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If your not playing your XSX/PS5 on a proper HDR set you are not doing the games justice

Magic Carpet

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I meant the bolded part here, I thought you meant 953 was HDR in dynamic mode and 767 was in a more accurate picture mode. Did you mean to write SDR for the 2nd bolded line?
I was unaware that you had to put it in Dynamic to get that 953 Brightness. If so owch thats a bad picture in Dynamic. I'm pretty sure the 2nd bolded is the color acurate HDR number 767.
 
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Zathalus

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Good HDR requires two things, a good screen and a good source. Getting the screen is easy, anything with good FALD, Oled, of Mini-LED should do the trick. Getting the latter, especially for games, is much trickier. Some are terrible quite terrible such as RDR2 or Cyberpunk. Others like Forza or Ori are amazing.

HDR gaming on PC is a bit of a shitshow, unless you use a TV or pay tons of money for a good monitor. Most 'HDR' monitors are a joke.
 
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Warnen

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Oled here and Xbox series x games look fantastic. Wish I had vrr to but didn’t want to spend that much on a tv when I mostly watch movies on it.
 
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Magic Carpet

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HDR gaming on PC is a bit of a shitshow
I've outright given up on HDR on my PC with my TV.
The Sun, Moon, and rotation of Thomas Edison in his grave have to align to even get it to work.
So much as change a setting anywhere, a resolution, a window mode, a restart, a crash, anything and it all she wrote.
Something major needs to change or be implemented in PC on graphics cards before it's even a thing.
 
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FUBARx89

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Good HDR requires two things, a good screen and a good source. Getting the screen is easy, anything with good FALD, Oled, of Mini-LED should do the trick. Getting the latter, especially for games, is much trickier. Some are terrible quite terrible such as RDR2 or Cyberpunk. Others like Forza or Ori are amazing.

HDR gaming on PC is a bit of a shitshow, unless you use a TV or pay tons of money for a good monitor. Most 'HDR' monitors are a joke.

Oooof, I'd be careful with that opinion. Last time I said HDR is still a busted piece of shite on RDR2 I got piled on saying I'm wrong and it's perfect 😂
 

Kuranghi

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Good HDR requires two things, a good screen and a good source. Getting the screen is easy, anything with good FALD, Oled, of Mini-LED should do the trick. Getting the latter, especially for games, is much trickier. Some are terrible quite terrible such as RDR2 or Cyberpunk. Others like Forza or Ori are amazing.

HDR gaming on PC is a bit of a shitshow, unless you use a TV or pay tons of money for a good monitor. Most 'HDR' monitors are a joke.

Ori 2 HDR was completely broken for me, looked really bad, this was on PC. The highlights were overbrightened and blown out, the shadows *edit* had less detail than the SDR shadows *edit* and the colours were oversaturated so for example the subtle blue glow on Ori became far too blue.

Were you playing on Xbox? Did you tweak any of the sliders from the default positions?

I was really disappointed and went back to SDR after waiting a month for them to put HDR in the PC version. You can see the problems here:



Mostly the first 3 images, the last 2 I was just showing how it looked for a dev I was communicating with who suggested I increase and decrease brightness to fix the issues I was seeing.
 
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FrankieSab

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Ori 2 HDR was completely broken for me, looked really bad, this was on PC. The highlights were overbrightened and blown out, the shadows were elevated and the colours were oversaturated so for example the subtle blue glow on Ori became far too blue.

Were you playing on Xbox? Did you tweak any of the sliders from the default positions?

I was really disappointed and went back to SDR after waiting a month for them to put HDR in the PC version. You can see the problems here:



Mostly the first 3 images, the last 2 I was just showing how it looked for a dev I was communicating with who suggested I increase and decrease brightness to fix the issues I was seeing.
Beware, you cannot see an HDR image on a SDR display. Those kind of comparison are useless unless let's say you see an HDR encoded video on youtube on an HDR tv.
 

