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Mistwalker's next project artwork

clashfan

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Sep 20, 2006
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stuburns said:
What? Those statements are contradictory in any sense.

I'll try and explain for you in case I wasn't clear. We don't know the specifics of LOs budget, but we do know that other companies consider similar sales numbers, a bomb, for example we know Mirror's Edge sold over a million and EA consider it a bomb.

The other statement was, being first doesn't always mean winning. If you still don't make a profit it's still a bomb.
You are going around in circles... :lol
 

gregor7777

Banned
Jan 17, 2007
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stuburns said:
What? Those statements are contradictory in any sense.

I'll try and explain for you in case I wasn't clear. We don't know the specifics of LOs budget, but we do know that other companies consider similar sales numbers, a bomb, for example we know Mirror's Edge sold over a million and EA consider it a bomb.

The other statement was, being first doesn't always mean winning. If you still don't make a profit it's still a bomb.
Nice try :lol
 

clashfan

Member
Sep 20, 2006
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stuburns said:
In what sense?

Please explain how that doesn't make sense and I'll try and make it clear.

1) Goto part 2 of my post to see more detail...































2) goto part 1 of my post for more clarification...
 

MoogPaul

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Dec 28, 2007
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Mirror's Edge sold over a million split between 2 consoles. LO sold more than Mirror's Edge did on any specific console.
 

StuBurns

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Jan 9, 2008
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MoogPaul said:
Mirror's Edge sold over a million split between 2 consoles. LO sold more than Mirror's Edge did on any specific console.
Are you suggesting that a game on two consoles needs to sell double to make a profit?

LO almost certainly had a larger development budget than Mirror's Edge. And a bigger promotional budget.
 

bloodforge

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Sep 10, 2005
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The design is way to "busy". This personifies everything I dislike about most modern Japanese character designs. What happened to simple designs.
 

gregor7777

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Jan 17, 2007
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stuburns said:
Are you suggesting that a game on two consoles needs to sell double to make a profit?

LO almost certainly had a larger development budget than Mirror's Edge. And a bigger promotional budget.
The point I originally made, before you dug your hole, was that by your own standard you have no idea if the game was a commercial success for Mistwalker. It's all guesswork.

So please stop talking out of your ass for your own sake, or not....for our sake. :D
 

Dabanton

Member
May 25, 2007
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Love the look of the picture LO was great i really hope we see another console game from them soon.
 

mujun

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Dec 5, 2008
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LiquidMetal14 said:
No mind to me as I have one but his studio needs to start making some PS3/Wii games.
are you calling for a one console future?

should insomniac for example be making games for 360/wii?
 

StuBurns

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Jan 9, 2008
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gregor7777 said:
The point I originally made, before you dug your hole, was that by your own standard you have no idea if the game was a commercial success for Mistwalker. It's all guesswork.

So please stop talking out of your ass for your own sake, or not....for our sake. :D
Not once in this thread have I said that it WAS a bomb, I said I think it was, and it would be by other studios standards. I never said Mistwalker consider it a bomb.

But, I agree that this discussion should be dropped. It's off-topic.
 

MoogPaul

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Dec 28, 2007
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stuburns said:
Are you suggesting that a game on two consoles needs to sell double to make a profit?

LO almost certainly had a larger development budget than Mirror's Edge. And a bigger promotional budget.
No, obviously a four disc rpg budget is going to be larger than a first person runner(?), but yes, more consoles, the larger the budget. Not double, but probably around 1.5 times. But you are comparing profit to profit. The main goal around these Mistwalker titles were to move consoles, not make money. In that respect, I would think that these two titles would be considered a success. The NA and PAL sales were probably icing on the cake.
 

StuBurns

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Jan 9, 2008
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MoogPaul said:
No, obviously a four disc rpg budget is going to be larger than a first person runner(?), but yes, more consoles, the larger the budget. Not double, but probably around 1.5 times. But you are comparing profit to profit. The main goal around these Mistwalker titles were to move consoles, not make money. In that respect, I would think that these two titles would be considered a success. The NA and PAL sales were probably icing on the cake.
Mistwalker aren't a Microsoft studio. Microsoft are just investors.

I suggested earlier in the thread that to Microsoft it probably was a success, but maybe not for Mistwalker because they don't benefit directly from the same things as Microsoft, they benefit from sales.

If they were like Naughty Dog, a first party studio, that would be different.
 

MoogPaul

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Dec 28, 2007
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stuburns said:
Mistwalker aren't a Microsoft studio. Microsoft are just investors.

I suggested earlier in the thread that to Microsoft it probably was a success, but maybe not for Mistwalker because they don't benefit directly from the same things as Microsoft, they benefit from sales.

If they were like Naughty Dog, a first party studio, that would be different.
well, to know that we would have to know the specifics of how much of the projects came out of microsoft's pockets and how much of mistwalkers plus the percentage split of the money gained from sales... which we'll probably never know.
 
Sep 24, 2007
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MoogPaul said:
well, to know that we would have to know the specifics of how much of the projects came out of microsoft's pockets and how much of mistwalkers plus the percentage split of the money gained from sales... which we'll probably never know.

