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Media Create Sales 11/26 - 12/2 2007

Magicpaint

Member
May 19, 2005
12,889
2
1,455
United Kingdom
iidesuyo said:
So far RRR2 hasn't set the charts on fire. It sells a lot worse than I expected (I know a lot of people who looked forward to the game, but were put off by the high price in the end).
The original RRR only really thrived with the help of the launch window, but when that benefit is gone (and the fact that RRR and the sequel are both mediocre titles) then you can't expect RRR2 to exactly light up the charts. Still, Horsez 2, Babyz and those other similar junk together are bringing in Ubisoft a lot of money with their low cost, relatively high volume sales, so expect those to continue.
 

Lobster

Banned
Oct 22, 2006
11,988
1
0
Sydney
z11.invisionfree.com
Magicpaint said:
The original RRR only really thrived with the help of the launch window, but when that benefit is gone (and the fact that RRR and the sequel are both mediocre titles) then you can't expect RRR2 to exactly light up the charts. Still, Horsez 2, Babyz and those other similar junk together are bringing in Ubisoft a lot of money with their low cost, relatively high volume sales, so expect those to continue.

Like I said on the other page..

We haven't even seen charts that include RRR2 though.
 
Dec 3, 2006
37,576
0
1,260
People expected NMH to be huge business in Japan?

I don't expect that game to do terribly well in America, much less Japan.
 

iidesuyo

Member
Apr 20, 2006
3,142
6
1,095
Lobster said:
We haven't even seen charts that include RRR2 though.

I was responding to the sales of shovelware in general, RRR2 was released in a lot of countries already.
 

kay

Member
Jun 29, 2007
2,249
0
0
Well, they can't really port most of their Tom Clancy titles to the system so it puts them in a position to do that stuff. They should market the game fine even if they didn't develop it.
 

Lobster

Banned
Oct 22, 2006
11,988
1
0
Sydney
z11.invisionfree.com
iidesuyo said:
I was responding to the sales of shovelware in general, RRR2 was released in a lot of countries already.

RRR2 was released, but we haven't had charts for it. Shovelware doesn't sell as well as we think it does but party games atm are selling.

DeaconKnowledge said:
People expected NMH to be huge business in Japan?

I don't expect that game to do terribly well in America, much less Japan.

No, but we had our hopes,dreams,wishes etc..

In America though..under Ubisofts control..we think it will do well..well I think so anyway.
 

Raw64life

Member
Jun 9, 2004
9,725
0
1,450
I'd be impressed by anything over 25k for No More Heroes. I also can't see it doing any more than 100-200k in America, unless it gets a good marketing campaign, which it wont. This thread has made me a lot more interested in the game however.
 

kottila

Member
Jan 22, 2007
4,857
0
895
Nibelung Valesti said:
ToI = 75k = 50% of shipment

:(

Buy this awesome game, damn it!!!

50% first day is good. It will end up selling most of it's shipment the first week, so how can that be bad?
 
Apr 17, 2005
6,476
0
1,490
First day analysis :lol

Jesus christ, what a hard time I had to find other Silent Hill numbers, but thanks to the awesome JoshuaJSlone page I could find them.

First week numbers:
Silent Hill 2 - 69,285
Silent Hill 3 - 46,715
Silent Hill 4 - 34,972

We can't make a good comparison between Minna no Golf Portable since it was a launch title. Anyway it did 66k first week, 400k LTD and budget re-release little below 200k. MnGP2 is going to need quite a good holiday boost to match that.

Uncharted numbers are really dissapointing, Lair, yes LAIR, did 15-20k first day. Its the same number Heavenly Sword managed though, 7k.

