Mobile Suit Gundam Iron Blooded Orphans S2TEKKADAN is MURDERERS, HAIL GHALLARJORN

gatti-man

Member
Berserk Barbatos...... the way they animated those scenes sticks in my mind. His claws dropping with blood and eyes glowing red. I feeel like watching the end just to watch that again. Might be my favorite anime scene of all time.
 
The Bandai kits for the VF-31 Siegfried from Macross Delta are all very great kits with good color separation and one of the better transformation gimmicks.

You get a whole set of waterslide decals to use rather than foil seals, so that isn't a problem whatsoever.

I really recommend getting it. The Draken, requires some paining because of the molding process, but it's just as good of a kit.

Here is my own personal 1/72 Bandai VF-31.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CnIcDhcVYAEYUI6.jpg[IMG] [IMG]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CnIcDhuVUAMy8hz.jpg[IMG]
[IMG]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CnIcDhaUMAALQJX.jpg[IMG]
[IMG]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CnIcDhbUcAAuR3e.jpg[IMG]

You can check your local hobby store as they are still in stock at a suggested retail price of 5,600円 but they regularly go on sale for as low as 3,000円 for very good MG sized kits.[/QUOTE]

Yeah I saw some in display in Japan and they were sexy looking beasts.

Macross jets in general, I really like how they look. Futureisitic enough but they still look like jets you know.

Need to try my hand at one of the sdf's oneday.
 

Haly

One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
5 years ago I had this to say about 0080: War tn the Pocket

So, let's talk about War in the Pocket.

This is a series marketed to stupid little kids who glorify war by purchasing little plastic models of weapons of mass destruction.

This is also a story about a stupid little kid who goes from glorifying war during wartime to learning that people die when they are killed the hard way, by seeing his surrogate father/brother get turned into hamburger by a beam saber.

This is also about how children must abandon their naivete in order to become adults.

Make of that what you will.
And I think since then, Sunrise had never so plausibly delivered a self-consistent anti-war story as IBO. IBO had many flaws, including a too long season 1 and too short season 2, but it rises above its flaws while every modern Gundam outside of GBF succumbs to theirs. IBO is up there for me with 0080 and 08th MS Team. Not quite in the same tier because of its shortcomings, but right behind them all the same.
 

Rymuth

Member
Okay, enough time has passed for me to sort through my thoughts.

This was a very solid series. Not perfect because it had a few missteps along the way.

First off, the series has the misfortune of being born in a post-Fukuda era where Sunrise's sensibilities can often bring down a series. As Hideki Ohwada (through Char) said in Gundam-San, if 0079 got released today then every character gets a Gundam and every girl has DD cups.
Yes, I get it, a Gundam series lives and dies by the kits it sells but there are times when an MS gets introduced for no reason than for it to have a model, whether it serves the plot or not. The White Shiden, Gundam Vidar etc --- I used to buy kits not because they looked cool but because they did something cool in the series and I wanted to relive that. It really is the Prequel/OT comparison. People wanted to buy Luke Skywalker models to relive him slicing the AT-AT and not Dexter Shmester (or whatever the name of that diner alien from Ep II)

Point B on the Fukuda-age sensibilities is the Moe factor. I never cared for Atra and at times borderline disliked her. Such a cynically design character (those fucking cat ears could not be more obvious) - her and Almiria were created for a very specific audience in mind and that's a real shame.

So that's a point knocked off.

Second, they couldn't commit to their execution. Lot of people failed to understand why Tekkadan needed to lose in the finale because the message was lost amidst flashy scenes of Mika looking cool.
The S2 initial arc with Chad should've been completely scrapped. Either use those extra episodes to flesh out the existing cast (Kudelia sorely needed some screen time, McG needed to be less of an idiot) --or-- do the arc but from the POV of the child soldiers on the opposite side. The main Tekkadan members are absent in this arc anyway so why not commit to it fully and make a bunch of new characters for this storyline. In this instance, you'll be able to expand on your world building, show the sideeffects of Tekkadan's influence on the world AND set-up Tekkadan's downfall as a satisfying conclusion for *all* fans when they suddenly roflstomp our new characters to death whilst self-wanking about "Orga's plaaaaaaceeee, waaaaaaa~~"

Not since NGE have I seen a series where the majority of the fanbase didn't 'get the point' and I believe an arc like that would've helped everyone catch on but, eeeh---c'est la vie. Another point knocked down.


