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Microsoft’s Xbox boss says Amazon and Google are ‘the main competitors going forward’

DanielsM

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When Phil Spencer gets a call from Nadella and is told they need to get out of the console business before it explodes:
Phil Harrison and Phil Spencer should get together and form a new gaming company (The Two Phils)... they can offer BaaS (Bullshit as a Service).

"If your CEO doesn't buy our bullshit, you'll get a full refund."
 
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MiyazakiHatesKojima

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Phil Harrison and Phil Spencer should get together and form a new gaming company (The Two Phils)... they can offer BaaS (Bullshit as a Service).

"If your CEO doesn't buy our bullshit, you'll get a full refund."
>Phil says Xbox monthly active users are at an all-time high
>Phil says Google and Amazon users are our target demographics

#NeverForget
 

Jigsaah

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Until that 2 billion gamers are under somebody's umbrella the fight still exists. Nobody has them firmly in their camp so far, so even though Stadia is on life support, the prize hasn't been won. Xcloud isnt even out of beta yet so its still too early to call this for anyone. In this, Phil is making sense.

Sony uses Microsoft's Azure but that's only because its something they could not compete with on this level now. Let Sony have a generation like they did this go around and they may be able to build something on their own on the level of Azure at that time. The first chance they get, I believe they will do it. in the meantime they can play a similar game to what Microsoft is doing with VR. Dip their toes in the water and wait and see how hot it gets.

Microsoft needs to fight all the battles and not forget what got them here in the first place. The reason they are even in the conversation is because of Xbox, which competed directly with Playstation. You don't get to just write them off because they aren't a trillion dollar company. I believe Phil knows this. So I can only guess this is a either a resignation from the console war to in part save face, or a resignation to try to unify the console makers against a much larger threat.

Basically "Winter is Coming".
 

Klayzer

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Real question for anybody in the know. Is Sony using Azure services right now? I thought they were still using Amazon and other cloud services.
 

DanielsM

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Sony uses Microsoft's Azure but that's only because its something they could not compete with on this level now.
Sony does not use Azure, not for gaming.

Both Sony and Microsoft are just using racked mounted consoles for streaming anyway.
 
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Branthrax

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This is the second time I believe I have caught you comparing cloud to digital and than trying to form a strawman off of it. Game streaming has almost existed as long as digital downloads. I would say game streaming is the past.... worse performance at more expense (or will be).

Game streaming should be growing at 100s% a quarter to have any real impact in growth, but its not really.
You type so much and say so little. I need to stop wasting my time.
 
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Hobbygaming

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They have access to almost 1 billion users via the MS Store/Windows Store yet they can't sell software on it. :messenger_tears_of_joy: Instead of competing they are trying to run to where the competition isn't.

My significant other will watch Shark Tank every once in a while... usually they jump down people's throats when they start a sales pitch that way.

"We just need 1% of the $500 billion market in X."
"We just need 5% of the 300 million customers currently using X"


Its basically a lie, meaning they really don't have a plan... trying to divert eyes away from their non-existent plan.

Virtualized desktops for instance have existed for a very very long time... yet the general consumer doesn't use them and most of the time have no idea they even existed... because for a consumer it doesn't make much sense. These companies think what works in enterprise/business will translate over to consumers... but there is really no real reason for someone to have a VD subscription at home... it costs more and they can just get on their old PC or their phone.

Phil sold Nadella a big pile of bullshit. :poop: :poop: :poop: :poop: :poop:
It's amazing to me how much access to data that these companies have yet they get so much wrong when trying to sway the consumers

I agree too that instead of facing the real competition they want to go compete elsewhere
 

DanielsM

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You type so much and say so little. I need to stop wasting my time.
No, basically what is going on is you're setting up a strawman to justify your position... I call you out on it... now you are getting upset.

If what you say is true you would see 100s of % of growth per quarter, yet, there is very little evidence that there is any real measurable growth.
 
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Evilms

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Spencer, always the word to make us laugh...


