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It's June. Why have we not heard anything about the PS5's M.2 expansion slot yet?

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Many PS5s (maybe even most) have either fan noise (there are three different fans used, and some are noisier than others) or coil whine. Mine has the latter, and while it's not loud (it's not noticeable when a game is making noise) there's always a buzzing sound at all times (more or less so depending on what is being rendered). If I mute the game I can hear it from several meters away. My fan is very quiet, but not absolutely silent. No fan is.

If you got lucky and got one without any of these issues, congrats. But they are common issues, and I've read so many accounts of people sending their consoles to Sony only to get them back no different. Basically, Sony considers this (at least the coil whine) "normal", just like GPU manufacturers do.
I guess it can be a bit of a lottery from the sounds of it, same thing with OLED with banding etc.
 
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RoadHazard

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I guess it can be a bit of a lottery from the sounds of it, same thing with OLED with banding etc.

Yep. But for sure if your PS5 sounds like a PS4 Pro something is actually wrong. There are many possible levels of noise between that and absolutely silent. My PS5 is much closer to absolutely silent than it is to sounding like my Pro, but it's not all the way there.
 

01011001

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Yep. But for sure if your PS5 sounds like a PS4 Pro something is actually wrong. There are many possible levels of noise between that and absolutely silent. My PS5 is much closer to absolutely silent than it is to sounding like my Pro, but it's not all the way there.

the 7200 model Pro can be pretty silent. only slightly louder than a One X if you are lucky. so it is absolutely possible that a PS5 is louder than a PS4 Pro and it being normal and not in any way defective
 
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01011001

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Alright, maybe that's a thing that exists, I've only experienced the typical jet engine Pro.

I have a 7000 model... so I also am very aware of that xD and my 1100 base PS4 isn't much better (worse actually)
but a friend of mine had a 7200 model and that thing was very quiet comparatively. it would be only slightly louder than my One X in super stressful games (the loudest my One X got was in Wolfenstein 2, wasn't awful but noticeable)
 

kingpotato

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Jokes aside if you deem your ps5 to be loud best to get it checked under warranty. I can stick my head right up next to mine and its practically silent. Mine is kept horizontal, shouldn't make a difference but it might.
It's fairly quiet, but a long way from silent. I have a disc edition and when the disc drive is spinning at full speed I can hear that. When the fan is at full speed I can hear that and sometimes I do hear the faintest of whines. It doesn't often run at full speed and usually I just hear a very light humming. Overall it's head and shoulders above my PS4 pro. I do keep it horizontal as well.

It is exceptionally warm where I live so that's definitely a factor.
 

01011001

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It's fairly quiet, but a long way from silent. I have a disc edition and when the disc drive is spinning at full speed I can hear that. When the fan is at full speed I can hear that and sometimes I do hear the faintest of whines. It doesn't often run at full speed and usually I just hear a very light humming. Overall it's head and shoulders above my PS4 pro. I do keep it horizontal as well.

It is exceptionally warm where I live so that's definitely a factor.

my friend's PS5's disc drive is also pretty loud... it's the only PS5 I've seen in person yet, but I bet that's normal. these things are not designed with Disc Drive sound in mind since games are always fully installed and only during installs you will ever hear the drive
 
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Corndog

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I really am pretty convinced it's just them working on firmware.

It's possible an 8 channel drive just isn't going to work.. but that would be quite the miscalculation by Sony. And considering they were likely working w/ a partner like Samsung on their controller.. I just don't see that as likely.
I don’t think anyone should worry unless the year ticks over and still nothing.
 

GHG

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Has a company ever offered their own branded accessory but also allow 3rd party ones?

I mean.. sure.. that's.. the most common type of hardware accessory lol 3rd party controllers can work on a PS4.. and a PC. Because that's normal.

It's not some super proprietary tech.. it's an nVME drive w/ a specific configuration.. Sony could either release it, or work w/ drive manufacturers to create some. The drives wouldn't even be that expensive, they'd just be useless on a PC (or they could also have on-board flash controllers I guess, not a super expert on this or anything.. but the configuration wouldn't be much of a benefit on a PC.)

That's not the same thing. There's a big difference between proprietary hardware and licensed hardware.

