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VR Let's Talk PC VR

Al3x1s

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This is looking pretty sweet, well realized with enough twists to differentiate it from other stealth action games like Espire 1 (outside potential quality).
I already backed it, don't make me go for the more expensive pledge :p
It's pretty cheap for a game copy too. Starting at the 16 euros tier (so, $20?) I think?

But I'm banned on KS (for pointing out a project was a scam, I didn't swear or anything, that one with the mother making her daughter "develop" a game etc., and I had backed several projects like Wasteland 2 at the physical tier with the box and cloth map even) so I'll have to get it on early access.
 
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Al3x1s

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This is looking super cool. Still, I seem to recall reading in the initial announcement that it's less about accuracy, more about the rhythm game aspect. Which I don't much like. Hopefully it has a mode that does the opposite, require proper accuracy, be more lenient about the rhythm. Cos other than that focus (if that's true) it looks like it could be one of the better lightgun style arcade games in VR , which there are too few of. I love stuff like The House of the Dead, Virtua Cop, Time Crisis, Ghost Squad, etc., but VR shooters that claim to be like them are usually meh horde mode/arena/wave games with neither the fun of nor the skill required by those oldies. Drop Dead is probably the best that approaches that actual arcade style feel but still nowhere near as great as those.
 
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Al3x1s

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Damn, I was hoping to be playing it tomorrow.
 
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Al3x1s

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Some gifs from Panther VR's kickstarter page.














Lots of details on there. It seems really well thought out. Some of its goals aren't what I'd like to see but they may work for what they want to do. If I was shown the footage and information I could easily believe someone telling me it's some stylized Ubisoft Splinter Cell VR, not another indie thing!
 
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Reon

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I'm intent on picking up an Oculus Rift S here soon, I'm running an RX580 and an AMD 3700X. Think that's enough hardware to play most big VR games to meet the 80hz of the Rift S's display? I'm going to upgrade the GPU at some point here to a 2070 but I'd like the VR headset first.

Thanks!
 
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Al3x1s

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Just check per game requirements, I dunno, I have a 1080 but an older 3770 CPU and some games like Arizona Sunshine seem to be unoptimized messes for no real reason but most are fine.
 
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Al3x1s

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Stitch

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Now that's a name I have not heard in a long time. I wonder if it's actually Oculus exclusive.. probably.. meh :messenger_face_steam:
 
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Stitch

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Oculus Link is a new way for people who own a Quest headset to access Rift content and experiences from their gaming PC. Starting this November, anyone who owns Quest and a gaming PC will have access to popular Rift games with Oculus Link software, which can be used with most high-quality USB 3 cables. Later this year, we’ll release a premium optical fiber cable to provide a best-in-class experience with maximum throughput and comfortable ergonomics.

:messenger_hushed:

Also the Quest will get Hand Tracking

yeaahh... so I might actually have to get a Quest lol
 
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Al3x1s

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Reon

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Now that's a name I have not heard in a long time. I wonder if it's actually Oculus exclusive.. probably.. meh :messenger_face_steam:
Man I'm actually psyched for this one, not only is it using the Medal of Honor IP but it's from Respawn too. Pretty sick.
 
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Al3x1s

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Whole OC6 day 1 keynote here.

Some really cool stuff (that won't be in our homes for ages I guess) being researched that will make the future of VR (not just Oculus) even greater!

 
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Romulus

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Great showing so far. I have to say that voice actor they got for the Vader is just off, no two ways about it. I've heard at least 5 attempted in other games/media that were far better, that's the worst. I guess its a nitpick, but Vader is such a huge part of the game
 
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Al3x1s

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Oh, I didn't realize Medal of Honor was Respawn's game! Those glimpses of it looked pretty awesome but we'll see just how involving it is. I hope it resembles the PlayStation 1 games which had (potential for) stealth and mission objectives and shit a la GoldenEye, not the later COD-like shit.
 
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Al3x1s

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Huh. I didn't expect these guys (they seem close with Valve) to do anything Oculus specific. Even for Quest (I guess it could later get on Rift/PC VR as most 1st party-ish Quest games yet but it probably won't be nearly as ambitious as the main Boneworks made for PC first). But money, I guess.
 
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Al3x1s

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Al3x1s

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I tend to dislike VR FPS that simplify controls and functions like reloading and such but maybe this could be to Unreal Tournament what Firewall Zero Hour is to Rainbow Six Siege. Hopefully with more depth than something like Space Junkies, fun as it is.
 
