Is VR dead in the water? (Steam VR game sales / Data Leak)

LOL okay buddy. You can have as much faith as you want. I’ll wait until I see proof.

You know what I think? SO MANY nerds wanted to put on a VR headset and have it be like, this spiritual experience that fulfilled all their science fiction dreams of the early 90s. Something that finally allowed them to completely and totally leave the real world for a fantasy world where they are the ultimate alpha male. The techno rapture of the nerds.

I have a feeling we’ll look back at this moment in gaming and laugh at how wrong we got it. VR gaming is going to join the likes of Kinect, waggle controls, light guns, stereoscopic 3D, dance pads plastic instruments, etc.
 
There just isn't any compelling use cases for VR when we have 4K televisions and no motion sickness from standard gaming.
There are countless uses? Just talking about gaming alone, the immersion of today's VR headsets is greater than that of a 4K or even 8K TV. You could be playing a game with photorealistic graphics on an 8K 120 inch projector and play what people consider the most immersive non-VR game and it still wouldn't come remotely close to the immersion of a modern headset playing some of the immersive VR games. And it will only get exponentially more immersive over time.

So immersion is one use case. Others are the new types of genres and games it provides, improvements to many existing genres of gaming, socialization in multiplayer games, the much higher level of interactivity, the greater connection to characters, and the ability to feel things that you wouldn't normally feel, like the scale of heights, invasion of personal space by an NPC / Player, feeling weightlessness in zero gravity.

LOL okay buddy. You can have as much faith as you want. I’ll wait until I see proof.

You know what I think? SO MANY nerds wanted to put on a VR headset and have it be like, this spiritual experience that fulfilled all their science fiction dreams of the early 90s. Something that finally allowed them to completely and totally leave the real world for a fantasy world where they are the ultimate alpha male. The techno rapture of the nerds.

I have a feeling we’ll look back at this moment in gaming and laugh at how wrong we got it. VR gaming is going to join the likes of Kinect, waggle controls, light guns, stereoscopic 3D, dance pads plastic instruments, etc.
No it isn't. Everyone is going to be laughing at you, not at VR. You will be the laughing stock of a bygone era where some people actually thought VR wouldn't take off.
 
Last edited:
LOL okay buddy. You can have as much faith as you want. I’ll wait until I see proof.

You know what I think? SO MANY nerds wanted to put on a VR headset and have it be like, this spiritual experience that fulfilled all their science fiction dreams of the early 90s. Something that finally allowed them to completely and totally leave the real world for a fantasy world where they are the ultimate alpha male. The techno rapture of the nerds.

I have a feeling we’ll look back at this moment in gaming and laugh at how wrong we got it. VR gaming is going to join the likes of Kinect, waggle controls, light guns, stereoscopic 3D, dance pads plastic instruments, etc.
No it isn't. Everyone is going to be laughing at you, not at VR. You will be the laughing stock of a bygone era where some people actually thought VR wouldn't take off.

LOL okay buddy. You can have as much faith as you want. I’ll wait until I see proof.

You know what I think? SO MANY nerds wanted to put on a VR headset and have it be like, this spiritual experience that fulfilled all their science fiction dreams of the early 90s. Something that finally allowed them to completely and totally leave the real world for a fantasy world where they are the ultimate alpha male. The techno rapture of the nerds.

I have a feeling we’ll look back at this moment in gaming and laugh at how wrong we got it. VR gaming is going to join the likes of Kinect, waggle controls, light guns, stereoscopic 3D, dance pads plastic instruments, etc.
No it isn't. Everyone is going to be laughing at you, not at VR. You will be the laughing stock of a bygone era where some people actually thought VR wouldn't take off. There's a reason why the majority of the tech industry is investing (still) in AR / VR. Because it is the future computing platform we're all going to be using, it's the successor to the smartphone, and going to be a large part of gaming, if not the biggest.

All I see is a few people here that just don't understand the topic they talk about, believing it's never going to take off, when the rest of the tech industry and every expert suggests it will.
 
Last edited:
“The successor to the smartphone”. Wow.

BTW just because companies are spending money on something doesn’t automatically mean it’s going to be the next disruptive technology.
 
“The successor to the smartphone”. Wow.

BTW just because companies are spending money on something doesn’t automatically mean it’s going to be the next disruptive technology.
This is a vision shared by many experts within the tech industry. Explain why this won't happen?