Licensed hardware like controllers and headphones use standard means of communication just as the official controllers do for the consoles these days - they all use Bluetooth or USB, both of which are standard. If you wish to make 3rd party hardware for the consoles you pay for a license, they add your device to the list of recognisable devices via bluetooth/USB and you're good to go. You don't need to use any special standard of interface that's been created by the console manufacturer specifically for that console. Those controllers/headphones will also work on PC and sometimes even on other consoles.

With proprietary the interface is non-standard meaning it's specifically been made for that single platform, and hardware made for it (whether first party or licensed) will not work anywhere else. Examples of this are the PS1/2 memory cards, the vita memory cards, the early Xbox 360 hard drives and most recently the Xbox Series expansion cards.

If Sony made some drives specifically for the PS5 that couldn't work on the PC or elsewhere then that would be proprietary and it's not something that benefits anybody in the long run.

I cannot believe we have people campaigning for proprietary technology. Do we not already have enough history to prove why it doesn't work?
 
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RoadHazard

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my friend's PS5's disc drive is also pretty loud... it's the only PS5 I've seen in person yet, but I bet that's normal. these things are not designed with Disc Drive sound in mind since games are always fully installed and only during installs you will ever hear the drive

What's a bit absurd is that Sony made a point of having vibration dampeners in the drive mount specifically to address this issue in their PS5 teardown video, but seems like most people's drives are about as loud as a PS4's (mine included). Luckily this is really only noticeable when a game is being installed and when the disc is checked as the game is launched, it then spins down rather quickly. What I don't get is why this happens even when launching a digital title (like Astro), but it is what it is.
 

01011001

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What's a bit absurd is that Sony made a point of having vibration dampeners in the drive mount specifically to address this issue in their PS5 teardown video, but seems like most people's drives are about as loud as a PS4's (mine included). Luckily this is really only noticeable when a game is being installed and when the disc is checked as the game is launched, it then spins down rather quickly. What I don't get is why this happens even when launching a digital title (like Astro), but it is what it is.

the PS5 OS seems really unfinished to begin with. I bet that's a weird oversight.
 

Allandor

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Well we heard nothing about that because Sony is just not ready to release the update.
Last think that was heard was that they experiment with the cooler speed. So I guess they still have problems getting cooler profiles ready that meets the cooling requirements for all SSD drives that might get certified.
Also so far the drives need to hold the peak speed all the time. Might not work that well while at the same moment the drives must be cooled. Current drives that get those speeds can get really hot quite fast and than throttle down. I guess (and hope) they tested it before with some prototypes but now they have the problem that not every solution on the market behaves like those prototypes.

Don't give a shit on announcements of SSD manufacturers until their drives are really certified. They might just want to sell you something to tell you after a year that it runs good with an USB adapter to store ps5 games.

And btw Sony uses 6 chips (12 channels) to get their high speed. Normally SSDs don't have that many chips, so the chips on the m.2 drive must have higher frequencies and therefore have more heat problems than the chips on the PS5 board that are also attached directly with the cooling system of the PS5.
So the internal memory has the advantage of lower frequencies and therefore lower temperatures and better cooling. Wouldn't be surprised if the cooler must spin a lot faster to cool down the extra storage, just to increase the air flow in that bay.
 

truth411

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The simple answer is that there's no drive on the market yet that meets both the technical and physical (heat) requirements.
I dont think this is it, there are M.2 with 7000mb read speeds now (Western Digital Black). Also M.2 really heat up when Writing not Reading off the SSD.

Im Guessing there waiting for greater availability of Compatible M.2s.
 

yurinka

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The console has enough internal storage and allows other expansion methods and we don't know if still there is SDDs in the market of that type will all these channels etc. So I think they may be busy with tons of other things and they may consider this is a very low priority task compared to another ones. Like maybe VRR, their next gen PS Now, etc.


They already arrived.
Final flash PCIE4 drives are nigh plentiful now.
Hell WD and Samsung announced PS5 compatibility last year.

The update just isnt ready yet, not to throw mud into the waters but Sony arent the fastest at releasing OS features.

For those looking to get a drive early these drives should all meet the speed requirement, we just dont know if Sony is going to somehow do case by case testing for approval(unlikely).
  • PNY XLR8 CS3140 — 7,500MB/s reads, 6,850MB/s writes
  • Adata XPG Gammix S70 — 7,400MB/s reads, 6,400MB/s writes
  • Mushkin Gamma — 7,175MB/s reads, 6,800MB/s writes
  • Sabrent Rocket 4 Plus — 7,100MB/s reads, 6000MB/s writes
  • Samsung 980 Pro — 7,000MB/s reads, 5,000MB/s writes
  • WD SN850 Black — 7,000MB/s reads, 5,300MB/s writes
  • Patriot Viper VP4 — 7,400MB/s reads, 6800MB/s writes
The WD Black, the Viper and the Samsung are going to be you best bet really, they outperform the rest of the pack in real use cases.
How many channels do they have? 6 like PS5 or 2 like the common PC ones? Cerny said that if it has less channels will need extra speed to compensate it and achieve similar results.
 
