• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
  • Hey Guest. Check out the NeoGAF 2.2 Update Thread for details on our new Giphy integration and other new features.

If Sony made a mobile-console hybrid with Switch-level specs, would fans be more forgiving?

Jubenhimer

Member
Nov 11, 2018
1,618
2,105
560
24
The Nintendo Switch is an impressive device, its Tegra X1 chip allows it to bring PC-level development and graphics tools to a mobile format. That said, it has its limitations as a mobile device, which means high end games ported to the system often have to make concessions to the graphical fidelity and performance vs. other platforms. If you play on the go or only have a Switch, this isn't a bad thing, but to some PlayStation and Xbox fans, it does make the console's actual capabilities somewhat of a joke vs the main systems.

That said, let's say Sony, who's previously been in handheld/mobile gaming with the PSP and PS Vita, decided to make a similar Switch-like device with similar specs to the Switch. Would PlayStation fans be more forgiving of such a device for its capabilities and limitations vs the Switch as they were with the PSP and Vita vs their console counterparts? Sony's prior handhelds were actually much weaker than the consoles they were based on, but I think Sony was able to do a better job at selling the capabilities of those platforms compared to Nintendo, who these days, isn't one to brag about technical specs, which is probably why many PS fans felt the PlayStation handheld were more powerful than they actually were, or at least more forgiving of their hardware limitations. It also helped that Sony had much more powerful home consoles to go with them, meanwhile Nintendo just has the Switch.

Not like it actually matters though, the Switch, PSP, and even the DS have shown that developers don't actually care if your console isn't powerful enough for games. What matters is if it's popular, and easy to develop for. PlayStaiton Vita could've been the same, had it not been for its failure.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Saruhashi

Danjin44

The nicest person on this forum
Mar 22, 2017
15,602
24,753
1,035
I personally don’t mind but I can imagine people who fan of most Sony’s AAA western games would be very pissed.
 

Dante83

Banned
Jan 23, 2012
442
244
585
I think sony is better off not following what nintendo does and concentrate on their best strength, which is a traditional console. Their VR seems good, so they should concentrate on expanding it and make it more seamless and user-friendly for the ps5. PSP and vita are cool and all, but they never really helped sony, especially the vita. I would rather prefer sony to pour more resources into making a bad ass console, better VR and future-proofing their cloud services.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Jagz

xGreir

Member
Apr 1, 2019
172
204
240
I would really like seeing a PS4 portable in the future, full PS4, not her own "portable" thing, and have some space for development and PS5 trough PSNow maybe.

That said, they will copy whatever Nintendo do, but they are far... Worse when installing new system, and don't like to take risks. At all.

I don't think the actual behavior of the Switch community can be called good, is just... Sad. And Developers take advantage of it.
The PS fans are not the same, and for God's sake, they don't have to be actually, for one time.

Sony just failed to sell their last portable, and abandoned it when they could, so I don't trust them even a little, and that would be the real handicap if decided to launch another portable.

In summary, Nintendo and its community should grow up a lot, but they do what Sony don't even dream of on the portable territory, even at "power" disadvantage.
 
Last edited:

SonGoku

Gold Member
Aug 16, 2018
4,759
6,581
635
Sony handheld hw would shit on the switch from great distance but it would also lack the full Nintendo support which carries the switch to great lengths, Sony support would be pisspoor.
 
Last edited:

SonGoku

Gold Member
Aug 16, 2018
4,759
6,581
635
This is based on how they treated the Vita. The PSP had good support.
True but it also had decent 3rd party support which i don't think can happen again and even at its best it pales in comparison to the support Nintendo provides to handhelds let alone now that they unified handheld and console and can focus all dev resources in one platform.
 

bitbydeath

Member
Nov 25, 2015
13,792
22,594
1,200
The VITA problems were not its specs.
It was the lack of 1st party support, the game card size limitation (3.3GB) and the biggest problem of all, ultra expensive proprietary memory cards.

