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Jim Ryan and the denigration of Playstation.

yurinka

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With them coming to other platforms it weakens the need and the branding for playstation though. Just because you can still play it on playstation isn't the point. How long do you think before those supposed exclusives come to pc.

That point you made of wanting those games being available also works towards pulling folks to other platforms if they know they can play them there. Just having the game on your platform is what Microsoft has been fighting for with Sony exclusives of the past. Microsoft has now used those gaming coming to its platform plus gamepass to make xbox the more desirable platform.
No, it doesn't weak anything. The PlayStation brand is more successful now than it has never been looking at their revenue, console sales, game sales or even exclusive sales. People buy PlayStations because they know it will have a ton of great games they want to play.
 
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Clear

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They’re not really starting hot though. If anything the second half of this gen is when a lot of their games will come into play. I’m expecting next year is when things will slowly start to pick up.
Well, here's the thing. The "past" is a finite resource and they've already flogged the hell out of it over the past few years, so they need a steady stream of new product to keep their appeal from rolling backwards.

This is the challenge of running a service like GamePass, its like a treadmill where if they stop running it'll slow down. Look at what they've thrown at it up to now to get it up to its current "speed", and consider that they need to keep that flow up perpetually...
 

NahaNago

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No, it doesn't weak anything. The PlayStation brand is more successful now than it has never been looking at their revenue, console sales, game sales or even exclusive sales. People buy PlayStations because they know it will have a ton of great games they want to play.
playstation 5 is currently still riding on the wave of the ps4. So of course it is successful right now. I'm thinking more of the long term. This gen just started and consoles are still flying off of the shelves for both companies so talking about successful sales doesn't mean anything. The question will be what happens next year or the year after when Microsoft is firing on all cylinders with all of the first party games and gamepass.
 
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Papacheeks

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playstation 5 is currently still riding on the wave of the ps4. So of course it is successful right now. I'm thinking more of the long term. This gen just started and consoles are still flying off of the shelves for both companies so talking about successful sales doesn't mean anything. The question will be what happens next year or the year after when Microsoft is firing on all cylinders with all of the first party games and gamepass.

Playstation isn't going anywhere, and if the quality of their launch games has anything to say about it. They are going full steam ahead with first party. 2021-2022 going to be stacked.
 
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Stooky

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playstation 5 is currently still riding on the wave of the ps4. So of course it is successful right now. I'm thinking more of the long term. This gen just started and consoles are still flying off of the shelves for both companies so talking about successful sales doesn't mean anything. The question will be what happens next year or the year after when Microsoft is firing on all cylinders with all of the first party games and gamepass.
Huh? Since when has xbox been firing on all cylinders? As for Sony we already know they have several 1st party titles cooking right now. Sony has delivered multiple times, I've been waiting to for Xbox to show up since 2014.
 

HE1NZ

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Let's be real. Sonys games are always high on the charts the first many weeks, and people still buy ps5.

Why do you think Sony dies if they don't port to pc? They went away with so much with no consequences last gen. I'm sure even though how much of an idiot Ryan is, they'd still outsell xbox and Nintendo.
I was mostly trollig, but here is a serious take.

Sony makes 1-2 exclusive games per year (which fanboys say are all 10/10, but in reality they are usually 8/10 at best) while Microsoft offers games for basically free. Once their acquisitions start pumping new games Sony won't be able to compete with MS. Sony needs to rely on something else. They need to hook people up to their eco system and their franchises, not necessarily their fat console. They will make more money selling their exclusives on Steam than trying to hook a tiny amount of PC gamers into buying a console just to play these 1-2 exclusives a year (a console that they sell at a loss). Sony going full PS/PC is best for everyone.
 
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Is PlayStation denegrated yet?

Jim !!!.. You cuck. WTF are you doing?

Meanwhile Jim:
 

NahaNago

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Playstation isn't going anywhere, and if the quality of their launch games has anything to say about it. They are going full steam ahead with first party. 2021-2022 going to be stacked.
Is 2021 going to be stacked. All we know for sure is Returnal and Ratchet and Clank. Covid and Jim's lies makes most of the games promised for 2021 seem iffy. I'm pretty sure gt got pushed back already and horizon zero dawn still has no release date, plus all we've had for god of war was a teaser.
Huh? Since when has xbox been firing on all cylinders? As for Sony we already know they have several 1st party titles cooking right now. Sony has delivered multiple times, I've been waiting to for Xbox to show up since 2014.
I totally agree on waiting for xbox to show up since 2014 but they just aquired like 5 studios and zenimax. They don't have any excuses now. Do you seriously think Microsoft isn't going to go ham on first party titles starting next year.
I was mostly trollig, but here is a serious take.

Sony makes 1-2 exclusive games per year (which fanboys say are all 10/10, but in reality they are usually 8/10 at best) while Microsoft offers games for basically free. Once their acquisitions start pumping new games Sony won't be able to compete with MS. Sony needs to rely on something else. They need to hook people up to their eco system and their franchises, not necessarily their fat console. They will make more money selling their exclusives on Steam than trying to hook a tiny amount of PC gamers into buying a console just to play these 1-2 exclusives a year (a console that they sell at a loss). Sony going full PS/PC is best for everyone.
So your plan is to remove the one of the reasons pc players might jump on to the playstation platform and possibly buy more games in that ecosystem by putting the 1 or 2 games a year they make on pc. The purpose of the exclusives is to entice people to buy your console. It is merely a starting point to get folks into your ecosystem. How is Sony hooking people up to their ecosystem when you aren't using their ecosystem. I can understand possibly introducing them to a franchise but let's be serious here it isn't like pc gamers didnt already pay attention to every game Microsoft and Sony were making already. Sony going full ps/pc is best for pc gamers is what you mean.
 