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What's a bit absurd is that Sony made a point of having vibration dampeners in the drive mount specifically to address this issue in their PS5 teardown video, but seems like most people's drives are about as loud as a PS4's (mine included). Luckily this is really only noticeable when a game is being installed and when the disc is checked as the game is launched, it then spins down rather quickly. What I don't get is why this happens even when launching a digital title (like Astro), but it is what it is.
Yeah my disc drive is loud when installing a game or loading a game. Once the game is booted up its silent again. Agreed it is daft that they would work on the fan but not so much the disk drive, kind of counter productive!
 

GHG

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I dont think this is it, there are M.2 with 7000mb read speeds now (Western Digital Black). Also M.2 really heat up when Writing not Reading off the SSD.

Im Guessing there waiting for greater availability of Compatible M.2s.

Yeh the SN850 looks good.

By the way sustained read will typically get the controller on these SSD's hot. It's just that there are very few applications that will constantly need to read from the drive at maximum speed, the bulk of the information usually gets transferred to RAM and then it can rest.

That's not the same for writing since the size(s) of the files will determine how much of a workout the drive is getting and how long for and that's a common use case for a hard drive so the bulk of the overheating reports will be from scenarios where the drive is being written to.
 
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Corndog

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The console has enough internal storage and allows other expansion methods and we don't know if still there is SDDs in the market of that type will all these channels etc. So I think they may be busy with tons of other things and they may consider this is a very low priority task compared to another ones. Like maybe VRR, their next gen PS Now, etc.



How many channels do they have? 6 like PS5 or 2 like the common PC ones? Cerny said that if it has less channels will need extra speed to compensate it and achieve similar results.
It’s not channels it’s priority levels I believe. Correct me if I’m wrong.
 

truth411

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It’s June, why can’t most of us at least get a PS5 yet?
Global Chip Shortage.
It maybe getting a little easier since AMD up their TSMC 7nm chip allocation by 80% earlier this year. So about Q3 or more like Q4 we should see some improvement but with the Holidays supply will continue to outstrip demand.
My hope is both Sony and Microsoft begin Instore Sales this year, that will dramatically cut down on the scalping.
 
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jhjfss

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Could be your hearing. You might want to use your healthcare.
Pop Tv Burn GIF by Schitt's Creek
 
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Chytin

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Be patient, Sony is working on the firmware update. It is internally called The Return of the Jet Engine.
The M2 drive will generate more heat. Expect your PS5 to get louder and even more so once the devs start pushing the hardware.
 

Three

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They plan to add a secondary discreet GPU from the PCIEx4 slot.

God knows what's going on
 

RCU005

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Everyone should be installing their PS4 games on an external HDD/SSD. There's no reason to use the PS5 internal memory for them.
 
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MaulerX

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They're still trying to figure out the thermal problems that will arise if they can't properly cool the thing.

It's already been stated that the ability to expand your SSD storage will coincide with a future firmware update that will ramp up the speed of the fans to aid in this process.

The obvious drawback being that as a consequence of increasing fan speeds there will no doubt be a large contingent of fans who will not be happy with how much noisier their console has now become.
 
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Im someone that bought a SSD more expensive than my PS4 Pro. It’s nowhere needed right now. I dont expect one till half next year. Year after that I expect HUGE gains from the SSD.
 

Rocco Schiavone

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Be patient, Sony is working on the firmware update. It is internally called The Return of the Jet Engine.
The M2 drive will generate more heat. Expect your PS5 to get louder and even more so once the devs start pushing the hardware.

The consoles run at max clocks already more demanding games doesn't mean that the consoles get louder. Complete bullshit.

You ca also put a cooler on the drive. Problem solved. If there will be heat or noise issues tbh.
 
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longdi

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i wonder what is the hold up?

Seems they were going in blind with just theorectical specs of how a max-out pcie4 ssd will be.

