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[RetroGamingUK]

So it can end up a publishing label for Playstation! Poetic

Think they're happy with that?

The bought Bethesda and Activision with the sole intention of making all those games exclusive to Xbox.

It was never about publishing the games, it was about dominance and now they're lumped with something they never wanted.

How long until Microsoft take Sony and Nintendo to court because they won't allow Gamepass and Xbox Store on their consoles?

 

[Klayzer]

Think they're happy with that?

If it makes them a ton of money, surely.

 

[RetroGamingUK]

If it makes them a ton of money, surely.

How long until they make back the money they used to purchase them?

How long until they mismanage the studios and further decrease the quality of the games?

Saying that, Microsoft seem happy having Office on Mac/iOS/Android, but then it's all about the 365 subscription.

 

[CGNoire]

You might be equating people laughing at their mistakes and mocking their stupid decisions as wanting them to fail. Consumers want to support a corporation's product because it's good, not because they feel obligated to.

...and where done here.

 

[Klayzer]

How long until they make back the money they used to purchase them?

How long until they mismanage the studios and further decrease the quality of the games?

Saying that, Microsoft seem happy having Office on Mac/iOS/Android, but then it's all about the 365 subscription.

Lol. Who knows on those questions. Xbox needs new leadership pronto, if they have any hope of a dramatic turnaround.

 

[Ar¢tos]

it's simple and it's Sony fans….a bunch of fossils who can't stop sticking JRPGs and other bad final fantasy games up their ass.

Whose Alt is this?

Edit : confused nicks, not 3yo.

But likely an Alt, no junior would be dumb enough to have a start like this here.

 

[Felessan]

Xbox was a great competitor on the scene. They were quite innovative back in the day, and really knocked it out of the park with the 360.

But it been a solid 12+ years of braindead decisions, yet leadership has been allowed to remain. They're basically a publishing brand now, their hardware is largely irrelevant. They're basically reverting back to their 90s publishing strategy, but instead of "Microsoft" doing the publishing, it's "Xbox."

It's both amusing, and really sad, to see something that was once really promising slowly recede from innovation.

It's all actually make sense if we take a look at history, motives and environment at each step.
Xbox started as a project to curb risk of playstation taking over consumers home space, expanding beyond just console under tv. MS was still quite big in consumer space than. And it was a real threat.
What happened next:
- Threat didn't realize
- Another unexpected threat appeared and taken away customers segment, the whole, not just entertainment, by a storm (smartphones). And MS efforts to fight back were in vain
- MS itself shifted heavily from consumer business to corporate business

Somewhere at the mid of '10 MS was a business run for corporates and Xbox was a business runs for customers, not a big one on the scale of MS, and having close to zero relevancy to other part of MS. But top management still have to be informed about status, problems, solutions etc to make decisions - a lot of efforts that just waste for a main business (and management resource is also limited). Which is why non-core side business with no synergy always considered bad for company and investors called for spin-off and selling Xbox for years.

So, I assume, Xbox management was given a task - either you are spun-off and sold (essentially sent to die as Xbox was not very competitive without MS backing) or you think a way to make it big again in consumer space, comparable to other MS part (to justify resources) and/or have a great synergy with other parts.
And this is where Xbox went - go for Netflix and go for cloud. Both was a risky takes and both relatively failed.

tl/dr - at x360 era Xbox was part of core strategy, at x1/xsx it was unwanted child - hence is the difference and results

 

[DeltaPolarBear]

tl/dr - at x360 era Xbox was part of core strategy, at x1/xsx it was unwanted child - hence is the difference and results

And yet had they stayed quiet and keep their heads down, they might have survive one or two more generations. The amount of money spent on acquiring Activision would have been sufficient to sustain a decade of Xbox Division operations otherwise. Microsoft barely noticed that Xbox exists. Until the merger happened.

 

[Bojanglez]

Two-edged sword. For example, all the content I am interested in is fragmented across different streaming services who all want me to pay money. Result: I am watching this shit without paying anyone. On the other hand, if you had just one streaming service, they'd totally fuck consumers in the ass as well.