IIRC i read a long time ago that BD and LO had a combined budget of 20 million. No idea on the break down for each game.
 

Fuu

Formerly Alaluef (not Aladuf)
Nov 22, 2007
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Kimihiko! Thank God, I was afraid he would disappear again after Cry On was canned.

dragonlife29 said:
I love this man. Seriously.

Also: Eeeeeeeek! :D:D:D The art gives off such a Drakengard vibe that I'm getting goosebumps!

I was so bummed when Cry On was canceled...I hope this one is in conjuction with Cavia--or just like Drakengard :D

*hugs Fuu*
*hugs back*

Keeping the dream alive!
 

LiquidMetal14

hide your water-based mammals
Jan 18, 2007
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mujun said:
are you calling for a one console future?

should insomniac for example be making games for 360/wii?
They can do what they want. They actually sell a decent amount of software for just 1 platform. Mystwalker has missed more than hit. It would benefit them in particular and everyone would win. Not a bias thing but a way for their games to reach a bigger base (especially in Japan)
 

dragonlife

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RPGCrazied

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Lost Odyssey II?

Doesn't have to star Kaim, it could be all new immortals or something. I hope so, I loved LO
 

gregor7777

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Jan 17, 2007
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RPGCrazied said:
Lost Odyssey II?

Doesn't have to star Kaim, it could be all new immortals or something. I hope so, I loved LO
I hope it is. I'd rather they refine an existing system than create something new again. For their next project, that is.
 

thetrin

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Sep 14, 2005
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dragonlife29 said:
I love this man. Seriously.

Also: Eeeeeeeek! :D:D:D The art gives off such a Drakengard vibe that I'm getting goosebumps!

I was so bummed when Cry On was canceled...I hope this one is in conjuction with Cavia--or just like Drakengard :D

*hugs Fuu*

Another Drakengard fan? :D
Or was that sarcasm?

And, yeah, it's a total tease :(
Why would you ever WANT something in conjunction with Cavia? :(

PSGames said:
You thought Kaim was a bad? WTF? He's one of the better designed JRPG characters in a long time.
Are you serious? He looks like a coke addict at a Renaissance Fair. He's easily the least appealing Takehiko Inoue character I've seen in a long time. And I LOVE Takehiko Inoue.
 

John Harker

Definitely doesn't make things up as he goes along.
Feb 26, 2005
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Y2Kev said:
No. Fable, Oblivion, and I'd wager Fallout is ahead in the US and Europe on Xbox as well.
Well, I wasn't really considering Fable or Oblivion to be RPGs, but I suppose one could make an argument either way. Not a biggie. Point still stands, LO #1 jrpg, which was just to who said it bombed anyway
 

dragonlife

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thetrin said:
Why would you ever WANT something in conjunction with Cavia? :(
Because I loved their own IP series, Drakengard. Bullet Witch is definitely bought when I get a 360 and--regardless of what I've heard--I'm sure I'll like it.

They have my respect for their own titles, not their other stuff like the Naruto games and such.

(It was pretty cool that they're behind development for Umbrella Chronicles, which I liked...:D)

Oh, and I love Kimihiko Fujisaka's art, which I first encountered with the Drakengard games...

It's total love, man :D
 

Rad Agast

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Jun 7, 2007
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stuburns said:
Are you suggesting that a game on two consoles needs to sell double to make a profit?

LO almost certainly had a larger development budget than Mirror's Edge. And a bigger promotional budget.
Not necissarilly double, no. /Pulling figures out of my ass... I would say a multi-platform title would cost an extra 25-30% more for each extra platform so you'll need roughly 30% more revenue to break even.

P.S. Don't know how well LO and Blue Dragon did financially but they were quite enjoyable classic turn-based J-RPGs for me. I'll take any thing Mistwalker will throw my way.
 

JudgeN

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Apr 12, 2007
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stuburns said:
Half a million units? That's not enough. Even if they broke even, which I highly doubt, the idea is to make enough profit to warrant the project in the first place.

A couple of weeks ago John Davison said a ground up 'next-gen' game needs to sell around 2.5 million to make money, including promotion etc. Maybe that's a little exaggerated, but 500k is no where near.

Maybe bomb is extreme, but I consider LO a bomb considering it's a really good JRPG and a platform exclusive.
That doesn't sound right, when the PS3 was first released namco and capcom went to say that the average game cost 16-17 million and they need to sale at least 500k to break even. 2.5 million sounds way way way off.
 

StuBurns

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Jan 9, 2008
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JudgeN said:
That doesn't sound right, when the PS3 was first released namco and capcom went to say that the average game cost 16-17 million and they need to sale at least 500k to break even. 2.5 million sounds way way way off.
It sounded off to me as well. But I just assume he knows what he's talking about.

But EA said Mirror's Edge was a flop and that sold over a million units.
 

zoukka

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Nov 18, 2006
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John Harker said:
You laugh, but the art wins. Because this person is clearly a man, and not a cliche 16 year old. Whether or not he has amnesia is still yet to be determined.
Scrape the dirt off his chin and he could go as a girl.