They also tried to make it a portable PS3 without the teams available for that level of support. They’d need to grow more teams specifically aimed at portable games for this to work.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Ar¢tos

Cattlyst

Member
Jan 18, 2019
384
459
330
I don't think there's a market for something like this now the Switch is dominating the handheld space.
 

MagnesG

Member
Apr 20, 2019
2,730
2,084
485
I remember the console plebs shitting on Sony first party efforts during the start of Vita. It's more like they're not gonna win either way.

High specs portables - fans complained about high prices or other side repercussions (proprietary mmc), there's always a catch to make up for those development and manufacturing cost besides battling piracy.
Low specs and affordable prices - fans rage about being underpowered, certain usual Sony devs focusing on graphics are not interested to invest in it, low 3rd party support

Maybe a streaming focused devices could do, for enthusiast..
 

xGreir

Member
Apr 1, 2019
172
204
240
I remember the console plebs shitting on Sony first party efforts during the start of Vita. It's more like they're not gonna win either way.

High specs portables - fans complained about high prices or other side repercussions (proprietary mmc), there's always a catch to make up for those development and manufacturing cost besides battling piracy.
Low specs and affordable prices - fans rage about being underpowered, certain usual Sony devs focusing on graphics are not interested to invest in it, low 3rd party support

Maybe a streaming focused devices could do, for enthusiast..

They just need to continue supporting the Vita, and launch a revision without their dumbass propietary memories.

Sony fault is just being fucking greedy and arrogant, even the WiiU saw a better life, being nowhere near of what the Vita could be.
 

Geki-D

Banned
Dec 6, 2017
4,137
5,167
730
as they were with the PSP and Vita vs their console counterparts? Sony's prior handhelds were actually much weaker than the consoles they were based on
The PSP & Vita weren't "based on" their home consoles, they were stand alone portable systems. The PSP & Vita weren't the only consoles at the time Sony were making, they had home systems too. Nintendo on the other hand right now only has the Switch as both a portable and a home system and it's specs are pretty lame in both cases and that's why people point out how weak the Switch is.

If Sony did make a portable system, it would never replace their more powerful home system and if Sony did make a portable only, you can bet people would be mad.
 

MagnesG

Member
Apr 20, 2019
2,730
2,084
485
They just need to continue supporting the Vita, and launch a revision without their dumbass propietary memories.

Sony fault is just being fucking greedy and arrogant, even the WiiU saw a better life, being nowhere near of what the Vita could be.
The only solution would be to sell at a great loss per unit, which is not feasible at all for some side profits.
Like I said, I'm not sure the demographics are that prepared for an under-powered console, or high specs with the equal high prices, or with any other money saving bullshit.

Vita's support can be equal to WiiU during its 2 years start so yeah they did try for a bit, at the end of the cycle it just makes sense for Sony to stop supporting when they have others to focus on.
 
Last edited:

Jubenhimer

Member
Nov 11, 2018
1,618
2,105
560
24
Nintendo on the other hand right now only has the Switch as both a portable and a home system and it's specs are pretty lame in both cases and that's why people point out how weak the Switch is.

As a mobile device, the Switch is a well enginered and powerful platform for its price. Of course, you might argue that a lot of phones are more powerful these days, but those cost $800+ as well. If Sony was making a Switch like device, its specs actually wouldn't be that far off from the Switch.

And like I said, it doesn't matter anyway. The Switch's success and simple hardware means developers are more than willing to support it with games.
 
  • Like
Reactions: MagnesG

Otterz4Life

Member
Jul 21, 2019
337
323
285
It rather Sony try a new handheld than keep funneling money into PSVR. The failures of the Vita are clear to everyone: it was too expensive and didn’t have enough support.

The PSP was an incredible handheld system that sold rather well. The right product could find success the way the PSP did.
 

Whitecrow

Member
May 7, 2018
1,775
2,667
585
I prefer a mobile-console than a pure console.

That said, Sony must support it properly. Vita support (and propietary SD card) was ****.
 

MagnesG

Member
Apr 20, 2019
2,730
2,084
485
There's also the narrative of Japan audience not being Sony's top priority anymore. Basically fuck handheld players after HQ relocation.
 

