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Opinion Clickbait Analysis Merit-based, anti-flame reaction to Halo Infinite trailer.

Tschumi

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I wanted to try and give my thoughts on the Halo Infinite trailer while side stepping the usual console warring shorthand. If the mods think this thread has turned out biased, they can go ahead and shut it down - i just wanna try to set aside all of the [gaming] politics and talk to the merits of that video. I was watching through it in another analysis video and caught myself having a few positive things to say about it as it unfolded.

First off, i am aware of the problems, I'm going to try to ignore them as much a possible. I've owned, in my life, a PS 1, GameCube, OG xBox, 360 and a PS3, excluding hand helds. At the moment I'm more of a Sony guy because I'm loving the build quality and high mindedness of my Vita 1000. I played Halo 1 obsessively in co-op, but have played little, if any, of the later titles. Any criticisms i make have been made in the context of the wider Halo series, i hope.

XBox fans, I'm not one of you, though i have been in the past. Please accept my input!

I invite any posters to share in my spirit of setting aside the qualms and trying to communicate.

Okay, getting in to it:

>> I like this sidekick dude. I liked how they're trying to mix up what I've often seem as a pretty awed relationship most characters seem to hold for MC. He alludes to some very recent brush with destruction - is that going to form the prologue of the game proper? Could be a fun parallel to the Pillar of Autumn opening section of OG Halo.



>> MC's suit looks nice, backlit a bit as he stands in the doorway to the shuttle, i like the strapping and such on the pilot's kit, too. The shadows across the pilot's face look nice and subtle when he turns away from MC.



>> The HUD is sleek. The world looks pretty cool when it is naturalistic. Movements do indeed seem nice and smooth. Combat is pretty satisfying to watch at range - whoever is playing it scores almost as many headshots as i do - and i do like the parts where MC grapples himself up to an enemy. Crunchy. Killing de-shielded/weakened elites or brutes with a single melee to the front must be a more recent addition to the series, or maybe they're not playing on legendary/its equivalent.



>> Vehicle movement looks pretty much the same as OG halo, which i can appreciate. Those warthogs were pretty perfect co-op videogame vehicles.



> Grunts also seem to be nice iterations of the series staple.




>> There seems to be good verticality in the enemy camps. One feels like there could be some fun to be had here, maybe even some genuine challenge if the high ground turns it to be meaningfully advantageous.

>> Brutes as targets make an interesting mix of elusiveness and bulk (and deadpan, if i may briefly reference the meme), the new variation in grenade types (sticky grenade? On the deployed shield?) seems to be continued from earlier games.. it seems like a nice addition.




>> I really could care less about 4k but the cinematic (i think? Maybe in game?) of the sidekick pilot sinking to his knees looks pretty detailed and rich. Also the scene where MC and sidekick are looking at the Halo hologram.




>> I'm glad they're trying to have an antagonist in the form of this.. brute general who seems to be addressing the player at the end. Has it become a staple of the series to have a competing alpha personality directing the narrative? Last time i checked was The Arbiter...

>> The way he talks actually leads me to suspect that he might be set up as a viable charismatic counter to MC for an opposing faction in an online game.



NOTE: The images are screengrabs from my phone, so nothing special, resolution wise. Maybe that's appropriate.

Thoughts:

>> I'm assuming this is going to be a multiplayer game - and a pretty crowded one at that. If that's the case then maybe the 4k, 60fps thing is a bit more impressive again - though maybe there's an individual internet connection bottleneck there.

>> The decentralised, unspecific plot necessitated by having a few dozen/score/hundred MCs fighting around a map does seem like a bit of a dilution of the narrative.

>> If it is multiplayer, i think it could be pretty fun. This wouldn't be the first time that a Halo game really shone in co-op, heck the series was born in the fires of co-op, so having the added element of teamwork on top of what we've seen in this trailer feels like it could be great fun.

>> They say they're trying to go back to an OG Halo aesthetic, and if that's indeed the case then i think I'm picking up on it and i appreciate it. I think the key priorities of a Halo game might be things like co-op, smoothness and crunchy combat, so in these respects i think the game has some potential to be a few people's favourite title.

