i don't get this new trend...and it's driving me nuts

i'm watching someone play Forespoken and man i just realized something

the recent trend of having some sidekick/character not being able to just SHUT THE FUCK UP AND LET US PLAY THE GAME IN PEACE AND AT OUR OWN PACE

It seems we just cant think for ourselves while playing games anymore, there must be guiding voices and augmented reality waypoints that literally reveal everything behind the walls because our feeble senses of sight and hearing are just not enough for such complex gameplay features like basic level exploration.

are we getting mentaly downgraded as species for these developers to feel the need to do this shit nowdays?
Yes you're right. Go play any PS1 game and you'll literally want to put a gun in your mouth because of how hard they are. Go further back than that and they get impossible.

You have to be a borderline genius mind reader to beat older games. Now 95% of games hold your hand like a child.

That's why games that are challenging but not impossible like Uncharted and The Last of Us that have limitd HUD but guide the player using lighting and enemy placement are a lot of fun to play.

Most of the time you know where to go but you also feel like you're discovering things on your own. Of course now Naughty Dog also uses NPC voice lines to help in some instances. But at least they are not irritating.

This is also why I have so much praise for Ghost of Tsushima and the way Insomniac decided to guide the player with the wind instead of HUD icons.
 

AJUMP23

Member
If it takes you more than 5 seconds to figure out where to look or switch to hit your companion has a comment about trying x or look over here.

No accounting for taking in the scenery of the world.
 

FoxMcChief

Gold Member
I’m playing through GoW:R, and i don’t remember the boy and talking head talking so damn much in the first game. They never shut up in the new one.
 
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jakinov

Member
Nah, I don't think that was it. The talking in Uncharted was entertaining, well written, felt natural.

It's not like all in game chatter is bad, it depends on how it is done. Forspoken to me seems hugely irritating, but in the original Nier it was, and still is, absolutely fantastic.

It's when they cross into this territory of never shutting up, and providing help if you take a second to paus it turns into an issue.
Didn't say it wasn't well done in Uncharted just that it popularized it.
 

Esppiral

Member
Now imagine playing that same game with that character speaking constantly in a foreign language because square is fucking cheap and didn't dub a heavy story driven game in to your native language.

Fuck you square, I hope it flops hard.
 

Mossybrew

Member
I guess it depends on the game. I enjoyed the banter in the Uncharted games, felt natural, but recently Ragnarok was just annoying, the constant dry conversations about Very Serious Topics as you were just trying to play the game got real old real fast.
 
Also you can thank marvel trash, for writers who are stuck as 12 year olds. The problem when the movies came out they saw it made billions made games with such writing. To bad it take years to get s game out. Years later its already outdated. As even most marvel projects flop by now.

They are simply braindead. Look at movies,music,games. I have never seen and heard more trash than in the 2020 ies. Im so glad i was born in the early 90.

Agreed, this is the worst decade for any kind of production with only the rarest bright spots, an absolutely abysmal culture across the board. Marvel defines it, and Marvel-ified Disney is the worst trash excuse for a pop culture I've seen in my life.

For a random comparison... even D&D is trash now. Fifth-edition basically leaned into a simplified Marvel-esque style of play where everyone is a hero and a badass and the rules are a fraction of what they once were.

This also comes from the idiotic and dishonest "expand the base" pushes, where they act as if we have some ethical need to get non-traditional gamers to play. Bullshit, they just want a wider base for more profit, there's no ethical meaning whatsoever to having more people play games or getting new audiences involved.
 
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MiguelItUp

Member
Definitely not new, but for whatever reason devs think it's what people want. I feel like it just got worse with the rise of games with "hero" characters after the MOBA fads. Because they all just keep talking, have "unique" personalities, etc. Maybe the rise of Marvel film fandom hasn't really helped either.

Some games have done it pretty well, but the majority just douse it in all that shit. It just because a yapping mess, annoying, etc.

Ragnarok irritated the fuck out of me with all the forced talking and walking segments. It felt like I watched more than played. Also the excessive chatting during combat when you're focused and the characters are like, "USE YOUR BLOCK!" or something similar. The whole telling you how to complete puzzles before you even realize it's a puzzle thing too. I get you can change the time to be informed or whatever. But why is the default what it is? It was so stupid, lmao.

