Media Create Sales: Aug 3 - 9, 2009

ccbfan

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Segata Sanshiro said:
oh man why didn't anyone think of this? clearly this type of situation is completely consequence-free for Capcom!

The funny thing is that it probably will be pretty minimal for Capcom.

The next hit from Capcom is going to be MHP3 and with the legs showing of MH3. Capcom's probably trying to get that out ASAP.

MHP3 is gonna destroy Japan. A special edition MHP3 PSP3000/PSPGO is gonna destroy Japan. Retailers are gonna be asking for tons of them. They mostly forget/forgive any of this after that and want to be buddy buddy with Capcom again.

What is will more likely hurt though is core game shipments on the Wii. Retailers are already extremely conservative with Wii core game shipments. This is not gonna help.
 

cvxfreak

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The amusing part is that Capcom probably prepped a huge shipment partially in response to how fast RE4 Wii, Umbrella Chronicles and the past Monster Hunters blew through their initial shipments.

Looks like Capcom needs to be somewhere in the middle. A 900K shipment instead, perhaps?

The Darkside Chronicles is up next for Capcom. I don't expect it to blow through and sell out, but it does have the potential to do better than UC.
 

schuelma

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ccbfan said:
What is will more likely hurt though is core game shipments on the Wii. Retailers are already extremely conservative with Wii core game shipments. This is not gonna help.

Oh come on. Yes, both sides screwed up. Yes, it looks like a bigger deal because the absolute scale of game and shipment was so high. But its not a case where we have a 40% sell through rate or something like that- we have an overall sell through rate of about 70% after nine days. That's not horrid or anything. It looks worse because the shipment itself was so high, but I think we're getting a bit carried away.
 

Cosmonaut X

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cvxfreak said:
Looks like Capcom needs to be somewhere in the middle. A 900K shipment instead, perhaps?
I think that something like an 800-900k initial shipment with a leaning more toward the CCPro bundles might have been better.

Doea anyone have a note of the SKU make-up of the shipments of Monster Hunter G (standalone/starter pack) and Tri (standalone/console bundle/CCPro bundle)? I'm sure they were floating around, and it would be interesting to see if the percentage of the shipment made up of controller bundles increased from MHG to Tri, and if so by how much.
 

cvxfreak

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schuelma said:
Oh come on. Yes, both sides screwed up. Yes, it looks like a bigger deal because the absolute scale of game and shipment was so high. But its not a case where we have a 40% sell through rate or something like that- we have an overall sell through rate of about 70% after nine days. That's not horrid or anything. It looks worse because the shipment itself was so high, but I think we're getting a bit carried away.
I'm curious to see how Nintendo addresses this in the future. I think this is the ultimate proof that perhaps not including a traditional controller with every Wii system in Japan has come back to haunt them, because it ends up complicating game shipments and SKU management. Can you imagine if traditional buttons had been a DS add-on? Poor comparison, but perhaps we'll see how well motion games on the PS3 and 360 sell when they have to bundle certain peripherals with certain SKUs.

If the standalone is the only issue with Tri's shipments, then none of it would have happened if every system already came with a regular controller. If they had one SKU at launch, normal priced, then we can better tell how the game would be received, and I doubt we would be having this price collapse.

I never mentioned this before, but I kind of found the heavy push of MH3 with the classic controller pro to be somewhat counterintuitive to pushing the Wii's image in Japan. Everyone knows what the Wii is supposed to do, yet Nintendo wanted gamers to feel that it could excel in traditional controls as well. It's as if Nintendo saw that its Wii strategy had hit a wall and tried to shove this controller down everyone's throats. The controller bundle, while the most popular, does give one a sense of PSP-on-TV-screen experience. I think they could have made better use of the Wiimote controls during promotion.

It's nice that Tri is proving to be a good lesson for everyone on all fronts, from its 2007 announcement up until now. No one's been able to perfectly call this game, and I think the surprises won't stop just yet.
 

schuelma

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cvxfreak said:
I'm curious to see how Nintendo addresses this in the future. I think this is the ultimate proof that perhaps not including a traditional controller with every Wii system in Japan has come back to haunt them, because it ends up complicating game shipments and SKU management. Can you imagine if traditional buttons had been a DS add-on? Poor comparison, but perhaps we'll see how well motion games on the PS3 and 360 sell when they have to bundle certain peripherals with certain SKUs.
.

