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[Feindflug]

This is getting way overblown, if your internet or Microsoft's servers are down you always have the option of playing games offline on the 360 while you wait. It's not going anywhere.

So you're saying that our ISPs and MS deciding when we can play the games and system that we'll spent money on is nothing worth of complaining about...I'd say that this getting overblown and getting a lot of attention can only be a good thing.

Also about the 360 alternative, why not get a PS4 or a Wii U and play that whenever I want instead? putting limitations on where and when we can use a gaming console is laughable.

 

[saunderez]

Sweet Billy is the perfect spokesman for this console. He seems to hate consumers exactly as much as Microsoft.

Has Geese come out and defended this guy yet?

Of course he has, he's first on the scene when one of his industry buddies is under fire. No backing down, no admitting your wrong, it's the Arthur Gies way.

 

[Septimius]

Well they havent lost any customers yet.

They have lost me. I was on the fence about nextbox, but this fiasco has completely killed my hype for this particular console, and as such, I very much doubt this console will ever be able to own up to its damaged reputation. And that's the point. With this whole thing coming very closely after SimCity, people actually start to dislike the always online model, since servers can fail. Even if it's meritless, this thing is hurting the reputation of the nextbox, and that will drag into the unveiling, even if it's not always online

 

[Calm Killer]

Love his response about not living in a metropolitan area. I live in a town in WV and I am happy to have 10 mb internet connection here. But if you go 3 miles outside of town the best you can get is a shitty 1 mb dsl from the telephone service here, and they don't even offer it in some areas. So to say deal with, when there are people here that want internet but have no legit option is complete BS. And yes these people are your customers.

 

[bidguy]

I can see a lot of publishers crawling up MS ass if they go through with this. EA would surely be pleased.

 

[DragonSworne]

Here is the single post on this forum from Adam Orth, aka sweet billy. It's a rely to thread "David Jaffe and Sony Designer discuss Halo TV-ad, MOH and respect for veterans" about his comments on veterans.

hey everyone...adam orth here.

a couple of things:

i was surprised at how dave presented our conversation on his blog today. yes, i agreed to it, but i didn't realize he was going to present it as "look what he said" and include a photoshopped image. i simply thought it was going to be an interesting look at one of the many discussions we have daily about games and design etc. i've spoken with dave about this and we're on the same page with me being unhappy about it, but that's life. dave is a public guy and i'm not. i didn't fully understand the ramifications of what him posting our innocent conversation would have. lesson learned.

i stand by my opinion of the commercial. i felt it was disrespectful and i don't need to justify that to OR for anyone. it's just an opinion. i don't really understand why it matters to anyone, but if it does, that's your prerogative. enjoy!

i'm not a fan of the halo series either. it's just not my thing. if it's your thing? great. enjoy!

i'm proud of the work i've done on all the games i've made and am making. some were great, some were not. i think alot of people who post here don't actually make games and those are the people who think that 1 or 2 people are responsible for the outcome of the final product. obviously that isn't true. so to pinpoint me for not making "great games" like halo and not being allowed to have an opinion about games until i make the next halo doesn't make much sense. if you want to believe that? enjoy!

to the people who don't like medal of honor. great. don't play it. i used to make those games and i loved doing it. are they the best games ever? no, but it was a great, great experience that millions of people around the world loved and continue to love. i don't work there anymore, but i support my friends efforts and always look forward to their next effort.

i work for sony. i regret getting involved in this situation with david and i'd hate to have our IM conversation reflect badly on sony as a company. that's the thing that bothers me the most, because it has nothing to do with them. i made a mistake and even though i stand by my opinions 100%, i'm a little embarrassed about this.

at the end of the day, we're talking about VIDEO GAMES. everyone needs to remember that. we aren't changing the world....it's just entertainment and today i learned a lesson about that that i wont forget. in the big picture, none of this is really that important.

finally, i'm totally open to having halo 3 blow me away.

thanks for listening and if anyone wishes to contact me further, you may do so at sweetbilly_@hotmail.com.

- adam.

We should contact Adam Orth at sweetbill_@hotmail.com and see why he's really bad at learning lessons.

 

[eot]

WOW

Maybe he is a nice guy but I can not se him run a company like Microsoft with that attitude.

I'm guessing you haven't seen this then either
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vhh_GeBPOhs

 

[SerRodrik]

Sweet Billy is the perfect spokesman for this console. He seems to hate consumers exactly as much as Microsoft.

Has Geese come out and defended this guy yet?

Surprise!

