Making games for children is a creative dead end

#51
I honestly thought Star Fox Zero was a fantastic game. But the forced motion controls bring it down. "Forced" being the key word. If it supported the Pro Controller, I would have probably played it a lot more.
This, I feel, really showcases Nintendo's core problem with developing titles. They are OBSESSED with developing for children who have no interest in playing their games to begin with. Adding in super modes where you can't die, structuring entire games around their tutorials, and conceptualizing and releasing ridiculous ideas that simply have no real audience, such as Pikmin or Codename S.T.E.A.M.
I don't see the problem with some of this. If a super easy mode is optional, what's the problem? How is Pikmin a ridiculous idea? I enjoy it. I think it's creative. If you don't like a game, that's cool, but I see nothing wrong with implementing new ideas. And I've met quite a few people that enjoy Pikmin. I never got into the series until I played 3, myself.
Nintendo needs to realize that children only want to PLAY THE SAME GAMES ADULTS ARE PLAYING. THERE IS NO REASON TO RUIN YOURSELF CREATIVELY PANDERING TO CHILDREN WHO WON'T BUY YOUR GAME ANYWAY.
And I don't think this is true at all. Not for all children, at least.
 
#52
The 3DS game is just a spin-off with different gameplay, Pikmin 4 will definitely not release 2018, so we are at three games in 17 years. Even if I give you Pikmin 4 in 2019, it's then four games in 18 years. In those 18 years there have been six 3D Marios, four 2D Marios (notably with a big gap until it started!), five Mario Karts, three F-Zeros (!), six Metroid main line games (probably seven by the time Pikmin 4 comes, plus three similar spin-offs and one further off spin-off), nine Zelda main line games, ten Fire Emblem games (eleven by the time Pikmin 4 comes), three Yoshi mainline games (four by the time Pikmin 4 comes; plus two spin-off games, one of which with similar gameplay), four Smash Bros. games (five by the time Pikmin 4 comes out), eleven Mario Party games, five Mario Tennis games, seven Pokémon mainline games (eight by the time Pikmin 4 comes out), three Donkey Kong mainline games, six Mario vs. DK games, nine Mario RPGs (in two subseries, with at least four games each), four Advance Wars game (or six Wars games, overall)...

Need I go on? What are you actually on about, Pikmin is at the lower end of active, running series, getting new entries.
Yes, and all of those sell better to kids than Pikmin. Have you lost the original context of this thread?

Instead of more games that historically sell well to kids, we get Labortion and Pikmin 35: Dream Drop Distance.
 
#53
I think the addition of 'Funky Kong' style extras are a great way of allowing a wider audience to engage with games beyond the easier, early game content. I much prefer that to flattening the experience across the entire game, such as with Super Mario 3D World etc. which to veteran gamers are a little pedestrian until you beat the game and harder content becomes available.
 
#54
Nintendo needs to realize that children only want to PLAY THE SAME GAMES ADULTS ARE PLAYING. THERE IS NO REASON TO RUIN YOURSELF CREATIVELY PANDERING TO CHILDREN WHO WON'T BUY YOUR GAME ANYWAY.
There are nothing wrong to create games for all ages as long as not censoring the adult oriented games to begin with.

Regarding the sales for all ages Nintendo games:
Japan best seller (12 month back) in units
1. Pokemon sun/moon around 2,2 millions
2. MHW 1,9 millions

So its no true at all about children do not buy children games.
 
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#55
Shigeru Miyamoto said these words in response to angry fan backlash in regards to Star Fox Zero's motion controls. According to him, those of us who despise the controls and wanted them changed were nothing but senile old men because we actually had standards.
I wouldn't conflate "having standards" and "not being very good at video games".
 