Geki-D

Banned
Dec 6, 2017
4,137
5,167
730
The Switch's success and simple hardware means developers are more than willing to support it with games.
Looking at its library, I would seriously call this into question. But this thread isn't about that. Though I can only laugh at your lack of self control; I answered your original question, you couldn't help jumping to the Switch's defence with a totally irrelevant point to the topic at hand :messenger_grinning_smiling:

There's also the narrative of Japan audience not being Sony's top priority anymore. Basically fuck handheld players after HQ relocation.
The Japanese, for the most part (bar big releases), only play on portable devices these days. The home console market has been eaten away by mostly mobile phones. The idea that the single country of Japan is still as relevant as the US (a country with 200 million more people in it) or the whole continent of Europe is wishful thinking. Publishers haven't dropped Japanese interests because they just hate them, it's because in an international market, it would be like putting all of your focus on a single state in the US with the rest of the world being an afterthought.
 
Last edited:
  • LOL
Reactions: Jubenhimer

xGreir

Member
Apr 1, 2019
172
204
240
The only solution would be to sell at a great loss per unit, which is not feasible at all for some side profits.
Like I said, I'm not sure the demographics are that prepared for an under-powered console, or high specs with the equal high prices, or with any other money saving bullshit.

Vita's support can be equal to WiiU during its 2 years start so yeah they did try for a bit, at the end of the cycle it just makes sense for Sony to stop supporting when they have others to focus on.

Trying to not harm anyone, but that is ridiculous.

Don't dare to launch an OLED + propietary expensive memories + 3G tech + sad launch titles, without doing at loss, in a portable form factor.

Even Nintendo had to drop the price.

It was a bad frame time to launch a portable device overpriced, and only Nintendo, that was humble enough, get to sell near 100 million, a fucking hit.

Vita could have been a huge hit with the correct leadership, but they decided to betray all their loyal customers, and that's a horrible mistake.
 

Jubenhimer

Member
Nov 11, 2018
1,618
2,105
560
24
Looking at its library, I would seriously call this into question. But this thread isn't about that. Though I can only laugh at your lack of self control; I answered your original question, you couldn't help jumping to the Switch's defence with a totally irrelevant point to the topic at hand :messenger_grinning_smiling:

It is true. It may lack a lot of the big AAA titles, but the Switch is not exactly starving for content, as most of the lower end games have made its way onto the system. The same was true for the PSP and the first year or so of the Vita. The point is that developers will support a system so long as it has an audience and is easy to develop for. That's why not many PlayStation fans cared if the PSP was underpowered vs the PS3 or PS2, it had games, so people still bought it.
 
Last edited:

MagnesG

Member
Apr 20, 2019
2,730
2,084
485
The Japanese, for the most part (bar big releases), only play on portable devices these days. The home console market has been eaten away by mostly mobile phones. The idea that the single country of Japan is still as relevant as the US (a country with 200 million more people in it) or the whole continent of Europe is wishful thinking. Publishers haven't dropped Japanese interests because they just hate them, it's because in an international market, it would be like putting all of your focus on a single state in the US with the rest of the world being an afterthought.
Everyone had known the reason from the start, doesn't make truth that easy to swallow. Even then, the margin for portable Japanese players are not that small either as well as their buying potential. 3DS sold 25 mil, Vita about 6 mil, PSP 19 mil, Switch is currently 8 mil in Japan only.

PS3 and PS4 only sold 10 and 8 million respectively. Of course the timeframe is all over the place but the point still stands. There's a sizable part of gaming communities Sony had abandoned at some point.

Trying to not harm anyone, but that is ridiculous.

Don't dare to launch an OLED + propietary expensive memories + 3G tech + sad launch titles, without doing at loss, in a portable form factor.

Even Nintendo had to drop the price.

It was a bad frame time to launch a portable device overpriced, and only Nintendo, that was humble enough, get to sell near 100 million, a fucking hit.

Vita could have been a huge hit with the correct leadership, but they decided to betray all their loyal customers, and that's a horrible mistake.
Not defending on Sony here. Yeah, they don't trust the market anymore, or maybe the execs doesn't idk. VR push is definitely related to this decision I think.
 
