Is There More To "Gaming Journalism" Than Flashy Headlines and Game Reviews?

Abriael_GN

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If I say "politicians are dishonest", do you believe I'm calling everyone who has ever served in any elected position in any government dishonest?
As a matter of fact, yes. You're making a blanket statement, which incidentally is obviously untrue.

Are you really that offended over me calling game journalists disingenuous?
It takes a lot to offend me. No. I'm not offended, just slightly disgusted and amused in equal measure. Extremism always has that effect on me.
 
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JohannCK

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The fact is however that the vast majority of consumers want this garbage.

Clickbait and other inflammatory nonsense is prevalent because people read it, talk about it, and spread it all over the internet. It's really that simple.

And the majority of people claiming to hate it are just as much a part of the problem given how they post links to these articles all over, all the time.

Edit: I'd like to add that while Americentrism is a given for the internet and all, there are people from other parts of the world, and we find it quite annoying at times, especially when blanket statements that only apply to the west are thrown all over.
 
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Whataburger

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No. There isn’t. It’s a fake bullshit job. More so now as it’s been hijacked by nonsensical political opinion pieces disguised as product reviews.

Both movie and film critics are worthless shills. Well at least Disney didn’t buy the entire game industry too... yet
 

cireza

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I stopped reading/watching anything that is "professional" years ago. There is nothing good that comes from it.

You are better off reading sites made by fans on their free time, or discussing with other players directly.
 
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LegendOfKage

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There are just as much variety and independence in written gaming journalism. You're just cherry-picking examples to fit your false narrative.
I hate generalizations, and I hate bad-faith arguments. I try to avoid both, and especially try to avoid absolutes. Never, always, nobody, everyone, etc. These things are not a good idea when making an argument, so allow me to reuse a question I've asked before that doesn't include them.

Gaming journalism is a massive industry with an extremely wide spectrum of workers, pf all ages, wage ranges, political orientation, and more. Your generalization is honestly pretty juvenile, not to mention unfair.
I posted this before. No one has taken me up on the challenge:

Please name me anyone working at a website that is featured on Metacritic who is openly conservative, or libertarian, or classically liberal (especially when it comes to being critical of censorship, deplatforming, removal of sexualized content, and other ways of people acting like the morality police) as those political labels relate to US politics. Which twitter profile of an employed modern video game journalist can I look at to find any of this?
 

Abriael_GN

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Please name me anyone working at a website that is featured on Metacritic who is openly conservative, or libertarian, or classically liberal (especially when it comes to being critical of censorship, deplatforming, removal of sexualized content, and other ways of people acting like the morality police) as those political labels relate to US politics. Which twitter profile of an employed modern video game journalist can I look at to find any of this?
I don't go around looking for people's political orientation. I judge them from their writing, which I would advise you to do as well.

I'm the News Editor of a site on Metacritic which I won't name because self-promotion is forbidden here (feel free to ask in private message if you care), and while I don't identify myself as any political label (because none of them is any good nowadays and none of them have been any particularly friendly to gaming and games over the nearly 20 years I have done this job on both print and web), I am definitely have been absolutely open in my criticism of censorship, and super-happy to support and cover those games that are shunned by certain sites because they include abundant boobage and other content that some people seem to take issue with.

Senran Kagura, Dead or Alive (including Xtreme), Moero Chronicle, LoveR, Muv-Luv... Think of a Japanese game with plenty of bouncing (or static) balloons, and I'm likely to have been giving it extensive and festive coverage.

To bring another example which I can name because I don't work there anymore, DualShockers' Editor in Chief Lou Contaldi is another that has always been openlyt against censorship, and I would say is most probably on the moderate conservative side of the political spectrum. They're on Metacritic as well.

There are plenty more examples all over the internet, across a metric ton of websites (also do keep in mind that there's more to gaming journalism than America). We may not be as visible as the Polygons, but we work our butts off to convey a positive view of gaming instead of the usual "gamers are dead" crap.
 
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Whitesnake

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As a matter of fact, yes. You're making a blanket statement, which incidentally is obviously untrue.
That's not how that works, but okay.

Again, just because there have been humans born with 3 arms, doesn't make the statement "humans are born with 2 arms" inaccurate.

You can claim I was personally attacking each and every individual game journalist to ever exist, but you know that's not the case.

It takes a lot to offend me. No. I'm not offended, just slightly disgusted and amused in equal measure. Extremism always has that effect on me.
Edgy.
 

Abriael_GN

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Again, just because there have been humans born with 3 arms, doesn't make the statement "humans are born with 2 arms" inaccurate.
That's a false equivalence. It's easily demonstrable that the overwhelming majority of humans are born with two arms. On the other hand, you have absolutely no element to prove that a similar majority of game journalists are as you describe.