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#56
Yes, and all of those sell better to kids than Pikmin. Have you lost the original context of this thread?
You have attacked Pikmin pretty much out of context of the thread. I'd also argue that Pikmin is not particularly aimed at children. It still sold reasonably well: Games 1 & 2 have both sold more than a million copies according to @Celine and some have claimed the third game has sold a million on Wii U, but I cannot corrobate this with @Celine's charts, so I guess there is no official data on that. That's not worse than some of the other smaller fanchises on the list.
 
#57
You have attacked Pikmin pretty much out of context of the thread. I'd also argue that Pikmin is not particularly aimed at children. It still sold reasonably well: Games 1 & 2 have both sold more than a million copies according to @Celine and some have claimed the third game has sold a million on Wii U, but I cannot corrobate this with @Celine's charts, so I guess there is no official data on that. That's not worse than some of the other smaller fanchises on the list.
Pikmin is Miyamoto's strange obsession. It is definitely one of his worst-selling franchises and yet it keeps getting AAA development resources.

I actually love Pikmin, so don't take my sarcasm as an inditement against the games themselves. Pikmin 3 was excellent and is probably my favorite, barely edging out the first game. I didn't bother with Hey! Pikmin but I did pick up the re-releases on Wii (the IR pointer controls are still quite good).

My enjoyment of the franchise doesn't prevent me from pointing out the hypocrisy, though. Nintendo uses the excuse of "making games for kids" when it suits them but when it actually comes to investing resources, they just make whatever the heck they want. The company has too many runaway "creative geniuses" (Miyamoto, Aonuma, Sakamoto) and not enough "practical businesspeople" (Sakurai, Konno, Iwata r.i.p).
 
#58
I actually hope Nintendo produces some educational CDROM games for kids in collaboration with an educational institution. Have no idea if they've done this in Japan already
 
#59
There are great ways to make games & media aimed at children, and there terrible ways. The shining example of creating for adults & children together is Pixar, whose films are wonderfully enjoyable for the young but don't shy away from deeper themes, mysteries, and emotional resonances--which children actually crave despite the more cynical companies that think catering to kids means dumbing down content and then adding in a few cheap innuendoes for the parents in the theater (ahem... Dreamworks).

Nintendo is the closet thing to Pixar in gaming, even if there are some missteps. Games like Odyssey or BOTW are wonderfully engaging for any age, and yet playful enough in their basic elements for children to enjoy on any level (you can just enjoy eg. hunting and cooking in Zelda and take the rest easy if you want, which I've seen my own kid doing). I don't get the criticisms when no one out there in gaming comes close to the universal appeal here.
 
#60
We could use an update to Mario Teaches Typing. Heck you could even make it a phone game aimed at improving typing efficiency on touch devices
 
#61
main reason I bought a switch was cos Nintendo is not afraid to make things colorful and fantastical and childlike. I would rather take cartoony characters over the faux seriousness of other systems. Honestly it feels like most gaming is stuck in the 90s trying to look grim and edgy, Nintendo is too original to get sucked into that trend and I’m fine w it.

As for easy modes, those are kind of in every game already, and most modern games are piss easy to begin with. I can ignore the optional modes entirely in SMO and for games like BOTW they haven’t been incorporated at all.
 
#62
Is making films for children a creative dead end? Writing literature for children? That would seem to render the beloved status of many classic movies and children's books completely inexplicable.

Designing a game for children -- I think Nintendo would prefer "accessible" to children, and that's important -- surely brings along with it particular challenges. Content, control, difficulty, etc. But creativity is sparked, not smothered by challenges and constraints.

Star Fox Zero is a weird example from which to springboard -- that game was not good for any age group.
 
#63
This seems like an odd thing to fret about.
Let Nintendo worry about it, if they're still making these types of games they obviously have more data than you to suggest they're still a relevent and an important market to them.
If there not pulling their weight and making money then you'll see them dissappear *cough*fzero*cough*
 
#65
Hmm.. With games and toys, yes, they get to choose what they like obviously (within budget). With other things though, like food, clothes etc, not really ;) Otherwise it'll be hell, lol. They do have a day every week where they get to eat whatever they want, which is mostly junk, surprise surprise, hah.