Last edited:

Murdoch

Member
Mar 11, 2014
530
161
440
I think AAA dev's are missing the point when porting to switch. Something is horribly wrong when Doom 3 launches on the switch and it absolutely blows the new Wolfenstein away for performance and image quality.

Go native res and dial back on the lighting, effects and textures, Keep the image clear and readable. If you honestly can't manage it then don't port your game. You're sullying the name of your studio with really bad ports. Just make a game FOR the platform itself or don't bother. Porting something that runs at sub 600p and 20fps simply doesn't cut it. The device doesn't need those games.
 

xGreir

Member
Apr 1, 2019
172
204
240
I think AAA dev's are missing the point when porting to switch. Something is horribly wrong when Doom 3 launches on the switch and it absolutely blows the new Wolfenstein away for performance and image quality.

Go native res and dial back on the lighting, effects and textures, Keep the image clear and readable. If you honestly can't manage it then don't port your game. You're sullying the name of your studio with really bad ports. Just make a game FOR the platform itself or don't bother. Porting something that runs at sub 600p and 20fps simply doesn't cut it. The device doesn't need those games.

But the community loves them, and are saying to the devs "pls, shit more in our mouths PLSSSS <3333" so...

Maybe having standards is wrong nowadays
 

Saruhashi

Banned
Oct 2, 2018
2,984
7,080
570
The Nintendo Switch is an impressive device, its Tegra X1 chip allows it to bring PC-level development and graphics tools to a mobile format. That said, it has its limitations as a mobile device, which means high end games ported to the system often have to make concessions to the graphical fidelity and performance vs. other platforms. If you play on the go or only have a Switch, this isn't a bad thing, but to some PlayStation and Xbox fans, it does make the console's actual capabilities somewhat of a joke vs the main systems.

That said, let's say Sony, who's previously been in handheld/mobile gaming with the PSP and PS Vita, decided to make a similar Switch-like device with similar specs to the Switch. Would PlayStation fans be more forgiving of such a device for its capabilities and limitations vs the Switch as they were with the PSP and Vita vs their console counterparts? Sony's prior handhelds were actually much weaker than the consoles they were based on, but I think Sony was able to do a better job at selling the capabilities of those platforms compared to Nintendo, who these days, isn't one to brag about technical specs, which is probably why many PS fans felt the PlayStation handheld were more powerful than they actually were, or at least more forgiving of their hardware limitations. It also helped that Sony had much more powerful home consoles to go with them, meanwhile Nintendo just has the Switch.

Not like it actually matters though, the Switch, PSP, and even the DS have shown that developers don't actually care if your console isn't powerful enough for games. What matters is if it's popular, and easy to develop for. PlayStaiton Vita could've been the same, had it not been for its failure.

I think the attitude in the west is always working against any mobile console and people are unforgiving and also have unrealistic expectations.
Even when the PSP and Vita were a thing it was not uncommon to see people complaining about graphics and going on about how everything looked awful.

There will always be a decent chunk of the community who will NEVER get over the fact that a mobile console is not going to rival your main home consoles or a high end PC.

You have a large portion of customers for whom "graphics" is the main thing they care about and so a mobile console is not going to give them the experience that they want. There seem to be less people around who are looking for a mobile console gaming experience.

The need to release "ports" doesn't help. Say the PS5 comes out in 2020 and then in 2022 Playstation has another go at a portable console. It's not going to be at the same level as PS5 but they will undoubtedly try to give you ported PS5 games on the console and inevitably people will make comparisons and you are in a situation where you are buying an inferior version of the game just to play on the go.

Switch gets around this mostly on the strength and exclusivity of Nintendo first party and the fact that the indie scene is so strong.
Even then you still have an underlying obsession with specs that casts a shadow over everything.

If there were some way for Sony to come out with a portable PS3 right now and then they would release the PS3 back catalog over time I would be really up for something like that but you know the community would just moan about "ports from 10 years ago" and "ugly graphics".

