• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

"LOCKE & KEY" (Netflix) - Welcome to Lovecraft

jason10mm

Member
Feb 3, 2009
1,317
266
945
Sad to hear it. I'm 2 eps in and it seems like fairly harmless YA fare, like a lot of other netflix stuff aimed at an ambiguous market of tweens, teens, and I guess genre fans? So far it is better than October Faction, in which it shares a TON of themes. I can see where they might be pulling punches with the horror though, which is a shame as the cinematography and set dressing are spot on and this should be a chilling atmosphere.

Can't say this looks low budget... at all! Go watch the foreign genre stuff and see what modern low budget looks like. These days tv is ridiculously lavish, it only pales compared to films because we are used to mega blockbusters. Truly golden times! Once the streaming wars die down I think we are in for a large collapse of production values and variety.

Anyway, still got many eps to go and the show has at least caught my attention with a minimal amount of eyerolls.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Ailynn

Karma Jawa

Member
Jan 20, 2020
177
302
265
Sad to hear it. I'm 2 eps in and it seems like fairly harmless YA fare, like a lot of other netflix stuff aimed at an ambiguous market of tweens, teens, and I guess genre fans? So far it is better than October Faction, in which it shares a TON of themes. I can see where they might be pulling punches with the horror though, which is a shame as the cinematography and set dressing are spot on and this should be a chilling atmosphere.

Can't say this looks low budget... at all! Go watch the foreign genre stuff and see what modern low budget looks like. These days tv is ridiculously lavish, it only pales compared to films because we are used to mega blockbusters. Truly golden times! Once the streaming wars die down I think we are in for a large collapse of production values and variety.

Anyway, still got many eps to go and the show has at least caught my attention with a minimal amount of eyerolls.
Finished watching it earlier today (no spoilers).

The tone is all over the place. At times it feels like a Nickelodeon Saturday morning series, and at others it’s full horror. It leaps from kids TV to adult themes quite jarringly.

Having said that, I enjoyed it and look forward to Season 2.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Ailynn

Ailynn

Faith - Hope - Love
Jan 1, 2017
1,211
5,914
865
East Tennessee, USA
Whimsical and for teens? Bummer I think I'll pass. I was slightly interested.
It really does seem almost universally very disappointing for fans of the comics. The graphic novels are amazing and one of my all-time favorite series.

Honestly, I probably would have actually liked the show a lot more if I hadn't known about the source material. That said, I definitely want to see a second season to see where they are taking the story...which changed quite a lot from the comics.


I feel a little silly admitting this, but the show has actually left me feeling bummed out for a couple of days. I should never have gotten my hopes up so much. 🗝:lollipop_pensive:
 
Last edited:

bonk64

Member
May 17, 2013
2,094
1,226
865
California
It really does seem almost universally very disappointing for fans of the comics. The graphic novels are amazing and one of my all-time favorite series.

Honestly, I probably would have actually liked the show a lot more if I hadn't known about the source material. That said, I definitely want to see a second season to see where they are taking the story...which changed quite a lot from the comics.


I feel a little silly admitting this, but the show has actually left me feeling bummed out for a couple of days. I should never have gotten my hopes up so much. 🗝:lollipop_pensive:
That's a bummer. It's impossible not to get your hopes up for something you love. Then when you get let down its like blaaaah.
 
  • Thoughtful
Reactions: Ailynn

finowns

Member
May 10, 2009
3,584
1,215
920
It reminds me of a cw show. I think they should have gone darker but I like it. It’s not super woke either.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Ailynn

Atrus

Member
Jul 16, 2007
4,244
303
1,090
Finished the series. I haven't read the original material it was based on but I thought it was good but not great.
Overall, it was very similar to other teen shows/movies like Mrs. Peregrine's Home for Peculiar Children but was made less interesting with the pointless school drama.

For something that the trailers show as whimsical fantasy, the show has characters do things that are expressly not related to it. Its like if the kids in the Lion, Witch, and the Wardrobe found Narnia and decided to spend as little time as possible there. I thought it was similar to Netflix's Haunting of Hill House where the family tragedy and drama was the main focus with the horror being in the background.