While not AS excessive, I love that they tried to introduce that kind of thing into Battlefield 2042, and it failed. They eventually muted and removed the voice lines for their characters. Now they're adding classes, lmao. Beautiful.
 
i like it when its done well. I find it odd if my character is with other characters and there is complete silence for like an hour.
Dragon Age has lots of banter, and u learn things that way. Guardians of the Galaxy has tons of banter.

Avengers has pretty much none, unless u are in an elevator. Which sucked. There def should've been more talking during gameplay

I like hearing my Ghost in Destiny. Though 90% of the time he says stupid stuff like "This is a fallen cache left here" or "im not sure about this".
 

nkarafo

Member
One of the problems in modern gaming that exists for quite a while (since the optical disks were introduced) is that developers no longer have to think about available space.

For decades, space was something they had to think about. They had to use it sufficiently. Add important features and remove stuff that maybe not worth wasting precious space. Optimize as much as possible and even compress as much as you can.

For a long time now though, this isn't a thing, at least for the main home consoles and PCs. Back in the day you would guess such idea should be a huge improvement with no negative side effects. Developers having as much space as they want to complete their vision? How can something like this have a single negative thing about it?

Turns out it does have a lot of negatives. Developers use the unlimited space they have with intense greed. They bloat their games and their code, they don't optimize, they don't compress, etc.

But the biggest problem is the audio. This (or FMVs) is the thing that used to take most of the space in past games and voiced speech was always an issue because of the large, additional space it takes. But now you get games like this. Now they talk much more that they should. I also really hate this trend.

Basically, i'm saying that constrain is actually a good thing and it can help any creator to make a better product without extra fat. But there are no technical constrains anymore. It now only depends on someone having constrain themselves.
 

Bekind

Neo Member
The more i saw how prevalent this "self-talking and having some sidekick/character who would never shut up" trend is in gaming space, the more i respect fromsoftware. Only Miyazaki and FROM have the balls to make its biggest game in history which does the polar opposite of what most modern gaming companies would do to their AAA handholding games. The risks they are taking are humongous, and i am so glad it pays off and becomes one of the all-time greatest. It's a wake-up call for modern gaming. Dont be afraid to take risks, respect your players.
 

Shut0wen

Member
This has been going on for years but not to the extreme extent of what sony has been doing, currently playing evil within the first game and theres some parts in there where a side kick is helping you with certain puzzles
 

Neff

Member
Remember when hours would go by in the original Tomb Raider, with not a fucking word said, letting the atmosphere and environmental storytelling do all the heavy lifting?

Yeah. Good times.

 

GymWolf

Gold Member
I'm watching DansGaming stream who put it on low and there's still a considerable amount of non story related banter during combat and collecting things in the world.
It is the description that you can read in the option menu for low.

I have it on normal so i didn't checked if it was correct.

In the demo the banter was pretty rare on low, maybe they tuned up the settings before launch.
 

Pejo

Member
OP, did you ever hear about the pirate with a steering wheel on his belt buckle?

He said, "YEEAAARRGGHH, IT'S DRIVIN' ME NUTS!

Classic Film Bow GIF by Warner Archive
 

zeomax

Member
Doesnt seem like he did anything wrong, except be an annoying sperg about it. The jumping mechanic was bugged? Ive never played it so i cant really judge..
It was not a bug it is a jump mechanic in Half-Life called crouch jump. You could do this in many games which used the HL engine.
 

NeoIkaruGAF

Gold Member
Ocarina of Time’s Navi was nothing compared to the incessant banter of modern games.
And the trend isn’t even that new. Anyone who played Puppeteer 10 years ago will know what I’m talking about.
 
i'm watching someone play Forespoken and man i just realized something

the recent trend of having some sidekick/character not being able to just SHUT THE FUCK UP AND LET US PLAY THE GAME IN PEACE AND AT OUR OWN PACE

It seems we just cant think for ourselves while playing games anymore, there must be guiding voices and augmented reality waypoints that literally reveal everything behind the walls because our feeble senses of sight and hearing are just not enough for such complex gameplay features like basic level exploration.

are we getting mentaly downgraded as species for these developers to feel the need to do this shit nowdays?
it's for "accessibility", aka filthy casuals, who are a huge part of the market.
it's also a lot easier to develop a game where the game tells the player where to go/what to do.

reared it's ugly head in the x360/ps3 gen. never really went away.
 

