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If a racing game is seen as GOTY quality and then why isn't it rewarded as such?

Danjin44

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Control barely sold any copies at launch, and was nominates though. The real thing is that the people doing the voting just want to fit in with their peers, so they all go along with the same mindset. Winners every year are quite predictable.
Control is not a game I would discribe as "niche", games like Ace Attorney or Shin Megami Tensei are niche, these games will never ever get nominated in mainstream GOTY shows no matter how good they are because these shows are targeting your average person.
 
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Control is not a game I would discribe as "niche", games like Ace Attorney or Shin Megami Tensei are niche, these games will never ever get nominated in mainstream GOTY shows no matter how good they arebecause these shows are targeting your average person.
Didn't say it was "niche". I said it didn't sell well at launch, because it didn't
 

Masterbrew

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Aquaplaning is not a huge fucking thing. Snow has been in a billion car games. Stunts have been in a billion car games. You are making waaaaaaaaaaaaay too much out of good but small changes. These things you are talking about, opening up the map, are not the gameplay. That's the level. Forza Horizon has made good changes, but it's not some mind-blowing award-winning changes.

The original TLOU was more of a cover shooter, Joel was more slow-paced, the sequel changed Ellie's movement, gave her the ability to scale surfaces quickly and dash, and added new melee attacks and faster-moving, smarter, and more agile enemies, the result is faster and different playing game. It's still similar to the first, but there are clearly different things going on in the gameplay.

The core gameplay of Forza Horizon and the racers it's built upon haven't changed in 20 years. The changes in racing games have been more about the tracks and presentation, and how arcade or sim they go, but it's extremely difficult to change driving gameplay, there are very clear parameters to what a car is and how it drives, only so much you can do with it.

You are downplaying the mechanics of different surfaces because you don’t care about driving games. People who are into Dirt Rally will tell you that driving on slush and ice in the alps might as well be a different game than driving on dry gravel in New England. It will take dozens of hours to learn a new surface.
 

Bragr

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You are downplaying the mechanics of different surfaces because you don’t care about driving games. People who are into Dirt Rally will tell you that driving on slush and ice in the alps might as well be a different game than driving on dry gravel in New England. It will take dozens of hours to learn a new surface.
What is the new surface in Horizon 5?
 

22:22

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What is the new surface in Horizon 5?
 

Bragr

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How you gonna say this "But I can't think of any third-person action game that plays exactly like TLOU 2, even though the first was is similar." and than say this "So in Forza and other driving games, the gameplay is moving forward, breaking and sliding, and stuff like that, which is extremely difficult to change when all you have to work with is a car" Its like me saying in TLOU 2 you go behind cover and shoot people like all the other 3d person games. You think that all the racing games have samey gameplay mechanics and are limited in what can differ. Do you think that The Crew has same gameplay as Forza Horizon or Burnout? So if i say that Metal Gear Solid 5 plays the same as TLOU 2 because they both are 3d person action games where you can shoot, take cover and lay on the ground and crouch. Cuz they use the same buttons for the same actions just have different animations so they are playing the same. This is untrue for Forza and its untrue for TLOU because both of them play different than any other game in there genre. And a well received franchise doesn't need to change there well received gameplay mechanics all the time, why do you need to change something that already works soo well.
Again, you are overexaggerating and using nonsensical examples.

We are talking about the difference between Horizon 3, 4, and 5, not completely different racing franchises.

Look at all the Horizon games and look at how little they changed in the gameplay, it's all about world design, setting, campaign progression, and stuff like that, not gameplay changes to the racing mechanics, and that is because it's not that easy to change racing gameplay without completely changing the game.

And I haven't said they need to change gameplay, I said it's similar to what came before.
 
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22:22

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Again, you are overexaggerating and using nonsensical examples.

We are talking about the difference between Horizon 3, 4, and 5, not completely different racing franchises.

Look at all the Horizon games and look at how little they changed in the gameplay, it's all about world design, setting, campaign progression, and stuff like that, not gameplay changes to the racing mechanics, and that is because it's not that easy to change racing gameplay without completely changing the game.

And I haven't said they need to change gameplay, I said it's similar to what came before.

At first glance every entry is interchangeable
 

Claus Grimhildyr

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Jan 30, 2018
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If a game is GOTY for you, let it be GOTY for you. Stop worrying about what other people have as theirs. Stop giving sites the power to dictate what is/isn't "game of the year". Their opinions mean literally nothing.
 