>> Another pillar of the Burden of Halo, so to speak, is an obligation to push graphical boundaries. At least, it should be, if they're hearkening back to OG Halo. I think the games looks to be in the right track to looking pretty good.. if indeed they are still pushing. Maybe not quite there yet.

That's that. I tried to open my mind and look for things to be excited about and i came up with the above. This is an ode to my idiosyncratic relationship with Halo, not intended to provide flame fodder. Thanks for your time!
 

Golgo 13

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I will say this — it was a poor showing for the unveiling of a next-generation console, and it’s flagship title. I think that’s what really has upset people. It was incredibly underwhelming, graphically.

However, I still think the game itself could be fun — I like the idea of the open-world, the grappling hook is somewhat interesting. I’m willing to give it a chance, but they should’ve done a better job showing it for the first time.
 
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Stuart360

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Yeah i think a lot of the negative reaction is because its Halo, the flagship game. If it had been Grounded or something then the reaction would of been different. People on the whole just expected more from Halo.

Having said that, i still think the game looks fine. I'm honestly surprised by the reaction, to an extent. I even got called 'gay' for saying i thought the game looked fine, in another thread, and no action by the mods so i guess my view is def in the minority lol.
 

Kimahri

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The reactions to this were asinine. Calling it a broken mess that needs fixing because you aren't impressed with the graphics is everything wrong with gaming imo.

My immediate reaction was that it looked hella fun, and I can't wait to play it. Looks like Halo back to form, and I'll be there day one.
 

Bogroll

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I'm looking forward to it way more than Ratchet and Clank even though that impressed me a bit more graphically.
 

John254

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Yeah i think a lot of the negative reaction is because its Halo, the flagship game. If it had been Grounded or something then the reaction would of been different. People on the whole just expected more from Halo.

Having said that, i still think the game looks fine. I'm honestly surprised by the reaction, to an extent. I even got called 'gay' for saying i thought the game looked fine, in another thread, and no action by the mods so i guess my view is def in the minority lol.
I think that negative reactions was primarily because people thought, that this is "next-gen game" and expected next-gen visuals. And Xbox execs didn't help it either with "most powerful console"

If 343 revealed this game last year (gameplay portions) and said "this is game for Xbox One X but it will also came optimised for Xbox Series X" people would accept it way better.

I'm looking forward for MP. Halo 5 was my mainly MP game for a long time, but it is time to let it go. We will see how will that go...
 

makaveli60

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Honestly, I was like okay this is what I expect a cross-gen game that's open world, designed around the og XBO and is running 4K60 on nextgen. Nothing more, nothing less.
This is the price for 60 fps and having a game designed around a weaker console. That's why I have to say again: fuck Lockhart and MS for botching nextgen (again). I really, really, really hope that Lockhart won't be released in the end.
 
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Nemesis Prime

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I just hope it does something incredibly unique with the multiplayer. Outside of the classic 4v4 game modes id like to see a big open world online game type. Maybe something BR like, just looking at the halo ring and the openness gives me BR vibes and I could see halo doing something perfect like that. It needs to try and be unique from the competition, warzone did a good job by adding contracts and other things you could do. Halo needs to implement some warzone features into a BR

the graphics are very disappointing but at the end of the day what matters is the multiplayer, and if this is accessible with xbox one to Xbox series X, and low and high end PCs, they could have a very successful game on their hands.
 

jigglet

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I was upset until i found out it was 120fps.

Most current gen games can't even run at 4k 60fps on a 2080ti. I'm not sure what else a 4k 120fps game is supposed to look like on a GPU roughly equivalent to a 2080. It needs polish, but the 120fps explained a lot of things for me.
 

geordiemp

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I was upset until i found out it was 120fps.

Most current gen games can't even run at 4k 60fps on a 2080ti. I'm not sure what else a 4k 120fps game is supposed to look like on a GPU roughly equivalent to a 2080. It needs polish, but the 120fps explained a lot of things for me.

