they've focus tested (and more importantly, something they've seen implemented quite often in the mobile games industry).
I think this is overexaggerating things just a tad. I've played enough predatory MTX-riddled mobile games to know what this stuff looks like, and DMC5 is in no way on that level. I'm not in favour of microtractions as a rule, but neither am I in favour of slating an otherwise excellent game for having them if they're unobtrusive.

For clarity's sake, have you actually played the game? Your post sounds like a fairly generalized critique of microtransactions to the degree where I'm sure I've read all of those points before. They're by and large valid in the context of disgusting iOS cash vacuums, but I feel like the context of the game's implementation is being ignored here.

Capcom is offering you something when you're angry/annoyed/frustrated, and most importantly, when you're full of adrenalin and likely to make a silly decision based on emotion and not logic.
If you're reaching the point of being so emotionally frazzled as to buy your way past a hard challenge so you can move on to even harder challenges then you're approaching the game wrong. Character action games are hard by nature, and learning by failure is an expected part of the experience.

And, again, the game gives you enough gold orbs for free that the player is given a decent amount of free revives to reconsider their choice of difficulty before falling into the insidious microtransaction trap that you're trying to paint a picture of here. It doesn't even tell you that buying with real money is an option until you exhaust your supply of in-game currency and attempt to spend more.

It's manipulative.

But even ignoring the manipulation aspect, the bigger issue is the snowball effect.

First it's instant revives to avoid frustration, next thing it's "special" ammo or finishers, next thing you know basic consumables are chargable, etc.
This is a slippery slope fallacy. You present no evidence to suggest that this has happened, and the fact that the microtransaction implementation (a.k.a. buying red orbs) is the same as it was in DMC4SE - a game released four years ago - strongly suggests that it hasn't.

I'm all for principle, but when principle overtakes context it's time to step back and take a minute.

The core difference is in the presentation- the game over screen presents you with the same options as the old games, with the addition of using red orbs to revive instead of gold ones. That's as much an accessibility measure as it is a MTX promotion one, because red orbs are readily available in the course of normal gameplay and, as I've mentioned, the game does not tell you that purchasing with real money is an option unless you're skint.
 
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#47
I don't care about micro transactions at all in games, but I was asking my wife how come I don't see much brought up about the fact that you can Pay to Win in DMC5 and yet anything EA has with cosmetic MTX gets just destroyed by gamers. It has never been about MTX, it's about what company that does them.
This.

I don't care about MTX either and I'm having fun with DMC5. Apparently options are not suppose to exist and we must complain about something we don't need to actually use...
 
Likes: Dthomp
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#48
I'm on chapter 6 and didn't even know the game had microtransactions.

It's easy to do when you simply don't give a fuck and play the game.
This.

This is why I never get the argument about something completely optional. So we've gone from arguing about season passes and locked DLC and when that starts to go away, they've goal posted new stuff to complain about?

Wow.

If I where to stop playing all games that have any type of mictransaction, it would be the majority of the best games released this generation. This type of thing is what starts to make those complaints get taken less and less seriously over time.
 
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#49
1. Git gud
2. The game is designed to be played flawlessly, you are severely punished in ranks for using revives, you are actively hurting yourself by using them. Not to mention I have like 15 gold orbs after first play through on Devil Hunter.
 
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