But I do like to involve them in things and trying making their own decisions.
All sounds completely reasonable and sensible to me.

I don't think your children are spoilt at all; I don't have a clue what hecatomb is on about to be honest.
 
#66
No. You said that someone's kids sound picky because they only get excited for Mario, Cartoons etc. I used this as an illustration to point out this is a really dumb problem to have because the alternative is, uh, GTA and Last of Us. Kids sound picky because they like cartoons? What are you on?
no I didn't, you just made that up on your own. I don't think the problem is there games for kids, I think the problem is his kids are just to picky when it comes to games.
 
#67
"I think personally Star Fox is a really fun game if you sit down and play it. I think, for example, an elementary school kid who plays it without any preconceived notions, I think it would be really fun for them. I think it's also really, really fun for siblings to play it together."

Shigeru Miyamoto said these words in response to angry fan backlash in regards to Star Fox Zero's motion controls. According to him, those of us who despise the controls and wanted them changed were nothing but senile old men because we actually had standards.

This, I feel, really showcases Nintendo's core problem with developing titles. They are OBSESSED with developing for children who have no interest in playing their games to begin with. Adding in super modes where you can't die, structuring entire games around their tutorials, and conceptualizing and releasing ridiculous ideas that simply have no real audience, such as Pikmin or Codename S.T.E.A.M.

Nintendo needs to realize that children only want to PLAY THE SAME GAMES ADULTS ARE PLAYING. THERE IS NO REASON TO RUIN YOURSELF CREATIVELY PANDERING TO CHILDREN WHO WON'T BUY YOUR GAME ANYWAY.

Nintendo and Miyamoto seem to principally rely on the 'It's for children!" excuse when justifying the existence of games like Star Fox Zero and the censorship of Xenoblade Chronicles X. According to Nintendo, it is not okay to treat children with respect and dignity.
Star Fox Zero ... controls and all... IS, and always will be ... a fine game.
 
#68
Why do they treat the 'children' like they are incompetents? Old mario games were 'for the children', but they were significantly more difficult. Nintendo games nowadays are so easy, the lack of difficulty saps a lot of the funfactor.
 
#69
I think it's more interesting that Nintendo makes fancy tech-demo titles or stand-alone titles to go along with something they've targeted toward children (such as Labo or to showcase a kid-friendly feature of their hardware, like motion control). That said, producing any kind of content for children is much harder than it seems; ask anyone who produces media specifically for children.
 
#70
Why do they treat the 'children' like they are incompetents? Old mario games were 'for the children', but they were significantly more difficult. Nintendo games nowadays are so easy, the lack of difficulty saps a lot of the funfactor.
games in general are easier these days, not just kid's games, and not just Nintendo's. play Bioshock: Infinite, if you die, you respawn immediately where you died and all the damage you did the to enemies carries over. that instant respawn is in nearly every game. every game has a map so you don't get lost. every game has a floating arrow telling you where to go. if you don't have an arrow, click R3 and you get detective vision, the game does the pixel hunting for you.

infinite lives, respawning health, online co-op, there are a million ways that modern games hold your hands. games are just easy now. this is why something like Bloodborne is about as hard as your standard NES game but compared to what we have now it is the most difficult thing ever.
 
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#72
Creators should make whatever they want. If that means they want to make an easy game for kids, let them do it. It's annoying that whinny fan-brats think they know better than artists and business people who have to create a product and test it with consumers to make it successful. When its done wrong, sure we can criticize it, but fans need to stop acting like they're the center of the universe, because you're not.
 
#73
There is a market for games for kids, thats why they keep making them cause people keep buying them. Im pretty sure if no one bought mario, Kirby, or Pokemon games anymore, they would stop making them.
 
#74
"I think personally Star Fox is a really fun game if you sit down and play it. I think, for example, an elementary school kid who plays it without any preconceived notions, I think it would be really fun for them. I think it's also really, really fun for siblings to play it together."