Kuranghi

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Oooof, I'd be careful with that opinion. Last time I said HDR is still a busted piece of shite on RDR2 I got piled on saying I'm wrong and it's perfect 😂

Nah you're right, it was a busted piece of shit at launch and nowadays its better but still didn't cross the line into territory that makes it close to being better than the SDR output overall.

Most people love the HDR in God of War but I found it trash too, elevated black level, oversaturated colour at default settings and no clear way to match it back the artistic intent seen in the SDR output.

The bushes look radioactive and Kratos looks like he's just drank a Tango:

 

Kuranghi

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Beware, you cannot see an HDR image on a SDR display. Those kind of comparison are useless unless let's say you see an HDR encoded video on youtube on an HDR tv.

I'm aware of that, but its not a useless comparison because those images are tonemapped to SDR, it still gives you an idea of how the tonemapping/image looks in HDR. Thats how the highlights and shadows looked when in-game, in HDR. It was even worse than that really, since the highlights were so over-bright. It looked like it was done automatically with no regard to the original art.
 
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FrankieSab

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I'm aware of that, but its not a useless comparison because those images are tonemapped to SDR, it still gives you an idea of how the tonemapping/image looks in HDR. Thats how the highlights and shadows looked when in-game, in HDR. It was even worse than that really, since the highlights were so over-bright. It looked like it was done automatically with no regard to the original art.
Not sure this technique works, it always depends on your tv settings as well. Ori is one of the best HDR game that I had played on XBOX , they improved the HDR color mapping on their latest patch. I do not know if your comparison is before that? Ori and the Will of the Wisps gets major HDR patch on Xbox One and PC | Windows Central
 

Kuranghi

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Not sure this technique works, it always depends on your tv settings as well. Ori is one of the best HDR game that I had played on XBOX , they improved the HDR color mapping on their latest patch. I do not know if your comparison is before that? Ori and the Will of the Wisps gets major HDR patch on Xbox One and PC | Windows Central

Yeah, I waited for that patch, still looked awful on my end. I still believe it was broken (either on my end or in general on PC) and not working as intended tbh, the default contrast setting was completely insane, as in anyone who knew anything about how an image should look would not say it looked correct or good, even in isolation with no SDR to compare it to.

If you aren't interested in an accurate image it could look great for you, I know a huge amount of people run their TVs with all settings maxed out so they prefer that oversaturated image with crushed shadows/blacks, like so many reshade filters that are made for games so fair enough if thats what you prefer but I'm all about seeing the artistic intent.

I have a feeling it looked a lot different on Xbox, as in it was working. Here is a random guy playing it in HDR on PC, if you watch the tonemapped SDR version you can still see the issues I pointed out but if I watch it in HDR its insanely garish for me, highlights are blown out, the colour is oversaturated:



If you have a TV with poor contrast then maybe that would counter the too high contrast and dull the oversaturated colours. and if the TV can't do bright highlights then the whole thing won't look as garish but the highlights will still be blown out, more so probably even.

No offense meant if you enjoyed it, as I said its a personal preference thing and maybe its totally different on Xbox vs. PC anyway.

edit - BTW, what do you mean by the bolded?
 
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FrankieSab

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Yeah, I waited for that patch, still looked awful on my end. I still believe it was broken (either on my end or in general on PC) and not working as intended tbh, the default contrast setting was completely insane, as in anyone who knew anything about how an image should look would not say it looked correct or good, even in isolation with no SDR to compare it to.

If you aren't interested in an accurate image it could look great for you, I know a huge amount of people run their TVs with all settings maxed out so they prefer that oversaturated image with crushed shadows/blacks, like so many reshade filters that are made for games so fair enough if thats what you prefer but I'm all about seeing the artistic intent.

I have a feeling it looked a lot different on Xbox, as in it was working. Here is a random guy playing it in HDR on PC, if you watch the tonemapped SDR version you can still see the issues I pointed out but if I watch it in HDR its insanely garish for me, highlights are blown out, the colour is oversaturated:



If you have a TV with poor contrast then maybe that would counter the too high contrast and dull the oversaturated colours. and if the TV can't do bright highlights then the whole thing won't look as garish but the highlights will still be blown out, more so probably even.