Just another fallacy to pass a false narrative. Incidentally, this kind of fallacies and extremist narratives are the trade of those you seem to be so hostile toward. Good job.

You can claim I was personally attacking each and every individual game journalist to ever exist, but you know that's not the case.
You made a blanket statement which isn't any better or any more realistic, nor any less of an attack towards everyone who does this job.
 
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Whitesnake

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That's a false equivalence. It's easily demonstrable that the overwhelming majority of humans are born with two arms. On the other hand, you have absolutely no element to prove that a similar majority of game journalists are as you describe.

Just another fallacy to pass a false narrative. Incidentally, this kind of fallacies and extremist narratives are the trade of those you seem to be so hostile toward. Good job.



You made a blanket statement which isn't any better or any more realistic, nor any less of an attack towards everyone who does this job.
You're still just arguing semantics. If you choose to misenterpret my statements as being towards each individual game journalist rather than major game journalists, major publications, and the industry as a whole, that's your prerogative. I have made clear that this interpretation is incorrect and if you refuse to listen and just assume that every criticism of the gaming journalism industry is a personal attack against you, that's an insecurity you'll have to deal with on your own.

As evidenced by pretty much everyone in this thread other than you, it's well-known that games journalism has been a deeply-flawed cesspit for a long time. If you want to ignore the numerous examples of ever major gaming news publisher pushing agendas, selling review scores, engaging in nepotism, self-aggrandization, and censorship, that's fine. You can deny the truth if you want. But I'm never going to join you in that game of pretend.
 
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No.
Journalism in quite a few "news" outlets has the same ailment, I can recall a day when you could get actual news from places, even if you disagreed with their editorial line.

As for gaming -- I have stopped reading reviews on any gaming site when I noticed their whole high, school level, by the number, "social" analysis, my guess is they wanted to show they went to a modern day University, and the brain washing worked on them, so they turned whatever they were doing into activism.
 

Abriael_GN

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You're still just arguing semantics. If you choose to misenterpret my statements as being towards each individual game journalist rather than major game journalists, major publications, and the industry as a whole, that's your prerogative. I have made clear that this interpretation is incorrect and if you refuse to listen and just assume that every criticism of the gaming journalism industry is a personal attack against you, that's an insecurity you'll have to deal with on your own.

As evidenced by pretty much everyone in this thread other than you, it's well-known that games journalism has been a deeply-flawed cesspit for a long time. If you want to ignore the numerous examples of ever major gaming news publisher pushing agendas, selling review scores, engaging in nepotism, self-aggrandization, and censorship, that's fine. You can deny the truth if you want. But I'm going to join you in that game of pretend.
If you're unable to express your "criticism" (quotation marks obligatory) without using all-encompassing blank statements, maybe you should express yourself better, because your posts come as nothing short of extremist and aimed at everyone working as a game journalist.

It's obvious that you know nothing about what it means working as a game journalist/writer/whatnot, and are fed extremist points of view by websites and outlets that are no less politically aligned than the ones you hate. They're just aligned with the politics you like. Sorry, but that isn't any better.

Keep hating if you will. There are thousands of people that will keep working hard and well, despite your hate. We're used to it.
 

Whitesnake

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If you're unable to express your "criticism" (quotation marks obligatory) without using all-encompassing blank statements, maybe you should express yourself better, because your posts come as nothing short of extremist and aimed at everyone working as a game journalist.

It's obvious that you know nothing about what it means working as a game journalist/writer/whatnot, and are fed extremist points of view by websites and outlets that are no less politically aligned than the ones you hate. They're just aligned with the politics you like. Sorry, but that isn't any better.

Keep hating if you will. There are thousands of people that will keep working hard and well, despite your hate. We're used to it.
That last line is pretty grand, because it shows that you haven’t been listening at all. I don’t hate you. I don’t know who you are. I don’t know what publication you work for. From what you’ve said, I can gather that it’s small. If your publication doesn’t have weight and isn’t notable, then you aren’t necessarilly who I’m talking about. You’re still taking it as a personal slight, despite the fact that I’ve said otherwise numerous times. I’m tired of games journalism being shit, and I want to see it change for the better. Are you trying to make it better? If yes, then obviously I’m not talking about you. You can continue to be defensive and rant about the semantics of a random forum-goer’s opinion as if it’s a personal attack against your character, but by doing so you’re divorcing yourself from reality.

And lol at calling consumer advocacy “extremist views”. Find a single untrue statement on deepfreeze. Try to justify a single one of the linked articles on that subreddit.