HE1NZ

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So your plan is to remove the one of the reasons pc players might jump on to the playstation platform and possibly buy more games in that ecosystem by putting the 1 or 2 games a year they make on pc. The purpose of the exclusives is to entice people to buy your console. It is merely a starting point to get folks into your ecosystem. How is Sony hooking people up to their ecosystem when you aren't using their ecosystem. I can understand possibly introducing them to a franchise but let's be serious here it isn't like pc gamers didnt already pay attention to every game Microsoft and Sony were making already. Sony going full ps/pc is best for pc gamers is what you mean.
This logic from 2007 is completely wrong and outdated.

You are not enticing PC gamers to join your ecosystem. You entice them to buy a console (at a loss for Sony), buy a tiny bunch of exclusives, then sell them on ebay (another loss for Sony) and go back playing on PC. PC and Consoles are two different ways to play, they are not competitors. PC games play on PC, console gamers play on console, mobile gamers play on mobile. Putting a game on PC does not devalue it for console gamers because they're not going to run buying a $2000 PC to play it. It only devalues it for Sony cultists who see exclusives in their sleep, but they are 0,1% of PS base.
 
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NahaNago

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This logic from 2007 is completely wrong and outdated.

You are not enticing PC gamers to join your ecosystem. You entice them to buy a console (at a loss for Sony), buy a tiny bunch of exclusives, then sell them on ebay (another loss for Sony) and go back playing on PC. PC and Consoles are two different ways to play, they are not competitors. PC games play on PC, console gamers play on console, mobile gamers play on mobile.
So you bought the console and several game. It isn't like used games were never a thing before. Plus I doubt they are going to sell the console until the end of the generation. Plus consoles become cheaper to make usually as the gen goes on. So now it just comes down to the console maker enticing you to buy more games on its platform after you have bought the console. Pc gamers play console games all the time just watch your favorite youtuber who praises pc and then plays every console exclusive and some mobile gamers still play on console.
for the next 2-3 years Well see how many of those titles are exclusive. I wouldn't hold my breath.
I'm wondering about the exclusivity of the games as well but I'm just going to view anything made by Microsoft studios as exclusive until they say they aren't. It saves you a lot of grief and won't leave you wondering will this one come or this one come to playstation or Nintendo.
 
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It only devalues it for Sony cultists who see exclusives in their sleep, but they are 0,1% of PS base.
Exactly.

Apple felt the same in the early 2000s, ditched their hardcore 2% marketshare following and went totally mainstream with the widest net possible to get people to buy iPods, Macs and then iPads. Apple even made iTunes work on PCs when iPods were new.

For every disgruntled Apple fan from 1984 pissed at them having everyone buy Apple gear, there's now probably 100 modern day customers to replace him.
 
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AGRacing

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In my eyes Jim Ryan is a step back, absolutely. I don't agree with the criticism of the hardware (it's technically excellent)... but there are moves in software and marketing I absolutely hate.

They should abide by some rules going forward

1.) Stop lying or being absolute idiots when announcing release dates.

2.) Stop censorship. You may as well be negotiating with terrorists as soon as you make the decision to censor one culture or one market.

3.) Always - ALWAYS play like you're the underdog.... because Microsoft sure as hell isn't screwing around this generation.
 
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Hatsuma

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In my eyes Jim Ryan is a step back, absolutely. I don't agree with the criticism of the hardware (it's technically excellent)... but there are moves in software and marketing I absolutely hate.

They should abide by some rules going forward

1.) Stop lying or being absolute idiots when announcing release dates.

2.) Stop censorship. You may as well be negotiating with terrorists as soon as you make the decision to censor one culture or one market.

3.) Always - ALWAYS play like you're the underdog.... because Microsoft sure as hell isn't screwing around this generation.
1.) These doods have been doing this generations predating Ryan. A weakness of Sony's for generations. But a problem with their silence, is that they are perceived not doing anything, which is comical.
2.) The censorship stance was happening before Ryan XD. That is Sony decision which may be to combat niche eroges which DMCV got caught up into.
3.) Let's see what Playstation plans are. They had a blistering 2020. We're only in March, XD. Typically Sony doesn't discuss the future plans that far out. They have a habit of announcing games too early in some cases, but don't go too in depth with future goings.

It is awesome to know future projects but I do want the here and now as well.
 

longdi

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i posted before, jimbo took over SCE global marketing job sometime in 2016, is it a coincidence their communication dropped like a rock around that period since?

imo Intel is a good recent example where their ceo was not a product guy. their malaise grew too deep while a false front from living off their past success and poor competitors, allowed some masking.

you can quote me on this, but jimbo is leading SCE down the same old Intel rabbit hole.
 
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Tschumi

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It's still awesome.

Now if you'll excuse me, I'm away from my ps4 pro so I'll play on my vita.
 
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Heisenberg007

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i posted before, jimbo took over SCE global marketing job sometime in 2016, is it a coincidence their communication dropped like a rock around that period since?

imo Intel is a good recent example where their ceo was not a product guy. their malaise grew too deep while a false front from living off their past success and poor competitors, allowed some masking.

you can quote me on this, but jimbo is leading SCE down the same old Intel rabbit hole.
Does this also include recording the highest ever revenue and operating profit and breaking industry records left and right?

We are all being hyperbolic in this thread.
 
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Heisenberg007

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If Sony's going to by buying developers then I hope its developers they have a history of close working relationships with. An example being Kojima.
Would love for the mad man to be under Sony's umbrella and have his team expanded to 2 or even 3 dev teams. Kojima is just the enough amount of crazy that will allow Sony to have that X factor in their portfolio of 1st party titles.
You need someone who wants to try and break the mould and you get that with Kojima. Might be risky in AAA development but we need that cause gaming has becoming a copy/paste job for the past few years now.
I agree. Kojima is a brand and must be poached as soon as possible.
 
