• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Metal Gear Solid Community |OT4| God Bless the Chopper!

Italian Joe

Member
May 29, 2013
314
0
345
Naples, Italy
www.reddit.com
Permanent Nukes on MGSV: TPP PS3 (and other consoles?) by reddit user Hastatus_ Atratus

Read this /u/KonamiUSSocial

Original reddit comment link

To Konami and the MGSV:TPP Players

I do not hunt and disarm nukes nor do I build or employ them, but my keen interest and understanding of the PF Virtual Battles system has allowed me to observe more types of accounts with nukes than most other people. I can say without any doubt that there are Permanent Nukes that remain inaccessible to all active players making Disarmament impossible to achieve. They have been there for over a year, possibly since the very beginning, and to date no Konami employee has yet acknowledged their existence. Given that Konami has been promoting Nuclear Disarmament and that Nuclear Disarmament is significant to unlocking ”Chapter 3" I suspect no one at Konami has observed or understands what these Permanent Nukes actually are. I tried reporting this issue to Konami but the reply I got back was very generic (automated?) and did not actually show they grasped what I was saying: it seemed like they thought I was reporting cheaters instead of examples of derelict accounts that have been permanently removed from the FOB system which in this case happen to also possess nukes. Contacting specific Konami employees directly for an intelligent back and forth conversation has not been possible. All my observations have been on the PS3, but I have heard from players on other consoles who have noticed a similar situation.

If I mention Permanent Nukes to someone they might think I am talking about many different things: They might think I am talking about an exploit where players reload their almost-completed-nuke save over and over so that they can build up 16 nukes nearly instantaneously; I am not talking about these nukes; They might think I am talking about people who use save editors to create nukes; I am not talking about these nukes; They might think I am talking about players who hoard 16 nukes and have enough time to rebuild their four lost nukes during their blockade because only 4 nukes can be stolen at one time and the triggered blockade time is more than enough time to max out their nukes again in a continuous cycle of 16,12,16,12,16,12,...nukes; I am not talking about these nukes; They might think I am subjectively complaining about something that is hard to achieve like many noobs on the internet; My complaint is not subjective opinion, but eye-witnessed fact. Let us get this straight, I am not talking about cheated/exploited nukes nor a bad intentional design decision lacking foresight; I am talking about literally Permanent Nukes that are present on accounts with bases that are permanently removed from all FOB tabs and so are inaccessible to everyone. This is an actual unintentional server/programming glitch caused by and probably unknown to Konami that can only be seen by the most observant and knowledgeable PF League players while they are moving up certain portions of the PF leaderboards.

Back during the week of March 14 to March 21 2016 (not 2017) I took the following two pictures:





At the time I was taking pictures of many people's stats because I had been figuring out how the PF battle scores were calculated. I also took pictures of unusual stats from time to time because I started seeing players with unusually high stats: I suspected that tyh56-5 had cheated in some manner in order to get 2.5 million Offensive Capability. At the time I had not really thought much about nukes on derelict bases. Derelict bases are accounts that clearly show no more player activity: their stats remain fixed over long periods of time or they have almost no staff left to take which indicates that they do not log in or have not taken care of their bases for some time. With the introduction of the compare PF stat feature in the May 2016 update it was also possible to see accounts that were no longer active because they possessed no PF-stat-ability staff. By September of 2016 I had come across more and more obviously derelict bases that still possessed nukes. I had seen bases with 0 Security staff and Total FOB defense in the single digits, which means any nuke hunter could take a casual jog straight for the nukes and steal them with no resistance. The longer such derelict bases keep their nukes and keep identical PF stats the more likely it is that their bases simply do not appear on the nuke tab or any other FOB tab. I called these Inaccessible Nukes and others mentioned noticing similar patterns on other consoles. At the time I was focused on other aspects of the game so I dropped the issue and assumed those who actively hunted nukes would report the issue to Konami and or Konami would realise that large numbers of nukes were obviously not being disarmed. Konami seemed to stop reporting nuke numbers so I figured they would fix the issue in an update or just stop talking about Disarmament and ”Chapter 3" altogether.

In May of 2017 however a new Konami Twitter spokesperson who signs their Tweets as "J" took over the @metalgear_jp Twitter account and the @metalgear_en Twitter account started retweeting J's nuke data. They have indicated, as had been formerly, that Disarmament unlocks ”Chapter 3" and have been reporting the nuke counts with graphs a couple times a week. They even indicated that there would be action taken against illicit nukes, the success or implementation of which I am dubious. Clearly they want players to disarm, but is it even possible? No, it is not.

With this new push for Disarmament from Konami I came across a thread about the renewed Konami Twitter activity (https://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/718564-metal-gear-solid-v-the-phantom-pain/75360719) and someone from Xbox One mentioned my previous observations about inaccessible nukes. At the time I was moving up the PF ranks again with an alternate account and happened to remember one of the derelict accounts with nukes that I had seen the previous week. I record everyone's Capabilities and Durabilities some weeks because I use a spreadsheet to determine the final scores and whether or not and against whom I should use my Liquid Carbon and Anti-Ballistic Missiles. The following is a screen capture of the stats of the players I faced on the week of May 30 to June 5 2017.



When I went back through my old pictures I noticed that one of them was tyh56-5 whom I faced on my main PSN over a year earlier. This player has exactly the same Capabilities and Durabilities over a year apart! This means that the player who owns the account has not signed in and no one has done any damage to their base. And yet they have had 4 nukes for over a year! According to my calculations with these 4 nukes and a maximum blockade of 5 days for each unsuccessful infiltration with maximum damage this account should have appeared on the nuke tab and been subject to nuke hunters over 70 times. Either nuke hunters sucked and failed over 70 times in a row and did zero damage every time or this account never appears in the nuke tab for active players to infiltrate.