In summation - 8/10, very good series that I've enjoyed but lament the missed oppportunites. I've had a wonderful time in both threads and look forward to whatever Sunrise cooks next and what Shun has in store for the next OT.
 

Blader

Member
Great, great finale. This show really impressed me. I wasn't expecting much from it at the start, and thought the first season was a slog to get through at times. But things really took off in season 2 and improved on season 1 in pretty much way, wrapping things up in a just about perfect ending. Easily a top 10 Gundam production.
 
Okay, enough time has passed for me to sort through my thoughts.

This was a very solid series. Not perfect because it had a few missteps along the way.

Not since NGE have I seen a series where the majority of the fanbase didn't 'get the point' and I believe an arc like that would've helped everyone catch on but, eeeh---c'est la vie. Another point knocked down.


In summation - 8/10, very good series that I've enjoyed but lament the missed oppportunites. I've had a wonderful time in both threads and look forward to whatever Sunrise cooks next and what Shun has in store for the next OT.

-snip- and agree whole heartedly.

The series could have been better but your right on all points as well. As much as I enjoyed their attempt to build up the world so much, it felt really bloated in areas. The Chad arc, the weird Mika threeway romance (I get it, it was a they know no real way of thinking about it) and more just felt like throw away scnarios where we could have gotten better looks at the Gundams they introduced, just to toss away. Vidar, Khimaris, Bael, Flarous especially, and Guison Full City.

Feels like there could have been way more action than we got, though the end was great. The human drama was definitely the best part and I love a good gangster story which this very much is. Like you it baffles me how a lot don't understand or like the ending.

I get it most anime fans just want to watch anime and see the lead win, but thats not what this story was about really. The vast majority don't want to or like to think about what they just saw I guess -shrug- thats the whole reason I watch stuff personally.
 

Paltheos

Member
My opinion is that all Macross TV shows are different flavors of bad, and the only worthwhile entries are OVAs or movies because they waste less of your time. But if you really MUST watch a Macross TV series, I would go with Macross 7.

I don't get it. I watched Macross 7 a couple years ago. It was nigh-unwatchably bad. It's long, repetitive, boring, tedious, and, for me, far worse than anything else I'd seen in the franchise. (Macross II is also garbage tier but has the advantage of being mercifully short).

Macross Frontier's not bad. It looks great, it sounds great. It's got Yoko Kanno behind it for the music, and the pop songs are all really catchy (except Triangular which is decidedly average). The world and technology are all fun to look at and learn about. Not all... in a terribly deep way, but it succeeds at being good popcorn entertainment because it has so much behind the production and because it doesn't mess that much up. Yeah, Alto is awful because he's so much less interesting than everyone else around him, and the villains are ultimately underwhelming. I don't care. Stuff like the Nijo Iro Kuma Kuma concert scene are such a wonder to watch, and the final action sequence for Sayonara no Tsubasa so exciting because all the elements of the movie climax brilliantly all at once. Totes worth it and I won't hear you badmouthing it!

I have pretty strong feelings for Macross Zero too but oddly not much to say about it. I just remember going into it not expecting much and then being won over by legitzo good stuff. At least until the second half which is dominated by a pair of crazy soldiers who would have surely been court-martialed for something crazy they definitely would have done before all this and who kinda ruined the whole thing for me.
 

Haly

One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
Sauce and deets come on man you can' just leave us dumb anglophones hanging.

It's probably a megabomb like Akatsuki isn't Mika's kid.