No offense meant if you enjoyed it, as I said its a personal preference thing and maybe its totally different on Xbox vs. PC anyway.

edit - BTW, what do you mean by the bolded?
Some say HDR is alway broken on PC, I cannot tell, I always play on consoles. I do not like oversaturated picture, my HDR settings are well calibrated for my taste. Are-you talking to me for your last question? Never said anything about the bolded...
 

Kuranghi

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Some say HDR is alway broken on PC, I cannot tell, I always play on consoles. I do not like oversaturated picture, my HDR settings are well calibrated for my taste. Are-you talking to me for your last question? Never said anything about the bolded...

Its definitely not broken all the time, I've played many games in HDR on PC and they looked amazing. I do love how easy HDR is on console, so much better yeah, just set it and forget it.

If you aren't into an inaccurate picture that indicates to me the HDR is definitely different on PC than Xbox. The main menu looked so mental in Ori 2 in HDR on the PC at default settings you'd definitely dislike that if you saw it on Xbox I'm sure.

Its all good about the last part. What display do you use for HDR btw?
 

FrankieSab

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Its definitely not broken all the time, I've played many games in HDR on PC and they looked amazing. I do love how easy HDR is on console, so much better yeah, just set it and forget it.

If you aren't into an inaccurate picture that indicates to me the HDR is definitely different on PC than Xbox. The main menu looked so mental in Ori 2 in HDR on the PC at default settings you'd definitely dislike that if you saw it on Xbox I'm sure.

Its all good about the last part. What display do you use for HDR btw?
LG Oled BX
 
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Gamer79

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Not only ps5, ps4 also looks great in hdr sets.

Also, yes, proper hdr must be OLED. It's fantastic. I can't afford it, but I've seen it ... It's my next goal.
I was looking at an OLED but do not want it. They dont' get bright enough for my Taking. Go with Quantum LED or Qled. Much cheaper and have better pictures in my opinon.
 
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rofif

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I was looking at an OLED but do not want it. They dont' get bright enough for my Taking. Go with Quantum LED or Qled. Much cheaper and have better pictures in my opinon.
If You play in a bright/day room, Oled is 100% too dark in hdr.
But it is a delight in a shaded/evening/night room
 
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StateofMajora

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What's a proper 4K set though?
For hdr - LG c1/g1 with hgig (bad QA atm though), or Sony fald lcd are the best options. Specifically older Sony models. But current ones will do if you have no choice.

Bare *minimum* to get anything of value out of hdr would be a fald lcd, even vizio M series.

In general current tvs should be a lot better than they are but companies are dragging their feet. No hgig for Sony and not pushing zone count on lcd are particular wtfs.
 
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Gamer79

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For people who don't want to break the bank: You DO NOT NEED AN OLED: Yes they have the deepest blacks but also lack peak brightness in some areas and have the burn int worry.

You can get either the HISENSE H9G or the TCL R635 in the 55inch variety for less than $700. The Hisense has a much better picture while the TCL has more modern features like 120hz support.
To me the most important issues for me is Picture Quality. I went with the Hisense and love it!

Rtings has the Hisense HG9 as their best "budget" tv. About Half the price of an Oled with much higher peak brightness. Rtings measured the Hisense H9G peaks brightness at over 1400nits. The tv simply has an amazing picture especially under $800.

 
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underwater

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Wrong. Qleds are really close to the black level of OLED's but Get Much brighter without the worry of Burn in. QLED all day for me.
QLED is a branding applied to sets which have a technology related to color gamut. QLED has got nothing to do with black level or HDR. There are sets which fall under the QLED banner that have atrocious black levels .. there are also sets which have okay black levels. It depends entirely on the other features of the set.

To get back to the issue at hand, good HDR requires high contrast between adjacent pixels. This is something that no LCD set can do well.
 
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underwater

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Why people keep saying this when it's not true?