Because a pair of XR glasses no thicker than standard shades which can switch between AR and VR seamlessly at any time and have all of it be indistinguishable from reality, that is clearly the successor to the smartphone.

Why? Because it takes on the same role. It does everything a smartphone does, except better in every way, and allows you to replace all other devices in your life, including tablets, TVs, monitors, projectors, even real life IMAX theaters. It's your personal "everything" device.

This is why it's going to be the next computing platform. Not because of the money being spent, but because of it's potential.
 
Last edited:
This is a vision shared by many experts within the tech industry. Explain why this won't happen?

Because a pair of XR glasses no thicker than standard shades which can switch between AR and VR seamlessly at any time and have all of it be indistinguishable from reality, that is clearly the successor to the smartphone.

Why? Because it takes on the same role. It does everything a smartphone does, except better in every way, and allows you to replace all other devices in your life, including tablets, TVs, monitors, projectors, even real life IMAX theaters. It's your personal "everything" device.

This is why it's going to be the next computing platform. Not because of the money being spent, but because of it's potential.
Except the fact that 1. nobody wants to wear a headset, 2. nobody wants to interact with someone who IS wearing a headset (and has their attention divided and who could be recording you), and 3. a touchscreen is a far better input device for the types of things people use smartphones for. But yeah other than that, better than smartphones.
 
Except the fact that 1. nobody wants to wear a headset, 2. nobody wants to interact with someone who IS wearing a headset (and has their attention divided and who could be recording you), and 3. a touchscreen is a far better input device for the types of things people use smartphones for. But yeah other than that, better than smartphones.
Nobody wants to a wear something on their head if the value isn't there. This is why nothing else has succeeded before in consumer's hands. Before VR we had 3D glasses and stereoscopic 3D displays. None of these do much for the end user, there just isn't much potential there. VR's potential is practically limitless. The peak of what VR can do is beyond even what Ready Player One envisions.

If people can have superpowers, they will wear something on their heads, guaranteed. And as I mentioned in my post, shades. They will be down to normal sunglasses size which means no effort to get on or off and literally no hassle.

Point #2 is something that people will likely just get used to as it offers too many benefits.

A touch screen is not better. AR / VR can utilize eye-tracking with larger screens without having to pull anything out of your pocket. There will be multiple inputs including gestures, voice, eye-tracking, and brain interfacing to "type" by thinking.

You could also simulate touch screens anyway. Your hand can be used as a screen as you can project anything on it.
 
That logic doesn't hold up. VR isn't the real world. It allows for a much better reality with things that are impossible in real life. If real life was literally just an Elder Scrolls game and everyone had magic and sword skills and could never be injured or die, people would be having the time of their lives fighting dragons and exploring impossible lands.

Also I'm not suggesting treadmills, you can still have immersive locomotion systems that aren't that demanding. It doesn't matter if it's not exactly like reality, it doesn't need to be. You can't play zero gravity frisbee in a big arena in real life. You can in Echo VR.

You are without a doubt going to be wrong. VR is much more than gaming as well. People can sit on their butt whilst watching movies in an IMAX theater, or tour the world and concerts, or socialise with people, or use it as a computing device, for education, etc. There are countless uses.
This is so true. My partner has been watching the world Cup in vr
 
Unless all to his stuff is fixed, call a funeral home. The viewing will be on Sunday.

It's somewhat ironic to see GiantBomb here as they are believers in VR and it's future. They were fairly dissapointed with the launch titles of Rift / Vive / PSVR, but the lineup has changed a lot since then and they have now played a number of VR games that they have really enjoyed. You also see this with CrowbCat who even used GiantBomb's material in his video to show the state of VR games (at launch) and since then has made positive videos about VR.
 
Last edited:
LOL okay buddy. You can have as much faith as you want. I’ll wait until I see proof.

You know what I think? SO MANY nerds wanted to put on a VR headset and have it be like, this spiritual experience that fulfilled all their science fiction dreams of the early 90s. Something that finally allowed them to completely and totally leave the real world for a fantasy world where they are the ultimate alpha male. The techno rapture of the nerds.