Most disappointing performance goes to GTA VCS clearly, very bad sell through too. Comparing to GTA LCS (which weren't good anyway), first week numbers:
GTA LCS PSP - 38,685
GTA LCS PS2 - 17,344 (5 weeks later)

On the other hand, one title that did quite better than expected is Power Pro Kun Pocket 10 for DS. Previous games in the series, first week numbers (LTD):
Power Pro Kun Pocket 6 03.12.04 GBA 55,429 (265,183)
Power Pro Kun Pocket 7 04.12.02 GBA 39,270 (213,210)
Power Pro Kun Pocket 8 05.12.01 DS 16,215 (122,788)
Power Pro Kun Pocket 9 06.12.07 DS 21,801 (144,631)

As seen above, previous DS entries were lower than the latest GBA ones, but 10 has done in its first day as much as other DS entries first week, so it looks fairly good to match 6-7 numbers for the week. Its a series with long legs due to its release date as you can see.

Lost Odissey numbers are just the same as Blue Dragon without counting its bundle, and seeing the sell through, it has done well but its looking unlikely that it'll surpass Blue Dragon.

A few games not reported but released yesterday are: Viva Piñata Let's Party, Momotarou Densetsu 16 Gold 360, Tamagotchi no Furifuri Kagekidan Wii and Hanetobi Wii.

I can't find a Gintama DS game last year (from Banpresto too) so the one this year looks like did quite better than that one. 15k is nearly as good as the PS2 one in August though, which did 20k first day and 57k first week.

I'm very curious to see how Ryu ga Gotoku 2 budget re-release does but I don't think it'll do anywhere near the first one budget re-release, 33k first day and humongous 450k LTD. At least it'll push RGG2 above 600k, RGG is about 800k.
 

ethelred

Member
Dec 19, 2005
16,019
1
1,525
Magicpaint said:
No, you'd expect a Tales game to sell a LOT better, but ToI had some harsh cirumstances, and according to shipments figures, it's not a bad performance, but it could be a lot better. It's selling better than Tempest, but much, much worse than everything else in the main series (and worse than RM which was a spin-off).

I'm not so sure of that, actually. Radiant Mythology did 97,156 for its first week. 75k on Innocence's first day... well, I could see it doing more than another 22k. Couldn't you?

No question Tales of Innocence's performance is low compared to any of the real Tales games, but I guess that's pretty expected. Hopefully the game will get good word of mouth and continue to sell well? At least it didn't instabomb first day like Tempest.

djtiesto said:
One question about the initial shipment percentage sold... what percentages are considered "good"? Like, is TOI's 50% of the initial shipment sold a good thing or a bad thing?

50% sell through isn't awful, but it's not really great, either. As Kuro pointed out, main series games usually do closer to the 70% range... but Tempest did only 30%. 50% is enough that I don't think retailers are going to panic and start slashing prices.
 

charlequin

Banned
Oct 19, 2005
26,635
1
1,405
Yeesh, poor performance on every title I was rooting for this week.

As ethelred says just slightly above me, the 50% sellthrough number on ToI isn't quite in bomba territory; at that level retailers can reasonably expect to move the entire shipment eventually. Still, 75k (and the <150k number we'll be seeing for week one) is pretty atrocious for the series; it's unlikely it'll beat 300k lifetime, which means it's underperforming even Tales of Symphonia GCN. This is entirely Namco's fault for poisoning the well with Tempest, of course. My hope is that they've pre-adjusted their expectations to match and we'll see a followup DS title that will hopefully sell better on this game's word-of-mouth, but given that it's Namco there's basically no imaginable idiotic response too stupid to be actually plausible. :/

A 40k, 50% opener for Lost Odyssey is disappointing (in the sense that I'd really like something Mistwalker does to succeed, since I want them not to vanish into the fucking air) but not particularly surprising; it's not going to beat Blue Dragon, but it should put up around 70k in its first week and crawl up into the six-digit range, which I don't think can possibly be less than MS' expectations on the title.
 

Stumpokapow

listen to the mad man
May 21, 2006
17,232
4
0
djtiesto said:
One question about the initial shipment percentage sold... what percentages are considered "good"? Like, is TOI's 50% of the initial shipment sold a good thing or a bad thing?

Rule of thumb:
First day = 25-50% of first week
First week = 25-50% of lifetime.

Exceptions:
- Non-games/casual games go longer
- Front-loaded series like DQ, FF, Musou go shorter. Most RPGs go shorter.
- Launch titles are in their own little world
- Budget re-releases impact things greatly.