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yurinka

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playstation 5 is currently still riding on the wave of the ps4. So of course it is successful right now. I'm thinking more of the long term. This gen just started and consoles are still flying off of the shelves for both companies so talking about successful sales doesn't mean anything. The question will be what happens next year or the year after when Microsoft is firing on all cylinders with all of the first party games and gamepass.
Do you know why we already know basically all the big games MS will release in the next 4 years or so since a year or two, while we only know the games Sony will release in the next 6 months or a year?

Because Sony already has a working strategy of consistently releasing great exclusives every few months and they build enough hype with the stuff they will mostly release in the next half a year, or a year. And mixes that with great exclusive indies and some marketing deals of the biggest AAA games. They don't need to hype the people with 'wait until several years in the future to see that game we still don't have in full production'.

Microsoft will deliver a good batch -their first one- of big AAA next gen exclusives in the 2023-2026 period and they'll need to manage how to become profitable putting all these AAAs day one on Game Pass on Xbox and PC. It will be a great period with tons of games, but I'm afraid PS5 already will have an insane market share distance that. And Sony will continue getting people hyped with their catalog for the next 6 months/a year with several exclusive goty candidates or winners plus several cool exclusive indies and key marketing deals with the top AAA multis. And will continue selling. This time with their next gen PSVR and PS Now in the market who should have addressed the main issues their past gen version had.

Microsoft will shoot their first important bullet this year with Halo. Let's see if it ends being great and how it stands against GoWR, Horizon 2 or Ghostwire Tokyo (well, this one is for both) and a fews months later GT7. Specially considering that after summer the supply constrains should have been fixed and that Sony has been breaking all sorts of gaming history records in the recent years.

i posted before, jimbo took over SCE global marketing job sometime in 2016, is it a coincidence their communication dropped like a rock around that period since?

imo Intel is a good recent example where their ceo was not a product guy. their malaise grew too deep while a false front from living off their past success and poor competitors, allowed some masking.

you can quote me on this, but jimbo is leading SCE down the same old Intel rabbit hole.
When Jimbo was handling the markething in Europe PlayStation meant a revolution for the console gaming industry worldwide but specially in Europe, which became the main PS market and worlwide to the point their first two consoles became by far the best selling ever worldwide.

Then he became President of SIEE in 2011 and PS3 made its comeback and PS4 fixed its main issues and started to break gaming history records. He became the sales and marketing head at SIE in 2016 and PS4 started to dominate even more and to get a lot of exclusives being GOTY winners or candidates.

In 2018 he became CEO of SIE and PS had in 2020 the best performing year ever for any console platform holder in gaming history. There's a pattern there, miss Spencer. Doesn't matter if fanboy trolls keep insisting on throwing shit to Jimbo for no reason, he always has been doing a great job.

I was mostly trollig, but here is a serious take.

Sony makes 1-2 exclusive games per year (which fanboys say are all 10/10, but in reality they are usually 8/10 at best) while Microsoft offers games for basically free. Once their acquisitions start pumping new games Sony won't be able to compete with MS. Sony needs to rely on something else. They need to hook people up to their eco system and their franchises, not necessarily their fat console. They will make more money selling their exclusives on Steam than trying to hook a tiny amount of PC gamers into buying a console just to play these 1-2 exclusives a year (a console that they sell at a loss). Sony going full PS/PC is best for everyone.
Sony makes a shit ton more money than MS from gaming. By selling consoles, games and subscription services. It's MS who can't compete with Sony. This is why MS first started to expand to PC and after seeing it wasn't enough, they are betting all in on Game Pass to see if at least they can compete on subscription services, where as of today Sony generates way more revenue and has way more subscribers even before they started to improve PS Now for the next gen (in the software side, the console hardware side already has a lead over Xbox for streaming and download services with BT 5.1, wifi 6, the SSD speed and the decompression chip).
 
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longdi

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Does this also include recording the highest ever revenue and operating profit and breaking industry records left and right?

We are all being hyperbolic in this thread.

Intel is still making profits. of course in comparison, SCE and console industry are smaller scale then intel
 

Heisenberg007

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Intel is still making profits. of course in comparison, SCE and console industry are smaller scale then intel
It's not just about profit, though. It is about recording the highest-ever operating profit for the company.

Moreover, recording the highest-ever revenue earned in the entire gaming industry + having the most successful console launch in the history of gaming (+ during a pandemic) + having the highest attach rate for a gaming subscription service + so many other things.

We may agree or disagree with some of the decisions Jim Ryan took, but to say that Jim is bad for the PlayStation business (based on current evidence and data) is a bit hyperbolic in my opinion.
 
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longdi

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Do you know why we already know basically all the big games MS will release in the next 4 years or so since a year or two, while we only know the games Sony will release in the next 6 months or a year?

Because Sony already has a working strategy of consistently releasing great exclusives every few months and they build enough hype with the stuff they will mostly release in the next half a year, or a year. And mixes that with great exclusive indies and some marketing deals of the biggest AAA games. They don't need to hype the people with 'wait until several years in the future to see that game we still don't have in full production'.

Microsoft will deliver a good batch -their first one- of big AAA next gen exclusives in the 2023-2026 period and they'll need to manage how to become profitable putting all these AAAs day one on Game Pass on Xbox and PC. It will be a great period with tons of games, but I'm afraid PS5 already will have an insane market share distance that. And Sony will continue getting people hyped with their catalog for the next 6 months/a year with several exclusive goty candidates or winners plus several cool exclusive indies and key marketing deals with the top AAA multis. And will continue selling. This time with their next gen PSVR and PS Now in the market who should have addressed the main issues their past gen version had.