That's a good point I really hadn't considered. I know that Samurai Warriors 3 is also getting a Pro bundle..hell maybe they should make it a mandatory pack in like Wii Play with the Wiimote.
 

cvxfreak

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schuelma said:
That's a good point I really hadn't considered. I know that Samurai Warriors 3 is also getting a Pro bundle..hell maybe they should make it a mandatory pack in like Wii Play with the Wiimote.
If I were Iwata (and hell, don't we all wish), I would reboot the Wii in Japan from this fall. Pack in all the essentials needed from the get go, so a Classic Controller (Pro or original, I don't think it matters too much) and a Wii Motion+ with every package. They don't have to drop the price and probably wouldn't, but I think if Nintendo's interested in finally bringing all the different segments of gamers onto its platform, it needs to make this move. The same goes for the other two when their motion technology hits.
 

schuelma

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cvxfreak said:
If I were Iwata (and hell, don't we all wish), I would reboot the Wii in Japan from this fall. Pack in all the essentials needed from the get go, so a Classic Controller (Pro or original, I don't think it matters too much) and a Wii Motion+ with every package. They don't have to drop the price and probably wouldn't, but I think if Nintendo's interested in finally bringing all the different segments of gamers onto its platform, it needs to make this move. The same goes for the other two when their motion technology hits.

Yeah. Right now you have this weird split with Nintendo in Japan. On one hand you're aggressively trying to push yet another non-traditional motion add-on (and you're quite successful at it), and on the other hand you're pushing third party software and a standard controller (Tri and SW3) which is blatantly trying to capture the traditional gaming audience. I don't know..it just feels like those two strategies might work against each other if not unified.
 

Datschge

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cvxfreak said:
I never mentioned this before, but I kind of found the heavy push of MH3 with the classic controller pro to be somewhat counterintuitive to pushing the Wii's image in Japan.
What makes Wii Play with Wiimote, WiiFit with WiiBoard, Mario Kart Wii with wheel etc.etc. different from MH3 with CC Pro? If at all MH3 once more proves that many Wii customers see additional value in pack ins.
 

Cosmonaut X

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cvxfreak said:
If I were Iwata (and hell, don't we all wish), I would reboot the Wii in Japan from this fall. Pack in all the essentials needed from the get go, so a Classic Controller (Pro or original, I don't think it matters too much) and a Wii Motion+ with every package. They don't have to drop the price and probably wouldn't, but I think if Nintendo's interested in finally bringing all the different segments of gamers onto its platform, it needs to make this move. The same goes for the other two when their motion technology hits.
Mm. I think they could certainly afford to at this stage, and I think it is important for them to make that final push for the Wii being a system for everyone. A bundle like the one you suggested:

Wii
Remote + nunchuk + MotionPlus
Classic Controller Pro

...would be ideal, and would present the purchaser with everything they need to get going. Chuck all of that in, keep the price flat at its current level and perhaps drop the pricing on the standard Wii package currently available.

I think there is a large chunk of the gaming audience out there that just doesn't appreciate the Remote setup, or is reluctant to jump in. Providing them with an out-of-the-box alternative might be a good way of appealing to them, coupled with a series of games like MHTri, SB3 and SW3 that offered more traditional styles of play and control.
 

RyuKanSan

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Who really thought the standalone version would really sell that many copies. I wonder if they learned anything with the MHP2G and how those that were bundled sold really well.
 

cvxfreak

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Datschge said:
What makes Wii Play with Wiimote, WiiFit with WiiBoard, Mario Kart Wii with wheel etc.etc. different from MH3 with CC Pro? If at all MH3 once more proves that many Wii customers see additional value in pack ins.
Those games only had one SKU, and that was with the accessory. It's not like Nintendo could sell Wii Fit without the balance board.

People commonly accuse Wii Play of selling on the merit of being a $10 game with a Wii Remote packed in for an additional $40.

Regarding your post though, I don't disagree with your sentiment. MH3 proved that there's value to the bundle. But now the standalone got screwed as a result.
 

Spiegel

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RyuKanSan said:
Who really thought the standalone version would really sell that many copies. I wonder if they learned anything with the MHP2G and how those that were bundled sold really well.
MHP2G was bundled?
 

iidesuyo

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The game didn't make make it into the Top 30, but Kororinpa II for Wii sold 640 units first week (according to Gamefront). That's not much, does anyone know how large the shipment was?
 

Datschge

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cvxfreak said:
Those games only had one SKU, and that was with the accessory. It's not like Nintendo could sell Wii Fit without the balance board.
Wii Fit plus will and will most likely sell less than the combined SKU as well, unless Nintendo manages to do some genius marketing reaching all the existing balance board owners.

cvxfreak said:
Regarding your post though, I don't disagree with your sentiment. MH3 proved that there's value to the bundle. But now the standalone got screwed as a result.
I thought the MHG Wii sales already pointed to this to happen. I guess (some? few?) retailers didn't take note and are getting burned for this now.
 

cvxfreak

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Datschge said:
Wii Fit plus will and will most likely sell less than the combined SKU as well, unless Nintendo manages to do some genius marketing reaching all the existing balance board owners..
Wii Fit Plus is ¥2000. They're preempted Bic on the price collapses. :D
 

Road

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schuelma said:
Oh come on. Yes, both sides screwed up. Yes, it looks like a bigger deal because lol Wii cant sell 3rd party hardcore games lol.
Just a hunch.