LED TV's are objectively better at HDR content.
Look at the bottom left of this LCD TV set. (It is a HG9 praised by the poster above)

The intent for the scene is to have the metallic parts of the armor - the shoulder piece and rivets - very bright (glinting) against the black of the armor.
But the panel is simply not capable of high contrast in such close proximity. Everything in the lower left of the frame - the black material and even the letterbox - has the luminance raised, and displays a horrible blue glow.

This is bloom, every LCD set has it to some degree. A set which suffers from this problem does not have "proper" HDR no matter what the manufacturer specs says, because subjectively the picture is crap.

 

Genx3

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Look at the bottom left of this LCD TV set. (It is a HG9 praised by the poster above)

The intent for the scene is to have the metallic parts of the armor - the shoulder piece and rivets - very bright (glinting) against the black of the armor.
But the panel is simply not capable of high contrast in such close proximity. Everything in the lower left of the frame - the black material and even the letterbox - has the luminance raised, and displays a horrible blue glow.

This is bloom, every LCD set has it to some degree. A set which suffers from this problem does not have "proper" HDR no matter what the manufacturer specs says, because subjectively the picture is crap.


When making a proper comparison you should at a minimum use TV's in the same price range.
So if you want to compare HDR on a $2,000 OLED then you should compare it to a $2,000 LED TV.

Of course Premium TV's should have better features and quality.

OLED's have perfect blacks, over all better picture quality with less blooming and better contrast with trade offs like burn in and fading colors with time.

LED's have way higher brightness, better HDR and reliability.
 
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Rubik8

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Can confirm. I just got a 4k OLED with HDR and it’s a game changer. I want to go back and replay all the PS5 games I finished on my crappy 1080p relic.
 

Reizo Ryuu

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Only use HDR for movies/shows on my set, have it disabled on my XSX.
Dolby vision looks fantastic on movies/shows, HDR10 is no slouch either, but it's been a mixed bag on games so far; the best one has been ori for me.
 
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skit_data

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Yeah, I will need to get one. It will probably be my next investment, because HUDs and text in games are starting to feel too much small as well. I’m sitting like this at times:


Everytime I’m playing at my cousins 65” 4k HDR TV I’m blown away.
 

Genx3

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Only use HDR for movies/shows on my set, have it disabled on my XSX.
Dolby vision looks fantastic on movies/shows, HDR10 is no slouch either, but it's been a mixed bag on games so far; the best one has been ori for me.
for the most part Games look great in HDR as well.
 

Genx3

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Every expert would disagree. And every av enthusiast.
Here's a Vizio OLED that costs $350 more than the Vizio Quantum X LED TV.

Yet according Rtings they perform similar in HDR content.
With HDR Movies receiving an 8.6 and Gaming an 8.7 on the LED.
The OLED received an 8.7 for movies and 8.8 for gaming.

Mind you the OLED is $350 more expensive.

Now a Samsung Q90A received an 8.6 for movies and 8.8 for gaming.

The fact OLED has limited brightness is it's limiting factor.
 
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I have HDR turned completely off on my XSX, I just cannot stand the eye-melting whites when it comes to subtitles and HUD/UI elements for more than 5min, literally. If I only could I'd disable the feature entirely directly on the TV (LG GX), because Netflix, YT etc. are also waaay to bright for 30-60min. sittings, let alone anything longer.

I tried HDR with like 40% brightness for some time, but then I asked myself, do I even get any benefits of the tech at all? Where sure, the bright stuff is now tolerable but everything else is so damn dimmed, washed out of color? So I went back to SDR and haven't looked back ever since. But that's one of the many reasons I went with an OLED panel instead of LCD, because the colors and contrast are amazing regardless, the only game where I personally saw noticeable difference was The Touryst, but other than I haven't miss HDR even once.

 

StateofMajora

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Every expert would disagree. And every av enthusiast.
Not for specular highlight detail ; high nit lcd when done properly is objectively superior.

For darker hdr content Oled wins.

If Sony can bother to make a mini led x90/95k next year with hgig support, after all the hdr displays I’ve used, I would say that’s going to be the best hdr for gaming overall.

Haven’t personally seen the z9d from 2016, but that is unbeatable in terms of 4K lcd atm.