Konami needs to start paying attention. Look at ALL accounts with nukes and verify that they appear in the nuke tab after their blockade runs out. That no one at Konami has been doing this already for such an important feature in the game is shameful.

I have seen MANY similar derelict accounts with nukes. I will not name them because I suspect Konami's support people will only think I am reporting cheaters instead of realising that I am reporting examples of a problem with Konami's programming and or servers (language barrier?). It is Konami's responsibility to seek out why such accounts and their nukes are permanently unavailable to the rest of the playerbase. I know there are Permanent Nukes currently on the PS3. I have seen nearly a hundred Permanent Nukes to date and given that the sample size of players I actually came across in the PF battles is very small I would not be surprised if 25% to 75% of all nukes currently present on the PS3 are Permanent. I have heard from people who say they have seen similar derelict bases with nukes on the PS4 and Xbox One so I strongly suspect that the programming and or server issue occurs on all platforms. Given that this situation has been present for over a year and Konami has done nothing and or is not observant enough to notice this situation players should come to terms that Nuclear Disarmament is currently impossible due to these Permanent Nukes. I really really want to see what ”Chapter 3" unlocks but at this point Disarmament is entirely dependent upon Konami's future actions.

Hastatus - aka the guy who figured out the math behind the PF Battles' scoring system and who sits in the highest PF Grade on the PS3.

************************************************************************************************************
The previous text was posted on July 7th 2017. It has remained unchanged. Since I will not go away until Konami officially says they understand the situation or they do something to rectify it I will add further evidence here from time to time if I think it makes a good example for people to understand what I am talking about. Maybe it will also help cross the language barrier.

Another example of an account with Permanent Nukes: MrUnkreative (PS3) - July 21 2017

I encountered MrUnkreative on two separate occasions during Weekly PF Virtual Battles: the week of May 9th and the week of July 11th (so two months apart).


July 11 2017


May 9 2017


July 11 2017

As you can see MrUnkreative's Capabilities and Durabilities were identical two months apart:
May 9th : Offensive Capability = 7872095; Offensive Durability = 182838; Defensive Capability = 5106301; Defensive Durability = 232751;
July 11th : Offensive Capability = 7872095; Offensive Durability = 182838; Defensive Capability = 5106301; Defensive Durability = 232751.

Identical Capabilities and Durabilities over a two-month period is indicative of a player who has neither signed in nor been damaged in any manner through infiltration by another player. Either of these would result in slightly changing values at a minimum.

This might not be totally convincing to everyone who does not understand the math involved in calculating Capability and Durability, but there is something else:









As you can clearly see this player has 0 Medics, 0 Rangers, 0 Sentries, and 0 Defenders. The odds of getting a staff member with a PF-Stat Skill is roughly 1 in 10 (when obtaining ranks high enough to have the skill). They are very easy to come by and so obtaining many of them is very easy. Not having any of them is highly unlikely for a player who is even remotely active. The PF-Stat Skill was introduced in the May 2016 Game Update. Having zero staff with these skills means that a player has probably not played the game since before the May 2016 update. So MrUnkreative has not played since before the May 2016 update and has had 4 nukes this whole time. He is not playing the game and other players are not able to invade his FOB. His account is derelict and inaccessible to the rest of the playerbase...and he has 4 Permanent Nukes that no one outside of a Konami programmer can disarm.

************************************************************************************************************

Another example of an account with Permanent Nukes: Astaroth-369 (PS3) - A Trophy Hunter - August 1 2017

I have encountered more Derelict Accounts with Permanent Nukes in the past few weeks but here is one that can be considered in a different way. I encountered Astaroth-369 during the week of July 11 2017.


July 11 2017

The first thing that indicated to me that this account had not been accessed by its owner for a long time was that they had 0 Medics, 0 Rangers, 0 Sentries, and 0 Defenders. This suggests that they have not played since before the May 2016 update. But there is another way to verify that an account has not been played by the owner: their trophy history.

Astaroth-369 is what I call a trophy hunter: they play a large number of games on a single PSN account and generally attempt to get Platinums for most of them. Here is the history of their game play as seen through their trophy history (you can view it for yourself at https://psnprofiles.com/Astaroth-369 ):

- Before playing MGSV:TPP they had already earned 54 Platinums.
- They started playing MGSV:TPP on December 1st 2015.
- They obtained Disarmament on Jan 21 2016.
- They obtained Deterrence on Jan 22 2016.
- They obtained the MGSV:TPP Platinum on Jan 23 2016.
- They then played 10 more PS3 games between Jan 23 2016 and August 23 2016, obtaining Platinums (or 100%) for all of them.
- They obtained a PS4 in August of 2016.
- They played their first PS4 game between Aug 17 and Aug 20 2016.
- They then played 26 more PS4 games; 11 of these were Platinumed.
- Their 10 most recent trophies were all obtained on August 1 2017 (today).
- They still had 4 nukes on their PS3 MGSV:TPP account on July 11 2017 and they are probably still there today (August 1 2017).

It is clear that this player played MGSV:TPP between Dec 1 2015 and Jan 23 2016. They got involved with nukes in mid-late January 2016. From their trophy history all common sense says that after getting the Platinum for MGS:TPP on Jan 23 2016 they stopped playing the game. You can see how they move from game to game and then a new console. Who would continue to play MGSV:TPP on the PS3 after playing 10 more PS3 games, getting a PS4, and playing 26 more PS4 games? 2.68 trophies per day is very, very time consuming. Clearly they have not been playing MGS:TPP on their old PS3 and yet over a year and a half after they stopped playing MGSV they still have 4 nukes on their account. His account is derelict and inaccessible to the rest of the playerbase...and he has 4 Permanent Nukes that no one outside of a Konami programmer can disarm.

