• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Jaffe's Project HeartLand plot revealed

theBishop

Banned
Nov 26, 2006
17,210
0
0
1up has learned some plot details and basic information about David Jaffe's ill-fated PSP title "Heartland". Here's the quote from Jaffe:

David Jaffe said:
Heartland was the story of China invading America. It was a first-person-shooter where you played a soldier debating whether to stay and fight for America or go AWOL to meet up with your family. We were trying to put in a lot of gameplay that would evoke emotion. You had sequences where you'd go into homes and your commanding officer would tell you to shoot innocent Chinese-Americans. It was very dark and was meant to cause players to consider what it's like to live in America and be an American today.

Hearing myself talk about it now makes me a bit sad [that we didn't finish it]. But I wasn't incentivized to make it, in a way that I could go to my family and say, ''You're not going to see me for 90% of the time, but there's a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow.'' There isn't a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow, at least the current way the industry is set up.
http://www.1up.com/do/newsStory?cId=3157905

that sounds like a pretty incredible premise to me.

If David was concerned with the time commitment-vs-reward of developing the game, I wonder if he'd be willing to take the GoW approach and hand over day-to-day control while maintaining a creative directorship.

I'd really like to see this game made.
 

Oldschoolgamer

The physical form of blasphemy
Jan 29, 2006
21,412
0
0
;_;

Sounds awesome.

Edit: Someone tell Jaffe about Gary's mod and the source engine. He should get some people to finish it for him.
 

White Man

Member
Jun 9, 2004
25,047
4
1,460
Seattle, WA
That sounds pretty high concept for something that would be a PSP game, but I guess if they were going to make this, it would've been marekted as a killer app.

I like the idea, and I'm not always on the same page as Jaffe.
 

theBishop

Banned
Nov 26, 2006
17,210
0
0
He should give all the work that was started on this game to High Impact Studio. They've proven themselves with Size Matters, now they can follow in Insomniac's footsteps and work on an FPS :).
 

Wario64

works for Gamestop (lol)
Jun 6, 2004
74,323
3
0
Didn't an EGM rumor say this game was really a God of War game in disguise? lol
 

Lord Error

Insane For Sony
Jun 8, 2004
28,320
0
0
Imagining this done using SF: DM engine makes me sad they abandoned it :(

Calling all Cars is cool and all, but this sounds like something I'd personally much rather be playing.
 
Aug 17, 2004
17,803
142
1,355
Well, the premise itself is pretty idiotic. These countries don't invade one another. I guess it could be done if the population of one was thinned out enough, but still sounds pretty unrealistic to me. The idea of adding difficult decisions and truly mature concepts, now that I'm all for. Some of the scenes sounded pretty harrowing, and that's a good thing.

There aren't many games on the horizon that I'm aware of that seem to be focused on exploring emotionally challenging concepts of war, and that's a shame. Well, there is that one game, but I won't even mention the name of it or Stinkles will accuse me of being a viral marketer, and probably communist too.
 

Mau ®

Member
Apr 16, 2005
16,569
0
0
That's very cool. I dont think PSP was the ideal plataform for such game. PS2 and PS3 would have been more convinient.
 

Ninja Scooter

Member
Jun 7, 2004
123,719
5
0
i don't know, i doubt i could feel 'bad' playing a videogame, and the whole point would be lost. What would be sad about your CO telling you to kill innocent families when i've been killing thousands of innocent pedestrians in GTA games for years without thinking twice?
 

White Man

Member
Jun 9, 2004
25,047
4
1,460
Seattle, WA
Wario64 said:
Didn't an EGM rumor say this game was really a God of War game in disguise? lol
That's what I heard, too. My source wasn't working on the project though, and I don't mention things unless I have a fair level of confidence in the rumor. I MADE THE RIGHT CALL.
 

Zeenbor

Member
Jun 10, 2004
945
0
0
Los Angeles
www.run-games.com
Interesting concept, but it's very scary to imagine this game being released because of the political implications. I can appreciate the underlying theme, though: Appreciate what we have now, because our way of life could be over before we know it and there are things we can do to make sure we don't **** it up everything. Pseudo-reality (like Children of Men) stories are projections of perceived futures which can help us appreciate what we have now and prepare us for what could happen in the future.
 

bud

Member
Nov 22, 2004
34,569
0
1,530
I don't see how a psp game, no matter how good it would be, could evoke emotions in the way that Jaffe wanted.
 