The TV14 rating is about right for audiences that might enjoy it. It may be too mature for little kids and as for adults, the story is incredibly predictable and the characters appear to be very stupid overall except for Georgie/Bode. The cast was likeable but the writing was pretty bad at times with characters doing things or not thinking of things that the average audience member would have come up with.

I still give it a good rating because I finished it without forcing myself to and as a package it certainly wasn't bad.
 
  • Thoughtful
Reactions: Ailynn

Ailynn

Faith - Hope - Love
Jan 1, 2017
1,211
5,914
865
East Tennessee, USA
It reminds me of a cw show. I think they should have gone darker but I like it. It’s not super woke either.
The comic goes WAY darker than the show, and can be fairly 'anti-woke' in some of it's themes. It has more detail on Duncan and his relationship with Brian, and they deal with some hate from a couple of rough ladies (who I assumed may be angry drunken self-denying lesbians). It also very slightly touches on Duncan using the Gender Key as a child to be a girl all the time...but later he lives life as a gay man rather than transitioning to be a girl...but this is all mostly sub-context.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: finowns

finowns

Member
May 10, 2009
3,584
1,215
920
Just finished it, I thought the ending was convoluted. The best character by far is Bode, the actor did a good job, everyone else felt flat. Like others I wish they’d stuck close to the source material instead we got something generic and rounded off.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Ailynn

GeorgPrime

Member
Jan 9, 2020
145
145
210
The comic goes WAY darker than the show, and can be fairly 'anti-woke' in some of it's themes. It has more detail on Duncan and his relationship with Brian, and they deal with some hate from a couple of rough ladies (who I assumed may be angry drunken self-denying lesbians). It also very slightly touches on Duncan using the Gender Key as a child to be a girl all the time...but later he lives life as a gay man rather than transitioning to be a girl...but this is all mostly sub-context.
Iam still waiting for people to say "That Show is not worth watching because there are no gay or lesbian characters in it". I realized it at the end of season 1... felt like a long time that i was able to enjoy a show without having to skip scenes or just "cancel" it like "Sexual Education". I dont mind them in a TV show but when they straight up want to show me gay porn stuff iam out.

Feels like iam not allowed to be happy about this but i cant change it.
 
Last edited:

LegendOfKage

Member
Mar 6, 2018
2,930
4,186
680
It really does seem almost universally very disappointing for fans of the comics. The graphic novels are amazing and one of my all-time favorite series.

Honestly, I probably would have actually liked the show a lot more if I hadn't known about the source material. That said, I definitely want to see a second season to see where they are taking the story...which changed quite a lot from the comics.
I'm sorry to hear that it was a disappointment for you.

As someone who doesn't generally like horror, and has never read the graphic novels, do you think I'd enjoy it? If you think so, I'll have to try it and report back as someone with no preconceptions of the series.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Ailynn

Ailynn

Faith - Hope - Love
Jan 1, 2017
1,211
5,914
865
East Tennessee, USA
I'm sorry to hear that it was a disappointment for you.

As someone who doesn't generally like horror, and has never read the graphic novels, do you think I'd enjoy it? If you think so, I'll have to try it and report back as someone with no preconceptions of the series.
I think there's a chance you may enjoy it...it isn't bad at all, although they made some strange changes to some of the actions a few of the characters make where they come off a little unintelligent and even uncharacteristically sadistic.

I'd love to hear what you think of it. :) After seeing it, you can check this out to see some of the larger changes. It's very spoiler heavy, though...so definitely wait until you see the show before looking.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: LegendOfKage

Hulk_Smash

Member
Jan 8, 2014
929
993
730
It really does seem almost universally very disappointing for fans of the comics. The graphic novels are amazing and one of my all-time favorite series.

Honestly, I probably would have actually liked the show a lot more if I hadn't known about the source material. That said, I definitely want to see a second season to see where they are taking the story...which changed quite a lot from the comics.