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Al3x1s

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Out now (patch, not DLC)!

I really liked this game, modest yet well made and fun, will dive in for the new content when I can! The melee, magic, puzzles, everything just worked nicely. On par with Vanishing Realms for sure.

I bought Lone Echo yesterday as it was 10 euros off for the day (it seems Oculus 1st party-ish games don't get deep or frequent discounts or anything so far) and played it for around 30 minutes. It is still every bit as impressive and as immersing as you heard it being talked up despite having seen much more stuff in VR since its launch (and even the other Echo game(s) which utilizes similar gameplay for different PVP purposes)! Highly recommended. Maybe wait for next year's sequel in case they make some even better bundle deal but it seems Oculus 1st party-ish stuff don't really get discounted much/often. Now I'm sitting with 3 days off and a minor foot injury after a lucky encounter with a car while on my brother in law's motorcycle and can't play/finish it :messenger_sad_relieved:
 
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Al3x1s

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The rest of the OC6 stuff uploaded. Lots of different and interesting for devs or users topics.
 
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Al3x1s

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Last few:

Or just go here (duh).
 
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Dontero

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Can you post links instead of spaming video files ?
Going back to subject.

So far i divide games into 2 carts:

- standard good games + VR
- crappy exclusive games for VR

So far 1st one is much more fun and better than 2.

Current top 5 in Vr:
- Fallout New Vegas
- The Witcher 3
- Dragon's Dogma
- Monster Hunter World
- Borderlands 2

Made for VR games usually are just shit aside from few.
 

Al3x1s

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Can you post links instead of spaming video files ?
I can, but don't wanna.

Plenty great VR-only games out there, sucks you didn't like them but oh well, nothing works the same for everyone. Still, your opinion isn't the objective fact you ended the post with after starting it nicely as the personal preference it is.

I don't care at all to play non-VR games with vorpx and such stuff, gimme real VR gameplay with hand tracking, presence, immersion or gameplay that can't be replicated outside VR rather than just a headtracked camera, I'd rather play on my monitor if that's all it has to offer.

With exceptions like cockpit/vehicle games of course, where you're operating a machine rather than embodying a character, though VR games of that type can still offer more than vorpx/quick ports, as in Vox Machinae's or VTOL VR's interactive cockpits and meaningful for gameplay headtracking. But at this point we're restarting the discussion we had on page 2 where you made your opinions clear (and once again tried to make it out as a fact that is how it is for everyone and the industry at large that needs to follow it to see success etc), why circle jerk?
 
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Al3x1s

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Can't wait for this, hope Espire 1 releases and scratches the itch until then.
 
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Keihart

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I wanna play Stormland and Spire, it's like the games that i've been waiting since playing Robo Recall and Onward.
Asgard's wrath seems cool for those RPG needs.
 
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Keihart

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I can, but don't wanna.

Plenty great VR-only games out there, sucks you didn't like them but oh well, nothing works the same for everyone. Still, your opinion isn't the objective fact you ended the post with after starting it nicely as the personal preference it is.

I don't care at all to play non-VR games with vorpx and such stuff, gimme real VR gameplay with hand tracking, presence, immersion or gameplay that can't be replicated outside VR rather than just a headtracked camera, I'd rather play on my monitor if that's all it has to offer.

With exceptions like cockpit/vehicle games of course, where you're operating a machine rather than embodying a character, though VR games of that type can still offer more than vorpx/quick ports, as in Vox Machinae's or VTOL VR's interactive cockpits and meaningful for gameplay headtracking. But at this point we're restarting the discussion we had on page 2 where you made your opinions clear (and once again tried to make it out as a fact that is how it is for everyone and the industry at large that needs to follow it to see success etc), why circle jerk?
I recently played Elite Dangerous again, hadn't touchet it since like 1 year ago...damn i still wish it had touch support, game is very cool but no being able to grab the controls already inside the cockpit is kinda lame.
Have you played No Mans Sky with the VR update? is it good?
 
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Al3x1s

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NMS has an ok VR implementation. Better than many, on par with Skyrim VR and such perhaps (so I guess pretty cool if you liked the core game). Solid but nothing spectacular and with a few quirks here and there. I can't say more since I'm not fan of the game outside VR either so I briefly tried it.