Y2Kev

TLG Fan Caretaker Est. 2009
Jul 6, 2005
91,412
0
0
30
Totally. The concept is scary, unnerving, and uncomfortable. I could totally see the cry thing.

But this is a PS3 game, not a PSP game. PSP is not suited for this kind of gameplay...or FPS.
 

D2M15

DAFFY DEUS EGGS
Jun 9, 2004
4,124
0
0
I guess it's more an indicator of how old and sappy I am, but I've had emotions evoked by games on machines far inferior to the PSP in processing power, visual fidelity or ease of control.

Bespoke games can work. It's a shame this one didn't.
 

White Man

Member
Jun 9, 2004
25,047
4
1,460
Seattle, WA
D2M15 said:
I guess it's more an indicator of how old and sappy I am, but I've had emotions evoked by games on machines far inferior to the PSP in power, visual fidelity or ease of control.
I know. Just last night I cried while playing this 20+ year old game.


...


Alright, actually I was just jerking off to Family Ties while thinking about why Nintendo fans act the way they do.
 

xaosslug

Member
Dec 22, 2005
13,629
33
1,250
in a van down by the river
White Man said:
I know. Just last night I cried while playing this 20+ year old game.


...


Alright, actually I was just jerking off to Family Ties while thinking about why Nintendo fans act the way they do.
so, one could say, in a roundabout fashion, you were jerking off to Nintendo fans... ;p

:lol
 

Tieno

Member
May 6, 2006
17,488
1
1,205
Belgium
Lets have a GAF fundraiser for Jaffe so he can have his pot of gold and is able to make this game!

Ok, I have 600 Microsoft Points!
 

White Man

Member
Jun 9, 2004
25,047
4
1,460
Seattle, WA
xaosslug said:
so, one could say, in a roundabout fashion, you were jerking off to Nintendo fans... ;p

:lol
Well, I have always been fond of certain paraphilias, as evidenced by my fevered whoring of certain websites.
 

Belfast

Member
Jun 6, 2004
9,234
0
0
That does sound good. We get tons of games about past conflicts and a bunch about really futuristic ones, but we almost never get any concerned with near-future wars that we, of this generation, could potentially be involved in.
 

-Rogue5-

Member
Apr 6, 2006
2,723
0
0
Toronto
www.gaming-age.com
That's weird... from his blog posts I (at one point he said they scrapped the game mid-dev and restarted) I got the feeling that the problem was the game just became a series of do-or-dont choices that ultimate grew stale. I'd imagine the problem being that you'd have to set up key "choose a path" moments, as you couldn't do it procedurally without massive overhead.

Take the example described -- if you don't shoot the Chinese-Americans you'd have to kill your superior (or be killed or watch as someone else killed the Chinese-Americans.) That drastically changes the rest of the game, but if the entire thing was comprised of moments like those it wouldn't be possible as the outcome of the game would be too varying. Just far to many potential conclusions... BUT, I definitely think it's possible on next-gen.

...plus dually analog sticks helps for FPS.
 

Tieno

Member
May 6, 2006
17,488
1
1,205
Belgium
-Rogue5- said:
That's weird... from his blog posts I (at one point he said they scrapped the game mid-dev and restarted) I got the feeling that the problem was the game just became a series of do-or-dont choices that ultimate grew stale. I'd imagine the problem being that you'd have to set up key "choose a path" moments, as you couldn't do it procedurally without massive overhead.

Take the example described -- if you don't shoot the Chinese-Americans you'd have to kill your superior (or be killed or watch as someone else killed the Chinese-Americans.) That drastically changes the rest of the game, but if the entire thing was comprised of moments like those it wouldn't be possible as the outcome of the game would be too varying. Just far to many potential conclusions... BUT, I definitely think it's possible on next-gen.

...plus dually analog sticks helps for FPS.
Sounds like Splinter Cell DA.
 
Feb 9, 2006
2,621
0
1,225
Flushing, NY
Marconelly said:
Calling all Cars is cool and all, but this sounds like something I'd personally much rather be playing.
I agree. The concept is much better than what I expected it to be and one of the more promising uses of FPS. I'd still like to see it happen actually.
 