Many Derelict Accounts with Permanent Nukes belong to people who do not speak English or who have so few trophies that they probably belong to people using them as Alternative accounts. Since Astaroth-369 included English in his account and they are clearly still very active on it I PSN messaged them a couple weeks ago asking them when they last played MGSV:TPP but they have not responded.

************************************************************************************************************

Some final comments before a hiatus - August 9 2017

My alternative account is moving up past the range of the Derelict Accounts with Permanent Nukes so I will likely not see anymore good examples to add. I will continue Tweeting Konami, but I will probably stop updating this document for a while. I will end with the following thoughts:

Warning to Konami: The Time Factor

- Permanent Nukes have existed since at least January 2016.
- I reported the issue to Konami Support and received an unhelpful automated(?) reply from Konami Support on June 9 2017.
- I opened up a Twitter account and Tweeted my Proof to @Konami, @metalgear_jp and @metalgear_en on July 7 2017.
- I have replied to the Nuke Counts with my Proof 10 times between July 7 and August 8 2017.
- After 2 Months I have received no intelligent reply from Konami about the issue and they have not made any public statement about it.
- Konami continues to give out Nuke Counts to players either unawares or hoping the vast majority of players remain unawares.

You might think that remaining silent about this issue will keep players from finding out the truth. It will not. Whatever policy you have in place preventing the disclosure of negative press will not serve you in time. The longer after June 9th 2017 you delay in responding in word and in deed the more negativity you will foster. It is one thing to miss a programming mistake for over a year and a half and claim you did not know, but it is another thing entirely once you have been informed and are continually informed twice a week when you post the Nuke Counts. Time is not your ally. More players will find out the truth and more players will learn for how much time you have known. This is the biggest programming flaw impacting the most number of players in the history of the Metal Gear franchise. Eventually many players will find out and many players will remember it for decades. What will be the perception of a player who looks at your lower budget games, like Survive, when they think back at how you could not handle entering a few zeroes in your biggest budget title?

Significance of this Issue

Some may not realise that this issue is in fact extremely significant. Early players claimed that this game was unfinished due to cut content and Konami argued the ending is there and the game is complete. Zero players have completed the game. Completing a game means reaching the intended ending of a game. Konami has confirmed that Nuclear Disarmament unlocks Chapter 3 whatever that entails. Dataminers can claim what is or is not included in Chapter 3, but absence of evidence is not evidence of absence because Chapter 3 could easily be part of a game update/DLC. Konami is still pushing players to complete Nuclear Disarmament. It is one thing for Chapter 3 to be nearly impossible to achieve requiring the cooperation of nearly every player. This is a grandiose and impressive thing to attempt. BUT due to Konami's server glitch it is not actually in the hands of the players as it was intended to be. This is a disastrous situation. Chapter 3 cannot be reached by any player ever no matter how delusional players or Konami employees are (delusional means they are able to trick themselves into ignoring a problem and pretending it is not there). It is permanently inaccessible because of Konami's lack of testing and maintenance. A game with an intended ending that cannot be accessed due to a programming error is by definition an incomplete game.

It is no different than how some developers in the past put out incomplete games: in 1987 David Perry did not have enough space on the ZX Spectrum port of Gladiator/Great Gurianos so he omitted the ending and just made the final boss invincible; In 1988 Ocean did not have the time or could not figure out the bug that caused gibberish garbled views in level 4 of Robocop on the Commodore 64 so they set an impossible time limit in level 3 to prevent players from reaching garbled level 4; In 1990 Midway thought their arcade game Smash TV was impossible to beat so they did not bother to include the Pleasure Dome ending which was advertised in the game; In 1993 Ocean did not have the time to finish Dennis (the Menace) on the Commodore Amiga port of the game so they created a pit impossible to jump so that the last boss and the ending could not be accessed by the player; In 2015 Konami created or allowed a bug to remain in Nuclear Disarmament stats so that players cannot reach Chapter 3 of MGSV:TPP. Is the bug accidental or is Chapter 3 just unfinished? What are players to think if Konami never attempts to fix the bug?

What the players can do to speed up Communication and Action by Konami

Konami is only in this business to make money. To spend money fixing an issue such as this might only be in the hands of financially-incentivized businessmen. They essentially calculate how much negative publicity will arise and whether it might cost them future business. The negative press must impact future revenues more than the cost of the fix. Metal Gear Survive already has a bad reputation so maybe the Konami people do not think the negative publicity can get any worse. In the past they had Hideo Kojima a perfectionist who would not have allowed such a bug to remain. Who do they have now? Currently few players read my Tweets and my proof of this situation is not reaching enough of the playerbase and its collective voice. J gets more likes for his Nuke Counts than I do for pointing out the futility of the whole situation. Part of this is the language barrier: many Japanese players likely do not understand what is going on and there is no evidence that J understands English. The person in charge of the English Metal Gear Twitter account rarely says anything of note and seems to spend most of their time Retweeting stuff. Other people cannot read more than 140 characters at a time and or will remain delusionally hopeful. If you want to help force Konami into action I urge people to start liking all my Proof Tweets. J gets 50 to 100 likes each time he posts the Nuke Counts. If I start getting more likes than J's original post they will more likely pay attention, they will be more likely to get a translator involved to understand why, and they will be more likely to bring the issue up with their bosses. The more people that like my proof posts the more it will be evident to them that more people know the truth. Please help force Konami to face and own the truth. Thanks.

Hastatus.

Continues down below...
 

