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Mortal Kombat 11’s Changes to Female Characters is “Sexist”

Dunki

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Oct 24, 2017
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YouTuber Liana Kerzner took NetherRealm Studios, Warner Bros. and Mortal Kombat 11 to task following their radical character design changes to many of their female characters. Kerner derided the changes calling it “benevolent sexism.”


Kerzner begins her video by defining “benevolent sexism” saying, “the type of sexism that reinforces an apparently positive sex role binary that are men are strong and women are kind. It seems temporary beneficial for women in the short term, but can become a real problem as things go on and women have higher aspirations and women step outside traditional binaries.”
https://boundingintocomics.com/2019...t-11s-changes-to-female-characters-is-sexist/

peope who are ok with these changes need to watch this. I think she can explain why this is sexist very well.

 

Dice

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Jun 6, 2004
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Yes, when you basically tell women “we are designing our characters to be respectful” and then put various controls on sexuality/beauty, you are telling them that they are only respectable women if they conform to your standards of presentation and are disrespecting themselves if they contradict it with their character preferences or self expression.

Also if you make your female character design decisions based on what manner a man may enjoy looking at them, actively presuming what potential enjoyment he may find and in your judgment deciding what he should not be allowed to find, and have no such presumption and prohibition mindset in regards to how women might view the male characters, you are being sexist.

I personally think the character designs are perfectly fine as well as attractive, however their mindset behind those designs, the double standard with the male character designs, and the virtue signaling in that interview are rather problematic and arrogant. Now, some would say I'm being disingenuous to social context with that, since men are more often sexual offenders, but within that notion is the fallacious reasoning.

It goes something like this:
1) Men are most often sexual offenders.
2) Sexual offenders appear to have a subculture of turning their attractions into the objectification, disparaging, and abuse of women. This is "rape culture" and one can see the way different depictions of media may feed it.
3) Rape culture is responsible for misogyny and abuse of women.
4) We must rid all cultural expressions of what can potentially feed into this.

Almost seems reasonable in a certain light, but in it are obvious problems:
1) It is saying that the attractions normal men experience upon viewing beauty and feminine sexuality is part of rape culture and makes them into rapists.
2) It is puritanical in cultural expressions to avoid contributing to rape culture while fearing victim-blaming and thus perceives itself as not, by way of its depictions, condemning women who are not puritanical in their self-expression.
3) The combination of 1 & 2 reveal the additional presumption which is that men thoughtlessly form their perceptions and personal character according to media and apparent extremes that their imaginations take as the meaning of that media, yet women apparently do not.
4) Apparently this is only true of sexual violence, and everyone is immune from other forms of violence in their media turning them into murderers.

So I find this kind of stuff offensive not because it is "taking away" scantily clad women or anything like that, but because it is communicating a message that I am a wild beast ruled by my passions, yet perhaps even worse, as apparently I won't only mindlessly follow what I am shown, but also dream up all sorts of additional nasty things by way of it to disparage and use women in some sort of sadism, like I'm perhaps inclined, simply by being a man, to surpass beast and be a sort of demon. Besides that, there is also the hidden disparagement of women's freedoms and beauty in it that is supposedly feminist yet anti-femininity.
 
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May 26, 2018
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The dictionary definition of sexism is unfair and unequal treatment between both genders, often out of prejudice towards a particular sex (hatred of females if it's misogyny, hatred of males if misandry) ... so yes, sexualizing only male characters (not both, like what Tekken would do with both D-cups and shirtless males) like MK11 just did would be actually sexist on its own.
To prove it's sexist, you shouldn't abide by the worldview that misandry doesn't exist, and then try and find side effects of sexist acts that happen to harm the gender you don't hate.
 

Blood Borne

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Oct 30, 2017
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The left are now telling women to cover up. They’re no different from religious zealots.
 
Oct 26, 2018
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The left are now telling women to cover up. They’re no different from religious zealots.
That doesn't even make sense. If anything, liberals are the ones who love nude beaches, want new mothers to be allowed to breast feed kids in public, and don't want women to be forced to wear archaic multi-layered ankle length dresses (I have no idea how men and women survived the heat in big dresses and suit and ties back then!).

But now, they want people to be covered up like a right wing conservative prude? Who knew.

Whether someone is left or right, at least give credit to righties..... they typically stick with their views and don't have totally contradicting views.
 

Ar¢tos

Member
Oct 24, 2017
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Games now need a certification like movies have the "no animals harmed during production".
For games will be:
"All female characters designed by a multi-nationality multi-race multi-religion and diverse sexual orientation women only team".
"All male characters designed by a multi-nationality multi-race multi-religion and diverse sexual orientation men only team".
That should solve it.
 

angelic

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Apr 18, 2013
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That doesn't even make sense. If anything, liberals are the ones who love nude beaches, want new mothers to be allowed to breast feed kids in public, and don't want women to be forced to wear archaic multi-layered ankle length dresses (I have no idea how men and women survived the heat in big dresses and suit and ties back then!).