-Rogue5-

Member
Apr 6, 2006
2,723
0
0
Toronto
www.gaming-age.com
Tieno said:
Sounds like Splinter Cell DA.
That's the EXACT example I was looking for. SCDA only had a few and they kind of ended up sucking... With Heartland I got the feeling that Jaffe didn't want to have the choices be so forced or that a few key choices were momumentally more important (like no one choice was more important than another.) Instead he wanted the player to make the choices fluidly throughout the entire game and have each one of them effect the outcome story and emotion(s) of the player. I can't even imagine the amounts problems associated with that.

To get around the emphasis of only certain "do-or-don't" moments, I was under the impression that he just added lots of them. But because of technology limitations or development hell, they had to be scripted, so he ended up with a game that was just full of scripted events (which doesn't sound too appealing, depsite how incredible the game's elevator pitch is.) Again, this is all just my speculation... But you can imagine how difficult it would be to try to make a game that relies on (emotional) choices, but at the same time seem as natural as possible... on a handheld no-less.

I want to interview Jaffe on just Heartland...it's a f_cking goldmine topic.
 

Ceb

Member
Jul 8, 2004
4,894
1
0
Wouldn't the "pot of gold" be to be able to look back at the finished game and say "Yep, I was the driving force behind this, I'm really pleased with it and critics and gamers will remember it as something special"? I thought that was the driving force for most creative minds.

Jaffe: http://guilesadvice.ytmnd.com/ :lol
 

Grayman

Member
Feb 7, 2005
15,125
0
0
34
Surrey, BC
Thats a great plot idea. It might have worked better just as a film or set of 2 films though.

and an FPS can work on psp. Move with shape buttons, aim with analog. Or use an iron sights aim system that forces players to stop so that moving and aiming is done with the one stick.

Ceb said:
Wouldn't the "pot of gold" be to be able to look back at the finished game and say "Yep, I was the driving force behind this, I'm really pleased with it and critics and gamers will remember it as something special"? I thought that was the driving force for most creative minds.

Jaffe: http://guilesadvice.ytmnd.com/ :lol
For a man with a family the emotional happiness of reaching the artistic pot of gold probably doesn't out weight nearly living in the studio for a year plus to get there.
 

Ceb

Member
Jul 8, 2004
4,894
1
0
Grayman said:
For a man with a family the emotional happiness of reaching the artistic pot of gold probably doesn't out weight nearly living in the studio for a year plus to get there.
Yep, and I respect that (my comment was made purely in jest). It's a shame though, this game sounds like it could've been the anti-WWII shooter.
 

Dachande

Member
Jun 24, 2005
3,333
0
0
UK
That sounds like quite an interesting idea, actually, but not particularly suited for the PSP at all.

Can't it be moved to PS3 and couldn't Jaffe take on the producer or exec producer position instead? Give the director role to someone within Santa Monica who he thinks could do it justice; maybe someone who hasn't directed a game before but is gagging for a chance and who could do it well. There's someone working under him like that, guaranteed, and surely the producer/exec position takes up less time. Right?

Listen to Suda! We need cool, original ideas and this is one! Hopefully he'll see this thread and respond to a few posts...
 

Grayman

Member
Feb 7, 2005
15,125
0
0
34
Surrey, BC
Ceb said:
Yep, and I respect that (my comment was made purely in jest). It's a shame though, this game sounds like it could've been the anti-WWII shooter.
yeah i just didn't check the ytmnd link until after i posted.
 

DjangoReinhardt

Thinks he should have been the one to kill Batman's parents.
Jun 7, 2004
3,887
0
0
China invading the U.S.? Really, David?

I take it the crying in this game was to be from laughter directed at the ridiculous premise.
 

Y2Kev

TLG Fan Caretaker Est. 2009
Jul 6, 2005
91,412
0
0
30
DjangoReinhardt said:
China invading the U.S.? Really, David?

I take it the crying in this game was to be from laughter directed at the ridiculous premise.
Does it really matter? It's a video game. Insomniac's shooter has aliens attacking and converting humans, and Gears of War has giant bug like creatures come out of the ground. It's just a game.