Is it native 4k120 on the campaign, or is it something else, could be 120 on some of the older multiplayer maps. WE dont know yet.

The 120 FPS is saying to me we are not going to fix the visuals in any great way for the XSX version.
 
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LeftThumbstick

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Is it native 4k120 on the campaign, or is it something else, could be 120 on some of the older multiplayer maps. WE dont know yet.

The 120 FPS is saying to me we are not going to fix the visuals in any great way for the XSX version.
It’s either 120fps and no backwards compatibility or fancier graphics, choose one.

For me, it’s good enough. Especially the fact that it’s going to be running 120fps, which people seem to be glossing on a console.

can someone else show me an FPS that does graphics like those, multiple players on the map at once, explosions, effects and more going off on a console? I’ll wait on the links being posted, which they won’t be.

The definition of “next gen” is so bloody vague yet people use it as some sort of imaginary benchmark to hate something before it’s even out. Next gen to me is 120fps, games being cross-plat among multiple generations old or new and being able to play with them and share the same content along with cross-gen progression and saving.

I think people will appreciate the 120hz gameplay over a tad more refined graphics or lighting.
 

BlackTron

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TBH it has nothing to do with console warring, especially for an FPS game I would play on PC anyway (just as I did Halo 1).

It just looks very lackluster. Nice that you're trying to be positive, but I disagree with most of these points. The warthog looks and sounds all wrong. I didn't like the pilot dude very much. The whole thing comes off an an inauthentic, dollar store Halo to me.

343 has failed this franchise, and Microsoft, spectacularly. I love(d) Halo, so I wish they would give it to someone else already.
 

Bernd Lauert

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Honestly, I was like okay this is what I expect a cross-gen game that's open world, designed around the og XBO and is running 4K60 on nextgen. Nothing more, nothing less.
This is the price for 60 fps and having a game designed around a weaker console. That's why I have to say again: fuck Lockhart and MS for botching nextgen (again). I really, really, really hope that Lockhart won't be released in the end.

You are conflating things. Yes, the Xbone is holding this game back. No, Lockhart has nothing to do with it. Lockhart is literally Anaconda with a cut down GPU. It will run all the next-gen exclusive games with no problems, just at a lower resolution.
 

Aladin

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There is no need for native 4k resolution anymore, They should have targeted 1080p60fps on series x, and shown off their DLSS alternative. That would have blown our expectation like the unreal demo.

The issue with a blockbuster franchise is that, if an average game does good, its enough sales to not bring pressure on the management. I am halo fan, and i am saying the management at 343i is lethargic. This is not phil's fault.
 

makaveli60

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You are conflating things. Yes, the Xbone is holding this game back. No, Lockhart has nothing to do with it. Lockhart is literally Anaconda with a cut down GPU. It will run all the next-gen exclusive games with no problems, just at a lower resolution.
You don't get the point, I'm not even talking about Halo, just in general for nextgen games. Game designed around 12TF GPU upscaled from 1440p to 4k for example VS a game that is designed around Lockhart's 4TF GPU which will have a bigger resolution on the X and done. Do you understand the difference?
 
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DarkLite

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Honestly, I was like okay this is what I expect a cross-gen game that's open world, designed around the og XBO and is running 4K60 on nextgen. Nothing more, nothing less.
This is the price for 60 fps and having a game designed around a weaker console. That's why I have to say again: fuck Lockhart and MS for botching nextgen (again). I really, really, really hope that Lockhart won't be released in the end.

This game is cross-gen, also releasing on Xbox One and it's by far the best looking gameplay we have seen at all:






And yes, this is all gameplay and it's crossgen. And please don't give me that crap, it's a simulator or it's from far above lol it is in fact easily the best looking gameplay we have seen.
 

Stuart360

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Flight Simulator maybe be cross gen but the base XB1 version wont come close to the PC version. In fact i wouldnt be surprised if it ends up XSX only. Phil mentioned XSX version in that interview, but didnt mention XB1.
 