AmuroChan

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It's pretty simple. Look at the outlets who vote GOTY and what % of their staff members actually know anything about racing games. There's your answer. Unlike the Oscars where there are 10 nominated films and you can require voting members to watch all 10 films, you can't really do that with games. So if you're a gaming outlet and only 10% of your staff are racing game fans, the other 90% isn't even going to consider voting for a Forza Horizon because they either haven't played it or have no interest in the genre whatsoever.
 
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Turk1993

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Again, you are overexaggerating and using nonsensical examples.

We are talking about the difference between Horizon 3, 4, and 5, not completely different racing franchises.

Look at all the Horizon games and look at how little they changed in the gameplay, it's all about world design, setting, campaign progression, and stuff like that, not gameplay changes to the racing mechanics, and that is because it's not that easy to change racing gameplay without completely changing the game.

And I haven't said they need to change gameplay, I said it's similar to what came before.
I have showed you different type of gameplay elements added in the newer Forza's but you keep ignoring them and downplaying them. And you where the one that was generalising gameplay in all racing games with your moving forward braking and slidin comment. Yet when i do the same for TLOU you say that im over exaggerating and use nonsensical examples.
 

Guilty_AI

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You actually need to aim at things though. Have you played DS? Because it's the most brain dead gameplay I've ever seen.
I did, and its nowhere just about "walking forward". Theres loads of planning ahead, choosing the right equipment based on the terrain, tense moments... heck, theres even shooting too. Its a far more complex game than random pew pew shooty shooty you'll find in the market
 
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I think Horizon 3 was received as one of the best games the year it came out. They messed things up (imo) with the timed seasonality in 4. Hopefully they strike a balance in 5.
 

Burythelight

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Because make forza horizon don't require the same effort to make a zelda game or god of war? They have limited simplistic gameplay? Lack of originality? I don't know im not a fan of the genre.
 

Handel

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Only certain genres and/or developers are allowed to win a lot of GOTY awards, the others just are brushed off to the side for being too much of a video game. Even here when people were discussing IGN's best game ever awards, there was outrage that Burnout 3 Takedown (best racing game ever) beat Chrono Trigger, as if a top tier racing game is just purely inferior to a top tier JRPG.
 
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Aenima

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You actually need to aim at things though. Have you played DS? Because it's the most brain dead gameplay I've ever seen.
I did, you only mention a part of the walking mechanics. The game has multiple vehicles, means of transportation like zip lines, multiple weapons for ranged, and melee combat, and for human and non human enemies.
Thers alot of gameplay elements that you dont mention cuz you either never played the game, or are just trolling.
 

Estocolmo

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Because Flight Simulator, Forza Horizon, Psychonauts doesnt fit Game Awards boring view of being a GOTY candidate, it must be Sony third person, action adventure same-old-formula!
 
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Claus Grimhildyr

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I'm sorry but that kind of BS argument, I personally consider FPS combat boring, does that mean it doesn't deserve to be in GOTY?

Why do you put so much stock in the GOtY provided by random sites/users? The only thing that matters is your own personal GotY.
 
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01011001

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Yep. Wish more people understood this.

the issue is, developers go after awards for prestige and better sales, and if shitty watered down games that look nice win regularly, what will happen is more and more devs and publishers will make shitty watered down games that look nice.

it's the equivalent of the so called Oscar Bait movies that go for predictable shit that worked in years before in order to release a movie that gains a big PR boost for winning Oscars.
 
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Claus Grimhildyr

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the issue is, developers go after awards for prestige and better sales, and if shitty watered down games that look nice win regularly, what will happen is more and more devs and publishers will make shitty watered down games that look nice.

it's the equivalent of the so called Oscar Bait movies that go for predictable shit that worked in years before in order to release a movie that gains a big PR boost for winning Oscars.

And yet how many films do we get that are both far more entertaining and passionate than "oscar bait" films? They only make up a very tiny portion. Game devs aren't stupid, neither are most publishers. I would argue only the worst dev teams/publishers will actively go for awards, instead of just trying to make a great game.
 

EDMIX

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Sure, but game like Controls has good chance of getting nominated because it mass appeal compare to nitche games.

or because its actually a great game. I overlooked it and upon playing it later on, it is indeed a great game. The nomination is deserved.


Estocolmo Estocolmo A lot of ignorance to unpack here... "Because Flight Simulator, Forza Horizon, Psychonauts doesnt fit Game Awards boring view of being a GOTY candidate, it must be Sony third person, action adventure same-old-formula!"