Italian Joe

Member
May 29, 2013
314
0
345
Naples, Italy
www.reddit.com
Permanent Nukes on MGSV: TPP PS3 (and other consoles?) by reddit user Hastatus_Atratus

***********************************************************************************************************

August 16th

Yesterday someone named ItalianJoe83 began to post my Document on many websites. I am not ItalianJoe83. I posted the link to my Document in three places: GameFAQs (HastatusAtratus) since I spend my MSGV time there for news and informative facts, on the MetalGearAntiNuclear Reddit (Hastatus_Atratus) since those who want to disarm all nukes are the most likely to be passionate about this subject, and on Konami's Nuke Count Tweets (HastatusAtratus) since I would like Konami to fix this bug. The posting of this information on other websites was done entirely by ItalianJoe83 without my involvement...I woke up and all of a sudden it was everywhere. I didn't even know what NeoGAF was. I have no problem with people distributing this information around the web but do please realize that the poster and I are not the same person. I will not make user accounts all over the place. If you have comments or questions you want me to read or answer you should contact me on my GameFAQs or Reddit account. I will continue to use only GoogleDocs when posting new relevant info.

"Chapter 3"

I never intended to get involved with the Schrödinger's Cat that is "Chapter 3". My quotes were intended to be Scare Quotes but I was probably inconsistent in their use. The fact is that Konami only publicly announced the Secret Nuclear Disarmament Event and its requirements, not the result which is obviously a secret. I refer to whatever the goal, result, unlock, reward, etc is as "Chapter 3" because it is the simplest recognizable name to give it. It could be a blank frozen screen when the game freezes, a video, or downloadable game content (if you want to keep something a secret it is logical to foresee dataminers and simply withhold data from the players; The PC users have noted extra curious DLC files that cannot be downloaded: https://steamdb.info/app/287700/dlc/). I never meant to suggest that Konami officially stated that there was something that they specifically called "Chapter 3" (though dataminers have found cards that say "Chapter 3: Peace" in a multitude of languages in the game's coding). A now former employee Robert Allen Peeler has possibly given clues on several occasions:
on Aug 30th 2016 he made an unusual reply: http://i.imgur.com/BFW9T3u.jpg;
on May 18th 2017 he retweeted someone's Tweet about ”Chapter 3": https://mobile.twitter.com/Reapers_Phantom/status/865262858208018432;
and on June 6 2017 he posted an unusual Tweet directly writing "#Chapter3" (https://twitter.com/popcicle/status/872250584337752064). It could be something and it could be nothing: but it is definitely not proof of either interpretation. I apologise if I created any misunderstanding concerning the "Chapter 3" issue. No matter what the reward is or whether you care about it the matter of principle that people should be focussing on is that Konami is asking players to reach an impossible goal as though it were possible.

Pro/Anti Kojima/Konami

I am not one of those people who worships Kojima or Konami or hates Kojima or Konami. Personally I do not care that much about either side and generally just ignore these extreme discussions. I simply play games and either find that I enjoyed or didn't enjoy the game. If I didn't enjoy a game I simply move onto the next. A month or two ago I bought two Konami games through the PSN Store that had little to no involvement from Kojima and I will probably get Death Stranding. This document is supposed to be informative constructive criticism that helps fix a very real problem. People that interpret my comments towards their extremist views are just superimposing their emotional feelings upon my words while wearing blinders. I am angry and concerned about only this one bug.

Hastatus.
 

KyanMehwulfe

Member
Aug 26, 2004
10,843
175
1,345
Huntusk
www3.telus.net
My impression is that were anything unlocked behind global platform nuclear disarmament, it's small or insignificant enough that they seem unconcerned whether it does get unlocked. Especially when they made effort to make changes such as allow us to reacquire Quiet or they add FOB content. So whatever it is is likely small enough that they can leave it there as a sort of 'ant farm' just to see what happens. Perhaps as insignificant as just the "Chapter 3" black chapter title screen and the disarmament cutscene -- in the way Chapter 3 started.

I can't imagine a company like Konami, especially with how they've treated post-release updates, would let more than that sit idle. With the numerous updates, FOB content, changes to help players get to content (e.g. getting Quiet back), or MG Survive, if this had any even minorly significant content they'd have likely shown effort long ago.

Just my impression, though having put 450 hours into SP (not including FOBs), of course I'd love for it to be more haha.
 

strafer

member
Apr 2, 2010
58,967
0
610
Sweden
So I haven't been able to keep up on what works these days regarding material farming, so what are a good spot or mission to farm for namely Fuel and Common Metal?
 

bad

Member
Nov 5, 2013
3,034
588
555
New York
So I haven't been able to keep up on what works these days regarding material farming, so what are a good spot or mission to farm for namely Fuel and Common Metal?
Fobs. Combat for common, Support for Fuel. Base dev for both. Command for both (but not as much as base dev)
 

TheBoss1

Member
Jan 18, 2014
935
45
385
Fobs. Combat for common, Support for Fuel. Base dev for both. Command for both (but not as much as base dev)
You still play FOB? I remember you playing that religiously and having a ton of S++ guys lol.
 

Banzai

Member
Jun 3, 2013
1,886
0
380
I'm thinking about getting TPP on PC and modding it. Will stuff like Infinite Heaven get me banned from FOB ? I'm mostly interested in quality of life stuff, like skipping helicopter rides and adding subsistence versions of all missions.
 

bad

Member
Nov 5, 2013
3,034
588
555
New York
I'm thinking about getting TPP on PC and modding it. Will stuff like Infinite Heaven get me banned from FOB ? I'm mostly interested in quality of life stuff, like skipping helicopter rides and adding subsistence versions of all missions.
If you use it during fobs, you will probably be reported. If you don't, you're fine.
 

Kindekuma

Banned
Jan 15, 2015
5,214
1
0
I'm thinking about getting TPP on PC and modding it. Will stuff like Infinite Heaven get me banned from FOB ? I'm mostly interested in quality of life stuff, like skipping helicopter rides and adding subsistence versions of all missions.
Nah you'll be fine. If you use trainers or any legit hacks, then you'll likely get reported. Infinite Heaven won't get you banned, I've been using it for ages and all game functionalities such as the online works.
 