Random LTD from Dengeki:

[Wii] Mario Kart Wii: 2,333,000.
[Wii] Super Smash Bros. Brawl: 1,938,000.
[Wii] Dragon Quest Swords: The Masked Queen and the Tower of Mirrors: 560,000.
[PS2] Monster Hunter 2: 719,000.
 

Datschge

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Spiegel said:
Difference is MHG can only be played with a CC.
Doesn't make any difference to the point that pack ins are seen as added value.
cvxfreak said:
Wii Fit Plus is ¥2000. They're preempted Bic on the price collapses. :D
Yea, there's not much price collapsing possible anymore. =P Will be interesting to see if both SKUs get tracked separately, and if so how they compare.
 

test_account

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Datschge said:
Doesn't make any difference to the point that pack ins are seen as added value.
Didnt the MHG + CC bundle also include a limited/special CC that was not sold seperately as well, while the MH3 + CC bundle includes a "standard" (or what i shall call it) CC Pro controller that also can be bought seperately? If this is the case, then i can see that MHG + CC bundle were more sought after because of the collecting value of this special CC.

EDIT: The MH3 + CC Pro bundle also has a collection value to it though, but at least the MHG + CC bundle had a special CC controller that might make it a bit more "collectible" (or what i shall say) and sought after, at least in my opinion :)

EDIT 2: For those who havnt seen the special CC that were included with the MHG + CC bundle, here is a picture of it:

http://www.everyjoe.com/files/294/2009/01/mhg_classic_controller-300x222.jpg
 

BattleMonkey

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Datschge said:
Doesn't make any difference to the point that pack ins are seen as added value.
It also doesn't mean that if more of the bundle was available it would have magically sold a ton more. For all we know they would have been stuck with a bunch of unsold bundles. Problem with all packins and limited deals is it can bite you in the ass, and retailers themselves are probably scared to order too many. People just making assumptions on the lacking sales.
 

cvxfreak

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BattleMonkey said:
It also doesn't mean that if more of the bundle was available it would have magically sold a ton more. For all we know they would have been stuck with a bunch of unsold bundles. Problem with all packins and limited deals is it can bite you in the ass, and retailers themselves are probably scared to order too many. People just making assumptions on the lacking sales.
There's no question that everyone who wanted MH3 in the first nine days got it. The game got a 1 Million shipment, so there certainly was no shortage. They've also penetrated 70% of the initial shipment relatively quickly, so it's not as if sales are "lacking" either. This isn't FF, DQ or Pokemon. The issue is that they've dropped the price of the standalone and that SKU only. That gives us reason to assume that that particular SKU isn't selling. If the game were a disappointment across the board, then we would have seen the bundle pricing corrected too. But that hasn't happened yet. If it does though...
 

Jokeropia

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Tomodachi Collection has now increased in weekly sales for four straight weeks.

57K -> 61K -> 74K -> 82K -> 91K
 
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cvxfreak said:
There's no question that everyone who wanted MH3 in the first nine days got it. The game got a 1 Million shipment, so there certainly was no shortage. They've also penetrated 70% of the initial shipment relatively quickly, so it's not as if sales are "lacking" either. This isn't FF, DQ or Pokemon. The issue is that they've dropped the price of the standalone and that SKU only. That gives us reason to assume that that particular SKU isn't selling. If the game were a disappointment across the board, then we would have seen the bundle pricing corrected too. But that hasn't happened yet. If it does though...
Still, the fact that a game that moved hardware to a decent degree ended up being discounted within weeks of its launch seems to point to something unhealthy in the games industry.
 

cvxfreak

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lowlylowlycook said:
Still, the fact that a game that moved hardware to a decent degree ended up being discounted within weeks of its launch seems to point to something unhealthy in the games industry.
And what exactly would that be? Understanding what caused this certainly would help to prevent this in the future. It's been looked at from so many angles already, yet "the game's a bomb" is the least satisfying and useful answer.
 

Vinci

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Jokeropia said:
Tomodachi Collection has now increased in weekly sales for four straight weeks.

57K -> 61K -> 74K -> 82K -> 91K
Still amazes me how long it took for Nintendo to take more advantage of the Miis. That seemed like an obvious choice from the beginning, nevermind so many other potential uses.
 

ksamedi

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Is it me or do Japanese retailers seem to slash the price pretty rapidly? In Europe, it takes at least a month of bad sell trough before the prices get slashed.
 

cw_sasuke

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ksamedi said:
Is it me or do Japanese retailers seem to slash the price pretty rapidly? In Europe, it takes at least a month of bad sell trough before the prices get slashed.