But I will say I was very impressed by lg c1’s hdr and if you have that you can’t really beat it in terms of 2021 4K TVs. Well I guess the step up g1 but that’s it.
 
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Buggy Loop

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To make a long story short. I am playing my ps5 on a Quantum LED 4k tv set with over 1000 nit brightness. Colors pop and the contrast is amazing. I took my library of games over my buddies house and he is playing on a 4 year old 1080p Samsung. Holy shit the difference is night and day. He doesn't have HDR and games often look flat and bland in comparision. It's equivalent of playing an Xbox 360 on a 480p flatscreen. Food for thought!

And peoples complain about PC prices? These “proper” panels are worth more than my whole setup.
 
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Artistic

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You can't get a better picture in this price range. Sure it lacks 120htz but I never would be using that feature anyway

I bought a TCL 5 series back in March. Is that any good HDR wise?
 

ZywyPL

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Tried messing with HDR yesterday for quite some time, and sorry but I stand for what I wrote, until HDR is applied in the pipeline before HUD/UI elements, then that's a no go for me. And no, the difference isn't anything near "massive" or "huge" with exception of just a handful of examples, whether in games or movies, the implementation in most cases if half-assed, sometimes even artificially added on SDR material, just like the fake 3D back in the days.
 
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MrFunSocks

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I have a ks8000 and have never been able to tell the difference between HDR on or off after calibrating it correctly.
Then you must not correctly have HDR turned on, or must be playing non HDR games.

This isn’t some opinion based thing - HDR is significantly different to SDR, and if you actually can’t see a difference you either have completely horrible eyesight or aren’t actually viewing HDR.
 
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Dibils2k

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i play with alot of ambient light, HDR is just not worth it, i play in SDR with high backlight and it looks brighter and is easier to see

for movies though, HDR all the way
 

MilkyJoe

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I'm not paying stupid money for a feature like HDR. When you can get 1000 nits Dolby Vision for £299 then I'll see what the fuss is about.

It's the difference between a 60 year old hooker with a minge like a dropped kebab and a threesome with Swedish twins that have to have their bras specially made.


I have a ks8000 and have never been able to tell the difference between HDR on or off after calibrating it correctly.

Have you got the HDMI ports UHD enabled? And the back light on full? If yes then change the HDMI port you are using then factory reset the TV, the re-enable UHD on all HDMI in settings.
 
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Kuranghi

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What display do you have?

I don't normally like to talk about it but if you twist my arm*, its a Sony ZD9/Z9D. Its an LCD HDR sex festival.

I have the 65", which has ~646 zones, the 75" has ~858 zones and this crazy monster here, the 100" supposedly has ~1536 zones according to display specifications, which I think makes sense because if you divide the zone count into the screen area of each of them you generally get the same zone size on each set, which is ~2.8 sq inches:



Here is Vincent talking about the 65" ZD9 vs a C7:


I got Vincent to come and calibrate it and he ended up staying for twice as long because I wouldn't stop asking him questions :messenger_tears_of_joy: He's a very nice man. The comparison above is what people are talking about when they say you get "better HDR pop" from some LCDs, but its really limited to a very few number of sets, like the following Sony's: XE94, ZD9 and ZG9. Also, the Panasonic DX902 and Samsung Q9FN (2018) are close but have some issues and a fewer dimming zones. I'd put the Sony XE93, XG95 and XF90 as amazing high end sets which amazing peak brightness but they don't have the zone chops to compete with the previous sets I mentioned so there will be a lot more blooming.

* This is a joke I literally can't shut up about it and I've owned it for three (3) years nearly now.
 
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Kuranghi

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Have you got the HDMI ports UHD enabled? And the back light on full? If yes then change the HDMI port you are using then factory reset the TV, the re-enable UHD on all HDMI in settings.
I have a ks8000 and have never been able to tell the difference between HDR on or off after calibrating it correctly.

I think there is some weird procedure to getting HDR working on a KS8000, maybe this will help:



edit - Kind of ignore the OP, the first comment says what you need to do.
 
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