Cerny do not have any physical max'xed pcie4 ssd to test during ps5 development. So they are only doing it now? 🤷‍♀️
 
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Corndog

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They're still trying to figure out the thermal problems that will arise if they can't properly cool the thing.

It's already been stated that the ability to expand your SSD storage will coincide with a future firmware update that will ramp up the speed of the fans to aid in this process.

The obvious drawback being that as a consequence of increasing fan speeds there will no doubt be a large contingent of fans who will not be happy with how much noisier their console has now become.
They should at least only ramp it up if a nvme drive is installed.
 

GuinGuin

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Be patient, Sony is working on the firmware update. It is internally called The Return of the Jet Engine.
The M2 drive will generate more heat. Expect your PS5 to get louder and even more so once the devs start pushing the hardware.

Oof. Update your material. That's a last gen console warrior jab. The giant fan in the PS5 is whisper quiet. It will never get louder because regardless of how hard devs push the hardware the energy profile is always the same and the fan therefore never has to speed up to compensate. This has been known for a year. Additionally you can presume that the internal SSD will be cooler as it isn't being used at the same time as the expansion SSD so no additional heat will be generated.
 
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IntentionalPun

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I cannot believe we have people campaigning for proprietary technology. Do we not already have enough history to prove why it doesn't work?
You are being way dramatic here.

All that was suggested was that Sony could ALSO make their own drive and sell it. Nobody is suggesting removing the ability to support 3rd party drives.

And you are completely misusing “proprietary” here. It literally means a company owns and controls a technology. Licensed hardware IS proprietary.

Im suggesting the opposite of that; none of this is proprietary it’s just a configuration of an NVME drive that people could offer. They might even be able to get them to work fine on PCs.
 
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JerryinSoCal

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Many PS5s (maybe even most) have either fan noise (there are three different fans used, and some are noisier than others) or coil whine. Mine has the latter, and while it's not loud (it's not noticeable when a game is making noise) there's always a buzzing sound at all times (more or less so depending on what is being rendered). If I mute the game I can hear it from several meters away. My fan is very quiet, but not absolutely silent. No fan is.

If you got lucky and got one without any of these issues, congrats. But they are common issues, and I've read so many accounts of people sending their consoles to Sony only to get them back no different. Basically, Sony considers this (at least the coil whine) "normal", just like GPU manufacturers do.
How many of the "so many accounts" you've read stack up to the MILLIONS of PS5's that are already in people's homes? A few vocal people on message boards (probably posting the same thing on multiple boards which makes it look inflated) doesn't come anywhere near most. I don't know anyone with a PS5 who has had any coil whine or a fan that's audible without sitting right next to the console and trying to hear it. If you have that issue that sucks and I feel for you I would be disappointed if I had one with those issues but there are always some defective units when it comes to electronics.
 
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captainraincoat

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We know the ps5 has all this inbuilt stuff to balance clock speeds ect so they are probably balancing the noise output between the revised fan profiles and the coil whine
 
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Year is half done. Will be interesting to see if any external SSDs work in 2021.

Might be a 2022 thing.
 

Black_Stride

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How many channels do they have? 6 like PS5 or 2 like the common PC ones? Cerny said that if it has less channels will need extra speed to compensate it and achieve similar results.
I take it you mean priority?
There will never be consumer grade 6 priority E18 level SSDs.

The fact the current SSDs saturate PCIE4 is all you need to know, Cerny knew these were the SSDs coming.
These are literally the fastest SSDs the slot on the PS5 can support.....if not these then that slot will never be used for games and Sony engineers are fucking fools. (we know they arent so clearly these range toppers are the SSDs Cerny was talking about)

You really think he didnt know a Samsung 980 Pro/Evo was coming?
Even i knew it was coming, thats the kind of SSD Sony were banking on, and they arrived a while ago.
Sony just doesnt have the update ready.

If you think Sony was banking on some super obscure SSDs for the average consumer to buy is absolutely ridiculous.
Sony was fully betting on whats available now.
Consumer grade off the shelf ~6.5GB/s SSDs with very low access times.
Else they might as well have just gone proprietary....making me hunt down some super rare obscure SSD just to put my games on doesnt make sense, and goes against what the whole idea of using an open standard represents.
 
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DynamiteCop!

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It honestly feels like they didn't do adequate testing and can't get anything to work in the system without causing serious heat problems. They're essentially ignoring the issue entirely, we're 7 months in and there's been not one word. Drives of the technical nature required exist, they're on the market now, they've been on the market for quite a while.
 