Microsoft will shoot their first important bullet this year with Halo. Let's see if it ends being great and how it stands against GoWR, Horizon 2 or Ghostwire Tokyo (well, this one is for both) and a fews months later GT7. Specially considering that after summer the supply constrains should have been fixed and that Sony has been breaking all sorts of gaming history records in the recent years.


When Jimbo was handling the markething in Europe PlayStation meant a revolution for the console gaming industry worldwide but specially in Europe, which became the main PS market and worlwide to the point their first two consoles became by far the best selling ever worldwide.

Then he became President of SIEE in 2011 and PS3 made its comeback and PS4 fixed its main issues and started to break gaming history records. He became the sales and marketing head at SIE in 2016 and PS4 started to dominate even more and to get a lot of exclusives being GOTY winners or candidates.

In 2018 he became CEO of SIE and PS had in 2020 the best performing year ever for any console platform holder in gaming history. There's a pattern there, miss Spencer. Doesn't matter if fanboy trolls keep insisting on throwing shit to Jimbo for no reason, he always has been doing a great job.

im not too clear what's going on in EU but the impression i get, is the market is smaller and fragmented in distribution. and you just need football games. Jimbo has been coasting over there, mainly outside UK and Ger.

ps3 revival has to be down with Kaz team, gutted the techie side of Ken's ways and back to core gaming.

speaking about Ken, he has more gamer charisma than suity suit jimbo.

check out YT of Ken guest tapping for giant-bomb or his ice bucket challenge or his recent causal video with head of Tekken team.

that's what a product person gives you, knowledge and passion for his project and people who support the project

does jimbo have a psn gamer card? does he even know how to operate a ps5?
 
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longdi

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It's not just about profit, though. It is about recording the highest-ever operating profit for the company.

Moreover, recording the highest-ever revenue earned in the entire gaming industry + having the most successful console launch in the history of gaming (+ during a pandemic) + having the highest attach rate for a gaming subscription service + so many other things.

We may agree or disagree with some of the decisions Jim Ryan took, but to say that Jim is bad for the PlayStation business (based on current evidence and data) is a bit hyperbolic in my opinion.
definitely disagree and concerning for me.

communication sticks out like a sore thumb once he took over.

as for the rest, some of it is down to the pandemic lockdown and some of it is from coasting on continuity. AAA games development now takes 3-4years?

jimbo legacy should start from ps5 and imo the writing on the wall looks hazy under jimbo
 

yurinka

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im not too clear what's going on in EU but the impression i get, is the market is smaller and fragmented in distribution.
Yes, EU is -and specially was before the EU union- a fragmented market with different languages and cultures. One of the keys of the PS1 huge success compared to previous consoles is that they understood that and started to localize everything.

That made many games like the JRPGs more accessible to many non-English native speakers who until then only got a few games localized. Europe (or EMEA to be more specific) has been the biggest PlayStation market since then and -plus obviously a good performance in NA and Japan- the key of their worldwide domination.

speaking about Ken, he has more gamer charisma than suity suit jimbo.

check out YT for Ken guess show on gamer bomb or his ice bucket challenge or his recent causal video with head of Tekken team.

that's what a product person gives you, knowledge and passion for his project and people who support the project
Crazy Ken is a genius, but I'm pretty sure he got mad when designing the PS3 and his anime mechas and AI will become Skynet and will kill us all. Loved his video with Harada, who is the best and also has some cool round tables with the other main Japanese FGC devs in YouTube.

I think executives like CEOs don't need to be youtubers or good PR stars to sell their stuff, they already have a marketing and PR team to do that. They don't even need to have a fucking idea about games. Their job is to make sure their business works and performs great.

I think that as engineer Ken is a beast, but with PS3 he forgot the console is to allow human beings to develop games for it and to sell it to people who won't get a second job to buy it. I think Cerny later did a better job with Vita/PS4/PS5 in that way: easy to develop for, powerful and full featured while at a reasonable price. Cerny may be a fucking weirdo but again, he doesn't need to be a PR likeable guy: his job is to be a great console arquitect, to cause boners between devs with SSD speeds, GPU stuff, memory management and other techie stuff. And to stay away from Japan Studio and don't force them to make Knack 3.
 
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cripterion

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Honestly, sounds to me like OP has a hard on for TLOU 2.

I don't like some of the things Jim Ryan says but honestly, when it comes to games just get used to the drought.

Everything is taking longer...add to that the shift in gaming with the success of games like Fornite, Japan being heavy into mobile games and you got the perfect recipe for what you're seeing today.
 

Keihart

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Yes, EU is -and specially was before the EU union- a fragmented market with different languages and cultures. One of the keys of the PS1 huge success compared to previous consoles is that they understood that and started to localize everything.

That made many games like the JRPGs more accessible to many non-English native speakers who until then only got a few games localized. Europe (or EMEA to be more specific) has been the biggest PlayStation market since then and -plus obviously a good performance in NA and Japan- the key of their worldwide domination.


Crazy Ken is a genius, but I'm pretty sure he got mad when designing the PS3 and his anime mechas and AI will become Skynet and will kill us all. Loved his video with Harada, who is the best and also has some cool round tables with the other main Japanese FGC devs in YouTube.

I think executives like CEOs don't need to be youtubers or good PR stars to sell their stuff, they already have a marketing and PR team to do that. They don't even need to have a fucking idea about games. Their job is to make sure their business works and performs great.