First...Psychonauts won GOTY before, second many GOTYs have been won that have not been Sony titles, Hades, Portal, Half Life 1, 2, that VR game they did, Red Dead 2, Sekiro, Fallout 3, Control, Witcher 3, BOTW, Resident Evil 2 and its remake etc

So....thats a lot wrong there bud.

Psychonauts isn't a bad game, but come the fuck on...it won a GOTY in a year that saw Resident Evil 4 and God Of War sweep those awards. Even Shadow Of The Colossus that year only got a few and its a great game, but its not going to be as massive as a RE4 or God Of War or something.
 
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Hugare

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Because gameplay in racing games boils down to accelerating and breaking. Changing gears ocasionaly when playing Manual.

"Oh but the detail inside the cars, the environments and etc."

Still, you'll have pretty much the same experience with Forza Horizon 3/4/5 gameplay wise

With Burnout at least you could takedown cars, making it the best racing game experience imo

Blur was underrated too
 
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Guilty_AI

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Because gameplay in racing games boils down to accelerating and breaking. Changing gears ocasionaly when playing Manual.
Gameplay in shooters boils down to shooting and reloading by that logic
 
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EDMIX

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Because gameplay in racing games boils down to accelerating and breaking. Changing gears ocasionaly when playing Manual.

"Oh but the detail inside the cars, the environments and etc."

Still, you'll have pretty much the same experience with Forza Horizon 3/4/5 gameplay wise

With Burnout at least you could takedown cars, making it the best racing game experience imo

Blur was underrated too

Agreed.

Static concepts like this need to do something pretty revolutionary to win such awards. Thus far, Mario Kart and GT seem to be the only racing series to get that award.
 

Guilty_AI

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Agreed.

Static concepts like this need to do something pretty revolutionary to win such awards. Thus far, Mario Kart and GT seem to be the only racing series to get that award.
Because shooting guns at enemies aren't static concepts apparently
 

Hugare

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Gameplay in shooters boils down to shooting and reloading by that logic
Nah.

They offer story. Different weapons with different feel. Setpieces. Wallrun, slide, double jump and other mobility options. Vehicles.

Even the most basic ones you'll use at least 6 buttons: aim, shoot, reload, run, crouch, throw grenades/whatever

And in racing games you follow the road/track. You are always moving foward.

FPS is 360°, especially in multiplayer. You dont know where enemies will come from, so its much more dynamic.
 
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AGRacing

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Because gameplay in racing games boils down to accelerating and breaking. Changing gears ocasionaly when playing Manual.

"Oh but the detail inside the cars, the environments and etc."

Still, you'll have pretty much the same experience with Forza Horizon 3/4/5 gameplay wise

With Burnout at least you could takedown cars, making it the best racing game experience imo

Blur was underrated too

You forgot steering.

All this talk is pointless guys.... "Trusted Reviews" already handed out all their 2021 awards.... you got to be a March release to get a trophy these days.
 

EDMIX

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Because shooting guns at enemies aren't static concepts apparently

Well....they are not.

That is something that can differ greatly.

Saying someone is shooting a gun in a game is just too broad.

Now if you told me shooting like HUNTING, like a game IP that was just about hunting or something and it had yearly sequels and different parts of the world with different weapons etc, I can see that being static, but to just say "shooting guns" doesn't make much sense.

Bioshock and Watchdogs 2 are not the same games, simply saying "shooting guns" doesn't really define both the main points of those games, but to say football, basket ball, racing etc is to describe the main idea generally enough to deem them static. So we have many different racing games from time to time, but the main idea 99.9% of the time is to race ie point A to B, outside of stuff like Rocket League or something (which btw won a GOTY) sooooo yea, actually being different and not that static can get you that award. Nothing wrong with static games mind you as I like a lot of them too, but I can't really tell you the best game of the year should go to a static concept. They need to really do a lot of new revolutionary shit for any one to really take notice.
 
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Guilty_AI

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Nah.

Racers offer different experiences. Different cars with different feels. Setpieces. Wallrun, drift, jump and other mobility options. Guns.

Even the most basic ones you'll use at least 6 buttons: accelerate, break, turn left, turn right, handbreak, Nitro/boost whatever

And in shooting games you just shoot. You are always shooting.

Racers are 360°, especially in multiplayer. You dont know what opponents will do, so its much more dynamic.
ftfy
 
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