BadWolf

Member
Apr 15, 2010
26,126
4
0
Never realized this. Devs love to show a game at great potential then downgrade at release.
Might have to do with it being a cross gen game and them wanting parity between both versions.

KojiPro will probably go all out with Death Stranding.
 

GreyOcelot

Member
May 20, 2014
3,401
0
0
Man, watching the video from 2014 and seeing how alive Mother Base felt, vehicles, choppers and animals, while it's totally fine the way it is now i'm kinda disappointed.

https://youtu.be/ggpBtOnq_AA?t=1507
there's really only a few major differences. drones/animals. and scripted events. they probably didn't have time to play test all of the scripted events they planned to have randomly happen on motherbase. it makes sense for something like that to be put on the chopping block considering the time crunch they were on. it's funny beceause they probably could have put a lot of this stuff in and then patched it later, but instead they released a relatively bug-free experience in comparison to a lot of other open world games. it's probably why there's so few animal-human interactions and events happening out in the open world. the game really needed like 6 more months of polishing. besides the fact that it really shouldn't have been fully open world to begin with. it's a shame. it remains one of my favorite games of all time, but man it could have been even better in so many ways.

infinite heaven is really great. i've played some of the added side ops and they are super challenging. feel more like main missions in terms of scale.
 

BadWolf

Member
Apr 15, 2010
26,126
4
0
there's really only a few major differences. drones/animals. and scripted events. they probably didn't have time to play test all of the scripted events they planned to have randomly happen on motherbase. it makes sense for something like that to be put on the chopping block considering the time crunch they were on. it's funny beceause they probably could have put a lot of this stuff in and then patched it later, but instead they released a relatively bug-free experience in comparison to a lot of other open world games. it's probably why there's so few animal-human interactions and events happening out in the open world. the game really needed like 6 more months of polishing. besides the fact that it really shouldn't have been fully open world to begin with. it's a shame. it remains one of my favorite games of all time, but man it could have been even better in so many ways.

infinite heaven is really great. i've played some of the added side ops and they are super challenging. feel more like main missions in terms of scale.
Yeah it's pretty suprising how well they nailed the core world and gameplay despite it being the team's first open world game. It was basically a super solid day 1 package while many other games in the genre release a whole bunch of fixes and patches (ala Horizon etc.).

I wouldn't be surprised if they had some really ambitious post release plans (ala Episode 51) etc. but unfortunately everything came crashing down with the Konami/Kojima fallout. Either way, it's still my GOTG.

On the bright side we will finally be getting a brand new major IP from Kojima.
 

BadWolf

Member
Apr 15, 2010
26,126
4
0
In 3017? Man I love his MGS games but dude takes forever to release a game. Idk who's worse - him or Polyphony.
What game did they take forever to release aside from MGSV?

2019 is very likely for Death Stranding.

His team doesn't have to create an engine from scratch this time.
 

strafer

member
Apr 2, 2010
58,967
0
610
Sweden
Yeah it's pretty suprising how well they nailed the core world and gameplay despite it being the team's first open world game. It was basically a super solid day 1 package while many other games in the genre release a whole bunch of fixes and patches (ala Horizon etc.).

I wouldn't be surprised if they had some really ambitious post release plans (ala Episode 51) etc. but unfortunately everything came crashing down with the Konami/Kojima fallout. Either way, it's still my GOTG.

On the bright side we will finally be getting a brand new major IP from Kojima.
Yeah, i wonder how the game would have turned out if Kojima got a blank check.

They were clearly some shit happening behind closed doors.
 

TheBoss1

Member
Jan 18, 2014
935
45
385
What game did they take forever to release aside from MGSV?

2019 is very likely for Death Stranding.

His team doesn't have to create an engine from scratch this time.
The list below only accounts for new games. No expansions/DLC, remasters/remakes, demos (MGS:GZ), or IPs that were outsourced.

Kojima
1998 - MGS
2001 - MGS2
2004 - MGS3
2008 - MGS4
2012 - MGS:pW (which shouldn't count but just to be fair)
2015 - MGSV

Naughty Dog
1998 - CB:W
1999 - CTR
2001 - JaD: TPL
2003 - Jak II
2004 - Jak 3
2005 - Jak X: CR
2007 - Uncharted
2009 - Uncharted 2
2011 - Uncharted 3
2013 - TLOU
2016 - Uncharted 4
2017 - Uncharted: TLL

In 20 years, these are the amount of new games produced by both studios
Kojima - 6
Naughty Dog - 12

Rockstar is just as bad as Kojima, if not worse, but they don't even need to drop another game and people would keep buying them. Not fair but they are the exception.
 

bad

Member
Nov 5, 2013
3,034
588
555
New York
The list below only accounts for new games. No expansions/DLC, remasters/remakes, demos (MGS:GZ), or IPs that were outsourced.

Kojima
1998 - MGS
2001 - MGS2
2004 - MGS3
2008 - MGS4
2012 - MGS:pW (which shouldn't count but just to be fair)
2015 - MGSV

Naughty Dog
1998 - CB:W
1999 - CTR
2001 - JaD: TPL
2003 - Jak II
2004 - Jak 3
2005 - Jak X: CR
2007 - Uncharted
2009 - Uncharted 2
2011 - Uncharted 3
2013 - TLOU
2016 - Uncharted 4
2017 - Uncharted: TLL

In 20 years, these are the amount of new games produced by both studios
Kojima - 6
Naughty Dog - 12

Rockstar is just as bad as Kojima, if not worse, but they don't even need to drop another game and people would keep buying them. Not fair but they are the exception.
Why not count PeaceWalker?
 

TheBoss1

Member
Jan 18, 2014
935
45
385
Why not count PeaceWalker?
Because it is a smaller title that was made for a portable console. Subjective I know, but I still counted it to show that there are still a lack of titles compared to a similar studio.