PlayStation 2: 155.1 million consoles sold and 1.537 billion games sold
Xbox: 24 million consoles sold and 165.1 million games sold

PlayStation 3: 87.4 million consoles sold and 999.4 million games sold
Xbox 360: 84 million consoles sold and 937 million games sold

PlayStation 4: 108.9 million consoles sold and 1.181 billion games sold
Xbox: 46.9 million consoles sold and 270 million games sold

So after three generations

Sony : 351.4 million consoles sold and 3.717 billion games sold
Microsoft: 154.9 million consoles sold and 1.372 billion games sold

M$ just realized that Sony was too strong for them in the gaming so they prefer to avoid the confrontation from now on not to be humiliated a fourth time in a row already that it is the shame for them to have been dismantled three times so 4
 

Gavon West

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What's pathetic is some the hot takes in this thread about cloud gaming. Can't even comprehend how some of you actually believe people won't want to play games like Infinite and OW on the go, versus a game like candy crush.

Y'all so salty it's blurring your vision. This is where gaming is heading in the very near future. It won't be the only way to play but it will exist as a viable option. Microsoft has already stated.

One of the biggest advantages next gen is the ability to play something like FH4 on console, go on the road or hit your lunch break and continue playing on your phone or laptop. If you guys really don't think that kind of freedom doesnt appeal to alot of gamers out there, you're in for a rude awakening.
 

ManaByte

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What's pathetic is some the hot takes in this thread about cloud gaming. Can't even comprehend how some of you actually believe people won't want to play games like Infinite and OW on the go, versus a game like candy crush.

Y'all so salty it's blurring your vision. This is where gaming is heading in the very near future. It won't be the only way to play but it will exist as a viable option. Microsoft has already stated.

One of the biggest advantages next gen is the ability to play something like FH4 on console, go on the road or hit your lunch break and continue playing on your phone or laptop. If you guys really don't think that kind of freedom doesnt appeal to alot of gamers out there, you're in for a rude awakening.
The hot takes will change when they can play Last of Us II on the go.
 

mckmas8808

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And people wonder why Xbox keeps failing time and again.

Thata boy Phil. Give up on the type of gamers that play stuff like Zelda, God of War, Mario and Uncharted. Go after that sweet, sweet Candy Crush market.

Count me out though.
BINGO! Phil is lying through his teeth. His main competitors ARE Sony and Nintendo. And now maybe Nvidia with their new service. We ALL know Google Stadia will fail before Holiday 2020. And Amazon has nothing.
 

DeepEnigma

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It's amazing to me how much access to data that these companies have yet they get so much wrong when trying to sway the consumers

I agree too that instead of facing the real competition they want to go compete elsewhere
It's not that they get it wrong. They want to control the message, just like they want to keep pushing the narrative in hopes to sway minds, condition gamers, and control the software completely with streaming garbage (end game, they hope).
 
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DanielsM

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What's pathetic is some the hot takes in this thread about cloud gaming. Can't even comprehend how some of you actually believe people won't want to play games like Infinite and OW on the go, versus a game like candy crush.

Y'all so salty it's blurring your vision. This is where gaming is heading in the very near future. It won't be the only way to play but it will exist as a viable option. Microsoft has already stated.

One of the biggest advantages next gen is the ability to play something like FH4 on console, go on the road or hit your lunch break and continue playing on your phone or laptop. If you guys really don't think that kind of freedom doesnt appeal to alot of gamers out there, you're in for a rude awakening.
You can already do that today, and yesterday on your own equipment for free. This is all very mature tech, I'm confused you haven't heard of it until now.

I'm so confused. If it were so appealing people would have been signing up for the last 10+ years, apparently the appeal stops as soon as they have to pay for it.

This is where gaming is heading in the very near future.
Huh, welcome to like 2009, none of this is new. Its like talking about a Sony walkman as new.
 
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Gavon West

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BINGO! Phil is lying through his teeth. His main competitors ARE Sony and Nintendo. And now maybe Nvidia with their new service. We ALL know Google Stadia will fail before Holiday 2020. And Amazon has nothing.
Wrong! Again, Cloud gaming and services is exactly where this train is going and Sony and Nintendo aren't even a blip on the radar because they don't have a dozen Azure server farms of their own around the world. That makes them extremely vulnerable with Amazon and Google coming in as competitors.

The traditional way of gaming is being left behind. That's why Sony went to Microsoft.
 

mckmas8808

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It's not that they get it wrong. They want to control the message, just like they want to keep pushing the narrative in hopes to sway minds and control the software completely with streaming garbage.
The sad part is most of the video game media actually BUYS the message that MS pushes. Many of them are still mad that gamers pushed back on MS' original plans for the Xbox One with their 24 hour checkin garbage.

