Lost Order announced (Matsuno/Yoshida/PlatinumGames/Cygames, RealtimeTactics, Mobile)

Oregano

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Mar 13, 2013
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The average gamer, hell even the average FF fan, doesn't have a clue what Vagrant Story and is probably only vaguely aware of FF Tactics existence.
 

Dark_castle

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Jun 25, 2013
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I'm pretty sure Granblue Fantasy will be remembered over half the JRPGs on PS4 right now.
For every Granblue Fantasy, there's thousands of throwaway, mobile JRPG by Kemco. Think about it, if Cygames have the ability to make Granblue Fantasy a good that it is, think about what happens when they actually had the budget and resource to make a console, turn-based RPG. Now it can turn out underwhelming, but it's a chance i will take all day.
 

Falk

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For every Granblue Fantasy, there's thousands of throwaway, mobile JRPG by Kemco. Think about it, if Cygames have the ability to make Granblue Fantasy a good that it is, think about what happens when they actually had the budget and resource to make a console, turn-based RPG. Now it can turn out underwhelming, but it's a chance i will take all day.
They're actually doing that though. Minus the turn-based part. :(
 

duckroll

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Granblue Fantasy is two years old, currently the fourth top-grossing app on the Japanese app store.

Takes a while to digest that fast food, apparently.
And they made Rage of Bahamut before that, and continue to invest in the IP heavily with a second high budget TV anime in production now. Maybe he meant fast food in the sense that McDonald's and KFC are long lasting powerhouse brands?

MC Donald is decades old. Still fastfood.
Yeah, so basically, more memorable than most restaurants and has more cultural impact? Gotcha.
 

Hubb

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Sorry for the dumb question, but does anyone have a good comparison of a mobile real time tactics game? Is this suppose to be like starcraft?
 

Falk

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MC Donald is decades old. Still fastfood.
Seriously, no one is asking to like it. What form of entertainment you enjoy or don't enjoy really is up to you.

But just because you don't like something doesn't automatically mean it's not popular, or automatically popular for the wrong reasons.

You don't have to take it as some kind of personal attack on your taste or something.
 

duckroll

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You don't have to take it as some kind of personal attack on your taste or something.
How can he not though? When deep down he knows how bad his own taste is. Being Perfo is suffering. No one even takes him seriously!
 

Ridley327

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Square Enix had no problems with him working on the Tactics Ogre remake.
In that case, the stakes aren't going to be high enough for them to worry that much about his involvement. Wasn't he not the director for the remake, either?

You have to admit that Squenix wouldn't be looking to get him back for a mainline FF anytime soon, even if he wanted to have another go at it.
 

skLaFarebear

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May 18, 2014
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The Granblue Fantasy spin-off, yeah. Combat looks fun, but c'mon, why not turn-based! I hope the other one is. :\
Because Granblue Fantasy is already turn-based?

Nothing wrong with variety in your spin-offs, especially when it's being done by a company that's experienced with the Action-RPG genre.
 

Perfo

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Aug 22, 2010
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Seriously, no one is asking to like it. What form of entertainment you enjoy or don't enjoy really is up to you.

But just because you don't like something doesn't automatically mean it's not popular, or automatically popular for the wrong reasons.

You don't have to take it as some kind of personal attack on your taste or something.
To be honest I said in reply to someone saying these staff members were wasted that I agree with him. Great artists such them are better honored and remembered with their names sticked to ambitious project for their times like fft and vagrant.
 

duckroll

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In that case, the stakes aren't going to be high enough for them to worry that much about his involvement. Wasn't he not the director for the remake, either?

You have to admit that Squenix wouldn't be looking to get him back for a mainline FF anytime soon, even if he wanted to have another go at it.
I think the feeling is largely mutual. Matsuno doesn't want to work on large scale productions anymore, and Square Enix would never want him in charge of a large scale production again!
 