I feel a little silly admitting this, but the show has actually left me feeling bummed out for a couple of days. I should never have gotten my hopes up so much. 🗝:lollipop_pensive:
I have a 9 and 11 year old that want to watch it. I don’t mind the occasional swear word or make out session, but are there any other adult themes I need to be aware of? And is there a gender key in the show?
 
  • Like
Reactions: Ailynn

jdforge

Member
Jul 20, 2004
1,836
389
1,665
I’m not loving this but I can’t stop watching it. The premise is really interesting and I’ve enjoyed the story and most of the characters. I really like Bode he is such a cool dude.

There were a few occasions I was genuinely a bit scared and would have loved them to take a risk and go a bit darker overall.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Ailynn

DunDunDunpachi

Patient MembeR
Apr 18, 2018
19,990
40,808
1,290
USA
dunpachi.com
My wife and I were looking for something akin to The Room but it sounds like a lot of time in this show is spent on character drama instead of spending more time exploring the supernatural stuff.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Ailynn

Ailynn

Faith - Hope - Love
Jan 1, 2017
1,211
5,914
865
East Tennessee, USA
I have a 9 and 11 year old that want to watch it. I don’t mind the occasional swear word or make out session, but are there any other adult themes I need to be aware of? And is there a gender key in the show?
Unlike the comic, there are very few swear words or scenes of violence on the show. What is there often happens offscreen...but there may still be a few instances where a little blood can be seen, such as from someone getting shot or hurt in some other way.

Some characters smoke and/or drink. There is also some sexual material although no nudity is shown.

As far as anything LGBT+ related, Uncle Duncan is still gay, but the only way you know that is because of a slight mention of his relationship with Brian (a character never even shown on the show). The Gender Key has been retconned into the Identity Key, which can change one's appearance in more than just gender...but is barely used at all. (I suppose the Gender Key was considered "unprogressive.")

Even toned way down, a couple of scenes may remain a little scary for young children. Overall, it seems they geared this version of the story toward the teenage crowd.
 

Pumpkin Seeds

Member
Jul 13, 2018
776
991
365
Finished watching it. They sort of jumbled a bunch of stuff together at the end. Felt like they thought they were going to have like a 12 episode run and then found out it was only 10.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Ailynn

weirder

Member
Sep 11, 2019
236
188
195
the Eye in the Triangle
I watched it all the way through and didn't turn it off. Had some good laughs with the show, one scene in particular had me laughing so hard. The premise is great. I have no prior experience with the source material. Some decent catchy songs coming back to mind as I type

 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Ailynn

Ailynn

Faith - Hope - Love
Jan 1, 2017
1,211
5,914
865
East Tennessee, USA
I’m not loving this but I can’t stop watching it. The premise is really interesting and I’ve enjoyed the story and most of the characters. I really like Bode he is such a cool dude.

There were a few occasions I was genuinely a bit scared and would have loved them to take a risk and go a bit darker overall.
I still enjoyed it mostly in retrospect despite my disappointment with so many changes from the source material. My biggest problem was the strange choices the characters make, both in their unwillingness to use the keys effectively, or also using one of the keys in a way that is very untrue to the character.

If they had gone with the events from the comics exactly, the show would have been a lot scarier and violent, much more visually full of wonder, and much more memorable in my opinion. Sure, they would have lost the younger crowd as an audience...but it would have become incredibly popular with adults.


My wife and I were looking for something akin to The Room but it sounds like a lot of time in this show is spent on character drama instead of spending more time exploring the supernatural stuff.
That's exactly it...the original story has an unknown amount of magical keys that do crazy imaginative things...but the show comes no where close to the same level of usage of them. Even the supernatural stuff is played down, and the villains are in no way as scary or dangerous as in the comics.

They also cranked up the high school drama- Exactly what no one was asking for. :messenger_confused:
 
Last edited:
  • Triggered
Reactions: DunDunDunpachi

Hulk_Smash

Member
Jan 8, 2014
929
993
730
Unlike the comic, there are very few swear words or scenes of violence on the show. What is there often happens offscreen...but there may still be a few instances where a little blood can be seen, such as from someone getting shot or hurt in some other way.

Some characters smoke and/or drink. There is also some sexual material although no nudity is shown.