The reason why sellthrough is important is that retailers want CONSTANT stock turnover. They have so many games to stock and used games are such a big force in Japan, that they really need to sell through the entire first shipment in the first few weeks. If they don't, they will slash the price ("price collapse" is the witty term used here) very aggressively and not place a second order. No second order is a sure sign your game did not do well.

Examples of overships in the last few years; Tales of the Tempest (<2000 yen within a few weeks of release, failed because it was a piece of shit), Dawn of Mana (<2000 yen within one week, failed because it was a piece of shit), Heroes of Mana (<2000 yen within a few weeks, failed because the Japanese thought it was a piece of shit). It's a Wonderful World and ASH are lesser examples; their price reductions were not quite as steep and their overshipping not quite as bad. Namco-Bandai is, in my experience, the worst company for overshipping or overprojecting. In general, overshipping is a problem that plagues mainly high-profile titles that bomb.

The opposite case, a sellout, can also be bad. Square-Enix has had shipment problems with Dragon Quest: Swords and DQM:J. Taiko Drum Master DS also had shipment problems. Resident Evil: UC has had minor shipment problems. This is bad because as soon as used copies of the game appear, new sales fall dramatically. Used games are a much bigger issue in Japan than North America. If you don't restock during a sellout, you are literally losing new sales by the day.

I'm sure a few of the keeners could probably provide more examples of price collapses and sellouts, as well as expand if you still have any questions.

charlequin said:
My hope is that they've pre-adjusted their expectations to match and we'll see a followup DS title that will hopefully sell better on this game's word-of-mouth, but given that it's Namco there's basically no imaginable idiotic response too stupid to be actually plausible. :/

On one hand: It's Namco. They're ridiculous.

On the other hand: They did say DS is the new main platform for Tales, and they said this after TotT. They are either even dumber than ever, or they genuinely understand that Tales on the DS is not necessarily defined by TotT. I'm sure they understand how bad TotT was, and the comparatively small first shipment pretty much shows they adjusted to this.
 

Magicpaint

Member
May 19, 2005
12,889
2
1,455
United Kingdom
ethelred said:
I'm not so sure of that, actually. Radiant Mythology did 97,156 for its first week. 75k on Innocence's first day... well, I could see it doing more than another 22k. Couldn't you?
Really? Somehow I thought its first week figure was higher than ToI's initial shipment figure o_0 I must be confusing it with something else then.
ethelred said:
No question Tales of Innocence's performance is low compared to any of the real Tales games, but I guess that's pretty expected. Hopefully the game will get good word of mouth and continue to sell well? At least it didn't instabomb first day like Tempest.
Yeah, I guess we can only hope good word of mouth and the holiday bump will help it. I think the shipment figure was a nice cautious move, but I don't expect, or rather, want it to stall around there for its LTD; that'd be very, very disappointing considering the game's quality compared to Tempest.

Though I guess if ToI leaves a good impression on the few that buy it, then that's a good platform for the next DS Tales game to build on. Here's hoping the next one (if there is one, lolz) isn't outsourced and is a real Tales Studio project. >_>
 

ethelred

Member
Dec 19, 2005
16,019
1
1,525
charlequin said:
it's unlikely it'll beat 300k lifetime, which means it's underperforming even Tales of Symphonia GCN.

It's unlikely, but... there's a slight possibility. If most of this order gets sold out quickly enough and retailers actually place a second order, and word of mouth remains good on the game... yeah, it's pretty unlikely. But the possibility exists.

charlequin said:
This is entirely Namco's fault for poisoning the well with Tempest, of course.

Absolutely. That game was such an atrocious decision. A major publisher should never do something like that with its main series. If you're going to try to sell people on the idea that a game is a main series title, you'd better make sure the quality is up to par.

Stumpokapow said:
On the other hand: They did say DS is the new main platform for Tales, and they said this after TotT. They are either even dumber than ever, or they genuinely understand that Tales on the DS is not necessarily defined by TotT. I'm sure they understand how bad TotT was, and the comparatively small first shipment pretty much shows they adjusted to this.