Yeah I agree.

You could subscribe to each service for a couple of months, alter your habits to make your money work the most efficiently.

To be fair I prefer the Music model where almost all music comes to all platforms and they just battle for quality of life improvements, niche content and price. But the downside of that is that artists seem to hate it, but can use it as exposure to then sell merch and tickets (which games can't do as well).

 

[Felessan]

And yet had they stayed quiet and keep their heads down, they might have survive one or two more generations. The amount of money spent on acquiring Activision would have been sufficient to sustain a decade of Xbox Division operations otherwise. Microsoft barely noticed that Xbox exists. Until the merger happened.

Seriously doubt it as even Nadella had it in his KPI until recently
It was probably a deal between Phil, Nadella and board of directors about future of Xbox and ATVI purchase was a last chance to make Xbox look good

It's not about amount money spent and those 70bn is not lost, ATVI still bringing in money. It's about reaching promised targets - Xbox failed to do it with gp, and failed again with ATVI buyout. So Xbox was stripped from freedom and some decisions were enforced. If ATVI didn't happen - it will still be the same, maybe even earlier as Phil couldn't deliver previous promise of GP growth and ATVI case helped him stall time for inevitable and have a glance of opportunity for Xbox

 

[RetroGamingUK]

Seriously doubt it as even Nadella had it in his KPI until recently
It was probably a deal between Phil, Nadella and board of directors about future of Xbox and ATVI purchase was a last chance to make Xbox look good

It's not about amount money spent and those 70bn is not lost, ATVI still bringing in money. It's about reaching promised targets - Xbox failed to do it with gp, and failed again with ATVI buyout. So Xbox was stripped from freedom and some decisions were enforced. If ATVI didn't happen - it will still be the same, maybe even earlier as Phil couldn't deliver previous promise of GP growth and ATVI case helped him stall time for inevitable and have a glance of opportunity for Xbox

What do you see as their plan going forward?

Mare they simply content with being a third party publisher?

 

[Brakum]

Competition is good when it's good.

some of the buggest advantages of competition are loeer prices and better products.

We're seeing higher prices and worse products so yeah fuck them.

 

[Felessan]

What do you see as their plan going forward?

Mare they simply content with being a third party publisher?

For now they are cutting parts that are "alien" to them like hardware and it's distribution

How software side will look like I don't know, but I expect Xbox to be reverse assimilated into ATVI structure of multipresence (subscription, live service, single games) powerhouse.

 

[lastmessiah]

Western developers are bankrupt because they produce crappy games.

No doubt, which is why I welcome the death of "AAA".

 

[PurePlatinum]

This. Just check their competing products in those markets. It's a literal graveyard of failures.

Xbox ironically, has probably been the most successful of those products.

I'm actually somewhat sensitive to the struggles of running an American based game company, in an era when western development is at an all time low.

Xbox will always be at a disadvantage as long as Japanese players and developers prefer their home platform. It's not their fault it's just the way the market is, and if Xbox is missing like half of all the big important Japanese games they just don't have a shot with hardcore players in the west.

Why would I get an Xbox when I'm not guaranteed to have all the new final fantasy games at launch? 2017 was the year that sunk them on this. They missed Persona, Nier, Yakuza and DQXI.

 

[Toons]

And that will happen when Xbox exits so the likes of Amazon can come in to fill the blanks. I remember a time when Xbox didn't exist, and I can see a time when Xbox will no longer exist. The competition will remain regardless. Especially if the newcomer actually had to make a profit to survive.

Amazons gonna be far worse at this than MS lmao

 

[rodrigolfp]

How long until they make back the money they used to purchase them?

Why they need to make the money back? They did shut down those studios??

 

[SSfox]

Lol as usual trying to put Xbox failures on everybody except Microsoft the only ones that destroyed the brand

 

[DeltaPolarBear]

Amazons gonna be far worse at this than MS lmao

You say that, but Amazon DID hire a co-creator of first gen Xbox a while back....