As far as anything LGBT+ related, Uncle Duncan is still gay, but the only way you know that is because of a slight mention of his relationship with Brian (a character never even shown on the show). The Gender Key has been retconned into the Identity Key, which can change one's appearance in more than just gender...but is barely used at all. (I suppose the Gender Key was considered "unprogressive.")

Even toned way down, a couple of scenes may remain a little scary for young children. Overall, it seems they geared this version of the story toward the teenage crowd.
Thank you very much!
 
  • Love
Reactions: Ailynn

residentgrigo

Banned
Jan 13, 2020
91
104
205
31
Germany
The comic is a 8,5/10 and I look forward to the spin-off followup in the summer. The show is a 6.something/10 and I can live without a followup. Is there a way to watch the 2011 Fox pilot btw. I only saw the trailer:

Edit: Forgot the mention the Audible adaptation. I just got it and will listen to it next month. It properly adapts the comics. Or so they say.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Ailynn

Ailynn

Faith - Hope - Love
Jan 1, 2017
1,211
5,914
865
East Tennessee, USA
The comic is a 8,5/10 and I look forward to the spin-off followup in the summer. The show is a 6.something/10 and I can live without a followup. Is there a way to watch the 2011 Fox pilot btw. I only saw the trailer:

Edit: Forgot the mention the Audible adaptation. I just got it and will listen to it next month. It properly adapts the comics. Or so they say.

Here you go! I actually posted it on the previous page. It is a way lower budget, but seemed like it was going to follow the comic extremely well for a show produced for Fox:



Also, I'm currently reading the graphic novels while listening to the Audible adaptation, and it is nearly identical to the source material, aside from a few extra comments and such. While it may be difficult for people listening to it the first time to follow along on what is happening, it's a pretty great experience reading through the graphic novelsimultaneously. :)
 
Last edited:

jason10mm

Member
Feb 3, 2009
1,317
266
945
I'm most of the way through it. Helps that it is 45 min/ep, guess it is destined for commercial airing somewhere.

The high school stuff is a bit if a drag because they are REALLY dug into the logistics of it. So much dialogue just about getting rides to and from school! Then they get the PERFECT opportunity to make school a cakewalk to focus on non school stuff and do they take it.....nope! They should have taken a note from stranger things or even sabrina and make school itself a dim background element at best.

Lovecraft is also the blackest town in Massachusetts! Almost every Locke adjacent character is black and in a show so driven by family issues I keep trying to confabulate the black characters into one family as well. Is Ellie the daughter of Joe? Who is the amputee guy and is he related to the savini club girl? It's a silly thing but is mildly distracting. Just wish they had a more diverse cast overall.
 

jdforge

Member
Jul 20, 2004
1,836
389
1,665
I finished this last night. It was an enjoyable ride and I’m looking forward to the second season. Thanks for the recommendation and updates to this thread.

Now to find a new show to binge.
 
  • Love
  • Like
Reactions: Weiji and Ailynn

residentgrigo

Banned
Jan 13, 2020
91
104
205
31
Germany
I finished the show. My 6/10 stands. I won´t return for S02 which wasn´t announced so far. The 2020 pilot is better than the 2011 pilot though.

His new comic is good btw but it´s the only winner in the DC horror line that Hill edits: https://www.dccomics.com/comics/basketful-of-heads-2019/basketful-of-heads-1
His other evil Superman comic The Cape from a few years ago was whatever for all that care as it had too many spin-offs.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Ailynn

Urprobablyright

Neo Member
Jan 31, 2020
255
174
160
I love Lovecraft... Eternal Darkness a great GCN title.. also read his omnibuses, though i only remember a few like At The Mountains of Madness and another one about a deathless guy in some, like, Maine costal town or something.. one of the better bosses in vanilla wow (hoho!).. still i feel i can claim status as someone who has done more with Lovecraft than googling his old gods and stuff~

But he's another one of those authors whose content didn't lend itself to serialisation imo... His stories tend to be focused around build ups to climaxes, not intrugues~
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Weiji and Ailynn

jason10mm

Member
Feb 3, 2009
1,317
266
945
Woof, those last few eps fell off a cliff for me. Everyone is 100% reacting to things, there is no planning, decision making is bizarre and nonsensical, and the key accountability is ATROCIOUS! Havent shouted at my tv so much in a long time :p

Not sure I'm in for a season 2 on this one. I know I'm not really the target audience for these teen shows but geezers, the latest batch from netflix has been really disappointing. Buffy they are not!
 