But now, they want people to be covered up like a right wing conservative prude? Who knew.

Whether someone is left or right, at least give credit to righties..... they typically stick with their views and don't have totally contradicting views.

That's the point, left brained people are hypocrites, their ideology is contradictory. Hey everyone, let's all just go free, as long as you play by our rules.

It's in everything they do. Hey let's make up a racial assault and hanging attempt to show fake racism. Aww, Mr Smollet, we can see you were only joking, you can go free.
 

Jubenhimer

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Nov 11, 2018
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I won't go as far as to call it "Sexist". But like I said in that last thread on this topic, It feels like its just NRS' pandering to radical third wave feminism because they feel like they have to, not because of any functional benefit. Give Team Ninja credit, they at least gave a valid reason for why they downplayed the sexuality in DOA6. Focusing more on eSports, means that distracting titlation needs to be toned down, especially when cash is at stake. Even then, it's far from gone.

This feels like yet another example of western developers bowing to what they think feminists want based on hyperboles and buzzwords.
 

Dragon Lord

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Jan 26, 2019
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Yes, when you basically tell women “we are designing our characters to be respectful” and then put various controls on sexuality/beauty, you are telling them that they are only respectable women if they conform to your standards of presentation and are disrespecting themselves if they contradict it with their character preferences or self expression.

That's really well summarized. This issue has bugged me for ages, but I've never been good at explaining it.
 

lukilladog

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Feb 6, 2018
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Brutalness is fine, exposed female skin is bad, and feminist´s opinion on cloth banning is irrelevant. What a nice product they got there, I know a couple of markets where they are gonna love this, I should contact Netherealm.
 

stickkidsam

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Jan 7, 2018
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I think if we all just stand naked together, in front of the studio, that we will be able to show them what the true meaning of respect is.

It's not illegal if it's in protest.
 

Ixiah

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Feb 16, 2018
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Wow....its offensive when Woman in games are Sexy, its offensive when they are not....
I wonder when Devs just stop listening altogether....
 

bitbydeath

Member
Nov 25, 2015
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I hear that in MK12 the women will have fatalities replaced with friendship moves like baking a cake or blowing a non-sexual kiss.
 

MichaelP

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Apr 23, 2014
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Oh ffs, it's never going to be right is it?

Female gaming characters with few clothes on then their male counterparts: sexist according to women.
Female gaming characters with more clothes on then their male counterparts: still sexist according to women.

It's a fucking (is it allowed to swear here, haven't been here for a while) game!!!

Just like a film, series, book, comic and so on..., it's fucking fiction and entertainment. Get of your fucking high horse and enjoy it.

/rant off, sorry about the language, this just makes me all worked up.....
 

sdrawkcab

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Dec 2, 2018
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This is getting absolutely ridiculous, and I can't stand it; every one is offended. You make any decision, regardless of. Your rationale and someone is going to get offended. This free world, where everyone has an opinion and can easily share it is, in and of itself, a nuisance. You simply can't please everyone.

It's a video game for Christ's sake, based on magic and mysticism, with characters who do the absolute impossible, in the most gory and graphic ways. Yet, somehow, people are outraged because (fe)male characters are either showing too much skin, not enough.

This is why I don't come online very often.

Developers need to stop trying to justify their decisions, to please group A, because almost all the time, group B is going to be offended or find fault in their reasoning.

I so wish I was a developer; let anybody challenge my design decisions; I dare them! I honestly wouldn't give a flying bloop!

"Why are her titties out?"

It's a design decision...I like the way it looked. You don't like it? Don't buy it.

"Why are the men showing so much skin?"

It's a design decision that I personally liked. I think it looks good. You don't like it; don't buy it. Now leave me alone and go bother someone else with your silly opinions.
 

sdrawkcab

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Dec 2, 2018
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Developers need to understand that sometimes, if you don't comment on things, they'll eventually fizzle out and die out. The phrase "Stop feeding the trolls" comes to mind.
 

petran79

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Sep 17, 2012
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I won't go as far as to call it "Sexist". But like I said in that last thread on this topic, It feels like its just NRS' pandering to radical third wave feminism because they feel like they have to, not because of any functional benefit. Give Team Ninja credit, they at least gave a valid reason for why they downplayed the sexuality in DOA6. Focusing more on eSports, means that distracting titlation needs to be toned down, especially when cash is at stake. Even then, it's far from gone.

This feels like yet another example of western developers bowing to what they think feminists want based on hyperboles and buzzwords.

Unfortunately the original creators are not in control anymore. As if original MK creators cared about feminism. All they wanted was to make a game to honor all those martial arts movies. Now the producers of those multi-million dollar games install their own watchdogs to impose what is right or wrong according to them.
 

Stuart360

Member
Sep 9, 2018
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I was watching someone play the beta and it was quite amusing seeing the women fighters in multiple layers of clothing, to not offend anyone, while they are pulling out peoples brains and slicing limbs off.
Murica fuck yeah!.
 