I think that as engineer Ken is a beast, but with PS3 he forgot the console is to allow human beings to develop games for it and to sell it to people who won't get a second job to buy it. I think Cerny later did a better job with Vita/PS4/PS5 in that way: easy to develop for, powerful and full featured while at a reasonable price. Cerny may be a fucking weirdo but again, he doesn't need to be a PR likeable guy: his job is to be a great console arquitect, to cause boners between devs with SSD speeds, GPU stuff, memory management and other techie stuff. And to stay away from Japan Studio and don't force them to make Knack 3.
CEOs, since they steer the ship, i would argue they should probably be somehow passionate about their specific business, that would help them get ahead of trends and understand better the consumer experience outside of just numbers, allowing them to contextualize what the numbers tell them, although, this is probably true and necessary for most management positions.

I was already yelling to the sky bloom and gloom before the bad news started to pour down and this type of threads gained traction (i called bullshit at the moment Shu was repositioned ), i'm not exactly happy of being right but there is nothing left to do but bitch about it on a forum and wait for whatever it's comming.
 
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Hypereides

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As a PS fan, I'm going to say something perhaps controversial, but I honestly wouldn't be bothered if PlayStation would happen to falter right now.

They haven't been the same for a long, long time if you ask me. The platform and Ryan are prepping for a different kind of future set for a new kind of audience while abandoning their Japanese tradition, apparently. Us, the long time original PS fans, don't seem to fit into that future. Those who enjoy those good old fashioned arcadey games are also being phased out. And you know what? I'm kinda cool with that. Its time for a new generation to get their turn.

Besides, their legacy has left us with a swath of great and unforgetable games to still be enjoyed and discussed. Heck, some of their older platforms might even see a resurgence with waves of indie/hobbyist developed games being released for them. Just like we've seen happen with the NES and the Mega drive for instance.
 
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sunnysideup

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The success ps sees now are from the seeds they planted at the end of ps3 and ps4 launch...not jimbos. he has just reaping what others sowed.


if he continues this short sighted profitering ps future looks uncertain.
 
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sunnysideup

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This logic from 2007 is completely wrong and outdated.

You are not enticing PC gamers to join your ecosystem. You entice them to buy a console (at a loss for Sony), buy a tiny bunch of exclusives, then sell them on ebay (another loss for Sony) and go back playing on PC. PC and Consoles are two different ways to play, they are not competitors. PC games play on PC, console gamers play on console, mobile gamers play on mobile. Putting a game on PC does not devalue it for console gamers because they're not going to run buying a $2000 PC to play it. It only devalues it for Sony cultists who see exclusives in their sleep, but they are 0,1% of PS base.
i bought a 2000dollar pc. and i was ps only

now i am not buying a ps5
 
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b6a6es

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Anyone or anything is better than him...I just can't take it anymore.

How are they gonna top the last two weeks? Come around to my house and kneecap me?

Really....FUCK Jim Ryan.
Bring Don mattrick !!!!!!!! Or cell processor Simp Kutaragi!!!!!!!!!!
 

Heisenberg007

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As a PS fan, I'm going to say something perhaps controversial, but I honestly wouldn't be bothered if PlayStation would happen to falter right now.

They haven't been the same for a long, long time if you ask me. The platform and Ryan are prepping for a different kind of future set for a new kind of audience while abandoning their Japanese tradition, apparently. Us, the long time original PS fans, don't seem to fit into that future. Those who enjoy those good old fashioned arcadey games are also being phased out. And you know what? I'm kinda cool with that. Its time for a new generation to get their turn.

Besides, their legacy has left us with a swath of great and unforgetable games to still be enjoyed and discussed. Heck, some of their older platforms might even see a resurgence with waves of indie/hobbyist developed games being released for them. Just like we've seen happen with the NES and the Mega drive for instance.
But didn't the Japanese market abandon PlayStation and the gaming console industry first? They switched to mobile and handheld gaming devices years ago.
 
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NahaNago

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Do you know why we already know basically all the big games MS will release in the next 4 years or so since a year or two, while we only know the games Sony will release in the next 6 months or a year?

Because Sony already has a working strategy of consistently releasing great exclusives every few months and they build enough hype with the stuff they will mostly release in the next half a year, or a year. And mixes that with great exclusive indies and some marketing deals of the biggest AAA games. They don't need to hype the people with 'wait until several years in the future to see that game we still don't have in full production'.

Microsoft will deliver a good batch -their first one- of big AAA next gen exclusives in the 2023-2026 period and they'll need to manage how to become profitable putting all these AAAs day one on Game Pass on Xbox and PC. It will be a great period with tons of games, but I'm afraid PS5 already will have an insane market share distance that. And Sony will continue getting people hyped with their catalog for the next 6 months/a year with several exclusive goty candidates or winners plus several cool exclusive indies and key marketing deals with the top AAA multis. And will continue selling. This time with their next gen PSVR and PS Now in the market who should have addressed the main issues their past gen version had.

Microsoft will shoot their first important bullet this year with Halo. Let's see if it ends being great and how it stands against GoWR, Horizon 2 or Ghostwire Tokyo (well, this one is for both) and a fews months later GT7. Specially considering that after summer the supply constrains should have been fixed and that Sony has been breaking all sorts of gaming history records in the recent years.
Sony has a great strategy I agree but if your opponent is making all of these moves and tactics to overcome you then you need to adjust your strategy to respond to it.

We don't know when GoWR or even if Horizon 2 is even releasing this year for sure. Considering that Ratchet is releasing in like June I think. I don't expect them to release GoWR AND Horizon in the last half of this year. They are definitely going to push back at least GoWR and I wouldn't be surprised of Horizon gets pushed back to early next year like February for example. Why wouldn't Sony be breaking records after having Last of Us and Ghost of Tsushima this year they are still riding high plus Demon Souls all in the same year.