 

[saunderez]

Here is the single post on this forum from Adam Orth, aka sweet billy. It's a rely to thread "David Jaffe and Sony Designer discuss Halo TV-ad, MOH and respect for veterans" abput his comments on veterans.







We should contact Adam Orth at sweetbill_@hotmail.com and see why he's really bad at learning lessons.

Oops. He forgot to not forget. Better luck next time Sweet Billy.

 

[something fishy]

They have lost me. I was on the fence about nextbox, but this fiasco has completely killed my hype for this particular console, and as such, I very much doubt this console will ever be able to own up to its damaged reputation. And that's the point. With this whole thing coming very closely after SimCity, people actually start to dislike the always online model, since servers can fail.

so people are going to take rumour as and out out fact and dismiss things based on it?

seems crazy to me to make a decision with no facts on something you as yet know nothing about. but that's the internet.

seems quite funny too that people are using internet connected devices to post on the internet about their anger at needing to be connected to the internet.

 

[TAS]

My favorite part of this video is when he has to stop and pant heavily into the mic after 30 seconds of activity.

Cocaine is a hell of a drug.

 

[gravitybear]

thanks a ton to private400 for posting a recap this late in the game. just saw the original tweets yesterday and missed everything else.

 

[grimshawish]

lol Dragon! Bit cruel but funny all the same
Obviously the guy gets far too emotionally involved with the projects he works on and feels the need to defend it even before its a thing lol


The Sweet Billy thing is fucking weird as hell though.

 

[semiconscious]

Genuine question: why would you not have a problem with an artificial limitation that can (either potentially or assuredly depending on where you live) have serious downsides, but with absolutely zero upside for you as a consumer?

I just don't understand the reasoning.

excellent question. mandatory online is like forcing a variable into an equation that works perfectly well without one...

 

[Bedlam]

With this whole thing coming very closely after SimCity, people actually start to dislike the always online model, since servers can fail. Even if it's meritless, this thing is hurting the reputation of the nextbox, and that will drag into the unveiling, even if it's not always online

The guys at MS probably shat their pants when SimShitty happened and showed the world the "benefits" of the brave new always-online future. lol

 

[Dirtyshubb]

Woke up this morning to all of this and it has really blown up since then, been a fantastic thread, especially the reveal of Sweet Billy etc.

Now as far as how this will affect Microsoft, i can see both sides of the argument (serious problems/Casuals won't give a shit) but i honestly think this is really bad for Microsoft.

As we all know their reputation isnt that great at the moment, Windows 8 getting very negative press, Windows Phone etc and the only really thing they had going with the majority liking was the XBOX division, 360 is the preferred console of choice in both US and UK. For the XBOX side to take a serious hit would be very bad for the company as a whole, especially considering Durango is meant to be the final stage in a 3 stage plan to take over the living room. They already had to convince shareholders the huge losses on XBox was needed, then the huge losses for majority of the 360's lifetime (very big part in due to RROD) so for the 3rd and supposedly final and profitable stage to come out to huge negative reactions and possibly luke warm sales/reception would be really bad for them.

Now many have said "casual audience wont give a shit" and i partly agree with them, we have seen many things happen that have gaming enthusiasts up in arms yet most people take it without even questioning it. But the thing you have to remember is this is because these casual people take things at face value, not bothering to do any research to help determine their purchases. Now you may say this only helps the argument that they wont care but when you factor in all the negativity that has been brewing up has now started tipping into mainstream media that has the potential to really snowball.

All it takes is for this story to carry on, mainstream media pick up on it and decide to roll with the negative image of Microsoft, referring to previous failed attempts at other products and there is pretty much no coming back from it then. Microsoft would have to do something really innovative and amazing to be able to come back form that to get anywhere near the success that they are hoping for with Durango.

Hell even if it doesnt turn out to be true regarding always online (even if it seems pretty clear it will be) the damage is already happening, the idea that Microsoft is anti consumer/forcing options on you will have permeated into the general medias bias and we have all seen that once they decide 'this is bad/this is good' they very rarely change that stance, if Microsoft come out and prove them right they will think they have cart blanche to slag off everything they do. The general public who only take what they read in papers etc will start to think "oh the new XBOX? Yeah i have heard really bad things about it" and that will be that for them.

It will be very interesting to see what happens, especially if it is always online as many people are saying because this does have the potential to really blow up in their face.

 

[iMax]

 

[Snegurochka]

ahahah holy shit 45 pages already
love you gaf <3

 

[Flatline]

so people are going to take rumour as and out out fact and dismiss things based on it?

seems crazy to me to make a decision with no facts on something you as yet know nothing about. but that's the internet.

seems quite funny too that people are using internet connected devices to post on the internet about their anger at needing to be connected to the internet.