DarkLite

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Flight Simulator maybe be cross gen but the base XB1 version wont come close to the PC version. In fact i wouldnt be surprised if it ends up XSX only. Phil mentioned XSX version in that interview, but didnt mention XB1.

this wasn't the point. he was saying that cross-gen games will not make good looking, true nextgen looking games possible, yet the only true nextgen gameplay we have seen so far that is truly mindblowing is from a crossgen game.

Also, Kena, one of the best looking games at the PS5 event is also crossgen!
 

Ar¢tos

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I find the pilot bizarre. His facial expressions are really exaggerated.
They should tone it down a bit for the release.
 

makaveli60

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this wasn't the point. he was saying that cross-gen games will not make good looking, true nextgen looking games possible, yet the only true nextgen gameplay we have seen so far that is truly mindblowing is from a crossgen game.

Also, Kena, one of the best looking games at the PS5 event is also crossgen!
Yet it would look even better if it was designed only around 12TF. I'm sorry but your argument is invalid against mine.
 

Flintty

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XBox fans, I'm not one of you, though i have been in the past. Please accept my input!

No.
Why should long time Halo fans care about what a random Sony dude on the internet has to say, especially when it could have been said in any of the other gazillion Halo threads. Why is your opinion so special? I don’t need you to tell me one of my favourite game series’ isn’t as bad as people say, I can make that determination myself. Your thread is just inviting more console warz.

P.S. It’s ‘couldn’t care less’.
 
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CrysisFreak

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This game is cross-gen, also releasing on Xbox One and it's by far the best looking gameplay we have seen at all:






And yes, this is all gameplay and it's crossgen. And please don't give me that crap, it's a simulator or it's from far above lol it is in fact easily the best looking gameplay we have seen.
It looks awesome but can we stop bringing it up?
It's just data science and AI using satellite images (and other data tbf) to create good looking backdrops that you do not interact with (except for the storms).
The game is also not interesting for action game lovers, which many of us are, it's a simulator.
 

Tschumi

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You raise a good point, but I've got a bit of a counter point to it...

YouTube dude Cherno seems to get a good run on NeoGAF, so i think it's alright to reference him here as a former developer with EA...

In his PlayStation deep dive (or was it reveal?) Video, he says a fundamental difference between pc game and console game development is that, on PC, games need to be made scalable to different computer power levels. Mid, high, ultra, whatever.

He then says consoles are in a way easier for game designers to express themselves with, since they have set performance parameters to design to. He figures that PC game designers might feel bad that their artistic vision has to be diluted or somehow altered from their vision.

Anyways, just a thought~ maybe XSX bringing the idea of scalability into the realm of consoles is actually a less-than-optional way to be treating their developers?
 
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MastaKiiLA

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It was disappointing in that the game was too early to show off to the public. It looked like what you'd read about in EGM, Next Gen, or Gamefan, back in the day, about the behind-closed-doors E3 demos they would see that were visually choppy, but really intended to showcase gameplay mechanics. However, this wasn't a private showing, it was a public one. And it came a month after Sony's showcase, where they presented trailers of games where they selected gameplay/cutscene segments that were able to better showcase what the final product should look like.

The thing is, they had a month to prepare, with the knowledge of where the competition set the bar, and they blew it. I'm not sure who was responsible for putting the show together, but they're probably not in Spencer's favor at this moment. Either they didn't receive the trailers they were hoping to have, or they expected the Halo walkthrough to be in a more advanced state. I don't know. Whatever happened, it was a misstep. They shouldn't have made a fuss about showing more gameplay, after their previous show, because they kinda pigeonholed themselves into having to show something being played, and chose a game with high expectations, but a low state of readiness. Someone dun goofed.
 
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SLoWMoTIoN

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The reactions to this were asinine. Calling it a broken mess that needs fixing because you aren't impressed with the graphics is everything wrong with gaming imo.
A flagship title running on a PC, were people suppose to expect any less?
 

Kimahri

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A flagship title running on a PC, were people suppose to expect any less?

I don't care about that. I care about entertainment value. Halo Infinite looks like something I'll enjoy playing. All this whining about graphics is insignificant noise to me.
 