Mobile gaming seems like a no-win situation if you are trying to sell to hardcore console gamers.
 
Jan 3, 2019
841
1,389
395
I don't want that. Sony must focus on their core business and new tech, like VR. Portable or mobile is a Nintendo / smartphones thing.
 

JordanN

Banned
Apr 21, 2012
23,204
18,258
1,245
Brampton, Ontario
As a mobile device, the Switch is a well enginered and powerful platform for its price. Of course, you might argue that a lot of phones are more powerful these days, but those cost $800+ as well. If Sony was making a Switch like device, its specs actually wouldn't be that far off from the Switch.

And like I said, it doesn't matter anyway. The Switch's success and simple hardware means developers are more than willing to support it with games.
Is this the same myth similar to "you can't build a more powerful PC than console for the same price"?

Given how crazy competitive the mobile phone market is, I wouldn't be surprised if the gap between Switch and mobile was even bigger, regardless of price.
To even prove this, I had to replace my old phone with a new one after losing it, 2 days ago. I was able to find one with a 720p screen for only $99. The same price I paid for my original phone from 3 years ago.

I can only imagine what a $400 phone must be like in comparison.
 
Last edited:

Jubenhimer

Member
Nov 11, 2018
1,618
2,105
560
24
To even prove this, I had to replace my old phone with a new one after losing it, 2 days ago. I was able to find one with a 720p screen for only $99. The same price I paid for my original phone from 3 years ago.

Screens are dirt cheap, I don't think resolution is a perfect indicator for the actual internals. And that's not taking into account things like the fan and controllers.
 

xGreir

Member
Apr 1, 2019
172
204
240
I think the attitude in the west is always working against any mobile console and people are unforgiving and also have unrealistic expectations.
Even when the PSP and Vita were a thing it was not uncommon to see people complaining about graphics and going on about how everything looked awful.

There will always be a decent chunk of the community who will NEVER get over the fact that a mobile console is not going to rival your main home consoles or a high end PC.

You have a large portion of customers for whom "graphics" is the main thing they care about and so a mobile console is not going to give them the experience that they want. There seem to be less people around who are looking for a mobile console gaming experience.

The need to release "ports" doesn't help. Say the PS5 comes out in 2020 and then in 2022 Playstation has another go at a portable console. It's not going to be at the same level as PS5 but they will undoubtedly try to give you ported PS5 games on the console and inevitably people will make comparisons and you are in a situation where you are buying an inferior version of the game just to play on the go.

Switch gets around this mostly on the strength and exclusivity of Nintendo first party and the fact that the indie scene is so strong.
Even then you still have an underlying obsession with specs that casts a shadow over everything.

If there were some way for Sony to come out with a portable PS3 right now and then they would release the PS3 back catalog over time I would be really up for something like that but you know the community would just moan about "ports from 10 years ago" and "ugly graphics".

Mobile gaming seems like a no-win situation if you are trying to sell to hardcore console gamers.

Isn't Switch the PS3 portable? Skyrim says so :messenger_tears_of_joy:

Is this the same myth similar to "you can't build a more powerful PC than console for the same price"?



Given how crazy competitive the mobile phone market is, I wouldn't be surprised if the gap between Switch and mobile was even bigger, regardless of price.

To even prove this, I had to replace my old phone with a new one after losing it, 2 days ago. I was able to find one with a 720p screen for only $99. The same price I paid for my original phone from 3 years ago.



I can only imagine what a $400 phone must be like in comparison.

Screens are not proof of anything, BUT look at phones like the pocophone F1 among others.

The truth is that in that very moment, the Tegra X1 was the most powerful chip accesible, and still hold its horses nowadays, but the development is so fast that we have already ps4 level chips out there, and can be done at marginal prices compared to the giants brands
 
Last edited:

JordanN

Banned
Apr 21, 2012
23,204
18,258
1,245
Brampton, Ontario
Screens are dirt cheap, I don't think resolution is a perfect indicator for the actual internals. And that's not taking into account things like the fan and controllers.
So why did the 3DS & PS Vita have completely different screen resolutions despite coming out a few months from each other (240p vs 540p)?