Shigeru Miyamoto said these words in response to angry fan backlash in regards to Star Fox Zero's motion controls. According to him, those of us who despise the controls and wanted them changed were nothing but senile old men because we actually had standards.

This, I feel, really showcases Nintendo's core problem with developing titles. They are OBSESSED with developing for children who have no interest in playing their games to begin with. Adding in super modes where you can't die, structuring entire games around their tutorials, and conceptualizing and releasing ridiculous ideas that simply have no real audience, such as Pikmin or Codename S.T.E.A.M.

Nintendo needs to realize that children only want to PLAY THE SAME GAMES ADULTS ARE PLAYING. THERE IS NO REASON TO RUIN YOURSELF CREATIVELY PANDERING TO CHILDREN WHO WON'T BUY YOUR GAME ANYWAY.

Nintendo and Miyamoto seem to principally rely on the 'It's for children!" excuse when justifying the existence of games like Star Fox Zero and the censorship of Xenoblade Chronicles X. According to Nintendo, it is not okay to treat children with respect and dignity.
OP - Switch seems to be doing just fine, but I still gotta agree with the bolded and underlined. As a parent, I have thought that many times as well. Even our switch at home - bought the kids all the best Nintendo games. And you know what they play on it? Nothing but Fortnite the past few months. They couldn't care less for the exclusives, nor do their friends. Mario Kart on occasion until Fortnite came out for Switch, but it essentially just collected dust until that point.
 
#75
What's interesting to me is how stubborn they are with making so many family friendly games when to me it's obvious their old classics pander to 30 year olds and up. I still love the classics and the new entries in the series... but we also need games that cater to the crowd that literally grew up playing Nintendo games. Our tastes change, preferences... keep the family friendly games coming, but please consider us seasoned gents too.
 
#76
What's interesting to me is how stubborn they are with making so many family friendly games when to me it's obvious their old classics pander to 30 year olds and up. I still love the classics and the new entries in the series... but we also need games that cater to the crowd that literally grew up playing Nintendo games. Our tastes change, preferences... keep the family friendly games coming, but please consider us seasoned gents too.
Nintendo doesn't need to make M-rated games though, they can just let the 3rd party companies do that for them.
https://www.amazon.com/Games-Mature...33011,p_n_feature_three_browse-bin:2055863011
 
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#79
Nintendo needs to realize that children only want to PLAY THE SAME GAMES ADULTS ARE PLAYING. THERE IS NO REASON TO RUIN YOURSELF CREATIVELY PANDERING TO CHILDREN WHO WON'T BUY YOUR GAME ANYWAY.
Yes nobody should never produce anything for children because it doesn’t appeal to you and your needs should be put above all the youngsters.

There are millions of games and developers out there. Let Nintendo do their thing and you do yours.
 
#81
Point is that they're there, plenty of them. Just because Nintendo isn't making them, doesn't mean third parties aren't doing it.
My point is there's hardly any at all. What's "plenty"? Without going into list wars. Seriously. And before I get "schooled" on what is there now, look back on previous consoles and what was there on Nintendo boxes. The difference this time is we're getting some decent M ports, stuff I'll actually play versus the Wii gen which was more shovel ware and tacked on controls or spin offs... but I've yet to see any made for Switch games, new games, that cater to the mature crowd.

Just imagine if Nintendo actually made an M rated game, with that good old Nintendo polish that usually hits the mark?
 
#82
Just imagine if Nintendo actually made an M rated game, with that good old Nintendo polish that usually hits the mark?
Bayonetta III. Point is, Switch already has plenty of M rated games considering its relatively short time on the market currently. And there's more coming, including new games like Doom Eternal. The bigger point is, you don't need an M rating to be for a mature audience. Octopath Traveler isn't rated M, yet its more mature than many actual M rated games. Adults don't actually care about the ESRB rating, they care about good, attractive games.
 