 

[Freelance Yakuza]

I don't want Microsoft to fail.

I just see where their decisions are leading them.

 

[Zacfoldor]

I've thought a lot more about this since my last post.

It is definitely so we can "hear the lamentations of the women," or in this case xbox fanboys.

In Conan the Barbarian, Conan's master asks him what is best in life. He says to, "To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentation of their women."

lamentation - the passionate expression of grief or sorrow; weeping.

If you think about it, Conan is saying some hard shit. He is saying that he will defeat his enemies and then seem them driven before him(perhaps as slaves?) and then hear "the passionate expression of grief or sorrow; weeping" implying that the men are the enemies and the women are merely indicators of the state of the men, lamentation.

Of course Conan is about barbarism. We are not this. We are modern. Conan is old. We do not want to hurt anyone. However we do have play "enemies" and it is what is best in life to beat them. Usually in sports or videogames. Sometimes in wars like the console wars.

I've fought them all my life. I am more a console warrior than anyone here. I sat down my warrior sticks even if some of the old me creeps out of me from time to time.

...but I can't get over the thought of wanting to hear those console war lamentations once again. They call to me, even now. Their sweet dulcet tones are calling me even now....but I stand for the light. I will not contribute to these things. I am not a better man...but perhaps wiser. There is no control without temptation and I expect to display control here on gaf. So shall we all. Some of us have a competitive drive and these emotions, winning and losing are hard to control. We just have to git gud. It's really simple.

 

[Yekshemesh]

What "competition" has xbox provided in the last 10 years?

 

[Azelover]

I don't want Xbox to fail. But let's be honest, they tried to fool us multiple times and basically got away with it.

If they want goodwill they need to be slightly more honest, at the very least.

 

[Tams]

Just because.

 

[Calverz]

Sega did paid online with the Dreamcast, hardly obscure.

Did they? I don't remember this. I played quake 3 and pso online and didn't pay for it.

 

[clarky]

Did they? I don't remember this. I played quake 3 and pso online and didn't pay for it.

In Japan and I think they maybe tried it in the US. It was free in Europe.

Quake 3 and PSO online, good times

 

[Calverz]

In Japan and I think they maybe tried it in the US. It was free in Europe.

Quake 3 and PSO online, good times

Yea man it was awesome. It felt so ahead of its time.

 

[Xeela_sunston]

You mean the ones who will impolde super fast If the PS6 weaker than the XSX 2?. I fun seeing PS fanboys rage when the XSX outperforms the PS5, Like 1440p ~ 2160p at a locked frame rate. While the PS5 Is 900p ~ 1440p with 48 ~ 58fps.

I'll laugh If their a PS6 Pro yet the XSX 2 still holds out.

 

[reinking]

You mean the ones who will impolde super fast If the PS6 weaker than the XSX 2?. I fun seeing PS fanboys rage when the XSX outperforms the PS5, Like 1440p ~ 2160p at a locked frame rate. While the PS5 Is 900p ~ 1440p with 48 ~ 58fps.

I'll laugh If their a PS6 Pro yet the XSX 2 still holds out.

 

[Bernardougf]

I've thought a lot more about this since my last post.

It is definitely so we can "hear the lamentations of the women," or in this case xbox fanboys.

In Conan the Barbarian, Conan's master asks him what is best in life. He says to, "To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentation of their women."

lamentation - the passionate expression of grief or sorrow; weeping.

If you think about it, Conan is saying some hard shit. He is saying that he will defeat his enemies and then seem them driven before him(perhaps as slaves?) and then hear "the passionate expression of grief or sorrow; weeping" implying that the men are the enemies and the women are merely indicators of the state of the men, lamentation.

Of course Conan is about barbarism. We are not this. We are modern. Conan is old. We do not want to hurt anyone. However we do have play "enemies" and it is what is best in life to beat them. Usually in sports or videogames. Sometimes in wars like the console wars.