A higher resolution will push more pixels, which requires more processing grunt. I don't expect my $99 phone in 2019 to be a beast, but consider at minimum, you need something to be at the level of OG Xbox to run those specs.

Give it 2 or 3 years, and we'll probably see $99 phones with 1080p screens and Xbox 360 level performance. And of course, phones that cost $400 or more would be farther ahead of the Switch.
 
Last edited:

Jubenhimer

Member
Nov 11, 2018
1,618
2,105
560
24
Isn't Switch the PS3 portable? Skyrim says so :messenger_tears_of_joy:

Not really. It's got more than 4x the RAM to work with, and it's GPU is based on PC archetecture, rather than the custom hardware of the PS3. the Switch is at least 2x the power of the PS3, and is much easier to develop for.
 

xGreir

Member
Apr 1, 2019
172
204
240
Not really. It's got more than 4x the RAM to work with, and it's GPU is based on PC archetecture, rather than the custom hardware of the PS3. the Switch is at least 2x the power of the PS3, and is much easier to develop for.

You didn't get the point
🤷‍♀️
 
Last edited:

Jubenhimer

Member
Nov 11, 2018
1,618
2,105
560
24
So why did the 3DS & PS Vita have completely different screen resolutions despite coming out in the same year with each other (240p vs 540p)?

For the Vita, Sony was most likely selling the system at a loss at the time, and for Nintendo, the extra cost was due to the Parallax barrier tech. There's a lot of additional costs that go into a gaming device that phones don't account for.
 

JordanN

Banned
Apr 21, 2012
23,204
18,258
1,245
Brampton, Ontario
Not really. It's got more than 4x the RAM to work with, and it's GPU is based on PC archetecture, rather than the custom hardware of the PS3. the Switch is at least 2x the power of the PS3, and is much easier to develop for.
To be honest, that doesn't actually make it more powerful.

The PS3 was designed in a way to take advantage of its more powerful CPU (which is technically faster than the one in PS4 and only slightly slower than the XBO).



The PS3 was truly a monster when games were designed for it.
 
Last edited:

Jubenhimer

Member
Nov 11, 2018
1,618
2,105
560
24
The PS3 was designed in a way to take advantage of its more powerful CPU (which is technically faster than the ones in PS4/XBO).

Sure, but the PS3 was notoriously overcomplicated with its CPU, that it didn't matter.
 

Eimran

Member
Apr 5, 2018
377
1,118
435
The VITA problems were not its specs.
It was the lack of 1st party support, the game card size limitation (3.3GB) and the biggest problem of all, ultra expensive proprietary memory cards.
Actually the specs were also a reason the Vita failed. They were too good. I know that sounds weird but because of the high specs, the game standards were higher and so were the costs. So developers had to put the same effort to produce AAA games as they did with consoles. And this was a big financial risk considering the sales of the unbeatable DS and the upcoming smartphone market, so nor the developers nor the costumers had much Faith in the Vita. Because of that fewer games were made which resulted in fewer systems sold, which led again to fewer games.... Eventually this led the poor overpowered system in a downward spiral of which escaping was difficult. But since Sony dropped the system like a brick, it was impossible.

So OT: no, Sony lost my trust in handheld gaming. They should stick to consoles.
 

JordanN

Banned
Apr 21, 2012
23,204
18,258
1,245
Brampton, Ontario
Sure, but the PS3 was notoriously overcomplicated with its CPU, that it didn't matter.
???

Sony's 1st party games disagree.

Even third party developers were able to do things with it and even switched to making PS3 the lead platform over Xbox.





I wish I could find the slide, but I remember a developer even admitted that working with the PS3 actually taught them how to take advantage of parallel processing on the next gen consoles.
This slide comes close, but I distinctly remember a developer was talking about going from PS3 to PS4 and that it was the PS3 that helped them make the transition.

 
Last edited:

Jubenhimer

Member
Nov 11, 2018
1,618
2,105
560
24
???

Sony's 1st party games disagree.

Even third party developers were able to do things with it and even switched to making PS3 the lead platform over Xbox.