Man, all that OC6 stuff (not to mention other unrelated to OC6 VR news in recent times, how can such supposedly enthusiast PC media not even talk about VR outside clickbait and sensationalized reports like a random newspaper's tech column?) and all RockPaperShotgun found worthwhile to write is "Oculus Quest’s cameras could make VR controllers a thing of the past". No they can't, how would you even shoot in a simple shooter, finger gun and pew pew noises? How do you move a character in 3D space, wiggle your thumb on a mental analog stick and expect it to know what the fuck you want to do, move vs thumb wrestle someone or just scratch an itch? Tactile inputs and feedback are still absolutely necessary and will remain so until you get Matrix level tech. In real life you have such feedback when you use all kinds of devices, why would VR suddenly be better without any (abstracted, depending on the device, as controllers aren't shape shifting) representation of that? That's not the purpose of that feature, to wholly replace controllers like that, not outside particular niches (ie, Minority Report esque interfaces or simpler social space games a la Rec Room). Anyway, nothing about the games, nothing about any of those dev perspective videos, talks, analyses, features, not even talking about turning Quest into an actual PC VR kit with the Link stuff. Why do I even bother checking them out any more >_>

Edit: ok so they wrote about Medal of Honor VR too, condescendingly about "wacky VR shenanigans" and how it's not realistic and is tone deaf because you can grab and throw objects to incapacitate (stall?) an enemy (in the trailer shown with a frying pan or similar). That was it. As if being by the developers of games like Call of Duty, Titanfall, Apex Legends, was a hint to it being a full realistic sim about the perils of World War II. Like a game where you land on Omaha Beach and instantly die from an explosion while the scene switches back to your waiting family until they get the bad news and you watch a depressing 2 hour movie about how that affects each person, would have been the grand revelation a VR (or non VR) FPS should offer >_>
 
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Al3x1s

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Nice categorized list of all the OC6 talks by UploadVR (not the actual keynotes and other stuff, refer to previous posts/the Oculus youtube channel for that).
 
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Dontero

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I can, but don't wanna.

Plenty great VR-only games out there, sucks you didn't like them but oh well, nothing works the same for everyone. Still, your opinion isn't the objective fact you ended the post with after starting it nicely as the personal preference it is.

With exceptions like cockpit/vehicle games of course, where you're operating a machine rather than embodying a character, though VR games of that type can still offer more than vorpx/quick ports, as in Vox Machinae's or VTOL VR's interactive cockpits and meaningful for gameplay headtracking. But at this point we're restarting the discussion we had on page 2 where you made your opinions clear (and once again tried to make it out as a fact that is how it is for everyone and the industry at large that needs to follow it to see success etc), why circle jerk?
My point is that none of those games bare very very very very very very few would work without VR. Their only gimmick is that they are VR games in field of garbage.

Which is why i prefer normal games converted into VR because they are awesome games to begin with.
Good example of that is superhot. Superhot first was great game and then it was converted into VR.
If they made superhot VR first then it would be garbage because they would be chasing gimmick instead of providing first solid core gameplay. This is why something like Dragon's Dogma is better than Beat Saber. Because it is first solid game second VR game.

Hand tracking and motion tracking will not survive. Why ? Because there is no feedback. It always feels like you are grasping air and secondly since there is no feedback in real life then there is no way of stopping your hands glitching out, going through models etc. which brakes immersion and feels bad.

Also thanks to whole VR = motion controlers dogma developers have, VR is not in place we were expected it to be. Adding head tracking to any game is really fucking easy so is projecting UI into 3D plane and bending it over player head. At this point most of games should have VR mode instead thanks to retarded developers we are in this weird paradigm where either you have full on bad VR minigame or some VR mode instead of just adding VR headtracking to the game which is easy.

VR is headtracking with 3D. Nothing else. Not headtracking with motion tracking.
There are some cases where it can be used for example in FPS games but this is singular use not wide use for everything.

Another garbage idea is room scale. If people who want to play games wanted to move they would be playing sports and doing anything other than gaming.

Sitting gaming headtracking and 3D is what VR should be and what will give it wide adoption.
Current paradigm only hurts VR.
 
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Keihart

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My point is that none of those games bare very very very very very very few would work without VR. Their only gimmick is that they are VR games in field of garbage.

Which is why i prefer normal games converted into VR because they are awesome games to begin with.
Good example of that is superhot. Superhot first was great game and then it was converted into VR.
If they made superhot VR first then it would be garbage because they would be chasing gimmick instead of providing first solid core gameplay. This is why something like Dragon's Dogma is better than Beat Saber. Because it is first solid game second VR game.