I think this is what they expected. The series producers have all but disowned Tempest, and they provided a lower first shipment, so they have to know the negative impact the game had. They've done a much better job marketing and pushing the game, so hopefully interest will build a bit beyond its first day.

Magicpaint said:
Really? Somehow I thought its first week figure was higher than ToI's initial shipment figure o_0 I must be confusing it with something else then.

Maybe you're thinking of Radiant Mythology's lifetime sales? It did 195k total.

Magicpaint said:
Yeah, I guess we can only hope good word of mouth and the holiday bump will help it. I think the shipment figure was a nice cautious move, but I don't expect, or rather, want it to stall around there for its LTD; that'd be very, very disappointing considering the game's quality compared to Tempest.

The good thing about the lower shipment combined with the better sales is that it'll be easier to sell out the complete shipment, making it a bit more likely retailers will order more if it seems like there will be demand. IF this is going to happen, though, Innocence needs to move just about all of its remaining shipment for its first week (so, it needs to do around 135-140k first week).
 

jarrod

Banned
Jun 6, 2004
25,732
1
0
Oh man, poor Arkanoid DS. :(


Luckyman said:
Wasn't 360 VF5 supposed to outsell PS3-version easily worldwide? It dosen't appear to be even close.
Well, VF5 PS3 only moved about 50k 1st week (about 90k lifetime) in Japan iirc. Honestly, 10k 1st day for 360 in Japan is better than I expected given the circumstances. :lol


Magicpaint said:
No, you'd expect a Tales game to sell a LOT better, but ToI had some harsh cirumstances, and according to shipments figures, it's not a bad performance, but it could be a lot better. It's selling better than Tempest, but much, much worse than everything else in the main series (and worse than RM which was a spin-off).
Uh, RM only moved 20k more for the first week... TOI is definitely outperforming it (and Eternia PSP btw). Not great for Tales or anything (pretty bad compared to the PS2/GC games actually), but still better than any handheld Tales yet.
 

Stumpokapow

listen to the mad man
May 21, 2006
17,232
4
0
jarrod said:
Oh man, poor Arkanoid DS. :(

After Mag Kid, did you really think an unadvertised peripheral niche game would do well? Fuck, Mag Kid was at least first-party so it had the "Nintendo golden touch" going for it.
 
Sep 11, 2007
26,921
1
0
Magicpaint said:
Though I guess if ToI leaves a good impression on the few that buy it, then that's a good platform for the next DS Tales game to build on. Here's hoping the next one (if there is one, lolz) isn't outsourced and is a real Tales Studio project. >_>

Why not? even Scamco could see the problem with ToI was their own fault with a shitty game like Tempest...

They try again with the same or more effort and it wil be a success....,Im pretty sure....
 
12.06.07 PS2 Ryu ga Gotoku (Repackage Version) (PlayStation 2 the Best) Sega 2800
That's Yakuza, right? According to my information, it already had PlayStation 2 the Best rerelease last October at 1890 yen. Now a new one... that's more expensive? They added something to it?
Kyoufu said:
Someone explain to me why games do not have a standard MSRP over in Japan? Its actually confusing as to why they're all priced differently.
We have different tiers of pricing in the US, too. DS games may be 30-40, or 20 if it's something like Brain Age. Most X360/PS3 games are $60, but some are $50 or even a budget $40. Japan just takes it further.
Kyoufu said:
Don't DQ games launch at an absurd price? I remember DQVIII being 80 dollars or so on launch.
9240 yen. Dragon Quest V PS2 was 8190.
Jammy said:
I mean, they are coming out in the thick of the holiday shopping period in Japan. I believe one of the Chocobo games for PSone in Japan was nearly a million seller, if not one.
The first one was. The second one released just a year later and did nowhere near as well. It's been 9 years since that one, though, so it's not like there's a recent trend to follow.
sphinx said:
Out of Dragon quest:swords, I don't remember a third party game that has passed 200K LTD.
None have, that we know of. However, DQ Swords is one of the few Wii exclusive spinoffs from established Japanese franchises we've yet seen; Chocobo could benefit from the same.
Parmenides said:
(almost )5 year-old PS2 would have obliterated Wii&PS3