I've fought them all my life. I am more a console warrior than anyone here. I sat down my warrior sticks even if some of the old me creeps out of me from time to time.

...but I can't get over the thought of wanting to hear those console war lamentations once again. They call to me, even now. Their sweet dulcet tones are calling me even now....but I stand for the light. I will not contribute to these things. I am not a better man...but perhaps wiser. There is no control without temptation and I expect to display control here on gaf. So shall we all. Some of us have a competitive drive and these emotions, winning and losing are hard to control. We just have to git gud. It's really simple.

Bro...whatever you're on
.... share this shit ... it's definitely good.

 

[TheThreadsThatBindUs]

This is everyone's approach to competition though. The only difference is the amounts of cash and other financial backing MS may leverage.

Provide proof of your claim or you're full of shit.

 

[ZiggyPop1991]

MS's Xbox is an American company and we need to keep jobs here in the US. For some reason everyone here wants MS to fail and make PS the only player in the console market. This would be extremely bad for everyone.

Also, Xbox gave us Xbox Live, GamePass and Halo. Without those, who knows where we would be.

Competition for a good and we need to buy Xbox products.

Funny. If anything PC gamers are the ones wishing for the death of all consoles, lol. Begging for every game to come pc and having all three become 3rd party publishers only lol. Most want MS to do better. All those studios and the quality is only just getting better.

 

[MilkyJoe]

Because XBox did it to themselves, so fuck them, why should anyone care what happens now.

 

[Karim]

MS's Xbox is an American company and we need to keep jobs here in the US. For some reason everyone here wants MS to fail and make PS the only player in the console market. This would be extremely bad for everyone.

Also, Xbox gave us Xbox Live, GamePass and Halo. Without those, who knows where we would be.

Competition for a good and we need to buy Xbox products.

My wild guess it's because MS tries more to monopolise the market where operate than to offer a good competion, but call me paranoic.

 

[yogaflame]

I think not. For me its just a normal console wars and fanboys. Its actually fun and competitive. For example from what I observe on X, Youtube and Facebook , theNintendo fans from really hates and bitter about Sony PS and its games, same goes with PS towards Nintendo, and same goes with Xbox towards PS, and vice versa.

But this what fuels the industry, the console wars and fanboys and exclusives. Without this elements in gaming competition, the quality will be down and there will be no innovation.

About MS xbox fall, I think the fall of MS xbox is managements and PR fault. MS xbox also has so many followers and fans, but MS alienated so many of them with there bad decisions.

 

[Crayon]

I've thought a lot more about this since my last post.

It is definitely so we can "hear the lamentations of the women," or in this case xbox fanboys.

In Conan the Barbarian, Conan's master asks him what is best in life. He says to, "To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentation of their women."

lamentation - the passionate expression of grief or sorrow; weeping.

If you think about it, Conan is saying some hard shit. He is saying that he will defeat his enemies and then seem them driven before him(perhaps as slaves?) and then hear "the passionate expression of grief or sorrow; weeping" implying that the men are the enemies and the women are merely indicators of the state of the men, lamentation.

Of course Conan is about barbarism. We are not this. We are modern. Conan is old. We do not want to hurt anyone. However we do have play "enemies" and it is what is best in life to beat them. Usually in sports or videogames. Sometimes in wars like the console wars.

I've fought them all my life. I am more a console warrior than anyone here. I sat down my warrior sticks even if some of the old me creeps out of me from time to time.

...but I can't get over the thought of wanting to hear those console war lamentations once again. They call to me, even now. Their sweet dulcet tones are calling me even now....but I stand for the light. I will not contribute to these things. I am not a better man...but perhaps wiser. There is no control without temptation and I expect to display control here on gaf. So shall we all. Some of us have a competitive drive and these emotions, winning and losing are hard to control. We just have to git gud. It's really simple.

Good thoughts but I never got the impression he resented his enemies. He actually liked having someone around to dominate. So that affects the core of the dynamic. Just my interpretation of the character, though.