I think you are possibly underestimating Microsoft or at least Microsoft's potential. Have you forgotten they still have that senua game plus now with all of those studios folks will have no choice but to buy a xbox. No matter the quality of these games like fall out, wolfenstein , Doom, or elder scroll games just them not being on playstation will be a massive draw for gamers to move to the xbox and with the inclusion of gamepass plus Microsoft has the Senua game as well. If Microsoft finally plays their cards right they could end up easily dominating the last half of this gen. You can't tell me that you aren't really interested in Microsoft's E3 especially after all of the acquisitions.
 

Hatsuma

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But didn't the Japanese market abandon PlayStation and the gaming console industry first? They switched to mobile and handheld gaming devices years ago.
Truth lol. Their console sales have declined gen over gen. In addition, they did not give up on Japan or the Studios. They are still working with Japan devs for a number of games, they likely have 2nd party games still funded to Japanese devs, and Japan Studios is still a thing. Ps3 generation and ps4 generation, there were studios that were given nowhere near the leeway and got shuddered. Hell, even Santa Monica was going to get shuddered if the GoW reboot wasn't such success. Evolution got axed, Zipper got tha boot, Cambridge got killed, etc... Japan Studios is still a thing but got downsized due to lack of profitability and productivity, for a decade. There has to be some accountability, my lord. The main reason they are centering the studio around Asobi is because of the productivity of Astrobot so far. This may not be the only focus permanently. Other people who departed may rejoin.

As for PC plans, I've already tagged in my other post that this was hinted at by Layden prior to Ryan. Detroit, which is an IP Sony owns, made it's way to PC.

As for everything else, Sony typically does not make future plans known, so it is better to examine what right now. Right now, Ryan literally just coordinated a global launch relatively unstaggered during a Pandemic and still managed to ship as many PS5s as PS4, lmao. He had greater plans for the information rollout and to produce much more, but the pandemic uprooted all those plans XD. However, he secured a solid launch line up, outclassing previous 2 generations.

Of course he is not without faults, but I don't understand the sentiment of PS5's future looks bleak when he has produced results and didn't just give empty promises. We literally are 5 months into this generation, so im confused why the present isn't factored in, only the far future. Again, Jim Ryan definitely has faults, and is not personable whatsoever, but why isn't he being given the same benefit of the doubt. You should be critical for sure, but damn at least do not downplay his every accomplishment.
 
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Clear

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I think you are possibly underestimating Microsoft or at least Microsoft's potential. Have you forgotten they still have that senua game plus now with all of those studios folks will have no choice but to buy a xbox. No matter the quality of these games like fall out, wolfenstein , Doom, or elder scroll games just them not being on playstation will be a massive draw for gamers to move to the xbox and with the inclusion of gamepass plus Microsoft has the Senua game as well. If Microsoft finally plays their cards right they could end up easily dominating the last half of this gen. You can't tell me that you aren't really interested in Microsoft's E3 especially after all of the acquisitions.

Noone's buying a console for a Senua game. And this is crucial because the Playstation business model is primarily built on selling consoles.

The reality is that the strategy MS are going for is a broad assault on the entire rest of the industry. The biggest market for most of the Bethesda properties is PC, and if they are out there day#1 on GP, that's competition for Valve, EGS, and every other online storefront that would normally be the primary retailer.

People have to stop thinking in terms of Xbox vs Playstation, its not about just that anymore. Its an entirely unprecedented shift in approach, especially so when they really aren't starting from a position of strength within any of the contested spaces.
 
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Heisenberg007

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Truth lol. Their console sales have declined gen over gen. In addition, they did not give up on Japan or the Studios. They are still working with Japan devs for a number of games, they likely have 2nd party games still funded to Japanese devs, and Japan Studios is still a thing. Ps3 generation and ps4 generation, there were studios that were given nowhere near the leeway and got shuddered. Hell, even Santa Monica was going to get shuddered if the GoW reboot wasn't such success. Evolution got axed, Zipper got tha boot, Cambridge got killed, etc... Japan Studios is still a thing but got downsized due to unprofitable and productivity, for a decade. Their has to be some accountability, my lord. The main reason they are centering the studio around Asobi is because of the productivity of Astrobot so far. This may not be the only focus permanently. Other people who departed may rejoin.

As for PC plans, I've already tagged in my other post that this was hinted at by Layden prior to Ryan. Detroit, which is an IP Sony owns, made it's way to PC.

As for everything else, Sony typically does not make future plans known, so it is better to examine what right now. Right now, Ryan literally just coordinated a global launch relatively unstaggered during a Pandemic and still managed to ship as many PS5s as PS4, lmao. He had greater plans for the information rollout and to produce much more, but the pandemic uprooted all those plans XD. However, he secured a solid launch line up, outclassing previous 2 generations.

Of course he is not without faults, but I don't understand the sentiment of PS5's future looks bleak when he has produced results and didn't just give empty promises. We literally are 5 months into this generation, so im confused why the present isn't factored in, only the far future. Again, Jim Ryan definitely has faults, and is not personable whatsoever, but why isn't he being given the same benefit of the doubt. You should be critical for sure, but damn at least do not downplay his every accomplishment.
I agree. Jim said that they have an answer for GamePass, and implied that they will be talking about their subscription services plan in 2021.

I think that plan will primarily be Jim's brainchild, and I'll reserve my judgment until I've seen that.
 

NahaNago

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Noone's buying a console for a Senua game. And this is crucial because the Playstation business model is primarily built on selling consoles.