Week 47 (2004) PS2 108,148

Week 48 (2004) PS2 93,829
That is a completely (dragonquestviii) objective look at (dragonquestviii) the state of how (dragonquestviii) PS3 and Wii fail to match up to (dragonquestviii) an aging PS2.
 

jarrod

Banned
Jun 6, 2004
25,732
1
0
Stumpokapow said:
After Mag Kid, did you really think an unadvertised peripheral niche game would do well? Fuck, Mag Kid was at least first-party so it had the "Nintendo golden touch" going for it.
But it's Arkanoid... who knows what a Magickid is, everyone knows (and loves <3 <3) Arkanoid.

I'm worried for Space Invaders Evolution and Legend of Kage 2 now... are Squeenix and Nintendo the only ones able to capitalize on nostalgia or something? :/
 

Link316

Banned
Jun 8, 2004
2,844
0
0
the Tales series sell better on Sony platforms, hope Namco realizes they made a mistake and moves it back

and I guess I can wait on Arkanoid
 

plagiarize

Banned
May 24, 2006
41,130
1
0
No More Heroes deserves more, but expected.
Uncharted deserves more, but expected.
Silent Hill Zer0 deserves more, but expected.

how you disapoint me this week japan.
 

Koren

Member
Mar 11, 2005
9,345
1
0
jarrod said:
But it's Arkanoid... who knows what a Magickid is, everyone knows (and loves <3 <3) Arkanoid.

I'm worried for Space Invaders Evolution and Legend of Kage 2 now... are Squeenix and Nintendo the only ones able to capitalize on nostalgia or something? :/
Is Arkanoid well known in Japan, though ? I've always though it was mostly a hit in western countries. Space Invaders is probably different.

Though I don't expect them to sell much, in last TGS it was some of the easiest games to try because very few people were queuing for them. That's a pity because Space Invaders is really a wonderful game (I find Arkanoid quite broken, though, even if the peripheral is nice. Far too easy, to begin with).
 

speedpop

Has problems recognising girls
Jun 9, 2004
27,616
0
0
Brisbane, Australia
Link316 said:
the Tales series sell better on Sony platforms, hope Namco realizes they made a mistake and moves it back
This is a silly thing to state. The reason Tales sold decently on Sony platforms was due to the console being the RPG console of that generation. SNES > PSX > PS2 > ??? (although this is quickly turning into DS)

As anyone can attest to.. RPG fans go where the RPGs are - most of the time being led by Square Enix's products first. RPG fans will snap up mostly every RPG that is ever released for that console.
 
Dec 3, 2006
37,576
0
1,260
Lobster said:
RRR2 was released, but we haven't had charts for it. Shovelware doesn't sell as well as we think it does but party games atm are selling.



No, but we had our hopes,dreams,wishes etc..

In America though..under Ubisofts control..we think it will do well..well I think so anyway.


Well at least NMH has the UBI marketing machine behind it in America. Maybe it will get some good exposure. Still don't expect it to light up the sales charts though.
 

ethelred

Member
Dec 19, 2005
16,019
1
1,525
speedpop said:
This is a silly thing to state. The reason Tales sold decently on Sony platforms was due to the console being the RPG console of that generation. SNES > PSX > PS2 > ??? (although this is quickly turning into DS)

Well, he's right, actually. The Tales series has historically always done better on Sony systems. Phantasia's sales were very poor on the SNES (it was the lowest selling game in the series until Tempest came along) -- it was only on the PSX that it hit it off. And Tales of the World on PSP sold more than the subseries ever had on the GB and GBA.