Falk

that puzzling face
Aug 26, 2013
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To be honest I said in reply to someone saying these staff members were wasted that I agree with him. Great artists such them are better honored and remembered with their names sticked to ambitious project for their times like fft and vagrant.
And you're still not getting it. Granblue was/is far more ambitious than half the JRPGs on PS4 right now. Exactly what I said in reply to you right at the start.

We can keep going in circles about how you've never heard of a particular game which somehow automatically disqualifies it, or we can just leave it at that.
 
Apr 21, 2016
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And you're still not getting it. Granblue was/is far more ambitious than half the JRPGs on PS4 right now. Exactly what I said in reply to you right at the start.
Yeah I was about to say. Nothing about Granblue was proven at the time, and now it's lighting the world(or japan idk) on fire. Wanting to be apart of that is like the definition of the word ambitious lol.

Especially in comparison to hanging around your old company hoping they let you work on something that's like the old games you used to make, which is what it sounds like you want from them Perfo
 

Falk

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Yeah I was about to say. Nothing about Granblue was proven at the time, and now it's lighting the world(or japan idk) on fire. Wanting to be apart of that is like the definition of the word ambitious lol.
To be a little more accurate Granblue when it launched WAS ambitious, because it was coming off the success of Rage of Bahamut. It definitely grew a couple orders of magnitude in the intervening two years, but despite being a web-based piece of software it did a lot of things design-wise right off the bat that were pretty ballsy.

I think history is somewhat being repeated here with Lost Order being announced/developed off the success of Granblue, just as Granblue rode on the success of RoB.

edit: world vs japan, I'd say right now it's still pretty much majorly Japan-based in its success. Sure, it has a very dedicated (yet niche) international following, but the barrier to entry, while a lot lower with an integrated English localization, is still there in terms of monetization, storefront exposure, etc.

What about Shadowverse though?
What about it?
 

duckroll

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To be a little more accurate Granblue when it launched WAS ambitious, because it was coming off the success of Rage of Bahamut. It definitely grew a couple orders of magnitude in the intervening two years, but despite being a web-based piece of software it did a lot of things design-wise right off the bat that were pretty ballsy.

I think history is somewhat being repeated here with Lost Order being announced/developed off the success of Granblue, just as Granblue rode on the success of RoB.
What about Shadowverse though?
 
Apr 21, 2016
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To be a little more accurate Granblue when it launched WAS ambitious, because it was coming off the success of Rage of Bahamut. It definitely grew a couple orders of magnitude in the intervening two years, but despite being a web-based piece of software it did a lot of things design-wise right off the bat that were pretty ballsy.

I think history is somewhat being repeated here with Lost Order being announced/developed off the success of Granblue, just as Granblue rode on the success of RoB.

edit: world vs japan, I'd say right now it's still pretty much majorly Japan-based in its success. Sure, it has a very dedicated (yet niche) international following, but the barrier to entry, while a lot lower with an integrated English localization, is still there in terms of monetization, storefront exposure, etc.
I see. I'm just fascinated by all of this. I haven't really paid attention to it prior to this, but it's really hard to ignore its impact in light of all these announcements. Seems like an exciting thing to be apart of.
 
Apr 21, 2016
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Can you further clarify here friend? I'm very interested to see an ambitious reply!~
I'm not familiar with the specific history. I just think a lot of the mobage cynicism is in a reaction to its success in hindsight, rather than coming from a more objective assessment of its game design and the circumstances it was developed and released in.
 

Leona Lewis

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They're either repurposing this artwork from NieR Automata or it wasn't actually for NieR to begin with:



The color scheme, the Ferris wheel. Or maybe Yoshida just likes his creepy abandoned amusement parks :p
 

Ridley327

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I think the feeling is largely mutual. Matsuno doesn't want to work on large scale productions anymore, and Square Enix would never want him in charge of a large scale production again!
Yeah. It's been clear for a long time that FFXII broke Matsuno is a big way, so any decision he's made to stay small has been out of his own personal desire to not work on a big production again, rather than being fundamentally incapable of working on one.
 