Wrong! Again, Cloud gaming and services is exactly where this train is going and Sony and Nintendo aren't even a blip on the radar because they don't have a dozen Azure server farms of their own around the world. That makes them extremely vulnerable with Amazon and Google coming in as competitors.

The traditional way of gaming is being left behind. That's why Sony went to Microsoft.
My dude. Sony just made like $6 Billion in 3 months with their "traditional way of gaming". Show me how that's going away.
 
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DeepEnigma

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The sad part is most of the video game media actually BUYS the message that MS pushes. Many of them are still mad that gamers pushed back on MS' original plans for the Xbox One with their 24 hour checkin garbage.
Shit is whack.
 

DanielsM

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Wrong! Again, Cloud gaming and services is exactly where this train is going and Sony and Nintendo aren't even a blip on the radar because they don't have a dozen Azure server farms of their own around the world. That makes them extremely vulnerable with Amazon and Google coming in as competitors.

The traditional way of gaming is being left behind. That's why Sony went to Microsoft.
I fail to see what Azure or Google or Amazon services has to do with anything, you'll get the same or virtually the same input latency. Microsoft is just rack mounting consoles just like Sony is doing. You are very confused. Microsoft is actually about 10 years behind everyone else, not that means anything as there really isn't any demand for this.

Generally, game streaming has two disadvantages to natively playing:

1. Performance i.e. input latency
2. Costs (more equipment, more electricity, more bandwidth, etc.)
 
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The_Mike

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Guess that's the end of the console war now that Nintendo and Microsoft have surrendered. Things will be a lot more peaceful around here.
Even if there were only one platform there would still be fanboys hating each other. Then they would just argue r why their game taste is better etc.
 
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wolffy71

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Look at it as an evolution of mobile gaming. There was that survey at GDC where devs were focused on mobile almost equal to PS and MS combined. There's huge money in the percentage of people that cant purchase consoles/tv. MS thinks they have a solution to both, console fans and those limited to mobile with the combo of Xbox, PC, and xcloud.
If xbox users, already in tens of millions, start adopting xcloud just to occasionally play while away from home and couple that with consumers interested in a better mobile gaming experience, its easy to see the idea being very successful. The amount of subs and software sold could be huge.
Its a bit of a bet on future tech in this area improving, but it's probably a good one.
 

Gavon West

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The sad part is most of the video game media actually BUYS the message that MS pushes. Many of them are still mad that gamers pushed back on MS' original plans for the Xbox One with their 24 hour checkin garbage.



My dude. Sony just made like $6 Billion in 3 months with their "traditional way of gaming". Show me how that's going away.
I didn't say its going away but its the old way of doing business in the gaming arena. Static consoles are a thing of the past. Cloud gaming adds so much untapped real estate to the gaming community. Its insane!

You don't have to believe it. Just keep watching. You'll see it for yourself.
 
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DanielsM

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I didn't say its going away but its the old way of doing business in the gaming arena. Static consoles are a thing of the past. Cloud gaming adds so much untapped real estate to the gaming community. Its insane!

You don't have to believe it. Just keep watching. You'll see it for yourself.
If that were the case people would have been signing up over the last decade.

I can't think of one thing that cloud gaming adds other than it adds worse performance and more costs.
 
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DanielsM

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Look at it as an evolution of mobile gaming. There was that survey at GDC where devs were focused on mobile almost equal to PS and MS combined. There's huge money in the percentage of people that cant purchase consoles/tv. MS thinks they have a solution to both, console fans and those limited to mobile with the combo of Xbox, PC, and xcloud.
If xbox users, already in tens of millions, start adopting xcloud just to occasionally play while away from home and couple that with consumers interested in a better mobile gaming experience, its easy to see the idea being very successful. The amount of subs and software sold could be huge.
Its a bit of a bet on future tech in this area improving, but it's probably a good one.
All of this has already existed for a decade+, it was a bad bet.

There's huge money in the percentage of people that cant purchase consoles/tv.
If you can't purchase a console, how are you going to afford the subscription... the subscription is still paying for the console, it just isn't sitting at your house. You are paying someone to manage your console., which generally is going to cost more, eventually.
 
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Hobbygaming

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It's not that they get it wrong. They want to control the message, just like they want to keep pushing the narrative in hopes to sway minds, condition gamers, and control the software completely with streaming garbage (end game, they hope).
You're 100% correct. And I hate that there are people that don't care about what bad can come from buying into these game streaming services
 
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Gavon West

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If that were the case people would have been signing up over the last decade.