“We’re used to it.” lmao what an edgy self-pitying little remark. Oh, the poor plight of the guy who writes about video games. Won’t anyone think of his suffering?😭😭Don’t people understand how horrible it is to have random forum users say that games journalism is shite?
 
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HeresJohnny

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That last line is pretty grand, because it shows that you haven’t been listening at all. I don’t hate you. I don’t know who you are. I don’t know what publication you work for. From what you’ve said, I can gather that it’s small. If your publication doesn’t have weight and isn’t notable, then you aren’t necessarilly who I’m talking about. You’re still taking it as a personal slight, despite the fact that I’ve said otherwise numerous times. I’m tired of games journalism being shit, and I want to see it change for the better. Are you trying to make it better? If yes, then obviously I’m not talking about you. You can continue to be defensive and rant about the semantics of a random forum-goer’s opinion as if it’s a personal attack against your character, but by doing so you’re divorcing yourself from reality.

And lol at calling consumer advocacy “extremist views”. Find a single untrue statement on deepfreeze. Try to justify a single one of the linked articles on that subreddit.

“We’re used to it.” lmao what an edgy self-pitying little remark. Oh, the poor plight of the guy who writes about video games. Won’t anyone think of his suffering?😭😭Don’t people understand how horrible it is to have random forum users say that games journalism is shite?
I'm not saying there are NO good game reviewers out there, but they're in a distinct minority, likely in the single digits imo. It's a shit job that doesn't pay much that forces you to live in an area that costs a ton (the Bay Area, usually). Further, you're surrounded by people in the industry making all kinds of bank who get treated like rock stars. Most game reviewers aren't dumb; they can sniff out the money, and they see they aren't on the right side of the fence for it, so they angle in towards working for developers or publishers. It's human nature to try and better oneself, but for reviewers to act like there ISN'T a huge fucking problem with the gaming press as a whole, requires them to either believe their audience is completely fucking gullible or that they themselves engage in willful ignorance. The only voices left in the spectrum are either the rare few who don't care about the money or the chest-beater SJW types who got tired of screaming at the sky while wearing a hat fashioned like a woman's uterus and decided to use their reviews as a means to bludgeon their warped agenda on a bunch of socially awkward people who probably haven't had much exposure to strong-arm politics and are pretty malleable politically.
 
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MC Safety

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I'm not saying there are NO good game reviewers out there, but they're in a distinct minority, likely in the single digits imo. It's a shit job that doesn't pay much that forces you to live in an area that costs a ton (the Bay Area, usually). Further, you're surrounded by people in the industry making all kinds of bank who get treated like rock stars. Most game reviewers aren't dumb; they can sniff out the money, and they see they aren't on the right side of the fence for it, so they angle in towards working for developers or publishers. It's human nature to try and better oneself, but for reviewers to act like there ISN'T a huge fucking problem with the gaming press as a whole, requires them to either believe their audience is completely fucking gullible or that they themselves engage in willful ignorance. The only voices left in the spectrum are either the rare few who don't care about the money or the chest-beater SJW types who got tired of screaming at the sky while wearing a hat fashioned like a woman's uterus and decided to use their reviews as a means to bludgeon their warped agenda on a bunch of socially awkward people who probably haven't had much exposure to strong-arm politics and are pretty malleable politically.
There's a lot of stuff wrong here. And it's regurgitated over and over again by people who have no idea either about game development or journalism.

I especially like the part about game developers "making bank" and being "treated like rock stars." This is especially tone deaf given the current state of game development.
 

Shai-Tan

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What's even more amusing is referencing deepfreeze which is full of innuendo and claims that boil down to "someone said something I didn't like" that then get spun into conspiracy theories motivated by political resentments

Anyhow, while I do think Jason Schreier has done good investigative work, when he was piled on a while ago for saying there is no such thing as objectivity in journalism he was confusing what is called splitting-the-difference (between two arbitary oppositions) with epistemological standards that follow for any critical thinking (including journalism advocating for a particular point of view).

Dan Drezner's The Ideas Industry critical of the elevation of "thought leaders" over "public intellectuals" and the death of expertise in the public sphere also applies to the distinction between generalists and specialists in journalism and the rise of opinion punditry. Civilization is built on a division of labor. As an intermediary journalists aren't merely offering their take on a story. Evidence requires analysis which follows from having an education, cultivating expertise in a beat, or leaning on experts and sources to put ideas in context. Experts and sources often disagree therefore there's an art in harnessing those threads. That craft demands more than writing well or being well spoken. Advocacy is not itself problematic if it's backed up by knowledge and good investigative practices.