Falk

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Aug 26, 2013
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I'm not familiar with the specific history. I just think a lot of the mobage cynicism is in a reaction to its success in hindsight, rather than coming from a more objective assessment of its game design and the circumstances it was developed and released in.
Don't get me wrong, there are plenty of things to complain about (largely stemming from the web-based platform)
- Inventory management
- clunky, slow-loading UI
- music being mono and looping horribly despite being some top-tier compositions
- a frustratingly slow grind at times

But you can't say it lacked ambition in what it wanted to do despite that. Right now there's virtually dozens of tweets a second during peak hours in a rather bizarre yet somewhat unique multiplayer ecosystem where leeching, MVPing and hosting by different parties settled into a sort-of community-approved equilibrium.

It's got voice acting for its main quest, some really high profile crossover events, and enjoys so much success that Cygames doesn't shy at outright refunding all expenditures (in-game currency equivalent) made in a period of time where some new character or whatever is deemed too overpowered and subsequently nerfed.
 

Folstern

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Great birthday gift to wake up to. I will take anything Matsuno. Here's to hoping that this game actually comes out!
 

poncle

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Matsuno + Yoshida, what could go wrong?

Not happy about the platform of course, but what matter most is the monetisation approach.
I gave up on Valkyrie Anatomia because of the shitty balancing, so I'm pretty sure I could give up on this one too.
 

duckroll

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Matsuno + Yoshida, what could go wrong?

Not happy about the platform of course, but what matter most is the monetisation approach.
I gave up on Valkyrie Anatomia because of the shitty balancing, so I'm pretty sure I could give up on this one too.
The problem with Valkyrie was that the story was great but the gameplay loop was a total disaster. I gave up on it too. Not only was the balancing poor, there was just no real incentive to keep playing the game because of the way they gated stuff off making it less and less satisfying to just play the game and events.

Matsuno being a top-class game designer AND scenario writer will hopefully not make the same mistakes. After all, I've played Terra Battle for well over a year, and still going strong. So even gacha games can hold my interesting if there is a good gameplay loop.
 

Decado

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This is getting ridiculous. How can platinum have so many active projects at the same time?
Full teams are not dedicated to each project. A producer here, other staff there.

Sounds like P* has an excess of producer and maybe game director talent so they are being hired out.
 

theMrCravens

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Hopefully the popularity of the GBF English translation will have Cygames release Lost Order with full translation also at launch.

Terra Battle made it work, so it should be no problem for that big ass company.
 

duckroll

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Is it successful? I mean, that's the current new actual Cygames "big" title right? Bahamut -> Granblue -> Shadowverse. Everything else they produce and publish is from one of their other subsidiaries or outsourced to another developer, including this game. So I wonder if Lost Order is better compared to Bahamut and Granblue, or if it's better compared to say... Knights of Glory and Little Noah.
 

duckroll

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Another game by Cygames is Knights of Glory (Mobage, 2013), that has exactly the same art direction style as Final Fantasy Tactics: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=euU9e0VZTdc

It's a browser game. It makes me sad to see Yoshida's art wasted on these cash grabs, but at least it helps to keep expectations low.
Yoshida has nothing to do with Knights of Glory. That is just a copycat style, like how Sting aped the style with Knights in the Nightmare. The mobile game Yoshida worked on at CyDesignation before this was Little Noah.
 

Sheiter

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Granblue still not having a traditional English release is puzzling. I might have to check it out though...
It almost certaily never will. Even with this pseudo-english release they still had trouble getting the latest tales crossover in english. If it was to come to the west officially it'd most likely be a stripped down versiom with next to no collabs on its own server where it won't self-sustain and shut down in a year. Once tou get past registration the game is practically no different than an official english release so there's no reason to hold back trying it out.