I can't think of one thing that cloud gaming adds other than it adds worse performance and more costs.
No offense, but that's because you're short sighted. Especially if you can't see what cloud gaming brings to the table. That's a you problem.
 
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DanielsM

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No offense, but that's because you're short sighted. Especially if you can't see what cloud gaming brings to the table. That's a you problem.
There is nothing it adds as it processes have to work the same in the cloud as they do natively, generally speaking, this isn't magic.

My problem is, I know how it works. :messenger_tears_of_joy:

1. Worst performance.
2. More hardware
3. More electricity
4. More bandwidth
5. = more costs
6. = less value

There really is no pro to cloud gaming, game streaming can be done today from ones own equipment for free... if that is your thing... but that is always going to be worse performance, but it at least that option... is free or freeish.
 
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Gavon West

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Yeah! Just think of Crackdown 3 and all those destructible environments!

(I know you mean streaming, but I'm still laughing at the "power of the cloud" all these years later, it never materialized)
Um, actually it did. Titan fall. Forza Motorsport. Forza Horizon and others. They aren't done with cloud destruction yet either. But we've seen Cloud in action this gen.
 

nowhat

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Um, actually it did. Titan fall. Forza Motorsport. Forza Horizon and others. They aren't done with cloud destruction yet either. But we've seen Cloud in action this gen.
Did it materialize in the fashion that was shown at Gamescom for Crackdown 3, like six months before release or so?

(I'll answer it for you, no it didn't and the footage was 100% bullshots)
 

DanielsM

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Um, actually it did. Titan fall. Forza Motorsport. Forza Horizon and others. They aren't done with cloud destruction yet either. But we've seen Cloud in action this gen.
Certain processes can be half off-loaded, but none of them really offer much value. Which is what everyone told Microsoft in 2013-2014 with all da stupid cloud bullshit. The benefits will most probably never equal the cons of complexity, which is why you don't see Microsoft talking about Crackdown 4.

I'm sure a developer will make another run at it... remote processing has technically been in games since the 90s i.e. some mmos.

Offloading in most games doesn't really make sense i.e. Crackdown 3, but you never know - I could seem other developers try certain things... but most games its overkill or a waste of time.

Cloud gaming can possibly make limited sense if performance and costs are not really a concern.

For most gamers, the best value is how most gamers game today - which is why nobody has signed up for cloud gaming for the last decade+.
 
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cireza

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I remember when Nintendo tried saying the Wii was "not competing directly" and caught a ton of flak from hardcore gamers from all camps.
Honestly this kind of argument (made by Spencer) drives me off a bit. I don't see a bright future when this is the actual driving force behind his decisions.

This means that whatever brings new players to the table gets a pass, and this does not mean quality. It was actually pretty shitty with Wii in my opinion. Extremely sad to see gaming going this way.
 
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12Dannu123

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He's not wrong.

  • Amazon has Amazon.com, Twitch, Prime
  • Google has Youtube, Google search, Stadia
  • Microsoft has Xbox Consoles, Mixer, Bing, Game Pass and XCloud.

These 3 companies have strong touch points into their ecosystems. Sony and Nintendo have no presence outside of Consoles.
 
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Gavon West

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Did it materialize in the fashion that was shown at Gamescom for Crackdown 3, like six months before release or so?

(I'll answer it for you, no it didn't and the footage was 100% bullshots)
It didn't materialize in the way we saw of the first footage but the technology that we saw in the final CD3 was extremely impressive! The multi player bombed, yes. But the tech was incredible.

Again though, they aren't done there. That's another advantage XGS will have with their first party games.
 
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Gavon West

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Honestly this kind of argument (made by Spencer) drives me off a bit. I don't see a bright future when this is the actual driving force behind his decisions.

This means that whatever brings new players to the table gets a pass, and this does not mean quality. It was actually pretty shitty with Wii in my opinion. Extremely sad to see gaming going this way.
How the fuck did you even come up this?? "Doesn't mean quality???"

What's sad is how you came to that conclusion in your post. Sheesh!!
 
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navii

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I remember Sega saying that Nintendo wasn't their competitor anymore before the Saturn launch. That worked out well for them.

Edit: even as a dumb high school kid I knew it was a dumb thing to say.
 
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