The reality is that the strategy MS are going for is a broad assault on the entire rest of the industry. The biggest market for most of the Bethesda properties is PC, and if they are out there day#1 on GP, that's competition for Valve, EGS, and every other online storefront that would normally be the primary retailer.

People have to stop thinking in terms of Xbox vs Playstation, its not about just that anymore. Its an entirely unprecedented shift in approach, especially so when they really aren't starting from a position of strength within any of the contested spaces.
Long term the biggest market for Bethesda is eventually PC. Are you trying to the discount hundreds of millions of dollars they make from console gamers on day one purchases of Bethesda games. Well the hundred of millions of dollars they use to make before they jumped to gamepass. Just because pc has the biggest market of gamers doesn't mean that they should be the primary focus of large publishers. I agree that folks need to stop thinking in terms of xbox vs playstatio it should be xbox vs ps vs pc. Truth be told Microsoft's gamepass, if they can keep funneling money in to it and keep growing the library will end up becoming the netflix of gaming and playstation console will end up looking like blockbuster. This is the shift that Microsoft has moved to. They won't need the oscar worthy games of Sony if they have the third party blockbuster hits plus the microsoft exclusives to entice folks to gamepass.
 
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Hatsuma

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I agree. Jim said that they have an answer for GamePass, and implied that they will be talking about their subscription services plan in 2021.

I think that plan will primarily be Jim's brainchild, and I'll reserve my judgment until I've seen that.
It is interesting. Idk if it'll be something as wild as day and date, especially for 1st party, but he has done massive things for Plus, coordinating huge Plus offerings, and offering the PS collection for newer players. I can't imagine anything too significant beyond this because their SW sales have been massive. Don't wanna groom his base to not buy games XD.

What could be shocking is, what if they add GeForce Now like functionality to now. For example, let you stream games you own. So ps4 users can stream ps5 games they bought. Or being able to stream your library to your phone or ps5
 

Papacheeks

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As a PS fan, I'm going to say something perhaps controversial, but I honestly wouldn't be bothered if PlayStation would happen to falter right now.

They haven't been the same for a long, long time if you ask me. The platform and Ryan are prepping for a different kind of future set for a new kind of audience while abandoning their Japanese tradition, apparently. Us, the long time original PS fans, don't seem to fit into that future. Those who enjoy those good old fashioned arcadey games are also being phased out. And you know what? I'm kinda cool with that. Its time for a new generation to get their turn.

Besides, their legacy has left us with a swath of great and unforgetable games to still be enjoyed and discussed. Heck, some of their older platforms might even see a resurgence with waves of indie/hobbyist developed games being released for them. Just like we've seen happen with the NES and the Mega drive for instance.

You have the weirdest view. So Capcom, Square-Enix, Atlus, Sega have not had break through's this gen on PS4? Persona is now reaching more people because of Sony's reach and promotion of the series. Same goes for Yakuza, now that series is reaching even more on PC/Gamepass because Sony shined a light on the series during PS2-PS3 and doubled down in PS4. CAPCOM would be on life support without Playstation. SUre monster hunter would continue to sell on Nintendo/Mobile. But one game isn't enough to fund the entire org. Without Playstation Resident evil would not have been as big this past gen. It was in a toilet after Resident evil 6. Playstation had their own VR solution and from what I know there was a big investment behind the scenes between capcom and Sony. Which is why PS4 was such a big part of Street fighter/Capcom cup. And also why playstation was promoting a lot of big games on their stage from capcom last gen and now this gen.

Atlus is now rolling out more games in wider capacity than they were previous gen.

If anything pre-switch release Playstation put a spotlight back on japanese developers with all the deals they made with games like Nier, street fighter.

Final Fantasy is in a much better position as well now. Which is why we are seeing so many exclusivity deals.

SO just because they themselves are not making in-house japanese titles, doesn't mean they are not curating a japanese library of software. Which seems to be bigger than it was last gen with larger games having bigger budgets when compared to previous gen. If you knew how much money they had invested in capcom/Square you would be shocked.
 

The_Mike

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2020 has been the Best year for PS history ever in terms of profits, mostly with record breaking numbers under Jim Ryan

PS players always use metacritic as why the games are best.

A big chunk of the same players hates Ryan, and now we are using Sony's revenue as a given factor of if Ryan made it better or worse.


But if the person I'm quoting is right, then I fully understand why Ryan takes this approach if he is certain that it buffs the revenue. Its logical.
 
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Shmunter

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Do you really believe this?

That Sony needs to fund games with limited market potential, that appeal to a small number of gamers, to achieve a "halo effect"?

What am I not getting here?
I do. Creativity begets creativity. I much rather a brand that is associated with risk and artistic intent, while also having the big hitters.

A big melding pot of boundaries being pushed which transcends and bleeds into other studios over time giving us fresh and invigorating titles.

360 had it early on, and once it started turning into a AAA shooter box, it’s identity soon became a shadow of its former self , while PS3’s focus on the above started turning heads. Eventually Xbox took on its current form, desperate for something unique to make it stand out with Sony dominating.

Sony making big missteps throughout ps4 gen that can be seen miles away from where I’m sitting.

Until Dawn was magic in a bottle, as was the VR offshoot....let go.

Driveclub was this gens Motorstorm in many ways....closed

Not backing Giant Sparrow, Thatgamecompany, Tequila Works.....the list goes on.

The other stand out is Death Stranding, and I’m not certain Sony gives a fuck.
 