 

[KeepThemEyesOpen]

I'm not everyone.

 

[Physiognomonics]

competition is good when playing fair, which ms are not. it's a ponzi scheme in order to buy every publishers they can and destroying them in the process. they are using their unlimited money to put all their competitors out of business with no regards for their profits. they want monopoly to make the price/conditions they want, this is what they do.

hopefully with steam and nintendo been so strong they are not succeeding. ironically sony stupid managers are copying them, but that will be their doom as they dont have trillion dollars to pay for their mistakes, only billions so they constantly currently raise prices of everything (hardware, software, services) and devaluating brand value with pc releases, day on pc release will be the end of them as less and less people will buy their ubisoft bland games on consoles and pc. i am talking about 1st party games. death stranding is 3st party and is on xbox. ms may destroy sony the way sega has been (by ea i think)

anywas their pc initiative is a failure. they are selling less overall with pc + console than what they were selling on console (ps4) alone. many of people predicted it would happen.

 

[clappedcheeks]

Competition is dictated by the quality of a product offered and the willingness of the consumer to engage with it. MS are not owed success they have to earn it. The acquisition spree to try and end their competition didn't work for them, but if it did and they eliminated Nintendo and PlayStation, would you be having a call to arms for people to support sony and Nintendo. Is it just MS that we should all be caring about? The 360 era was great and MS contributed an enormous amount to the gaming sphere during the that era, but what have they done since then? They got greedy and wanted the whole pie to themselves and fucked up in the process. I would say the one bright spot would be a reduction in the aggressive astroturfing and shilling by forum members and you tubers, but who am I kidding as they're all on the "just get a PC" train now.

 

[Skyfox]

It's the media. Videogame journalists. It's Sony giving in to the extreme left.

Microsoft is under attack as it is more conservative. These systems of zeitgeist influence are not nothing, sadly.

 

[Skyfox]

Oh and Nintendo has been infiltrated by the left. No where near as bad as Sony. But the rot is already visible to some of us.

 

[Hector Hall]

They're just taking after their cult leaders, sony. Who moneyhatted sega out of business, even refused to give PS2 devkits to devs who were making dreamcast games. Always funny hearing sony fanboys cry about "Xbox is anti-comp". Sony has been following the same business strat since the 90s. Moneyhat all the comp out of business, they thought they did it too. And that's why we got a 600 dollar PS3, with barely any launch games.

Do you have any proof of those nonsenses?

 

[Hector Hall]

It's the media. Videogame journalists. It's Sony giving in to the extreme left.

Microsoft is under attack as it is more conservative. These systems of zeitgeist influence are not nothing, sadly.

I dont think so, it's true about Sony because they moved their SIE HQ to California, home of the mad. That may change in the future, California studios are producing few games and from Asia things as Death Stranding 2, Stellar Blade, Rise of Ronin. and Phantom Blade Zero are coming, wich aren't woke at all.

But MS? Man, they are at California too and just recently the Avowed head was saying things like he despising whites and doing whatever possible not to hire man and wanting the superior black race to take charge of the studio some day.

 

[Roberts]

Avowed head was saying things like he despising whites and doing whatever possible not to hire man and wanting the superior black race to take charge of the studio some day.

Nobody on Avowed team ever said something about hating whites. Do some research before saying stupid shit like that.

 

[Duchess]

I'd rather it was Sega vs Nintendo vs Sony, like we had back in 1996.

In some parallel universe, that's how it's currently playing out.

 

[Begleiter]

They're not competing now is the thing. I want their current direction to fail because it's a net negative for the industry and stops good games getting made, whether their own or from the push they give to Sony or Nintendo to try to stay ahead. I want early (pre-Kinect) 360 era Microsoft back, the version of the company that was actually trying.

 

[Hector Hall]

Nobody on Avowed team ever said something about hating whites. Do some research before saying stupid shit like that.

Things is, I did.

Matt Hansen, art lead of Obsidian, did say explicitly that he hired in a pure race basis as he didn't want more "crusty white men" working in Obsidian.