I have a feeling we’ll look back at this moment in gaming and laugh at how wrong we got it. VR gaming is going to join the likes of Kinect, waggle controls, light guns, stereoscopic 3D, dance pads plastic instruments, etc.
I just grabbed one yesterday with some previous limited VR use and its no fad, I'm not saying its going to replace gaming as we know it but its got its own place. I had a blast playing through a couple different genres of games through the demo disc included not too mention some of what I had that already supports VR. Its definitely an early iteration of what might come in the future but its something to be supported by the gaming community to see it evolve, plus its just fun to play. Sorry to hear you feel burned at previous attempts to innovate/ offer something abit different.
 
Cost is certainly a huge factor. But the biggest issue is that there is no IT game. If you're asking people to spend hundreds of dollars on entertainment, you need a compelling reason to justify it. Unless there is a VR game that everyone wants to play, it's a goner.
 
Do you see yourself playing few hours standing like a fool in small room, waggling controlers all the time ? Where is your stamina for that ?
Because that is the issue. It killed Wii motion gaming and VR by my experience is not in better situation.
Usually play about an hour before taking break. I do worry sometimes about my gf sharing videos of me playing in my skivvies, but it's not a problem whatsoever when you're actually playing cause you're not some guy waggling controllers but a bad-ass ninja wall-running to get the drop on the unsuspecting king as you drive your sword across his neck and watch with satisfaction as he crumbles to ground unable to notify his minions for help.


I thought you said you haven't touched the Vive in over 2 years? (since launch)
Think you're replying to the guy I replied to. You and I are on the same page on VR. Guessing you read Snow Crash? Cause that is the path we're starting down now.
 
These figures are actually kind of impressive considering. Before Steamspy died, IIRC RE7 and FFXV didn't even cross 500k units, or stumbled across it if they ever did. Same goes for a number of major AAA traditional games. We won't even get into your average indie game's Steam sales figures. For any VR titles to moving 200k on Steam alone is quite good. It should be pointed out a majority of Rift owners buy games on the Oculus store, so real numbers are going to be quite a bit higher just in the PC space. Factor in PSVR and a few these titles may be close to half a million units.
 
Last edited:
These figures are actually kind of impressive considering. Before Steamspy died, IIRC RE7 and FFXV didn't even cross 500k units, or stumbled across it if they ever did. Same goes for a number of major AAA traditional games. We won't even get into your average indie game's Steam sales figures. For any VR titles to moving 200k on Steam alone is quite good. It should be pointed out a majority of Rift owners buy games on the Oculus store, so real numbers are going to be quite a bit higher just in the PC space. Factor in PSVR and a few these titles may be close to half a million units.
Thanks for speaking truth to power. Some people don't seem to understand this.
 

BANGS

Fresh single BANGS in your area, or in my browser.
VR isn't dead, it's a fad that regressing and will be dormant until it rises again. Happens at least once every decade or so and it won't actually stick until the tech is good enough and cheap enough to sustain it... The good news for VR fans is that next decade might actually be the one where it sticks...
 
Because it is the future computing platform we're all going to be using, it's the successor to the smartphone, and going to be a large part of gaming, if not the biggest.
If it's going to be the biggest, then it should also be the best option to play other types of games than first person games.
 
I remember before trying VR how ridiculous the tech seemed and I was certain it was going to just be a fad. Then I went to a Microsoft store and tried a RIFT with touch controllers. It was around the moment in the demo where the Trex came down the hallway, approached, and then walked past me that I knew I had to have my own headset. Bought a Rift with Touch and a third sensor for roomscale and now it's pretty much the only platform I play. I've put more hours into VR Fallout than my Xbox One copy. And when you turn off the in-game music, it can be an amazing, tranquil experience. I've had numerous, immersive experiences. I've had experiences playing The Climb, hanging on some high ledge, where I actually lock up. The feeling of falling feels so real in that game. Lone Echo is an amazing, full fledged game. Wilson's Heart was a fun story. Beat Saber is addictive.

I don't know. Even with current tech I find VR easy to get lost in. And the hardware is only getting better and cheaper. You can get an Oculus Go for only $200 and people seem to be really enjoying it. I just don't see the technology going away anytime soon.
 
I definitely think if the price point was lower, more people would get to experience it and see for themselves its not going to be a fad, this is something with staying power. Not to replace gaming as we know it but hold its own spot as a gaming side bar so to speak.