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Clear

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Long term the biggest market for Bethesda is eventually PC. Are you trying to the discount hundreds of millions of dollars they make from console gamers on day one purchases of Bethesda games. Well the hundred of millions of dollars they use to make before they jumped to gamepass. Just because pc has the biggest market of gamers doesn't mean that they should be the primary focus of large publishers. I agree that folks need to stop thinking in terms of xbox vs playstatio it should be xbox vs ps vs pc. Truth be told Microsoft's gamepass, if they can keep funneling money in to it and keep growing the library will end up becoming the netflix of gaming and playstation console will end up looking like blockbuster. This is the shift that Microsoft has moved to. They won't need the oscar worthy games of Sony if they have the third party blockbuster hits plus the microsoft exclusives to entice folks to gamepass.

Sony want to be Marvel Studios. That's the game-plan, and if they can maintain momentum its a good one.
 

yurinka

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Sony has a great strategy I agree but if your opponent is making all of these moves and tactics to overcome you then you need to adjust your strategy to respond to it.
As of now the MS strategy didn't affect Sony, Sony keeps growing and performing better. Maybe in the future it affects their game subscriptions services, where Sony has a big lead and plans to release their next gen PS Now soon. I assume they may address it there if needed.

We don't know when GoWR or even if Horizon 2 is even releasing this year for sure. Considering that Ratchet is releasing in like June I think. I don't expect them to release GoWR AND Horizon in the last half of this year. They are definitely going to push back at least GoWR and I wouldn't be surprised of Horizon gets pushed back to early next year like February for example. Why wouldn't Sony be breaking records after having Last of Us and Ghost of Tsushima this year they are still riding high plus Demon Souls all in the same year.

I think you are possibly underestimating Microsoft or at least Microsoft's potential. Have you forgotten they still have that senua game plus now with all of those studios folks will have no choice but to buy a xbox. No matter the quality of these games like fall out, wolfenstein , Doom, or elder scroll games just them not being on playstation will be a massive draw for gamers to move to the xbox and with the inclusion of gamepass plus Microsoft has the Senua game as well. If Microsoft finally plays their cards right they could end up easily dominating the last half of this gen. You can't tell me that you aren't really interested in Microsoft's E3 especially after all of the acquisitions.
We know for sure that both Horizon 2, GoWR, Ghostwire Tokyo and Halo Infinite are going to be released in H2 2021. Sure, like any other game they can be delayed -specially now with covid- but we're almost in Q2 2021 and they officially continue being H2 2021 games even if they had recent events and interviews were could have announced a delay and didn't do it. So they continue being H2 2021 games.

And it's likely that Starfield and BOTW2 may join the H2 2021 party too, and that supply constrains issues may be solved during H2 2021 which would skyrocket sales, so they better have some cool, fresh (and if possible exclusive) AAAs there ready to be bought with the console.

I don't understimate anyone, I only check data and facts. As an example, regarding the Senua game. The teaser looked great and the game will have great visuals as the previous Ninja Theory games had, but Hellblade and the other previous Ninja Theory games were not big sellers so it would be super rare that it would have any impact on the market. Regarding its possible launch date, it isn't crossgen so according to the '2 years of crossgen' that MS said we should expect it to be released mininum late 2022. Its tech demo that we saw was made in Unreal Engine 4 but it's also going to be an Unreal 5 game, and devs will get a preview of this engine early this year and a complete version expected for late 2021, so add some months to adapt it to the new engine and make some tweaks to take full advantage of it in the case they already had the game developed and you get this H2 2022 date specially adding a covid buffer and considering the game may not be complete once they get UE5. So the game won't have an important impact and in any case we shouldn't expect it for this year.

Regarding Fall Out, Wolfenstein , Doom, or Elder Scroll games we know they will continue supporting their current games on PlayStation and that at least some future Zenimax games will be on PlayStation even if some may have timed console exclusive on Xbox: remember when they say 'first or best' -means they will appear later or at the same time somewhere else-, when talk about supporting established communities on non Xbox platforms -so maybe with new sequels or DLcs-, when mention they will honor past deals for future games -never specifying they are only Deathloop and Ghostwire- or when talk about reaching the 3 Billion gamers-that includes PlayStation-.
 
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NahaNago

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Sony want to be Marvel Studios. That's the game-plan, and if they can maintain momentum its a good one.
Sony is more like old Disney that relied on random big movies rather than Marvel Studios. Marvel Studios had a general plan that led up to end game.
As of now the MS strategy didn't affect Sony, Sony keeps growing and performing better. Maybe in the future it affects their game subscriptions services, where Sony has a big lead and plans to release their next gen PS Now soon. I assume they may address it there if needed.


We know for sure that both Horizon 2, GoWR, Ghostwire Tokyo and Halo Infinite are going to be released in H2 2021. Sure, like any other game they can be delayed -specially now with covid- but we're almost in Q2 2021 and they officially continue being H2 2021 games even if they had recent events and interviews were could have announced a delay and didn't do it. So they continue being H2 2021 games.

And it's likely that Starfield and BOTW2 may join the H2 2021 party too, and that supply constrains issues may be solved during H2 2021 which would skyrocket sales, so they better have some cool, fresh (and if possible exclusive) AAAs there ready to be bought with the console.
Sony doesn't have a big lead. The gen just started. They might have what a million or maybe 2 more consoles sold when Microsoft has barely released an exclusive.

Until we have a solid date for those most of those games and not a H2 of 2021 then I'm going to continue to be hesitant to believe they are releasing this year. Sony has no problem delaying a game for their benefit whether it be to scheduling conflicts with other big games or the game needing more work. I can at least believe that Halo infinite will release this year due to it having been originally planned to release last year.

Sony just like Nintendo releases games to the beat of their own drum so Starfield or BOTW2 isn't going to affect Sony's console sales that much this holiday. In the past I've complained that Sony releases everything during the mostly the first half the year and Microsoft during the holiday season. I can understand why they did it since they didn't want to compete with EA ,Activision, and Ubisoft for the holiday sales.
 
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