Later on, some ex workers of Obsidian spoke out and said the policy in Obsidian changed just after the MS buyout and people like Hansen were given the power to persecute and leave it clear that any worker who didn't adhere with the new pronoun policies that misgendered others would be fired. Here you have a link

Obsidian Whistlebower Tells All on 'Avowed' Art Director Matt Hansen Amid Racist Hiring Allegations

A whistleblower from Microsoft-owned Obsidian Entertainment has shone a light on toxic behavior from Avowed art director Matt Hansen.

thatparkplace.com

Maybe it's you who are saying stupid shit don't you think? Maybe he did say explícito I hate all whites, it was an hyperbole, but it's clear he was being racist and discrimination to white me as the Woke soab he is.

 

[ToadMan]

Xbox (hardware but I'm fed up with differentiating all the time) is dead because of competition... Too much competition for Xbox to survive.

It's not for any of us here to save them. It was for them to make a product people were prepared to pay for.

They did that in the 360 gen, but then failed for two straight.

Competition - perhaps even excessive competition - killed them, not lack of competition. And with Xbox gone, there is still a more competitive gaming industry and there will be many more losers going forward.

 

[Roberts]

Things is, I did.

Matt Hansen, art lead of Obsidian, did say explicitly that he hired in a pure race basis as he didn't want more "crusty white men" working in Obsidian.

Later on, some ex workers of Obsidian spoke out and said the policy in Obsidian changed just after the MS buyout and people like Hansen were given the power to persecute and leave it clear that any worker who didn't adhere with the new pronoun policies that misgendered others would be fired. Here you have a link

Obsidian Whistlebower Tells All on 'Avowed' Art Director Matt Hansen Amid Racist Hiring Allegations

A whistleblower from Microsoft-owned Obsidian Entertainment has shone a light on toxic behavior from Avowed art director Matt Hansen.

thatparkplace.com

Maybe it's you who are saying stupid shit don't you think? Maybe he did say explícito I hate all whites, it was an hyperbole, but it's clear he was being racist and discrimination to white me as the Woke soab he is.

OK, let's go back to your initial comment which is, I quote: "Avowed head was saying things like he despising whites and doing whatever possible not to hire man and wanting the superior black race to take charge of the studio some day."

If by Avowed head you mean the project's leader, a director then her name is Carrie Patel. She has never said anything like that. We are talking about Matt Hansen. First of all you link to some random webpage that quotes Grummz, lol, probably the most pathetic grifter in gaming world. Second of all, Hansen direct quote is: "Reminder to Black artists out there who are looking for portfolio reviews or job advice: my DMs are open, and you will always have my priority. We got too many crusty white dudes in this field, please let me help you replace me one day - I want to go back to living in the woods." There is nothing racist about it and if you feel offended by this jokey, self-depreciating message I don't know what to tell you. Obsidian is still predominantly white.

 

[Hector Hall]

OK, let's go back to your initial comment which is, I quote: "Avowed head was saying things like he despising whites and doing whatever possible not to hire man and wanting the superior black race to take charge of the studio some day."

If by Avowed head you mean the project's leader, a director then her name is Carrie Patel. She has never said anything like that. We are talking about Matt Hansen. First of all you link to some random webpage that quotes Grummz, lol, probably the most pathetic grifter in gaming world. Second of all, Hansen direct quote is: "Reminder to Black artists out there who are looking for portfolio reviews or job advice: my DMs are open, and you will always have my priority. We got too many crusty white dudes in this field, please let me help you replace me one day - I want to go back to living in the woods." There is nothing racist about it and if you feel offended by this jokey, self-depreciating message I don't know what to tell you. Obsidian is still predominantly white.

First things first, yes, addressing people by their race, as in Black Artists, is racist.
Second, admitting you put priority into hiring people based on race is racist.
And third, saying you have too many "crusty white men" is a version of the woke "room full of white men" (white women is ok men apparently not so much) that is both exist and racist.