Code:
Phantasia  		SFC  	248,879
Phantasia Remake	PSX 	631,904

Phantasia: Narikiri 1	GB  	154,602 
Narikiri Dungeon 2	GBA 	186,413 
Narikiri Dungeon 3 	GBA 	113,414 
Summoner's Lineage	GBA 	52,102 	
Radiant Mythology	PSP 	195,271

Still, in Innocence's case, there is that extentuating circumstance (hello, Tempest!). It remains to be seen if Innocence can build off its early numbers and pull out some better sales, and it remains to be seen if Namco will be able to further build off Innocence's success with the next DS Tales game.
 

charlequin

Banned
Oct 19, 2005
26,635
1
1,405
ethelred said:
It's unlikely, but... there's a slight possibility. If most of this order gets sold out quickly enough and retailers actually place a second order, and word of mouth remains good on the game... yeah, it's pretty unlikely. But the possibility exists.

The vague glimmer of light for a game like this is that we know that the size of the series' fanbase is more than double the size of the shipment. If the word of mouth was unbelievably strong and every single one of the Tales fans on the fence decided they had to have the game, there wouldn't be enough used copies for all of them. :lol

I think this is what they expected. The series producers have all but disowned Tempest, and they provided a lower first shipment, so they have to know the negative impact the game had. They've done a much better job marketing and pushing the game, so hopefully interest will build a bit beyond its first day.

Yeah, I'm hoping so too. The chances of the game being a success by series standards are nil, but the chances of it still sending a "yes, we want GOOD games on DS" signal (by putting up good day 1->week 1 and week 1->lifetime turnovers) are still decent.

Link316 said:
the Tales series sell better on Sony platforms, hope Namco realizes they made a mistake and moves it back

 

Stumpokapow

listen to the mad man
May 21, 2006
17,232
4
0
jarrod said:
But it's Arkanoid... who knows what a Magickid is, everyone knows (and loves <3 <3) Arkanoid.

:lol

I guess that shows how badly Mag Kid did. It's not "Magickid". It's "Magnet Kid". The whole premise was that you get a tabletop peripheral and moving your DS moves the character. Almost like your DS is simultaneously the mouse you use and the computer monitor.

I'm worried for Space Invaders Evolution and Legend of Kage 2 now... are Squeenix and Nintendo the only ones able to capitalize on nostalgia or something? :/

Legend of Kage 2 is going to bomb SO hard. The brand is no longer known. It doesn't look particularly compelling on its own as a platformer. It's not going to have much advertising. 50k max.

Space Invaders will bomb harder but I'm less concerned because it's not the first or even really 5th or 6th remake and I can't imagine it costed much.

I am sad for Arkanoid, though. The peripheral looked neat. I'll buy it when it's localized (they just announced it for Europe, so NA will get it too)
 

Jirotrom

Member
May 21, 2006
10,799
0
0
38
DeaconKnowledge said:
Well at least NMH has the UBI marketing machine behind it in America. Maybe it will get some good exposure. Still don't expect it to light up the sales charts though.
its coming out in a rough month here, but it might actually help boost its sales coming out next to smash bros and DMC4.
 

jarrod

Banned
Jun 6, 2004
25,732
1
0
ethelred said:
Still, in Innocence's case, there is that extentuating circumstance (hello, Tempest!). It remains to be seen if Innocence can build off its early numbers and pull out some better sales, and it remains to be seen if Namco will be able to further build off Innocence's success with the next DS Tales game.
Even if Innocence gets decent word of mouth, I think the usual DS inventory snafus will probably nerf it's potential. It'll move the initial 150k no problem imo, but beyond that is more up to Namco/Nintendo's highly questionable production and logistics capabilities. :/
 

Jokeropia

Member
May 15, 2006
6,556
0
0
Link316 said:
the Tales series sell better on Sony platforms, hope Namco realizes they made a mistake and moves it back
TOI is outperforming all four PSP Tales games, actually.
 

ethelred

Member
Dec 19, 2005
16,019
1
1,525
Jokeropia said:
TOI is outperforming all four PSP Tales games, actually.

That's a remarkably stupid remark, even from you. Tales of Innocence is neither a port nor a spinoff. It has been fully pushed by Namco as an original main series Tales game. The "next Tales of."

papelnabangka said:
MS paid for LO, right?