The last few days we've seen MULTIPLE sources confirming the always-online model and after this it's a certainty that Microsoft was planning to do it. What I don't believe is that Microsoft will continue with that plan, they can't be that stupid after all this.

 

[Dennis]

Woah things sure did escalate overnight. This is probably going to get worse if MS stays quiet lol.

 

[Unknown One]

just was going to type this. Not impossible in this times.

Even with this guy i'm not convinced that MS would do this (always online needed for games). Only If they have GTA5, AC and Madden as one year exclusives. Even then... no way.

That is seriously impractical as they would have to play hundreds of millions just for 2 games. Opposing console owners wouldn't like that. Nobody likes year old ports.

 

[eznark]

Surprise!

My god he is a parody

 

[DragonSworne]

Is the "Hire Veterans" bit coincidental? Holy crap if it is lol

 

[PBY]

The last few days we've seen MULTIPLE sources confirming the always-online model and after this it's a certainty that Microsoft was planning to do it. What I don't believe is that Microsoft will continue with that plan, they can't be that stupid after all this.

After all what? This is Internet outcry, which MS had to know what would happen. I doubt this changes anything- for better or worse

 

[The Living Tribunal]

Holy shit.

 

[bidguy]

Maybe this will force MS to reveal it sooner or they can finally deny this stupid rumor.

 

[Jadedx]

Surprise!

It's not like what he is saying is not true.

 

[Corto]

WOW

Maybe he is a nice guy but I can not se him run a company like Microsoft with that attitude.

Instead he should be here :

I always laugh at that video on the 21 seconds mark he injures his left foot/leg but still keeps the show going. The man is just a relentless beast.

 

[HalfBakedProphet]

"guys I was just joking around, this stuff isn't serious anyway so a can say whatever I want"

 

[JCreasy]

excellent question. mandatory online is like forcing a variable into an equation that works perfectly well without one...

This should be quoted on every page

 

[darkwing]

MS should thank 'sweet billy' , now they know not to mess with this always online stuff

 

[Thorgal]

thanks a ton to private400 for posting a recap this late in the game. just saw the original tweets yesterday and missed everything else.

thanks .but i did not make it .someone else did.

 

[Azih]

Good Lord GAF, do you expect me to be on this forum 24/7? Can you not schedule this drama during the time I'm on?

 

[fluffydelusions]

Someone make a deal with it gif with that guys head pls.

 

[gravitybear]

If I worked on anything non-public I wouldn't even have a twitter account.

It's easy, if you keep your mouth shut you don't get fired for blowing it early. That being said, I'm sort of glad it happened (aside from the obvious eventual tragedy of someone's job), because I believe MS will be forced to publicly respond.

 

[ElectricKaibutsu]

Has Geese come out and defended this guy yet?

Surprise!

Best reply of the thread?

Spoiler

It's at least up there

 

[Shao Kahn Brewing a Stew]

Oh my! 80+ pages of insanity over one of the most shittiest analogy ever, and I missed out on all of it. Time to catch up!

 

[Jigolo]

• IGN: Microsoft Creative Director on Always Online: 'Deal With It'
• Eurogamer: Microsoft creative director dismisses "drama" around always-online consoles
• CVG: Microsoft creative director speaks in favour of 'always online'
• vg247: Always-on: “Deal with it,” says Microsoft creative director
• Gematsu: Microsoft creative director defends ‘always online’
• Huffington Post: Microsoft's Adam Orth Fans Rumour That Next Xbox Requires 'Always On' Internet Connection
• CNET AU: Xbox's Adam Orth doesn't get 'always on' concerns
• CNET UK: Microsoft exec can't see the problem with always online Xbox
• TechRadar: Did Microsoft just confirm an always-online Xbox 720?
• Official XBOX Magazine: Microsoft creative director defends always-online consoles, trades blows with BioWare
• The Verge: Microsoft creative director: 'I don't get the drama' over 'always-on' Xbox rumors
• Kotaku: Microsoft Creative Director 'Doesn't Get The Drama' Around Always-Online Consoles, Devices
• SixthAxis: Microsoft Studio’s Creative Director Speaks About An Always-On Requirement
• The Escapist: Microsoft Exec on Always Online Consoles: "Deal With it"
• Develop: Microsoft exec: I don't get the drama around always-on
• Gameplanet: Got a problem with always-on? "Deal with it" – Microsoft Game Studios creative director
• NowGamer: Xbox 720 Always-On Practically Confirmed

After a shit storm at most of those websites and Reddit. I hope MS caves about the always online.