  • Like
Reactions: Weiji and Ailynn

Weiji

Member
Jul 20, 2018
680
830
365
As a non-graphic novel reader who has watched through EP3 I’d recommend people give it a shot.

Visuals are stunning and very high quality.

Writing has its ups and downs, but there are excellent moments mixed in.

Some of the core concepts, such as survivors guilt are surprisingly well constructed.

There is no wokeness in the plot or dialogue at least this far. Other then perhaps the need for cross racial dating among the main cast. I didn’t find it annoying here as the cast is on point with their acting. Relationships don’t feel forced for me.

So why not a glowing recommendation?

Well the way characters react to magical elements and situations just don’t make sense at times. I agree with other comments on the tone. This should be horror, and parts of it are... and then we’re back at school dealing with normal teenager problems like they didn’t almost die last night.

It doesn’t make sense to the point that it breaks suspension of disbelief. Really a shame, because in most other ways I found the concept and execution really very good.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Ailynn

jason10mm

Member
Feb 3, 2009
1,317
266
945
Weiji, my issue with it is that it just isnt clever. There is little use of the keys to solve problems, they really only cause them. Only 1 character fully exploits them and it is maddening to see everyone else fail to anticipate it other than a few moments. Characters make poor decisions and entrap themselves. It got so bad I started hoping for a TPK of the entire Locke family.

Still, if some of the high school drama engages with you, them the series is fine. And I cant blame Tyler for dating the hispanic girl, she fine! And the least ridiculous character on the show.

A quick spoiler question though, for around ep 5 or 6 I think.
what did kinzie and Scot use to make the horror movie scene? Did the plant key let you control plants, not just reveal all those memories?
 
  • Like
Reactions: Weiji and Ailynn

Ailynn

Faith - Hope - Love
Jan 1, 2017
1,211
5,914
865
East Tennessee, USA
A quick spoiler question though, for around ep 5 or 6 I think.
what did kinzie and Scot use to make the horror movie scene? Did the plant key let you control plants, not just reveal all those memories?

The Flower or Plant Key was something new for the show, so I'm not sure. For that matter, the entire Savinis horror fan film stuff is new to the show as well.

In the comics, Dodge is not strangely limited to having to be given the keys, and can just take them at will and does so often...attacking the Lockes in many multiple ways in an effort to procure the Omega Key.

One of the keys briefly shown that Dodge attacks them with is the Thorn Key, which allows control over vicious thorny black rose vines in the greenhouse. Maybe the showrunners got that idea from this scene?

 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Weiji

Weiji

Member
Jul 20, 2018
680
830
365
Weiji, my issue with it is that it just isnt clever. There is little use of the keys to solve problems, they really only cause them. Only 1 character fully exploits them and it is maddening to see everyone else fail to anticipate it other than a few moments. Characters make poor decisions and entrap themselves. It got so bad I started hoping for a TPK of the entire Locke family.

Still, if some of the high school drama engages with you, them the series is fine. And I cant blame Tyler for dating the hispanic girl, she fine! And the least ridiculous character on the show.

A quick spoiler question though, for around ep 5 or 6 I think.
what did kinzie and Scot use to make the horror movie scene? Did the plant key let you control plants, not just reveal all those memories?
I don’t disagree with anything your saying.

I’m actually pretty confused right now as the villain just said she can’t take keys by force... but she grabbed the fire key strait off the neck of the other kid she threw into the train like 1 episode ago? ... uh what?
 
  • Like
Reactions: Ailynn

Weiji

Member
Jul 20, 2018
680
830
365


In the comics, Dodge is not strangely limited to having to be given the keys, and can just take them at will and does so often...