Sure, but in the end, Cell wasn't the right direction to go in, which is why Sony switched to off-shelf x86 for the PS4. There's little point in super-powered CPU if it takes half the generation to figure out how it works.
 
Last edited:

JordanN

Banned
Apr 21, 2012
23,204
18,258
1,245
Brampton, Ontario
Sure, but in the end, Cell wasn't the right direction to go in, which is why Sony switched to off-shelf x86 for the PS4.
The PS4's CPU was terrible and was already outclassed by even weak PC's.

PS3 was more expensive/exotic, but it did pay off in supporting future game development and even computer research.
 
Last edited:

Jubenhimer

Member
Nov 11, 2018
1,618
2,105
560
24
The PS4's CPU was terrible and was already outclassed by even weak PC's.

But developers didn't care, it was simple and easy to work with. And was good enough for what many wanted to do. That's really what people seem to forget, everybody always says that Nintendo needs to make the most powerful console to compete with Sony and Microsoft, but the reality is most developers don't care about RAW number specs. They care about about easy to use, and popular hardware.
 

JordanN

Banned
Apr 21, 2012
23,204
18,258
1,245
Brampton, Ontario
But developers didn't care, it was simple and easy to work with. And was good enough for what many wanted to do. That's really what people seem to forget, everybody always says that Nintendo needs to make the most powerful console to compete with Sony and Microsoft, but the reality is most developers don't care about RAW number specs. They care about about easy to use, and popular hardware.
It goes either way.

Valve once said they were never going to release games on PS3 only a few years later Gabe shows up on stage and announces Portal 2.

Developers supported PS3 or PS4 in spite of how powerful it was.

Speaking as a consumer though, I did prefer the PS3 giving me a more powerful design compared to the PS4 where the slower CPU did affect game development. Sony is in the business of making money, but that doesn't mean me as a consumer shouldn't wish for better specs.
 
Last edited:

MagnesG

Member
Apr 20, 2019
2,730
2,084
485
So why did the 3DS & PS Vita have completely different screen resolutions despite coming out a few months from each other (240p vs 540p)?

A higher resolution will push more pixels, which requires more processing grunt. I don't expect my $99 phone in 2019 to be a beast, but consider at minimum, you need something to be at the level of OG Xbox to run those specs.

Give it 2 or 3 years, and we'll probably see $99 phones with 1080p screens and Xbox 360 level performance. And of course, phones that cost $400 or more would be farther ahead of the Switch.
Vita was sold at a loss with even their predatory memory cards tactics. 3DS was sold much much cheaper after the price cut.

Cheap phones doesn't the battery capacity, thermal designs nor controllers to work properly as a dedicated portable consoles. They'd be dead in 30 mins, or melt in your hands. Also phone prices would always win because the factory prices for their counterparts are cheaper due higher demands.

Also Switch lite will be sold for $200 later.
 
Last edited:

Jubenhimer

Member
Nov 11, 2018
1,618
2,105
560
24
It goes either way.

Valve once said they were never going to release games on PS3 only a few years later Gabe shows up on stage and announces Portal 2.

Developers supported PS3 or PS4 in spite of how powerful it was.

But also remember that it took Sony stepping in to actually try and help these developers understand the Cell before that happened. And Indies didn't exist in the same fashion that they do today, to the Cell was even more of a headache for them to figure out. The PS4 traded significant CPU power in order to be easy and accessible to all developers. It's a big reason why it's so successful.
 

JordanN

Banned
Apr 21, 2012
23,204
18,258
1,245
Brampton, Ontario
Vita was sold at a loss with even their predatory memory cards tactics. 3DS was sold much much cheaper after the price cut.

Cheap phones doesn't the battery capacity, thermal designs nor controllers to work properly as a dedicated portable consoles. They'd be dead in 30 mins, or melt in your hands. Also phone prices would always win because the factory prices for their counterparts are cheaper due higher demands.

Also Switch lite will be sold for $200 later.
Eh, not true. I don't even play mobile games, but I decided to browse the marketplace and even old console games like GTA: San Andreas have been ported to it.