Or Mika lost his virginity to Orga first.

Or Mika was fucking Hush bareback on the side
 

casiopao

Member
Sauce and deets come on man you can' just leave us dumb anglophones hanging.

It's probably a megabomb like Akatsuki isn't Mika's kid.

Or Mika lost his virginity to Orga first.

Or Mika was fucking Hush bareback on the side

Or we are going to get a new movie called Ride's Flash and Almiria Counterattack.^^

You all want it.^^
 

Haly

One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
"Orga and Mika aren't really dead." -Mari Okada
 

Sandfox

Member
So what was said?

Based on the translation I've seen:
-Every other potential ending had every member of Tekkedan + Kudelia dying because Nagai felt none of them deserved to live and needed to pay for their actions. Okada fought for the ending we got, which was the most positive, with the last five episodes being rewritten as a result.
-Okada admitted to never having any confidence in the writing for the second season
-Gaelio got special treatment because Okada liked his voice and she wanted him as MC because of it

I think more details are supposed to come next month.
 

MaxDOL

Member
Uh, apparently the last Okada's interview sparked some pretty heated reactions in the JP fanbase (and non)?

I can not read Japanese so take it with the grain of salt.
Some one post the scan of the interview in our local Thai forum and they said they intend to kill most of the Tekkadan members (Gundam Zeta style) because they are terrorist that murder other people.
But the female writer change the story to one that air because she think the viewers are attracted to Tekkadan and do not want them to die.
 
Based on the translation I've seen:
-Every other potential ending had every member of Tekkedan + Kudelia dying because Nagai felt none of them deserved to live and needed to pay for their actions. Okada fought for the ending we got the most positive ending, withthe last five episodes were rewritten as a result.
-Okada admitted to never having any confidence in the writing for the second season
-Gaelio got special treatment because Okada liked his voice and she wanted him as MC because of it

I think more details are supposed to come next month.

So much for a well planned out finale, lol.
 

duckroll

Member
So is anyone still laughing at my comments about how Tekkadan is a terrorist organization and how none of them deserved to live? Hahahahahaha.
 

StayDead

Member
So is anyone still laughing at my comments about how Tekkadan is a terrorist organization and how none of them deserved to live? Hahahahahaha.

Tekkadan were more anarchists than terrorists until the second season started. They got caught up in violence trying to save themselves from what was essentially slavery.

The second season was more once again them getting involved to try and improve things for themselves, but then they just backed the wrong horse. I don't think they were ever really terrorists.

Also they did bad things, but not all of them deserved to die.
 
So is anyone still laughing at my comments about how Tekkadan is a terrorist organization and how none of them deserved to live? Hahahahahaha.

Yeah I am.

It was a dumb comment.

Only a handful of people in this show deserved to die, none of them were tekkadan. Doesn't make them good guys either.
 
So is anyone still laughing at my comments about how Tekkadan is a terrorist organization and how none of them deserved to live? Hahahahahaha.
I still don't consider Tekkadan as terrorist and I'm really happy they mostly all survived. None of them particularly deserved to die.
 

kurahador

Member
So the original ending has Tekkadan and Kudelia gets wiped while the war criminal and pedophile lives.

I'll take the one we get.
 
So is anyone still laughing at my comments about how Tekkadan is a terrorist organization and how none of them deserved to live? Hahahahahaha.
They were not really a terrorist organization just a scapegoat to further the agenda of Rustal Elion. It was just convenient for him that they allied with McGillis.
 
NONE of them were Tekkadan.O_O

HAHAHAHAHAAHA

Yeah none if them.

The people that deserved to die were the sex slave traders, slave traders, child abusers and peados.

Not the disenfranchised war children who were being played by one adult or another from day one until they got into something over their heads.

It's cool bro. Pretty sure al qaida didn't either.

Thanks for reminding me why I don't partake in anime discussions, nothing but edgy kids.
 