Microsoft is the publisher, yes.
 

Sho_Nuff82

Member
Jan 2, 2007
39,630
1
0
Jirotrom said:
its coming out in a rough month here, but it might actually help boost its sales coming out next to smash bros and DMC4.

If NMH sells half of RE4's first month in the US (putting it around 60k) it would be a minor miracle. I don't see why people think this game is going to do significantly better business than Killer 7, the presentation and story is just too esoteric for the average gamer.
 

jarrod

Banned
Jun 6, 2004
25,732
1
0
ethelred said:
That's a remarkably stupid remark, even from you. Tales of Innocence is neither a port nor a spinoff. It has been fully pushed by Namco as an original main series Tales game. The "next Tales of."
It does still have the "outsourced" card playing against it though (only other Tales to share that distinction are Tempest from DIMPS and Legendia from Project Soul). Worth noting at least... I wonder if it'd have done any better were it a 100% Tales Studio project?
 

ethelred

Member
Dec 19, 2005
16,019
1
1,525
jarrod said:
It does still have the "outsourced" card playing against it though (only other Tales to share that distinction are Tempest from DIMPS and Legendia from Project Soul). Worth noting at least...

Then note it. That doesn't justify fallacious comparisons like the one Joker was making and you were endorsing.
 

jarrod

Banned
Jun 6, 2004
25,732
1
0
Sho_Nuff82 said:
If NMH sells half of RE4's first month in the US (putting it around 60k) it would be a minor miracle. I don't see why people think this game is going to do significantly better business than Killer 7, the presentation and story is just too esoteric for the average gamer.
Sure, but the design (ie: Zelda+GTA) is pretty approachable compared to something like Killer 7. That's somewhat important I think... design was what really what held K7 back from wider success (if anything it's aesthetic and narrative were the major selling points, not a hinderance).
 

jarrod

Banned
Jun 6, 2004
25,732
1
0
ethelred said:
Then note it. That doesn't justify fallacious comparisons like the one Joker was making and you were endorsing.
I wasn't endorsing, just correcting. Anyway, I wonder how Alfa Systems feels about their best performing Tales game to date?
 

Grecco

Member
May 3, 2006
21,525
0
0
Sho_Nuff82 said:
If NMH sells half of RE4's first month in the US (putting it around 60k) it would be a minor miracle. I don't see why people think this game is going to do significantly better business than Killer 7, the presentation and story is just too esoteric for the average gamer.


Because its more of a game than K7 was.
 

Jokeropia

Member
May 15, 2006
6,556
0
0
ethelred said:
That's a remarkably stupid remark, even from you. Tales of Innocence is neither a port nor a spinoff. It has been fully pushed by Namco as an original main series Tales game. The "next Tales of."
If none of the PSP games are applicable for comparison he should really have said "Sony consoles", but more importantly TOI had no possible chance to outperform any of the PS2 games given the launch shipment.

I think the ad-hominem was uncalled for, btw.
 
Apr 17, 2005
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JoshuaJSlone said:
That's Yakuza, right? According to my information, it already had PlayStation 2 the Best rerelease last October at 1890 yen. Now a new one... that's more expensive? They added something to it?
Its the same price (1890Y). I wonder why this 'restock' now, they already sold 450k of that over many weeks, I guess they expect the budget release of the sequel to have some following so new users pick up both of get the first one after playing the second...its weird anyway.
 

ethelred

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Dec 19, 2005
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Jokeropia said:
If none of the PSP games are applicable for comparison he should really have said "Sony consoles", but more importantly TOI had no possible chance to outperform any of the PS2 games given the launch shipment.

I think the ad-hominem was uncalled for, btw.

It wasn't an ad hominem. An ad hominem is an attempt to refute a remark through a personal attack. Now, hypothetically, if I had said, "Your point is wrong because you're a fucking tool," that would be an ad hominem. On the other hand, if I were to say, "Your argument is wrong because of logical reasons X, Y, and Z, and oh yeah, that's really stupid," that's not an ad hominem.