Something thats interesting is the price point of the games, most games for me in Canada are about $24.99 to $29.99 CAD, if MSRP was to be shifted to maybe $39.99 or $49.99 CAD and the price of the actual VR set dropped to $299.99 CAD I feel like there could be more adopters, to support PSVR. Its getting there, theres been a price drop since launch obviously, there have been some crazy sales with the Skyrim bundle dropping down to $349.99 CAD, where the regular price sits at $449.99 CAD for that bundle right now.

One thing I dont agree with is the MSRP of the PS Move controllers, Sony is not doing themselves any favours by repackaging last gen tech and selling a set at $129.99 CAD, I feel like they should eat more cost out of those to bring in more adopters. It basically forces people to go the bundle route.

If they just bought the headset itself at $249.99 CAD and the camera at $79.99 CAD. At that point at $459.99 CAD all in with everything you need, why wouldn't you do the bundle and get yourself Skyrim, Doom or whatever other games they're offering.
 
If it's going to be the biggest, then it should also be the best option to play other types of games than first person games.
It does though. I don't see the problem here. All 3D genres work in VR and 3rd person / top-down can work best in VR when done right. Moss and Astro Bot (and really any platformer) put into VR will be at it's best in VR. Mario would definitely be better in VR, I can safely say that. RTS games could be utterly incredible with haptic gloves when you could scoop units up in your hands and feel them wiggling about.

You can also just use it to play games on virtual screens.
 
Last edited:
Yeah at the moment it’s basically an enthusiast product. Which makes it pretty useless for consoles.

Come back in 20 years when it costs 200 bucks and is like putting on a pair of shades. It will never go mainstream in its current clunky form. By that time AR is more likely to be the big thing not VR.
 
Last edited:
There just isn't any compelling use cases for VR when we have 4K televisions and no motion sickness from standard gaming.
But that's literally not the point of VR.

Do you see yourself playing few hours standing like a fool in small room, waggling controlers all the time ? Where is your stamina for that ?

Because that is the issue. It killed Wii motion gaming and VR by my experience is not in better situation.
I do because me like nearly all my friends with a VR headset, use our sets for maybe 4-6 hours at a time.
 
Last edited:
Yeah at the moment it’s basically an enthusiast product. Which makes it pretty useless for consoles.

Come back in 20 years when it costs 200 bucks and is like putting on a pair of shades. It will never go mainstream in its current clunky form. By that time AR is more likely to be the big thing not VR.
That's misunderstanding how AR and VR work. AR does not fill in the main role of VR so it can't replace it. And in 20 years, every expert believes they will be the same thing. Which means both in one device and you just switch between them seamlessly.

Also today there are VR headsets like Oculus Go which are fully standalone and $200. Give it 2-3 years and you'll be able to have an experience that matches Oculus Rift / Vive but as a $200 standalone. Then add another 5 years onto that and it should be good to take off.

However smartphone levels of adoption will only happen when they combine into one form factor.
 
To be fair virtual theatre is actually pretty cool.
It's very underrated since people don't understand it. When resolutions get better, you can completely replace any display, whether it be a phone, 8K TV, 8K monitor, 8K projector or an 8K IMAX screen. Virtual Screens would always surpass real screens in versatility, yet be equal in quality.

Even as soon as 2nd gen headsets, you will have enough resolution to replicate the real IMAX theater experience perfectly, at least as long as you sit closer to the front until another bump in resolution.
 
To be fair virtual theatre is actually pretty cool.
It's very underrated since people don't understand it. When resolutions get better, you can completely replace any display, whether it be a phone, 8K TV, 8K monitor, 8K projector or an 8K IMAX screen. Virtual Screens would always surpass real screens in versatility, yet be equal in quality.

Even as soon as 2nd gen headsets, you will have enough resolution to replicate the real IMAX theater experience perfectly, at least as long as you sit closer to the front until another bump in resolution.
Yeah, playing Resident Evil 7 in Theatre mode is better than the real VR.
Yeah...no
 
Yeah, playing Resident Evil 7 in Theatre mode is better than the real VR.
Yeah...no
I never said it was better than actual vr but watching 3d blurays is pretty cool.

I also played through a bit of the last of us remastered in theater mode. However this is the only thing that has made me get really bad motion sickness. (TLOU not blurays)
 
VR in its current form might not last but if anyone thinks in 50 years we will still be using phones to take pictures and whatnot are delusional. I don't expect Minority Report levels on engagement but who knows? All it is going to take is for it to not be as bulky and portable. I would like to contact lens screens personally.
 