Blader

Member
I like the moral ambiguity and blurred lines between good and evil of the ending we got compared to a purely kill-em-all ending. And it's not as if many of Tekkadan weren't killed as is.
 
I mean if you don't automatically empathize with tekkadan more simply because most of them are war orphans/slaves you're probably a sociopath.
 
This was the first Gundam in like forever, that didn't shit the bed in it's finale. Even great Gundam TV series tended to just get messy at the end. I like they went with slightly different approach this time.
 

casiopao

Member
I mean if you don't automatically empathize with tekkadan more simply because most of them are war orphans/slaves you're probably a sociopath.

I emphathize with them on S1 for sure there. I sure as hell won't back them anymore in S2 especially when they are now Space Yakuza and aiding a coup vs the world lol.

You thought we are idiot?
 
I emphathize with them on S1 for sure there. I sure as hell won't back them anymore in S2 especially when they are now Space Yakuza and aiding a coup vs the world lol.

You thought we are idiot?

Considering the world was screwed up enough to allow them to be sold in slavery, and turned into war machines, I think it's pretty understandable they'd try to rise up against such a corrupt government.
 

Haly

One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
I would sympathize with slave uprisings yes, even if they murder their owners. I don't see this as very controversial.

Would you condemn the Haiti Revolution for overthrowing the French colonials?

Gjallerhorn has more pedophiles at positions of massive political power than the British Parliament.
 
Considering the world was screwed up enough to allow them to be sold in slavery, and turned into war machines, I think it's pretty understandable they'd try to rise up against such a corrupt government.

I might sympathize with them more if their goal of rising up against said government was coming from a moral or ideological standpoint, but Orga himself joined and participated only in exchange for becoming "King of Mars", which just made it sound like (to me) that the Mars would just be trading one tyrant for another.
 

Shouta

Member
Did Tekkadan commit any serious war crime in S2? Heck, they even saved Mars from Lol's fuckup with the MA.

War crime? Siding with McGillis in his coup-d'etat is the most notable. They killed the Mars association guy and Jasley but that was in retaliation for them attacking Tekkadan and the Turbines.

Every other thing they did was actually on the right side of things. Coming to the defense of Arbrau when Rustal Elion sent Beardy Face to incite war, stopped the rampaging MA that Iok made go berserk, and came to the defense of the Turbines when Iok and Gjallarhorn were trying to massacre non-combatants.

Tekkadan were space Yakuza basically but they were being pretty legitimate until everyone else decided to fuck with them.
 

Haly

One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
War crime? Siding with McGillis in his coup-d'etat is the most notable. They killed the Mars association guy and Jasley but that was in retaliation for them attacking Tekkadan and the Turbines.
This is not a war crime. A crime yes, possibly treasonous depending on how you look at it (although para-military outfits seem legal in Gjallerhorn's world), but I think Taruranto was specifically referring to internationally banned weapons like, say, Dainslefs... or chemical bombs.

*ahem*

The closest Tekkadan got to it was firing their own Dainslef from Flauros and it technically missed.
 

Shouta

Member
This is not a war crime. A crime yes, possibly treasonous depending on how you look at it (although para-military outfits seem legal in Gjallerhorn's world), but I think Taruranto was specifically referring to internationally banned weapons like, say, Dainslefs... or chemical bombs.

*ahem*

The closest Tekkadan got to it was firing their own Dainslef from Flauros and it technically missed.

Oh, yeah. Brain fart. The Dainslef would be the closest then.
 
Who was it that was it that was inciting the colony rebellion by providing them with weapons so that they could wipe them all out at once back in season 1. I don't remember.
 

Shouta

Member
Who was it that was it that was inciting the colony rebellion by providing them with weapons so that they could wipe them all out at once back in season 1. I don't remember.

As I recall, it was Nobliss Gordon who did that. He tried to frame Tekkadan and Kudelia as the people that armed the colonies and wanted her Kudelia to die to incite rebellions on Mars. That was under the guise of helping her out, I think.
 
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