Hand tracking and motion tracking will not survive. Why ? Because there is no feedback. It always feels like you are grasping air and secondly since there is no feedback in real life then there is no way of stopping your hands glitching out, going through models etc. which brakes immersion and feels bad.

Also thanks to whole VR = motion controlers dogma developers have, VR is not in place we were expected it to be. Adding head tracking to any game is really fucking easy so is projecting UI into 3D plane and bending it over player head. At this point most of games should have VR mode instead thanks to retarded developers we are in this weird paradigm where either you have full on bad VR minigame or some VR mode instead of just adding VR headtracking to the game which is easy.

VR is headtracking with 3D. Nothing else. Not headtracking with motion tracking.
There are some cases where it can be used for example in FPS games but this is singular use not wide use for everything.

Another garbage idea is room scale. If people who want to play games wanted to move they would be playing sports and doing anything other than gaming.

Sitting gaming headtracking and 3D is what VR should be and what will give it wide adoption.
Current paradigm only hurts VR.
But Super hot VR doesn't play like superhot vanilla, they are very much different games.

And the best games are in fact better in VR that is good and not the contrary, the game is designed with the constraints of a new ruleset limited by how you interact with it. You have to design games for the medium they are in and the constraints of it if you want to make the most of it. If not, why bother.
Games in VR not designed for it are pretty bad usually unless major overhauls are made, just depth perception is not enough usually, you need as many degrees of freedom as possible to have some real prescense not to mention that performance it is not a trivial problem, when you go into VR you basically render the game twice and have to get at least 60 but ideally 90 fps when most games are OK at 30 rendering only once. Not something trivial at all when designing a game from scratch.
 

Dontero

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But Super hot VR doesn't play like superhot vanilla, they are very much different games.
same exact rules mate. The only difference is in input control. Whatever you play with motion controls or not it is same exact game.

You have to design games for the medium they are in and the constraints of it if you want to make the most of it. If not, why bother.
This is what i am talking about. You don't want VR. You want some kind of embodiment of yourself in game.
VR is just just your head positional tracking. Which means it is perfectly capable of replicating what... in game camera does all the time.

If implementation of VR in game is just your head movement instead of camera IT IS GREAT VR.
This is why people want Fallout 4 VR not some minigame/experience VR. Because gameplay>"experience"

This is why RE7 is still best VR game.

Games in VR not designed for it are pretty bad usually unless major overhauls are made, just depth perception is not enough usually, you need as many degrees of freedom as possible to have some real prescense
No not really. VorpX with Fallout New Vegas is good example of that. You just need only headmovement and UI reshufle. Once you get that game is instantly better. Getting out of doc house feels completely different.

And i can play that game for 100s of hours which is probably more than top50 Vr only games combined.
 
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Keihart

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same exact rules mate. The only difference is in input control. Whatever you play with motion controls or not it is same exact game.



This is what i am talking about. You don't want VR. You want some kind of embodiment of yourself in game.
VR is just just your head positional tracking. Which means it is perfectly capable of replicating what... in game camera does all the time.

If implementation of VR in game is just your head movement instead of camera IT IS GREAT VR.
This is why people want Fallout 4 VR not some minigame/experience VR. Because gameplay>"experience"

This is why RE7 is still best VR game.



No not really. VorpX with Fallout New Vegas is good example of that. You just need only headmovement and UI reshufle. Once you get that game is instantly better. Getting out of doc house feels completely different.

And i can play that game for 100s of hours which is probably more than top50 Vr only games combined.
Now you are just moving the goalposts of what VR is, by you very constraint and disengenous definition of what VR is, sure, VR is very simple and there is no need of anything special in VR games.

But let's be honest, VR is not and never was just watching stuff in 360 degrees with depth perception, that was only the first of many things you had to solve to get VR. When you think of Virtual Reality in the popular sense that is represented in any media, it is always about imersing the user in another world completly, so obviously you always want as many degrees of freedom as possible for the most complete experience possible.

Also, no, superhot is not the same game in VR, have you played it? If you have you are being very insincere about it
 
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Al3x1s

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My point is that none of those games bare very very very very very very few would work without VR. Their only gimmick is that they are VR games in field of garbage.
Your point is nonsense. That's like saying pointing and clicking with a mouse or dragging a cursor with an analog stick is just the same gameplay as playing with a lightgun in the arcades where you actually have to physically take aim with something that resembles a gun (with no crosshair, truly aim).