I prefer Kojima titles over Naughty Dog's but it's not like they are an inferior studio.
 

bad

Member
Nov 5, 2013
3,034
588
555
New York
Because it is a smaller title that was made for a portable console. Subjective I know, but I still counted it to show that there are still a lack of titles compared to a similar studio.

I prefer Kojima titles over Naughty Dog's but it's not like they are an inferior studio.
I understand what you're saying but I still think you count PW. It has single player and two forms of multiplayer.

And I think you have to count PO, Ghost Babel, Ac!d series, the cancelled Rising game (which was running on the fox engine).

Naughty Dog just seems like it runs a smoother ship(From the documentaries I've watched about both studios).
 

BadWolf

Member
Apr 15, 2010
26,126
4
0
The list below only accounts for new games. No expansions/DLC, remasters/remakes, demos (MGS:GZ), or IPs that were outsourced.

Kojima
1998 - MGS
2001 - MGS2
2004 - MGS3
2008 - MGS4
2012 - MGS:pW (which shouldn't count but just to be fair)
2015 - MGSV
PW absolutely does count, it is a part of the main series and was directed by Kojima.

Ground Zeroes also counts since it is part of MGSV, excluding it is like saying that the Tanker chapter wasn't a part of MGS2.

All of those mainline entries you listed are 3-4 years apart, that's normal dev time for games like his. Look at something as bare bones as RE7, that took 2.5 years.

And it's nice how you are including stuff like CTR for Naughty Dog but excluding MGS Portable Ops, Ac!d games, Zone of the Enders, Metal Gear Rising etc. for KojiPro.

Either way, doesn't really make sense to compare them directly like that since their games are of different types and scales.

I mean should I whip out the list of Capcom or Square Enix games from the last 20 years and compare them to Naughty Dog?
 

Crazy Diamond

Member
Feb 11, 2016
2,043
0
250
The list below only accounts for new games. No expansions/DLC, remasters/remakes, demos (MGS:GZ), or IPs that were outsourced.

Kojima
1998 - MGS
2001 - MGS2
2004 - MGS3
2008 - MGS4
2012 - MGS:pW (which shouldn't count but just to be fair)
2015 - MGSV

Naughty Dog
1998 - CB:W
1999 - CTR
2001 - JaD: TPL
2003 - Jak II
2004 - Jak 3
2005 - Jak X: CR
2007 - Uncharted
2009 - Uncharted 2
2011 - Uncharted 3
2013 - TLOU
2016 - Uncharted 4
2017 - Uncharted: TLL

In 20 years, these are the amount of new games produced by both studios
Kojima - 6
Naughty Dog - 12

Rockstar is just as bad as Kojima, if not worse, but they don't even need to drop another game and people would keep buying them. Not fair but they are the exception.
He didn't just make Metal Gear during that time. And Koji Pro made way more than that too.
 

TheBoss1

Member
Jan 18, 2014
935
45
385
Fair enough. I was only counting the games where Kojima was involved, which is still low compared to the 6 games Naughty Dog has come out with in the last 10 years.
I should not have said expansion but the new Uncharted is seems way bigger than your typical DLC.
He didn't just make Metal Gear during that time. And Koji Pro made way more than that too.
So what else did he (Kojima, not Koji Pro) make that was released?
 

Javier23

Banned
Feb 21, 2014
1,523
0
0
Fair enough. I was only counting the games where Kojima was involved, which is still low compared to the 6 games Naughty Dog has come out with in the last 10 years.

I should not have said expansion but the new Uncharted is seems way bigger than your typical DLC.
You mentioned expansions. Plenty of DLC are pretty big. See Bethesda's expandalones, or The Witcher's...

MGS2 Substance and MGS3 Subsistence, which you didn't count, are considerably bigger than your typical DLC, and are still expansions.

Also, why compare one developer to an entire studio?

Your entire comparison doesn't hold water.
 

Italian Joe

Member
May 29, 2013
314
0
345
Naples, Italy
www.reddit.com
Permanent Nukes on MGSV: TPP PS3 (and other consoles?) by reddit user Hastatus_Atratus

***********************************************************************************************************

August 16th

Yesterday someone named ItalianJoe83 began to post my Document on many websites. I am not ItalianJoe83. I posted the link to my Document in three places: GameFAQs (HastatusAtratus) since I spend my MSGV time there for news and informative facts, on the MetalGearAntiNuclear Reddit (Hastatus_Atratus) since those who want to disarm all nukes are the most likely to be passionate about this subject, and on Konami's Nuke Count Tweets (HastatusAtratus) since I would like Konami to fix this bug. The posting of this information on other websites was done entirely by ItalianJoe83 without my involvement...I woke up and all of a sudden it was everywhere. I didn't even know what NeoGAF was. I have no problem with people distributing this information around the web but do please realize that the poster and I are not the same person. I will not make user accounts all over the place. If you have comments or questions you want me to read or answer you should contact me on my GameFAQs or Reddit account. I will continue to use only GoogleDocs when posting new relevant info.

"Chapter 3"

I never intended to get involved with the Schrödinger's Cat that is "Chapter 3". My quotes were intended to be Scare Quotes but I was probably inconsistent in their use. The fact is that Konami only publicly announced the Secret Nuclear Disarmament Event and its requirements, not the result which is obviously a secret. I refer to whatever the goal, result, unlock, reward, etc is as "Chapter 3" because it is the simplest recognizable name to give it. It could be a blank frozen screen when the game freezes, a video, or downloadable game content (if you want to keep something a secret it is logical to foresee dataminers and simply withhold data from the players; The PC users have noted extra curious DLC files that cannot be downloaded: https://steamdb.info/app/287700/dlc/). I never meant to suggest that Konami officially stated that there was something that they specifically called "Chapter 3" (though dataminers have found cards that say "Chapter 3: Peace" in a multitude of languages in the game's coding). A now former employee Robert Allen Peeler has possibly given clues on several occasions:
on Aug 30th 2016 he made an unusual reply: http://i.imgur.com/BFW9T3u.jpg;
on May 18th 2017 he retweeted someone's Tweet about ”Chapter 3": https://mobile.twitter.com/Reapers_Phantom/status/865262858208018432;
and on June 6 2017 he posted an unusual Tweet directly writing "#Chapter3" (https://twitter.com/popcicle/status/872250584337752064). It could be something and it could be nothing: but it is definitely not proof of either interpretation. I apologise if I created any misunderstanding concerning the "Chapter 3" issue. No matter what the reward is or whether you care about it the matter of principle that people should be focussing on is that Konami is asking players to reach an impossible goal as though it were possible.