#83
A couple of points on the op's premise:

Star Fox Zero is a great game and the controls work very well. The perspective switch takes some getting used to, but it is a clever mechanic used in a good way. Disliking Star Fox Zero is not indicative of having standards but of having a certain (from my perspective: poor) taste.

Star Fox Zero requires adaptation to both, motion controls for finer aiming, and management of two perspectives. This is an additional learning curve that can be problematic for rusty old players (such as myself). Past examples have already shown that many older players are so set in their ways that even very well planned and executed control schemes that use motion have a hard time getting accepted, just think of the complaints leveled at Skyward Sword. Star Fox Zero was also a victim of this. This has nothing to do with having standards, but with being stubborn or just having a hard time to adapt.
I thought Skyward Sword was great. I think motion controls CAN be good, when used well. I don't know if this constitutes "poor" taste, but the reason I thought the Wii version of Twilight Princess was a joke wasn't because I'm a senile, inflexible old man. It was because suddenly you had an imprecise waggle shoehorned into what was a button press. It felt like a HUGE forced gimmick. Skyward Sword rectified this and I was satisfied with their solution, even if you had to buy an add-on to get what they seemed to be advertising since before launch. The point is that different for the sake of different isn't better.

Control in video games should be intuitive. Swinging a sword and having the on-screen sword move is easy to understand. Star Fox 64 was a great title because it was an accessible arcade-ish shooter set on rails. Star Fox made the rules of engagement very simple: aim and shoot. That inherent easy-fun arcadeyness is lost when you need to "adapt" to pick it up. Now you need to learn to manage two perspectives? Unnecessary barriers to entry before enjoying the game, that's why Zero is a bad star fox.

Even my dad when I was a kid thought star fox was cool and tried out the game, and he isn't a gamer and can't even play Mario. Now that's effective game design! I'd tell him a new game came out to try for old times, but now you have to "adapt" when in fact the old control scheme just worked. He'd be equally averse to Zero's scheme now years later as he would have been in 1997.

In the same way, Skyward Sword's controls just worked. It's not about being an old fuddy duddy or hating motion, it's about using the tech at their disposal to design an intuitive experience, not using the tech...just to use it.

If Nintendo wanted independent aiming and shooting so badly, how about using the Wii Remote like a flight stick and the control stick to aim the weapons? While I'd still prefer the arcade simplicity of 64, this would be immediately understood, mimic in some way the real-life action, and, much like Skyward's sword controls, tear down a barrier due to how easy to grasp it is. Instead we got Zero, a game designed around validating the existence of the Gamepad.

Nintendo's marketing during Wii was highly focused on how the wiimote broke down that barrier between the player and the game. Swing the golf club! Choose your sword swings wisely! During this time Nintendo was hugely successful. Zero is the antithesis of this design philosophy, adding instead of taking down barriers. Maybe I have bad taste, but I think it's a hilariously bad product that deserved to fail.

I gotta be direct, I'm so glad Zero bombed. It's the culmination of everything maddening about Nintendo up to that point.
 
#84
My point is there's hardly any at all. What's "plenty"? Without going into list wars. Seriously. And before I get "schooled" on what is there now, look back on previous consoles and what was there on Nintendo boxes. The difference this time is we're getting some decent M ports, stuff I'll actually play versus the Wii gen which was more shovel ware and tacked on controls or spin offs... but I've yet to see any made for Switch games, new games, that cater to the mature crowd.

Just imagine if Nintendo actually made an M rated game, with that good old Nintendo polish that usually hits the mark?
could be cause Nintendos online gaming isn't as good as Sony or Microsofts, hence why you never hear anyone playing games like CoD, or Mortal Kombat online. Or other multiplayer games rated M.
 