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yurinka

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I take it you mean priority?
There will never be consumer grade 6 priority E18 level SSDs.

The fact the current SSDs saturate PCIE4 is all you need to know, Cerny knew these were the SSDs coming.
These are literally the fastest SSDs the slot on the PS5 can support.....if not these then that slot will never be used for games and Sony engineers are fucking fools. (we know they arent so clearly these range toppers are the SSDs Cerny was talking about)

You really think he didnt know a Samsung 980 Pro/Evo was coming?
Even i knew it was coming, thats the kind of SSD Sony were banking on, and they arrived a while ago.
Sony just doesnt have the update ready.

If you think Sony was banking on some super obscure SSDs for the average consumer to buy is absolutely ridiculous.
Sony was fully betting on whats available now.
Consumer grade off the shelf ~6.5GB/s SSDs with very low access times.
Else they might as well have just gone proprietary....making me hunt down some super rare obscure SSD just to put my games on doesnt make sense, and goes against what the whole idea of using an open standard represents.
Yes, as I said before I meant priority, my bad:

In his PS5 talk Cerny said that (future, maybe some of the current ones may work) standard, non-propietary PCIE4 M.2 SSDs would need to be as fast or more as the PS5 one if have 6 priority levels, or faster (didn't specify how much) if using less priority levels to compensate it. PS5 SSD has a raw speed of 5.5GB/s, but unlike in PC, thanks to PS5's I/O system and particularly its decompression by hardware and memory management on average ~8-9GB/s and up to ~22GB/s if particularly well compressed of data (after decompression, and the amount obviously depends on the type of data) gets loaded from the SSD to the RAM. So I assume it must be key to fit the specs to make sure they achieve that.

He also said that when available they will have some support webpage with a compatibility list mentioning the SSDs models they verified that work properly there.

And no, most SSDs that have been in the market for years (or are today) aren't ~6.5GB/s. Only a few are.
 
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phil_t98

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its a bit odd the silence around this, they had said it would be available before the year end. it will prob happen in the next month or two
 
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DarkMage619

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Many PS5s (maybe even most) have either fan noise (there are three different fans used, and some are noisier than others) or coil whine. Mine has the latter, and while it's not loud (it's not noticeable when a game is making noise) there's always a buzzing sound at all times (more or less so depending on what is being rendered). If I mute the game I can hear it from several meters away. My fan is very quiet, but not absolutely silent. No fan is.

If you got lucky and got one without any of these issues, congrats. But they are common issues, and I've read so many accounts of people sending their consoles to Sony only to get them back no different. Basically, Sony considers this (at least the coil whine) "normal", just like GPU manufacturers do.
My fan has a melodic hum and I have coil whine too! Total console lottery. I feel your pain.

I am guessing with Sony taking advantage of the compression techniques for their games its possible that they will just keep games small over actually activating their storage bay any time soon.
 
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DenchDeckard

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There’s the rumour for a sea gate event at the end of June right? And a ps5 event. Fingers crossed it gets announced this month
 

RoadHazard

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How many of the "so many accounts" you've read stack up to the MILLIONS of PS5's that are already in people's homes? A few vocal people on message boards (probably posting the same thing on multiple boards which makes it look inflated) doesn't come anywhere near most. I don't know anyone with a PS5 who has had any coil whine or a fan that's audible without sitting right next to the console and trying to hear it. If you have that issue that sucks and I feel for you I would be disappointed if I had one with those issues but there are always some defective units when it comes to electronics.

Of course I can't actually know how many are affected, but I'm absolutely certain it's more than "a few vocal people". That's easy to tell just by looking around the interwebs. This isn't something only a few super critical nerds are complaining about, it's definitely widespread.

And coil whine isn't a defect, it's a natural characteristic of electronic devices like this. High end PC GPUs very commonly have it. There are things that can be done to minimize it, which unfortunately Sony hasn't done (while MS has, so you don't hear about this issue with the XSX).

Here's a poll of 7,500 people where around 75% say they have it: https://www.pushsquare.com/news/2020/11/poll_have_you_experienced_ps5_coil_whine

Yes, a poll like this is gonna attract people with that issue, but still, definitely more than "a few vocal people".
 
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ZywyPL

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I expect the hear about it by the end of the year (and VRR). If not, that will mean Sony screwed up something and PS5 will never get those features.
 
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