Kvally

Member
i'm watching someone play Forespoken and man i just realized something

the recent trend of having some sidekick/character not being able to just SHUT THE FUCK UP AND LET US PLAY THE GAME IN PEACE AND AT OUR OWN PACE

It seems we just cant think for ourselves while playing games anymore, there must be guiding voices and augmented reality waypoints that literally reveal everything behind the walls because our feeble senses of sight and hearing are just not enough for such complex gameplay features like basic level exploration.

are we getting mentaly downgraded as species for these developers to feel the need to do this shit nowdays?
That was my issue in GT7 and the Cafe and the other races. They kept having driver after driver after driver after drive babbling on and on and on and wouldn't shut the fuck up.
 
The navi hate gets overblown ... it was a miracle that a game could even talk back then we freaking loved it

The thing about Navi is that she might be annoying in a few parts, particularly the beginning, but later the game gives you plenty of massive dungeons filled with complex intertwined puzzles, and Navi barely says a word through some of those. So there is plenty of challenge and faith in the player, just not at the very beginning.
 

fart town usa

Gold Member
I think it worked well in Ghostwire: Tokyo. Honestly can't remember if the guy possessing you pointed out solutions but the banter was nice considering you're literally the only person in Tokyo, lol

But yea, I hate when games solve puzzles for you. It can completely ruin the game.
 
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Handel

Member
i like it when its done well. I find it odd if my character is with other characters and there is complete silence for like an hour.
Dragon Age has lots of banter, and u learn things that way. Guardians of the Galaxy has tons of banter.

Avengers has pretty much none, unless u are in an elevator. Which sucked. There def should've been more talking during gameplay

I like hearing my Ghost in Destiny. Though 90% of the time he says stupid stuff like "This is a fallen cache left here" or "im not sure about this".
Ambient dialogue in Dragon Age isn't spoiling puzzles or scenery, it's character relationship building between your party members. GotG are a proper crew/team, and it's much more organically worked into their banter that they talk about how to progress though I never felt that game was insulting my intelligence with hints like in GoW:R. Banter as a whole is not the problem, the problem is the bad execution in some recent AAA titles.
 

Barrico82

Member
It depends on the execution, In GOW beside the puzzles, The interaction between the trio is fun and has its own great moments, But in Horizon FW ooh my god what they have done to Aloy characteristics made her horrible and intolerable.

These days I am play Chorus, the intractions between the main character and the AI of the plane is fun, entertaining and hilarious. Without it the game will be boring and not fun at all !
 

mnkl1

Neo Member
i don't see it as a trent, i see it as game getting more realistic, just like games have been getting better visuals, getting more photo realistic.
 

Drizzlehell

Member
One of the reasons why I grew so tired of modern mainstream video games and why I started to skip on so many of them. These insipid, vaguely action adventure games that are primarily driven by their forgettable plots, where you spend most of the time either watching a cinematic or slowly walking and listening to more plot.

I genuinely struggle to think about something that would stand out about God of War Ragnarok's gameplay. 3 months after finishing that game and all I can remember is that I was mashing buttons in between the story beats. The gameplay feels so milquetoast and indistinct in most games like this, and there's barely anything about them that would make me go "oh yeah, it's that game where you could do this awesome thing". Usually it's the "game about this story or character".

This "cinematic" bullshit was cool when they first started doing it back in the PS3/360 days but the novelty of it has worn off considerably. Right now I just want something that will be a video game, first and foremost. I want to see new and interesting gameplay innovations, with maybe some kind of a plot in the background for context and nothing else. Not the other way around.
 

mnkl1

Neo Member
I think it worked well in Ghostwire: Tokyo. Honestly can't remember if the guy possessing you pointed out solutions but the banter was nice considering you're literally the only person in Tokyo, lol

But yea, I hate when games solve puzzles for you. It can completely ruin the game.

maybe it's not really a puzzle. why would the developers create a puzzle and then solve it for you? that's a lot of development time wasted
 
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