#85
Bayonetta III. Point is, Switch already has plenty of M rated games considering its relatively short time on the market currently. And there's more coming, including new games like Doom Eternal. The bigger point is, you don't need an M rating to be for a mature audience. Octopath Traveler isn't rated M, yet its more mature than many actual M rated games. Adults don't actually care about the ESRB rating, they care about good, attractive games.
Fair points in principle... and sure an M rating isn't neccessary, but I still appreciate adult gaming as well as the family friendly output Nintendos got. When compared to Sony or Microsoft though... what Nintendo has is a drop in the bucket. Every single gen all I keep hearing is "more is coming"... maybe Switch manages to obtain more adult or M rated titles than any Nintendo console before it. Who knows. But going by past examples? I'll believe it when I see it. Currently there simply isn't the variety of adult or M rated games on Switch to satisfy my tastes... I'll continue with PC and XB1 until there are more that I crave playing on the go. Or better yet, some Switch exclusives. Either way, what's enough for you clearly isn't enough for me lol
 
#86
could be cause Nintendos online gaming isn't as good as Sony or Microsofts, hence why you never hear anyone playing games like CoD, or Mortal Kombat online. Or other multiplayer games rated M.
Its unfortunate... but that might be the case too. A robust online experience lends itself to serious gamers... gamers who appreciate those games. I understand that train of thought even though I dont entirely agree
 
#87
Its unfortunate... but that might be the case too. A robust online experience lends itself to serious gamers... gamers who appreciate those games. I understand that train of thought even though I dont entirely agree
Nintendo's online has no impact on what games come to Switch or not. Developers don't actually give a shit what Nintendo does with online, they just care whether it can do it or not.

Fair points in principle... and sure an M rating isn't neccessary, but I still appreciate adult gaming as well as the family friendly output Nintendos got. When compared to Sony or Microsoft though... what Nintendo has is a drop in the bucket. Every single gen all I keep hearing is "more is coming"... maybe Switch manages to obtain more adult or M rated titles than any Nintendo console before it. Who knows. But going by past examples? I'll believe it when I see it. Currently there simply isn't the variety of adult or M rated games on Switch to satisfy my tastes... I'll continue with PC and XB1 until there are more that I crave playing on the go. Or better yet, some Switch exclusives. Either way, what's enough for you clearly isn't enough for me lol
And again, Switch already has enough M rated games on it at the moment. They may not be to your tastes, but they're there.
 
#89
When I was 9 I played hardcore strategy games like Universal Military Simulator that looked like this....
Being a kid doesn't mean you're stupid. Unless you ARE stupid. And Nintendo is clearly making games for stupid kids (and stupid adults).

Enjoy the stupid then!
Entertainment doesn’t need to require of you to use your full cognitive abilities in order to make you feel entertained.
 
#91
Yeah dumbed down games are boring.

Mario odyssey = literally worst game I have played in years. Boring levels, repetive tasks, ugly "cute" graphics with low details, annoying controls(sometimes).

Most I enjoyed were those 2D parts, it just tells that mario 1 is better game than odyssey.

Collect xxx things is just boring and cheap way to add "content" for simple people. It ok IF game has lot of other content, but when main goal takes 10mins to complete and collecting xxx-things takes 100mins, it is just bad game making.

And normal 10+ year old can play almost any game(not porn) without getting traumatized, unless they are overprotected by their parents.
 
#92
When I think "children", I think 12 and under. I think it goes without saying that Nintendo are the masters of games that appeal to children. What makes them even more unique is that those "kiddie games" can (and do) also appeal to adults. That's quite a feat if you ask me, and something that Sony and MS can only rarely manage with their games, which seem to mainly focus on people 13 and up, and by my definition, are no longer really "children" anymore. Nintendo doesn't seem to be hitting any dead ends catering to children that I'm aware of, they seem to manage it just fine without even trying.
 
#93
Entertainment doesn’t need to require of you to use your full cognitive abilities in order to make you feel entertained.
The games are fun if they are challenging or competitive. Playing games suppose to be an exciting occupation, not easy or relaxing.
There isn't much competitive or challenging games for kids, that is why most of them are playing Call of Duty and GTAV. The "M" rated games.

p.s. to be less dramatic kids also like Overwatch and Minecraft.
 