 

[Revven]

good good but i hoped something else happened

This happened (nice little recap of the events):

I'm not sure where that poster who does thread recaps is -- but I'll try my best..

• NeoGAF user Shinobi screen caps the tweets of Adam Orth, Creative Director at MSFT Studios.
• These tweets contain the fallacious analogies you see in the OP -- in defense of an always-online console box.
• In conjunction with the Kotaku thread about the always-online rumors, this thread blows up.
• The story is picked up by popular gaming sites including CVG, Verge, Kotaku, and others.
• David Jaffe attempts to defend the character of Adam (they were former coworkers) -- but particularly his comments regarding rural towns in the US and their online infrastructure.
• Adam attempts to excuse the tweets as jokes and locks his twitter account.
• Detective-GAF then finds an alleged dev on a separate forum claiming one should keep up with their ISP bills (implying some truth to the rumor).
• Detective-GAF then confirms that alleged dev to be an actual developer working on next-gen games.
• The story continues to blow up on reddit, reaching the front page with thousands of comments.
• A user in the reddit thread claims Adam is an ass in person and he insists on being called 'sweet billy.'
• Detective-GAF then confirms Adam is in fact, sweet billy, here on GAF. And his tweets confirm he is, in fact, an ass.
• Aaron Greenberg claims to be unaware of the existence of Adam Orth. [Insert Sweet Billy joke]

 

[I-hate-u]

wow

 

[Reiko]

After all what? This is Internet outcry, which MS had to know what would happen. I doubt this changes anything- for better or worse

Mentally prepare yourself for a brutal, next gen NPD.

 

[DJ Lushious]

so people are going to take rumour as and out out fact and dismiss things based on it?

seems crazy to me to make a decision with no facts on something you as yet know nothing about. but that's the internet.

seems quite funny too that people are using internet connected devices to post on the internet about their anger at needing to be connected to the internet.

Welcome to NeoGAF!

 

[shinra-bansho]

Remember this post.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=47647432&postcount=5498

There was a post by a poster, Matt, on here who has insider info iirc - indicating this rumor is indeed a reality.

-----

A few more:

• Joystiq: Microsoft Studios creative director dismisses 'always-on' console concerns
• Digital Spy: Microsoft creative director on always-on connections: 'Deal with it'
• JustPushStart: Microsoft Employee Defends Rumored Always Online Feature On Xbox 720
• Technobuffalo: Next Xbox Requires Internet? Microsoft’s Adam Orth Doesn’t Care

Some international flavour:

• Eurogamer Portugal: Diretor Criativo dos Microsoft Studios defende a ligação constante à Internet
• Eurogamer Sweden: Microsoft-anställd bemöter kritik kring ständig uppkoppling
• JVN: Nouvelle Xbox : pas de jeu possible sans connexion internet ?

 

[flyinpiranha]

Holy shit. I've been catching up for the past hour. I can't believe the audacity of some of these public figures that are supposed to be representing their companies.

As much as I love Forza, Halo 4 didn't impress me all that much and Fable is gone, Gears is not my thing .... MS is making it extremely difficult for me to purchase their next console.

The 360 was by far my favorite of the past 7 or so years. But I honestly have no desire for the next iteration with all the rumors and speculation. I don't like the path they've chosen in the past two years and I'm not really enjoying what the vision is for their future.

So far everything Sony has showed has been something I want (outside of real names - optional, and Social integration - optional).

Seriously, I would imagine MS has to say something today. It's gotten too big.

 

[Flatline]

After all what? This is Internet outcry, which MS had to know what would happen. I doubt this changes anything- for better or worse

Are you seriously trying to imply that internet is irrelevant? This has been the top story in one of the biggest sites and the biggest gaming forum on the internet for a day, how the fuck can a company ignore that kind of volume of bad publicity?

 

[Uno Venova]

Holy shit, I did not expect the thread to almost double overnight. Catching up.

 

[Unknown One]

Sony should thank 'sweet billy' , now they know not to mess with this always online stuff

Fixed....hopefully.

 

[grimshawish]

Welcome to NeoGAF!

 

[BloodMoney]

Wow, this topic exploded overnight. 4,000+ posts...

 

[Revven]

seems quite funny too that people are using internet connected devices to post on the internet about their anger at needing to be connected to the internet.

I don't lose access to my whole computer if my internet goes out.