Pro/Anti Kojima/Konami

I am not one of those people who worships Kojima or Konami or hates Kojima or Konami. Personally I do not care that much about either side and generally just ignore these extreme discussions. I simply play games and either find that I enjoyed or didn't enjoy the game. If I didn't enjoy a game I simply move onto the next. A month or two ago I bought two Konami games through the PSN Store that had little to no involvement from Kojima and I will probably get Death Stranding. This document is supposed to be informative constructive criticism that helps fix a very real problem. People that interpret my comments towards their extremist views are just superimposing their emotional feelings upon my words while wearing blinders. I am angry and concerned about only this one bug.

Hastatus.
************************************************************************************************************

Another example of an account with Permanent Nukes: DogsOfXOF (PS3) - A player with more nukes than they have available FOB space - August 28 2017

So obtaining top three this week means my alt will move up into the same grade and group as my main account. I didn't expect to see any Derelict Accounts with Permanent Nukes this past week, but to my surprise there was one definite one and a likely second one which both displayed an unusual characteristic worth exhibiting here: they have more nukes than they have available FOB space.


August 22 2017


March 21 2017

I can confirm that DogsOfXOF has the same Capabilities and Durabilities that they had when my main account encountered them back during the week of March 21st 2017. What I had not noticed back then was that they actually possess more nukes than they have FOB space: they have 8 nukes and yet only possess 1 FOB. This can be verified by looking closely at the locations on the spinning globe that makes up the background of the PF Virtual Battle screens. You can use the analogue stick to speed up or slow down the spinning. I have checked this globe several times to make sure I have not missed any FOBs because those in the South Pacific and South Atlantic are easy to miss since they are more feint. There is only 1 FOB visible on the globe. I also checked their Platform stats: each fully constructed MB or FOB = 25000 Defensive Durability and DogsOfXOF only has 29464; each fully constructed MB or FOB = 7504 Defensive Capability and DogsOfXOF only has 8844. They also have less than 200 Offensive and Defensive Staff. So DogsOfXOF has only 1 FOB and yet they have 8 nukes.

It was already clear to me that they had hacked/modded their save to obtain their Capabilities in the millions when I first encountered this account, but I also suspected that they had hacked/modded their unit levels: they have lvl 148 in both Combat and Security Units. When you check their PF stats you can calculate the exact numbers of staff they have in these units (as long as you know the individual grade values for staff like I do): In their Combat Unit they have: 1 S++, 5 S+, 109 S, 38 A++, and 12 A++ (total = 165); In their Security Team they have: 40 A+, 29 A, 9 B, 6 C, 9 D, and 38 E (total = 131). If you have even the slightest familiarity with the number of S++ and S+ you need to get lvl 148 during your experiences with Development Project requirements it is blatantly obvious DogsOfXOF should not have anywhere near lvl 148 in these units. Since they have hacked/modded collectibles for obtaining high Capabilities and have hacked/modded high unit levels it is not surprising they would do the same thing with nukes.

So DogsOfXOF has some hacked/modded nukes resulting in more nukes than they should be able to hold. Their account has been derelict and inaccessible to the rest of the playerbase for at least 5 months...and they have 8 Permanent Nukes that no one outside of a Konami programmer can disarm.

Hastatus.
 

Xux

Member
May 10, 2007
4,660
11
1,015
Seattle.
Gosh this Nuke stuff is fascinating. Good thing I got the Steam version! Only 8500 or so to go!

Hopefully they rig it to trigger sometime in my lifetime so I can see it firsthand.
 

BadWolf

Member
Apr 15, 2010
26,126
4
0
Konami can make all the MGS games in the world and it still wouldn't be a real MGS game.

The day Kojima left was the day MGS died.

Have zero interest in what comes next.
Yeah the guy was just too involved in creating those game from top to bottom.

It's like having an Ico game without Ueda or a Nier/Drakengard without Taro. Pointless.

The thing that hurts a little though is that on the one hand yeah he had been making MGS forever and everyone (himself included) wanted him to move on but at the same time... the world needs an MGS featuring the Boss and the Cobra unit set during WW2. If only he hadn't mentioned that lol.
 

TheBoss1

Member
Jan 18, 2014
935
45
385
Konami can make all the MGS games in the world and it still wouldn't be a real MGS game.

The day Kojima left was the day MGS died.

Have zero interest in what comes next.
I'm with you on this. MGSurvive looks like DLC for MGSV. Graphical improvements are minimal, if any. Gameplay is pretty much the same which isn't a bad thing at all since it has one of the best controls ever in any game. Zombie apocalypse as the main story? GTFOH
Yeah the guy was just too involved in creating those game from top to bottom.

It's like having an Ico game without Ueda or a Nier/Drakengard without Taro. Pointless.

The thing that hurts a little though is that on the one hand yeah he had been making MGS forever and everyone (himself included) wanted him to move on but at the same time... the world needs an MGS featuring the Boss and the Cobra unit set during WW2. If only he hadn't mentioned that lol.
Seeing as The Boss is one of my favorite characters in the series, I HATE that we will never get that game.
 