The reason why we don't see more AAA games is because Casuals are the main audience. But if phones continue to get more powerful and become more accessible, then we will no doubt see AAA developers step up the effort and comparisons will be made to what the Switch can do.

 
Last edited:

JordanN

Banned
Apr 21, 2012
23,204
18,258
1,245
Brampton, Ontario
But also remember that it took Sony stepping in to actually try and help these developers understand the Cell before that happened. And Indies didn't exist in the same fashion that they do today, to the Cell was even more of a headache for them to figure out. The PS4 traded significant CPU power in order to be easy and accessible to all developers. It's a big reason why it's so successful.
PS4 was still going to be a success because one company wanted to ban used-games and force always online (Xbox One) and the other was selling a home console that confused people into thinking it was a tablet add-on for their old one (Wii U).

PS4 being more powerful wouldn't have changed this. Hell, IT IS the most powerful console this generation. It's only been dethroned after Xbox One X and the PS4 Pro came out later.
 
Last edited:

Jubenhimer

Member
Nov 11, 2018
1,618
2,105
560
24
PS4 was still going to be a success because one company wanted to ban used-games and force always online (Xbox One) and the other was selling a home console that confused people into thinking it was a tablet add-on for their old one (Wii U).

PS4 being more powerful wouldn't have changed this.

Sure, Sony Captializing on the other two floundering made things easier for them and sealed the deal, but dumping exotic hardware in favor of stuff most developers actually wanted was what helped give the PS4 a significant edge. The Cell had a lot of potential, obviously, but in the end, most devs just want good cheap tech, and the PS4 gave that to them.
 
Jan 29, 2019
5,209
5,454
495
We already have Nintendo...

Seriously, what they could do is release a portable ps4 compatible machine with a 7nm chip inside, some fast storage soldered on the board (if it makes the power consumption low enough).... Maybe on the 5nm node. With backward compatibility it may work.

Digital only, obviously.
 

JordanN

Banned
Apr 21, 2012
23,204
18,258
1,245
Brampton, Ontario
Sure, Sony Captializing on the other two floundering made things easier for them and sealed the deal, but dumping exotic hardware in favor of stuff most developers actually wanted was what helped give the PS4 a significant edge. The Cell had a lot of potential, obviously, but in the end, most devs just want good cheap tech, and the PS4 gave that to them.
Actually, what we saw was more developers target PC instead.

In fact, consoles going for the "shared architecture" actually meant they got the worst version of multiplatform games that today, most low end PCs can easily outperform them.

If PS4 had more powerful specs, the results would still be the same. PC games would have lead first, followed by PS4/PS4 Pro/Xbox One X, and then Xbox One at the bottom.
 
Last edited:

MagnesG

Member
Apr 20, 2019
2,730
2,084
485
Eh, not true. I don't even play mobile games, but I decided to browse the marketplace and even old consoles games like GTA: San Andreas has been ported to it.

The reason why we don't see more AAA games is because Casuals are the main audience. But if phones continue to get more powerful and become more accessible, then we will no doubt see AAA developers step up the effort and comparisons will be made to what the Switch can do.

I said all of those with regards to cheap $99 phones, they obviously would never have those capacity because they're not designed for that. Switch at its launch was already the flagship portable console using the most advanced technology suitable for its price.
GTA: San Andreas is a PS2 port with framerates lagging if not played on at least medium tier phones, less vehicle roaming and city busywork, and multiple other alterations to make it accessible as much as possible.
High end phones can indeed be more powerful, make sense with their price there's no denying that. Though ultimately it was still a phone, even the licensing stuffs would be wildly different between those two.

Also, the Fortnite video is comparing the Switch with latest the Galaxy and Iphone. Switch still wins in terms of stability and endurance even with its $300 price.
 
Last edited:

HeresJohnny

Member
Mar 14, 2018
9,844
22,803
750
I like Sony just as they are. It’s where I go for most of my gaming needs, and that works for me. This next time around, I’m hoping to only buy one console, so I want them to just keep doing what they do best.