Seems to be usual in Japan, i remember how they slashed mario galaxys price in the 2nd week or so and some retailers got bitchslapped by nintendo because of it...
 

Zeni

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Jokeropia said:
Tomodachi Collection has now increased in weekly sales for four straight weeks.

57K -> 61K -> 74K -> 82K -> 91K
Next multiplatinum title from Nintendo?
 

slaughterking

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ksamedi said:
Is it me or do Japanese retailers seem to slash the price pretty rapidly? In Europe, it takes at least a month of bad sell trough before the prices get slashed.
There was a time when UK retailers would slash the price even before the release of some games. That was awesome. :I
 
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ksamedi said:
Is it me or do Japanese retailers seem to slash the price pretty rapidly? In Europe, it takes at least a month of bad sell trough before the prices get slashed.
As I understand it European retailers usually have some sort of buyback protection in place. Japanese retailers do not, so if a game undersells, it's the retailers who have to deal with the toxic stock. Or so I've heard.
 

Urban Scholar

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I normally don't thread into too much but I have a question.

Are those retail slashes and what not with MH3 a result of golden week in Japan? Is it safe to assume this and the sales #s are the norm as people are probably just chilling away from home and gaming as a result? Then again my whole vacation question could be wrong, just throwing it out there.
 

charlequin

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ksamedi said:
Is it me or do Japanese retailers seem to slash the price pretty rapidly?
The Japanese sales cycle is dramatically faster than in the US. People buy games day-one more often, play them faster, and turn them around into used games almost immediately, in part because the incentives are there to turn around and resell copies quickly, so already two or three weeks out you can be almost certain to find pristine used copies of any big game in Japan while generally it takes a while for most such titles to trickle out in the US.
 

test_account

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Urban Scholar said:
I normally don't thread into too much but I have a question.

Are those retail slashes and what not with MH3 a result of golden week in Japan? Is it safe to assume this and the sales #s are the norm as people are probably just chilling away from home and gaming as a result? Then again my whole vacation question could be wrong, just throwing it out there.
I dont think that the holiday "Golden Week" has been in Japan recently (i think golden week is in March or April or something), but i think there have been another holiday in Japan recently. I dont know if this holiday has something to do with the MH3 pricedrop in some stores though, since i am under the impression that game sales usually increases when there is a holiday in Japan.
 

Mr Killemgood

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test_account said:
I dont think that the holiday "Golden Week" has been in Japan recently (i think golden week is in March or April or something), but i think there have been another holiday in Japan recently. I dont know if this holiday has something to do with the MH3 pricedrop in some stores though, since i am under the impression that game sales usually increases when there is a holiday in Japan.
Obon.
 

test_account

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Mr Killemgood said:
Ye, that was the name :) I couldnt remember what this holiday was called, thanks for mentioning it! :)

EDIT: Regarding what i said in my previous post that game sales usually goes up in Japan when there is a holiday, maybe there is an expection where gaming sales goes down during a holiday?
 

Xiaoki

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Expect Monster Hunter Portable 3 to be announced this fall.

The sales of MH3 would be great if it was only preceded by MH2 Dos. You dont come off the incredible success of MHP2, MHP2G and MHP2G The Best and then expect the Wii version to sell conservatively.

Guess this cements Monster Hunter as a PSP franchise.
 

Shambles

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Am I the only one that is blown away by the PS2 being able to place 3 titles in the top 10 and to control the number 1 spot? I know the customer base is huge but I didn't think it was that active still. Especially against MH and DQ in non first weeks.
 
Xiaoki said:
Expect Monster Hunter Portable 3 to be announced this fall.

The sales of MH3 would be great if it was only preceded by MH2 Dos. You dont come off the incredible success of MHP2, MHP2G and MHP2G The Best and then expect the Wii version to sell conservatively.

Guess this cements Monster Hunter as a PSP franchise.
When was it ever going to leave the PSP?
 

Sohter.Nura

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manueldelalas said:
I think that although Graces will not do as good as the PSP spinoffs in Japan, it has a chance to sell better worldwide on the Wii than on the PSP...

Kind of the same audience that bought Symphonia on the GCN (best selling Tales game ever), and I've seen many people buying the sequel on the Wii (I read somewhere it sold as well as Vesperia).
I heard the first month numbers were actually better than Vesperia :eek: not sure about LTD.

On the other hand, I don't know how to put this, but Symphonia numbers will never be reached by Tales of Series anymore, it was a fluke of some sort :B
 

evilromero

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Really lucky timing. It was the first 3D Tales, on a RPG starved Nintendo console, with a decent push supported by Nintendo.
Exactly. And I won't make that mistake again.
 

DangerousDave

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Not reaching the million is not the same as bombing. Don't forget that MH3 is the fastest-selling third party on Wii. Probably Capcom expected more units sold, but is still a very good number.