Ah ok, I’m not wrong to be confused, the show writers changed things and weren’t consistent about it.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Ailynn

jason10mm

Member
Feb 3, 2009
1,317
266
945
Ah ok, I’m not wrong to be confused, the show writers changed things and weren’t consistent about it.
No, they do sorta address it later on but it is clearly something they dosnt really think through.

They actually do a fair amount of after the fact bandaid dialogue to justify some silly actions. While I appreciate that these are kids and really ought to be out-thought by adults, it is frustrating because it goes against the norm for these types of shows.
 

Weiji

Member
Jul 20, 2018
680
830
365
I'm most of the way through it. Helps that it is 45 min/ep, guess it is destined for commercial airing somewhere.

The high school stuff is a bit if a drag because they are REALLY dug into the logistics of it. So much dialogue just about getting rides to and from school! Then they get the PERFECT opportunity to make school a cakewalk to focus on non school stuff and do they take it.....nope! They should have taken a note from stranger things or even sabrina and make school itself a dim background element at best.

Lovecraft is also the blackest town in Massachusetts! Almost every Locke adjacent character is black and in a show so driven by family issues I keep trying to confabulate the black characters into one family as well. Is Ellie the daughter of Joe? Who is the amputee guy and is he related to the savini club girl? It's a silly thing but is mildly distracting. Just wish they had a more diverse cast overall.
Can I just say that amputee guy is such an amazingly likable character.

I know the show has its problems but I really like this cast, honestly a lot of the B team is better then the main bunch.
 

SLoWMoTIoN

Milk Connoisseur
Feb 2, 2018
11,622
10,997
885
Pretty eh so far and the main kid is so fucking annoying. But I enjoyed that predictable part where

the skinny bitch kills a kid warriors style.
I'll prob watch it all and hate myself for it like I always do for most netflix shows. :)
 
  • Like
Reactions: Ailynn

Ailynn

Faith - Hope - Love
Jan 1, 2017
1,211
5,914
865
East Tennessee, USA
Pretty eh so far and the main kid is so fucking annoying. But I enjoyed that predictable part where

the skinny bitch kills a kid warriors style.
I'll prob watch it all and hate myself for it like I always do for most netflix shows. :)
If you get the chance, read the comics instead- They are excellent and the show is a real letdown for most fans.
 
  • Thoughtful
Reactions: SLoWMoTIoN

SLoWMoTIoN

Milk Connoisseur
Feb 2, 2018
11,622
10,997
885
Apparently there was a movie a few years ago and the weird girl from Lost Girl played Dodge?
But on this adaptation a younger sticc AOC plays her instead? How was Dodge suppose to look again?
 
  • Thoughtful
Reactions: Ailynn

Ailynn

Faith - Hope - Love
Jan 1, 2017
1,211
5,914
865
East Tennessee, USA
Apparently there was a movie a few years ago and the weird girl from Lost Girl played Dodge?
But on this adaptation a younger sticc AOC plays her instead? How was Dodge suppose to look again?
Double spoiler warning for the comics, but Dodge takes many forms. You can see a few below (although I avoided one in particular so as to not spoil the show):

 
  • Thoughtful
Reactions: SLoWMoTIoN

SLoWMoTIoN

Milk Connoisseur
Feb 2, 2018
11,622
10,997
885
Double spoiler warning for the comics, but Dodge takes many forms. You can see a few below (although I avoided one in particular so as to not spoil the show):

I figured it was a demon. But I meant her host in the tv show. I guess she's tan so it fits more than the Lost Girl actress.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Ailynn

Ailynn

Faith - Hope - Love
Jan 1, 2017
1,211
5,914
865
East Tennessee, USA
I figured it was a demon. But I meant her host in the tv show. I guess she's tan so it fits more than the Lost Girl actress.

Oh, sorry! Yeah, Ksenia Solo played her in the unaired 2011 Fox pilot of Locke & Key. I found this short clip, here:

I personally liked per portrayal of Dodge a little better, and really liked the pilot episode. You can see it in its entirety in one of my earlier posts in this thread. :)
 
Last edited: