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I found a vagina in Watch Dogs 2 and Sony suspended me (Update: Ban lifted)

Pantz

Member
Sep 21, 2006
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danowat

Member
Aug 30, 2014
13,870
500
665
It's a good resolution for the OP, so that's good, what's not so good is the censorship that Ubisoft have decided to do, the game is a mature / 18+ game, there is no need for them to patch this nudity out.

Has this issue highlighted a problem with the share system and mature content within the PS4 then?, is Sony going to fix it?.
 

Darkstorne

Member
May 26, 2014
2,886
0
0
It's a good resolution for the OP, so that's good, what's not so good is the censorship that Ubisoft have decided to do, the game is a mature / 18+ game, there is no need for them to patch this nudity out.

Has this issue highlighted a problem with the share system and mature content within the PS4 then?, is Sony going to fix it?.

I mean, what does a low resolution vagina really add to the game? If all it does is cause controversy like this, and we'd lose nothing by removing gratuitous nudity, then I don't see the problem.

Definitely agree with your second comment though. If we have to second guess when we're allowed to use the Share feature, that's a problem. And plenty of people have posed great solutions already, like an opt-in option for users to view images and videos shared from mature rated games. If you haven't opted in, then the images could always be blurred until you select them and confirm you're okay with viewing potentially mature content.
 

danowat

Member
Aug 30, 2014
13,870
500
665
I mean, what does a low resolution vagina really add to the game? If all it does is cause controversy like this, and we'd lose nothing by removing gratuitous nudity, then I don't see the problem.

I don't like knee jerk, retro active censorship that panders to the tabloid notion that "games are evil", the developer felt it was appropriate to be in the game from the get go, then it shouldn't be removed.

I would imagine the developer will go with the line that it was a mistake, and shouldn't have been in their in the first place though.
 

a.wd

Member
Mar 16, 2007
3,887
0
0
uk
Update:
I think we may have..won? I've got this support email backpeddling the bans but of course never admitting fault. Have Sony ever conceded a ban before? Also something must have hit a nerve because I never filed a support ticket but they're the ones contacting me.



I would also like to point out the suspensions were very real and I couldn't sign in to my account.

I would reply back and say "that almost sounds like an apology, but it appears to be missing some key points"

Then I would point out that the media storm created by this could have been avoided by better QA/QC/Policies and customer service.

Also I would point out sex is legal (and viewing a nude body is not even that) amongst consenting adults below the age rating for this game, shooting people is not for any age, then ask why one is a bannable offence and one is not.
 

test_account

XP-39C²
Mar 22, 2007
23,613
2
1,130
Update:
I think we may have..won? I've got this support email backpeddling the bans but of course never admitting fault. Have Sony ever conceded a ban before? Also something must have hit a nerve because I never filed a support ticket but they're the ones contacting me.

I would also like to point out the suspensions were very real and I couldn't sign in to my account.
At least they say that the bans were incorrect, indirectly saying that they did the wrong thing. The first ban was probably within the rules, but the extended ban was strange. But thanks for the update, very good that you got the ban removed! :)
 

Tunahead

Member
Apr 4, 2014
703
0
0
So are they like patching all the vaginas out or specifically ones on the otherwise clothed characters? Because if they keep in nude beaches and stuff then I can find that understandable. It is in extremely poor taste to have female characters walking around whose vaginas you can see, but only by attacking them.
 

RocknRola

Member
Jul 9, 2016
4,102
0
275
If a game is rated M, then nudity is perfectly acceptable. Now, the question of whether it adds something valuable or not is interesting, but doesn't negate the possibility of it being there in the first place.

I mean, if I can pretend that I'm mass murderer in these sort of games a random vagina or a penis seem more than fine.

Shame Ubi went this way though. Makes no sense either, it's an M rated game. If some kid buys it, that's on the kid and the respective parents and maybe the store also. Never on the developer or the actual game (assuming it's rated accordingly).
 
Mar 16, 2016
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Um is a M rated game actually allowed to show a vagina? Even rated R and cable shows can only show the public hair, not like the whole thing in all its glory.

This isn't simply a matter of M means 18 and 18 means you can watch whatever you want. Rating systems can levy additional restrictions.

I'm not super familiar with the ESRB but wouldn't it need to be rated AO?
 

RocknRola

Member
Jul 9, 2016
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Um is a M rated game actually allowed to show a vagina? Even rated R and cable shows can only show the public hair, not like the whole thing in all its glory.

It is in Europe (or in Portugal at the very least). M = 18+ = Adults (by law 18 year olds are adults in every sense of the word). Ergo, everything is legit. Not even sure there is a rating above that here, tbh.

EDIT:


Oh, nevermind. The ESRB site says M = 17+, which is definitely different (from a legal standpoint). AO is the 18+ one. In which case.....eh....nudity may or may not be legit.

EDIT 2:

MATURE
Content is generally suitable for ages 17 and up. May contain intense violence, blood and gore, sexual content and/or strong language.



ADULTS ONLY
Content suitable only for adults ages 18 and up. May include prolonged scenes of intense violence, graphic sexual content and/or gambling with real currency.

The difference between "graphic sexual content" and just "sexual content" is what may make the world of difference here. Though I feel "nudity" would fit in with "sexual content". They didn't make a sex scene of any sort, it was just nudity. Sooo...dunno. kinda confused right now.
 
Mar 16, 2016
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It is in Europe (or in Portugal at the very least). M = 18+ = Adults (by law 18 year olds are adults in every sense of the word). Ergo, everything is legit. Not even sure there is a rating above that here, tbh.

EDIT:


Oh, nevermind. The ESRB site says M = 17+, which is definitely different (from a legal standpoint). AO is the 18+ one. In which case.....eh....nudity may or may not be legit.

It's not just nudity it's the opening and everything. Again if we look at TV I'm pretty sure there's never been an instance where that could be shown, but breasts, buttocks, and the front of the pubic area have been.

Saw your edit. Yup graphic nudity versus just nudity is a good way to distinguish. There are degrees.
 
Mar 16, 2016
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I see some people in here who are angry about the censorship but is this instance of nudity really the hill to die on? It's so insignificant and meaningless. I'd rather fight for the release of actual AO games and pornographic games on consoles where this sort of nudity would actually make sense.
 

Mar Nosso

Banned
May 19, 2013
723
0
0
I would reply back and say "that almost sounds like an apology, but it appears to be missing some key points"

Then I would point out that the media storm created by this could have been avoided by better QA/QC/Policies and customer service.

Also I would point out sex is legal (and viewing a nude body is not even that) amongst consenting adults below the age rating for this game, shooting people is not for any age, then ask why one is a bannable offence and one is not.

Ha! Loved this post. Aiming for the heart and listing all the right things.
 

RocknRola

Member
Jul 9, 2016
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0
275
I see some people in here who are angry about the censorship but is this instance of nudity really the hill to die on? It's so insignificant and meaningless. I'd rather fight for the release of actual AO games and pornographic games on consoles where this sort of nudity would actually make sense.

Speaking for myself, I wouldn't say angry just disappointed that devs suffer so much backlash for these things.

I don't think it adds particularly anything to this game, especially if they don't do anything with it which seems to be the case, but I don't feel it causes any sort of harm either.

Ah well. It is what it is I guess. Hopefully one day devs won't be scared of making full on AO games with whatever they decide to throw in there.
 

Pantz

Member
Sep 21, 2006
2,106
2,217
1,635
It's not just nudity it's the opening and everything. Again if we look at TV I'm pretty sure there's never been an instance where that could be shown, but breasts, buttocks, and the front of the pubic area have been.

Saw your edit. Yup graphic nudity versus just nudity is a good way to distinguish. There are degrees.

Check out the movie Punch (2002) Rated R. They showed on cable and it has a full vagina scene. (Movie also came out of Canada).
 

Coxy100

Banned
Sep 28, 2015
2,604
0
0
UK
Update:
I think we may have..won? I've got this support email backpeddling the bans but of course never admitting fault. Have Sony ever conceded a ban before? Also something must have hit a nerve because I never filed a support ticket but they're the ones contacting me.



I would also like to point out the suspensions were very real and I couldn't sign in to my account.

"Do not share anything that is vulgar."

I would reply to them and say

"Do not approve anything in games on your system that you find vulgar then".
 

ArtHands

Member
Oct 14, 2012
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I see some people in here who are angry about the censorship but is this instance of nudity really the hill to die on? It's so insignificant and meaningless. I'd rather fight for the release of actual AO games and pornographic games on consoles where this sort of nudity would actually make sense.

it makes things more authentic considering the lady is a hooker.
 

Akai__

Member
Jun 14, 2012
9,691
0
0
NeoGAF + Media: 1 - Sony: 0

Congrats OP. Still a shame that they are making it seem like it was an accident. lol
 

Dictator93

Member
Jun 29, 2011
23,812
4
660
That´s insane, why would they even model that in the game? They fucked up, Sony fucked up, OP did nothing wrong. Classic example of shooting the messenger

I scarcely see what is wrong with it being in the game as long as it was properly vetted by a ratings board.

What is wrong with some genitalia (male or female) in a game where you can just shoot random civilians on the street?
I would reply back and say "that almost sounds like an apology, but it appears to be missing some key points"

Then I would point out that the media storm created by this could have been avoided by better QA/QC/Policies and customer service.

Also I would point out sex is legal (and viewing a nude body is not even that) amongst consenting adults below the age rating for this game, shooting people is not for any age, then ask why one is a bannable offence and one is not.

Well put.
 

FLAguy954

Junior Member
Jan 27, 2012
5,155
3
0
USA
I scarcely see what is wrong with it being in the game as long as it was properly vetted by a ratings board.

What is wrong with some genitalia (male or female) in a game where you can just shoot random civilians on the street?


Well put.

I feel the same. The way people divide how they perceive violence vs nudity is fucking hypocritical.
 

Tunahead

Member
Apr 4, 2014
703
0
0
I feel the same. The way people divide how they perceive violence vs nudity is fucking hypocritical.

I mostly agree, but when there's nudity in a game you can only see by attacking someone then it kind of inadvertently veers into gross sexual violence territory.
 

Rookhelm

Member
Apr 5, 2016
910
3
290
I see a lot of people saying, "oh, I can shoot someone in the face, but vagina is a no no?"

While that sentiment is true, and worth talking about, that's not Sony's fault. At least here in the US, that standard pretty much exists everywhere. so the blame for that (double?) standard shouldn't fall to Sony.
 

filly

Member
Jun 12, 2014
452
3
290
London
Watch dogs 2 dev wanted exactly this to happen. Controversy stokes the flames of the media. It is part of why GTA was so successful. Both same style of game too.
 

RichiRamjag

Member
Nov 6, 2014
6,910
0
0
I would reply back and say "that almost sounds like an apology, but it appears to be missing some key points"

Then I would point out that the media storm created by this could have been avoided by better QA/QC/Policies and customer service.

Also I would point out sex is legal (and viewing a nude body is not even that) amongst consenting adults below the age rating for this game, shooting people is not for any age, then ask why one is a bannable offence and one is not.

And the rep on the other end would ignore most of that and send you a canned message back.
 

Aenima

Member
Nov 5, 2004
1,685
568
1,525
Portugal

Lol, as expected. The german site is the only one that dont censor the pic and place it on the article without the need of external links :D

But they are one of the contries that ban or censor most games that show alot of gore. Funny how diferent cultures work on videogames.

Not so funny that because of this thread the game is being now censored.
 

Ric Flair

Banned
Nov 27, 2013
1,929
1
0
What I want to know is why there is a hole cut out of the panties, that's such a bizarre thing to have been textured, is it not?
 

IvorB

Member
Apr 26, 2013
8,952
0
0
What I want to know is why there is a hole cut out of the panties, that's such a bizarre thing to have been textured, is it not?

Have you seriously never heard of crotchless underwear before? It's a perfectly valid item in the wardrobe of any streetwalker.
 

Gestault

Member
Oct 18, 2012
14,362
3
0
Man, they really tricked op good by saying his account wasn't really banned. He would have no way to know otherwise.
 

SeeNoWeevil

Member
Jan 11, 2015
2,951
2
315
I don't like knee jerk, retro active censorship that panders to the tabloid notion that "games are evil", the developer felt it was appropriate to be in the game from the get go, then it shouldn't be removed.

I would imagine the developer will go with the line that it was a mistake, and shouldn't have been in their in the first place though.
Agreed. It just reinforces the notion that videogames are kid's toys, regardless of their rating.