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Musky_Cheese

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I thought the lighting was nice my first watch. IDK if I knew it was real time or not. But I don't agree with the lighting being the reason things look off. Imo, it is the lack of wear.

This is supposed to be a place and time that the UNSC lost, the Banished won. But armor worn by the Banished looks brand new. The AR used by Chief as well as the Warthog driven by Chief looks brand new. Even the crashed UNSC ship Chief passes looks brand new, and it crashed on the Halo.

That is what is "off" imo.
 

Investor9872

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The reactions to this were asinine. Calling it a broken mess that needs fixing because you aren't impressed with the graphics is everything wrong with gaming imo.

My immediate reaction was that it looked hella fun, and I can't wait to play it. Looks like Halo back to form, and I'll be there day one.

Look. All games are supposed to be fun. Developers can make fun games lower spec systems, like the Nintendo Switch. The problem here is MS has been blitzing the market since 2019 with adverts and statements like "Our next console will be the most powerful console ever, 10x Teraflops than the Xbox One." And when they finally showed their flagship title for their new, most powerful console ever, graphically it was way underwhelming, having people asking where did the 12 TF go?
 

Kimahri

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Look. All games are supposed to be fun. Developers can make fun games lower spec systems, like the Nintendo Switch. The problem here is MS has been blitzing the market since 2019 with adverts and statements like "Our next console will be the most powerful console ever, 10x Teraflops than the Xbox One." And when they finally showed their flagship title for their new, most powerful console ever, graphically it was way underwhelming, having people asking where did the 12 TF go?
Does it bother you that this doesn't matter to me?

I've played video games for over 30 years. I stopped giving a damn about this stuff a couple of generations ago.
 

Investor9872

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Does it bother you that this doesn't matter to me?

I've played video games for over 30 years. I stopped giving a damn about this stuff a couple of generations ago.

Sounds to me that you're more bothered about this than I am, kiddo!
 

MiguelItUp

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I didn't understand all the extreme negativity. Did it look revolutionary? Nah it didn't. Some parts definitely looked like it was WIP. But I never once thought it looked really bad.

I'm actually really curious to see what they do with multiplayer, and I'm hoping it's more along the lines of the OG trilogy. I'm sure a lot of folks are hoping for the same thing, but we'll have to see what happens!
 

Bernd Lauert

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You don't get the point, I'm not even talking about Halo, just in general for nextgen games. Game designed around 12TF GPU upscaled from 1440p to 4k for example VS a game that is designed around Lockhart's 4TF GPU which will have a bigger resolution on the X and done. Do you understand the difference?

Games designed around a 12TF GPU at 1440p will run at something like 900p on Lockhart. I don't see the problem.
 

Esca

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Games designed around a 12TF GPU at 1440p will run at something like 900p on Lockhart. I don't see the problem.
You're missing what he's saying. What if devs/pubs decide to develop a game based on the 4tf console and for the 12 tf one they get an upscaled game with some better visuals, higher resolution, and more fps. Exactly like what is currently done with the xbone s/base ps4 vs the xbx/pro.

The only ones we know for sure that wouldn't do that is Sony since they have one set of specs for their first party. But third party would just port over the Xbox version.


We have no way of knowing what shenanigans may be pulled and is a different pov
 
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Investor9872

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You're missing what he's saying. What if devs/pubs decide to develop a game based on the 4tf console and for the 12 tf one they get an upscaled game with some better visuals, higher resolution, and more fps. Exactly like what is currently done with the xbone s/base ps4 vs the xbx/pro.

The only ones we know for sure that wouldn't do that is Sony since they have one set of specs for their first party. But third party would just port over the Xbox version.


We have no way of knowing what shenanigans may be pulled and is a different pov

The bigger Devs usually do it the other way around, which is to say that they would develop for the 12 TF machines, and then downsample the games for the lesser machines. But I can see your point, in that some smaller devs, without limited fundings, will develop for the less powerful machines first, and then release upscaled textures and additional assets for the machines that are 3x-4x more powerful, and that is not what we as the consumers want to see.
 
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