Unfortunately the economics of news favors low information generalists who bang out stories with what gets clicks in mind. And dumb hot takes is a feature not a bug if clicks are what matter most. While deadlines and time pressures favor hot takes I see a lot of smart commentary elsewhere produced on shoe-string budgets. My hot take is cries for gamer "authenticity" backed up by reactionary anti-intellectual attitudes favors an insularity that reinforces know-nothing cultural analysis. The reactionary takes on YouTube and elsewhere are just another form of this punditry with a different political valence.
 

SlashBringingHasher

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media reviews are useless. unless your getting a review from someone who tears it a part as a fan. like angry joe

not garbage shitters that throw out general statements that are not used beyond stupid articles like them or books from the 1600s
 

Mr Nash

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Game journalism is just a relic from the magazine age when people had extremely limited ways to learn about existing and upcoming games. The internet slowly chipped away at that, first through getting information out there way faster, and later with video content being more than enough for people to decide if a game was worth looking into. The news > previews > reviews cycle isn't all that important anymore. Developers can just slap up announcements on YouTube and people will stream the games as they become available. That process renders the old system that game journalism used obsolete. Stuff like historical pieces, long form analysis, or in-depth interviews about the development process would probably save a lot of these outlets, but they seem completely uninterested in doing that stuff on any meaningful scale.
 

Abriael_GN

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That last line is pretty grand, because it shows that you haven’t been listening at all. I don’t hate you. I don’t know who you are. I don’t know what publication you work for. From what you’ve said, I can gather that it’s small. If your publication doesn’t have weight and isn’t notable, then you aren’t necessarilly who I’m talking about. You’re still taking it as a personal slight, despite the fact that I’ve said otherwise numerous times. I’m tired of games journalism being shit, and I want to see it change for the better. Are you trying to make it better? If yes, then obviously I’m not talking about you. You can continue to be defensive and rant about the semantics of a random forum-goer’s opinion as if it’s a personal attack against your character, but by doing so you’re divorcing yourself from reality.

And lol at calling consumer advocacy “extremist views”. Find a single untrue statement on deepfreeze. Try to justify a single one of the linked articles on that subreddit.

“We’re used to it.” lmao what an edgy self-pitying little remark. Oh, the poor plight of the guy who writes about video games. Won’t anyone think of his suffering?😭😭Don’t people understand how horrible it is to have random forum users say that games journalism is shite?
You seem not to be at all aware of what a blanket statement means. If you think it doesn't affect everyone doing a job when you say that those doing that job have no integrity, I can't help you.

The site I work for is on the medium size, that 10+ million views a month range that isn't big or small. "Game journalism" isn't shit. Certain game journalists are shit. Many of them are very visible, but this doesn't make them the sole representatives of the whole range of professionals doing that job. I'm as tired of them as you are, and probably more, but shaking your angry fist at the whole category does nothing else than making you look like an extremist, which is like an invitation to a fancy party for those shit journalists that get another excuse to bash the evil gamers.

Incidentally, it's very easy to (thinly) veil political extremism with "consumer advocacy." As someone else before me aptly said, a lot of the posts in the site and subreddit you cite boil down to "someone expressed an idea we don't like." Those are as political as they come, but you just mistake them for righteous because their political ideas match yours. They advocate politics as much as the journalists they bash. They simply advocate the other side. That's not any better.

The "we're used to it" remark is simply the truth. I have done this job for nearly 20 years, on print first and web after, and I'm used to be called all kinds of stuff like shill, nazi, pedo, and their exact opposites depending on who decides to take offense at every given moment. The fact that I'm used to it doesn't mean that it's pleasant.
 
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Dragon Lord

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The nature of what constitutes "journalism" has always been subject to differing views and attitudes. Since the advent of the internet, the boundaries are even blurrier since anyone can feasibly report on a topic, and since aggregation now plays an even more massive role.
 

LittleBusters

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Wouldn't it be cool if gaming sites did in-depth gaming tutorials and revisited past games? Everything now is about hyping the latest games on the most surface level with these clickbait sites. Screw 'em all.
 

Helios

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This guy’s your pinnacle of gaming journalism?
Kind of. He's one of the few people that does actual "investigative" journalism. I think I've said this before but you can see that he has connections in the industry and is able to get information that not everyone is has access to (For example all the information surrounding Blizzard's management). Unfortunately the guy is a dick and loves to get those social justice brownie points.
 
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Abriael_GN

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SaturnSaturn

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Only site i actually follow is Gematsu they have lots of info about new games, and when they release.
99% of games journalists are paid shills or political activists and they dont even like to play games, so why should i care about their opinion?

I dont even bother reading reviews anymore, i just look at gameplay and buy the game if it looks cool, has served me very well so far.