GreyOcelot

Member
May 20, 2014
3,401
0
0
I'm with you on this. MGSurvive looks like DLC for MGSV. Graphical improvements are minimal, if any. Gameplay is pretty much the same which isn't a bad thing at all since it has one of the best controls ever in any game. Zombie apocalypse as the main story? GTFOH
i'm sure the gameplay feels good, but is there even any stealth? that's the best part of mgsv
 

strafer

member
Apr 2, 2010
58,967
0
610
Sweden
Currently replaying MGS1 on Playstation and I'm fighting Rex, all the bosses so far has been a cake but Rex is giving me a workout, can't really remember if I had trouble the first time, been a really long time since I played through the first game.

But one thing I hate is that you have to restart from the fucking beginning everytime you die and you cant skip the Grey Fox cutscene, makes it a little more frustrating.

Rex > Sahelanthropus
 

Tizoc

Member
Jun 23, 2010
81,146
13
850
32
Oman
Sorry if this was already answered but are there any major differences between the US and PAL versions of MGS2 Substance and MGS3 subsistence?
 

Italian Joe

Member
May 29, 2013
314
0
345
Naples, Italy
www.reddit.com
Permanent Nukes on MGSV: TPP PS3 (and other consoles?) by reddit user Hastatus_ Atratus

************************************************************************************************************

Another example of an account with Permanent Nukes: rosariotummi93 (PS3) - A player with Command Platforms with so many custom mines it causes the infiltrator's system to crash - September 10 2017

So here is a different situation that causes Permanent Nukes even though the account is visible in the Nuke Tab. Some players had found a way to create more custom mines on their FOBs than they were supposed to be allowed: how I do not know. When players attempt to infiltrate these accounts their system crashes because it cannot handle the excessive number of mines. The numbers of these mines are visible in their FOB stats before you attempt to invade them so you can avoid a system crash. If they are present on the Command Platform their nukes become permanently inaccessible.

Youtube user Baldy Pain has posted videos documenting this situation on the PS3. rosariotummi93 had 2 nukes and 146 mines on their command platform back in August of 2016 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QR8CLFHvFKc). Their account is often visible in the nuke tab and yet they currently still have 2 nukes and 146 mines on their command platform over a year later (September 2017: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6MnUiE1CsAw). Do be aware that only the platforms with the excessive number of mines cannot be invaded: the other platforms can be invaded normally. rosariotummi93 only has excessive mines on their Command and Support Platforms and so his other platforms can be invaded normally.

If one checks their PSN Trophy history (https://psnprofiles.com/rosariotummi93) it is possible to see that they are a trophy hunter and appear to have stopped playing with this PSN account in October of 2016. If they have not been banned this will still make it unlikely that they will ever respond to a PSN message or come back to remove their nukes on their own.

So rosariotummi93 has some hacked/modded custom mines on their Command Platform that causes the PS3 systems of nuke-hunters to crash. Their account has been derelict and their Command Platform has been inaccessible to the rest of the playerbase for at least a year...and they have 2 Permanent Nukes that no one outside of a Konami programmer can disarm. As long as even a single Permanent Nuke of any sort exists Disarmament can never be achieved by any player.

Hastatus.
 
Nov 23, 2011
4,231
56
445
Are they hinting that you have to do disarmament on every platform? It's impossible on PS3, 360 and PC because there will be cheaters. Only PS4 and Xbox One are still cheat-proof.
 

Ludens

Banned
Feb 5, 2014
6,900
0
0
Permanent Nukes on MGSV: TPP PS3 (and other consoles?) by reddit user Hastatus_ Atratus

************************************************************************************************************

Another example of an account with Permanent Nukes: rosariotummi93 (PS3) - A player with Command Platforms with so many custom mines it causes the infiltrator's system to crash - September 10 2017

So here is a different situation that causes Permanent Nukes even though the account is visible in the Nuke Tab. Some players had found a way to create more custom mines on their FOBs than they were supposed to be allowed: how I do not know. When players attempt to infiltrate these accounts their system crashes because it cannot handle the excessive number of mines. The numbers of these mines are visible in their FOB stats before you attempt to invade them so you can avoid a system crash. If they are present on the Command Platform their nukes become permanently inaccessible.

Youtube user Baldy Pain has posted videos documenting this situation on the PS3. rosariotummi93 had 2 nukes and 146 mines on their command platform back in August of 2016 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QR8CLFHvFKc). Their account is often visible in the nuke tab and yet they currently still have 2 nukes and 146 mines on their command platform over a year later (September 2017: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6MnUiE1CsAw). Do be aware that only the platforms with the excessive number of mines cannot be invaded: the other platforms can be invaded normally. rosariotummi93 only has excessive mines on their Command and Support Platforms and so his other platforms can be invaded normally.

If one checks their PSN Trophy history (https://psnprofiles.com/rosariotummi93) it is possible to see that they are a trophy hunter and appear to have stopped playing with this PSN account in October of 2016. If they have not been banned this will still make it unlikely that they will ever respond to a PSN message or come back to remove their nukes on their own.

So rosariotummi93 has some hacked/modded custom mines on their Command Platform that causes the PS3 systems of nuke-hunters to crash. Their account has been derelict and their Command Platform has been inaccessible to the rest of the playerbase for at least a year...and they have 2 Permanent Nukes that no one outside of a Konami programmer can disarm. As long as even a single Permanent Nuke of any sort exists Disarmament can never be achieved by any player.

Hastatus.
Sorry but...I think nobody cares for this. You keep posting status about this stuff, but I think at least here there are not people caring about the fact it's impossible to get the ending because some nukes can't be dismantled. You even opened a thread. I don't say you shouldn't do it, you stated your point and you did a good thing, but keeping posting status here hoping for Konami to fix the issue (because we GAF users can't do nothing about) is useless.