It's very underrated since people don't understand it. When resolutions get better, you can completely replace any display, whether it be a phone, 8K TV, 8K monitor, 8K projector or an 8K IMAX screen. Virtual Screens would always surpass real screens in versatility, yet be equal in quality.

Even as soon as 2nd gen headsets, you will have enough resolution to replicate the real IMAX theater experience perfectly, at least as long as you sit closer to the front until another bump in resolution.
+1

I could care less about VR gaming, however, I do have & use my Samsung Odyssey for movies in Big Screen Beta. It's amaze balls while lying in bed and can see it replacing my Sony 4K projector HT setup once the FOV and resolution gets high enough.

Hopefully the Rift 2 & Vive 2 get closer to that aspect (tested a Pimax 8K myself and they have a long way to go to compete with the major players in terms of blury edges/optics/non-oled panels)
 
Last edited:
It bums me out, but it looks like the big name support fell off a cliff (probably rightfully so if adoption numbers are down over expected). Sony was really the only chance of making VR go mainstream enough to be really profitable, and they'd have had to take a pretty sizable loss on in-house dev costs to do so. Just like we saw with the VITA, when games dry up for a platform, so does the platform. There are a lot of fun little indie games and "proof of concept" games but we only got a handful of premium feeling complete VR games. Resident Evil 7 is one of the best, along with Skyrim VR (though dated). These are the types of games we needed to keep driving the tech forward, but they're expensive and probably don't make back enough money to make it seem "worth it".

It's a shame, too, because VR has been my #1 improvement to gaming over the past 10 years, once you get in and actually play it. Even a guy like me that loves VR can feel the drought of big "homerun" games. I was really hoping the idea of 3rd person platformers where your head controls the camera would take off. There's so much opportunity that was never explored properly.
 
It bums me out, but it looks like the big name support fell off a cliff (probably rightfully so if adoption numbers are down over expected). Sony was really the only chance of making VR go mainstream enough to be really profitable, and they'd have had to take a pretty sizable loss on in-house dev costs to do so. Just like we saw with the VITA, when games dry up for a platform, so does the platform. There are a lot of fun little indie games and "proof of concept" games but we only got a handful of premium feeling complete VR games. Resident Evil 7 is one of the best, along with Skyrim VR (though dated). These are the types of games we needed to keep driving the tech forward, but they're expensive and probably don't make back enough money to make it seem "worth it".

It's a shame, too, because VR has been my #1 improvement to gaming over the past 10 years, once you get in and actually play it. Even a guy like me that loves VR can feel the drought of big "homerun" games. I was really hoping the idea of 3rd person platformers where your head controls the camera would take off. There's so much opportunity that was never explored properly.
I wouldn't be worried at all. It's just fine. Facebook are the biggest driving force for VR anyway rather than Sony, and their investment is getting much bigger every year. There are also half a dozen AAA VR games (fully exclusive to VR) announced now, including games from Insomniac, Respawn, and Valve.

Also one of Sony's 1st party studios is working on AstroBot, a 3rd person platformer for VR.

VR in its current form might not last but if anyone thinks in 50 years we will still be using phones to take pictures and whatnot are delusional. I don't expect Minority Report levels on engagement but who knows? All it is going to take is for it to not be as bulky and portable. I would like to contact lens screens personally.
Technically minority report will already be there by gen 2. All you need is perfect hand tracking, the ability to real-time scan your keyboard, and that's it. All gen 2 stuff.
 
Last edited:


wake up people

look at that 3x PC virtual reality headset growth from 2016-2017

it's not dying, it's just getting started!

but bury your head in the sand if you would prefer. that sand is nice and comfortable if you're a small baby that can't tolerate change.
 
I'm optimistic about VR, but I agree w/ a lot of the stuff that's been said here about changes that need to happen for mainstream adoption.
- Needs to weigh about as much as a pair of sunglasses, and needs to be just as easy to put on / take off, and needs to be much more breathable.
- Some kind of mode where the player can instantly switch to seeing the outside world, easily toggling this view on/off.
- Earbuds that let you hear the outside world just as well as the game world.
- Either self-contained everything, or else fully wireless communication w/ a console / PC.
- A free month's supply of dramamine bundled in, eheh.

It'll be interesting to see PS5's version of VR, but I don't think it'll hit these points. I'm not sure VR will step out of its niche next gen. Might take a while :/