#94
Yeah dumbed down games are boring.

Mario odyssey = literally worst game I have played in years. Boring levels, repetive tasks, ugly "cute" graphics with low details, annoying controls(sometimes).

Most I enjoyed were those 2D parts, it just tells that mario 1 is better game than odyssey.

Collect xxx things is just boring and cheap way to add "content" for simple people. It ok IF game has lot of other content, but when main goal takes 10mins to complete and collecting xxx-things takes 100mins, it is just bad game making.

And normal 10+ year old can play almost any game(not porn) without getting traumatized, unless they are overprotected by their parents.
Pretty much. The last truly great Nintendo game was Metroid Prime, and it wasn't even developed by NOJ. And hilariously, the worst part of Metroid Prime, the artifact hunt at the end, was actually mandated by NOJ as a cheap tactic to artificially lengthen the game. NOJ really does love bullshit collection filler. It'd be comical if I didn't actually want their games to be good.
 
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#95
Mario odyssey = literally worst game I have played in years. Boring levels, repetive tasks, ugly "cute" graphics with low details, annoying controls(sometimes).
97 on metacritic. https://www.metacritic.com/game/switch/super-mario-odyssey


Super Mario Odyssey is ranked in the top 0.0% of games scored on OpenCritic
Based on 97 scored reviews, 104 reviews total.

https://opencritic.com/game/4504/super-mario-odyssey

What games do you actually like then? Let me guess, the new boring, repetitive spider-man. Lol
 
#96
My kids don't want to play the games I play. All they care about is Mario and party, and all the cartoon/disney/etc stuff.
no I didn't, you just made that up on your own. I don't think the problem is there games for kids, I think the problem is his kids are just to picky when it comes to games.
How did I make that up? The kids want to play the games the ESRB thinks they should, and you think they should be less picky and play T rated games. Lol, I remember wanting to play Turok on N64, and my mom wouldn't let me. If I had refused to play any of the other N64 games and demanded Turok anyway, I'd be pretty damn picky.

Thankfully by the time Goldeneye came out I had more flexibility. And yes, 007 was THE game I wanted. Shame on me for wanting the current multiplayer craze game all my friends had.

Clearly, I was a picky SOB and my parents should have grabbed a random game off the shelf instead.

My point is, calling kids picky because the games they so happen to want are the same games marketed to and appropriate for them is disingenuous. If your reason for calling them picky wasn't because they want these games, I see no other basis for your argument. Nothing else was stated. It's quoted above. So where did it come from?
 
#97
It's like that for everyone, but not everyone is perceptive enough to realize it.
I do agree that a mentally challenging game may be the most interesting in the long run. But entertainment doesnt meed that all the time. Sometimes someone may just want something easy and fun where they need to react rather than think. That doesnt mean that they are stupid.
 
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#98
I do agree that a mentally challenging game may be the most interesting in the long run. But entertainment doesnt meed that all the time. Sometimes someone may just want something easy and fun where they need to react rather than think. That doesnt mean that they are stupid.
Look at the thread title.

It is a fact that targetting children is an artistic dead-end. Do you think Shakespeare or Beethoven or Proust targeted children?

There will eventually be studies showing that game complexity is strongly correlated with IQ. The stupider someone is, the simpler the games they prefer. It is already obvious, but once the studies start rolling in even the stupid people will have to accept it.
 
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#99
Look at the thread title.

It is a fact that targetting children is an artistic dead-end. Do you think Shakespeare or Beethoven or Proust targeted children?

There will eventually be studies showing that game complexity is strongly correlated with IQ. The stupider someone is, the simpler the games they prefer. It is already obvious, but once the studies start rolling in even the stupid people will have to accept it.
Sure, if someone is not very smart they may prefer something simple they can understand better, however, just because someone likes simple entertainment doesn’t mean they are by default stupid.
 
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