So yeah, you could have the exact same content without the lightgun, the same levels, enemies, scripted events, but the gameplay would be shit without the lightgun and the vastly different to thumb twiddling and mouse dragging player skills it tries to challenge.

Just as it was shit to play all those arcade ports on your console if you didn't also buy the lightgun accessories (back in the day lightguns were actually possible, not the Wii/Move/Aim/AimTrak caricatures that aren't really as precise).

And that emulation of guns (in actual 3D space and closer to real life functions rather than a flat screen yet without losing movement and other action controls thanks to having conveniently placed analog sticks and buttons on top) is far from the only thing VR can do.

It's just a minor example that even people who never played VR can understand but you somehow pretend not to. As if pressing X for a horizontal and Y for a vertical slash in Soul Calibur is at all similar to 1:1 weapon wielding in Blade & Sorcery and other VR games.

Your Fallout 4 VR doesn't only have headtracking, it's similar to Skyrim VR with full 1:1 hand movement weapon and other controls. It's not as good as full VR games, there are not enough interactions, physicality and intuitiveness, but it doesn't agree with your headtracking-only or bust take either, it argues against yourself!

So, again, you've said all this shit before, on page 2. Why circle jerk? You've added nothing and just ignore everything that was said to you before and expect people to repeat the conversation again for what purpose? Just to ignore them like you ignored all the examples of what you can do with VR hand controls that you can't intuitively replicate without it only to reiterate that they can "play the same" out of VR to put them down (yet you're the only one advocating VR games that play the same out of VR since they don't take advantage of its full potential as that's all you like in VR anyway, lol).

Is it that hard to just deal with the fact not everyone shares your opinion, including the developers of VR software and hardware, so that you can't just move on and keep playing the non-VR games in VR happily as you claim to do already? Nobody's taking your vorpx away.

Just have your fun as we do in VR games rather than try to convince everyone, user or bystander, by constantly repeating with no arguments, just opinions, that we're actually playing shit software because you don't like it so it can only be the one objective truth of its quality, lol.
 
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Stitch

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Just ignore the obvious troll. I guess shitting up steam threads wasn't satisfying enough for him.
 
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Dontero

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But let's be honest, VR is not and never was just watching stuff in 360 degrees with depth perception, that was only the first of many things you had to solve to get VR.
Go and see initial kickstarter for oculus. Nothing there about hand controls or motion controls. This is what people wanted. Not some weirdo clunky hand movement or even whole body movement. People just wanted window into game with their head movements.

Till today the best game for VR which sold the most units is RE7 and this helped to move millions of PSVRs not some beat saber or other garbage wave stuff.

It is like people forget about Wii. Where is Wii today and motion controls like Kinect or Playstation Move ? Nowhere. Because ultimately do not want to exercise when they play their games nor they want to use inaccurate inputs. They can work in specific cases but not for most of games.

The fasters devs and people will accept that the faster VR will adopt.
People want COD in VR, GTA in VR not some "experience" in VR.

And public already answered. They don't want "experiences" they want their COD in VR and until then they will not move to VR regardless how much hand waving you do.

The only way for people to accept motion controls is to have feedback without that it will be clunky garbage.
 
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Al3x1s

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And yet Rift and Vive have sold a ton of hand controllers and new kits that have hand controllers by default. Users didn't reject them, they embraced them, rather than show them they prefer buying the original kit without the hand controllers which was still available. Or do you seriously think Oculus focused on that without seeing an upward trend? And every VR enthusiast has been hyped for Valve's knuckles (now Index) since their inception. Where do you base VR users not wanting them and them being clunky and weirdo? Controllers offer 1:1 precision these days, nothing clunky about it unless your hands are clunky. Some games are clunky yes, just as there are clunky non VR games even though buttons have been used for decades. There are plenty non "experience" games in VR. Plenty "experience" games out of VR too. Dunno what your point is with that, as if hand controllers are to "blame" for a segment of devs and users that wish to make such things? What's it to you? When or if a GTA VR happens it will most certainly include hand tracking. Same for COD VR or Splinter Cell VR that is actually coming as Medal of Honor VR (by COD's original developers no less) and Sniper Elite VR prove, not that we need big IP like that to prove it, plenty pre existing smaller games have shown this. But again you just ignore reality to force your opinion as fact.

Nobody's taking your vorpx away, stop pretending your use case scenario is how everyone else should feel.
 
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