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As I said in another thread, what's wrong with options?

If you look at Soul Calibur you have Ivy, she is by far the most stand out "sexy" female character and there are others who are not as over the top, but even Ivy has always had an alternate costume that covers every inch of her body, so for anyone too scandalized by the sight of a little bare female skin, it's never been an actual issue.

For modern game designers, why not have alternate costumes that are sexier than the default ones or vice versa? Instead SJWs want to dictate that it can only be one way, when the logical thing is to offer options so that everyone is happy.
 

Dacon

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Apr 24, 2011
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As I said in another thread, what's wrong with options?

If you look at Soul Calibur you have Ivy, she is by far the most stand out "sexy" female character and there are others who are not as over the top, but even Ivy has always had an alternate costume that covers every inch of her body, so for anyone too scandalized by the sight of a little bare female skin, it's never been an actual issue.

For modern game designers, why not have alternate costumes that are sexier than the default ones or vice versa? Instead SJWs want to dictate that it can only be one way, when the logical thing is to offer options so that everyone is happy.

Because if I don't like something it shouldnt be in a game for other people to like because I don't like it and I don't want anyone else to like it therefore it shouldnt exist
 

lock2k

Banned
Jun 13, 2018
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Feminists are so stupid that their little crusade enabled things such as:

-Men competing with (and destroying women) at sports. Congrats, imbeciles

- Sharia been something cool and acceptable. Cover up women because it's respectful. My ass. There's nothing more empowering to women than wearing whatever the fuck they want without giving a fuck about other people think.

Sorry if I'm harsh. But modern feminism is undoing whatever good things they had before. If anything, us straight males here have way more love and respect for women than those fucked up fat purple haired monsters who call themselves feminists. Finished my rant.
 

DynamiteCop!

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Mar 3, 2018
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Developers need to stop pandering and just make games, they're going to piss people off on either side and nothing will ever be right. Do right by the source material and the gamers, don't worry about anybody else.

Fan service sells, outrage by activists who are a vocal minority and don't really game don't benefit or harm anything.
 

TYRiAX

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Oct 21, 2004
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I did feel that the female models in older MK games were pretty immature, but not enough to really give a F.

My feeling is if you are designing "swimsuit" costumes at least do it for both sexes.

Anyway isnt MK11 all about char customisation? Keep some sexy stuff in there then if you wanna make the default costume realistic/practical/etc
 
Oct 26, 2018
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Don't worry skin freakers, MK just leaked a new female character with her shiny new costume.

 

Shmunter

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Aug 25, 2018
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The Puritan movement is catching on, women are trying to dissociate from sexuality. It’s only going to get worse...

Charlize Theron at the Oscars. Yes not visiting North Korea.

 

Xiaoki

Member
Sep 11, 2005
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Right, that's the SJW mindset, they are arrogant, self centered, egotistical, dictatorial assholes.
If this thread is just going to be sweeping generalizations and insults then it should probably be moved to Politics.

Isolate this kind of shit posting to that board.
 

zenspider

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May 9, 2016
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"Women are kind"... is that the stereotype? I've definitely slipped into another timeline. Where I'm from, 'cunning' would be the generous counterpart to "strong".
 
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#Phonepunk#

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"Women are kind"... is that the sterotype? I've definitely slipped into another timeline.

didn't you know? aggression is male behavior. TOXIC male behavior. women are all flowers and roses, they are never aggressive. if they are, they are exhibiting toxic masculinity.
 

#Phonepunk#

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it would be interesting to see the lineup at NetherRealm studios. i see Ed Boon is the president. who is the team that made this game? i would be surprised if there were many women. usually in cases like this, it's a game made by a mostly male team, directors, producers, writers, etc. all male, so they have to do this lame male feminism to show how woke they are.

IMO if these games were made by primarily women they wouldn't be itching so hard to project how woke they are being.
 
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The Puritan movement is catching on, women are trying to dissociate from sexuality. It’s only going to get worse...

Charlize Theron at the Oscars. Yes not visiting North Korea.


While mainstream and corporate culture is moving away from female sexuality, it's increasingly rare that a female cosplayer doesn't do nudes, there's a grassroots movement of women who still like to flaunt their sexuality.
 

CatCouch

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Jul 11, 2018
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It's important to have multiple points of view discussing these issues. One side controlling the discussion and squashing out dissent is not healthy for a society.

It's nice to see debate on this topic outside of forums.

I've always found it odd that so many arguments revolve around making women conform to one set of standards. I thought it was obvious that people, whether male, female or trans, express themselves in different ways; some are sexual, some are more modest and both are valid.

It always bothered me how so many people try to suppress others while claiming that it's about tolerance, respect and acceptance. It always struck me as hypocritical.
 

brap

Banned
Jan 9, 2018
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Don't worry skin freakers, MK just leaked a new female character with her shiny new costume.

Fucking disgusting bullshit designed by a male chauvinist pig. Look at how much of her neck and arms are exposed. Not good enough for MK11.

it would be interesting to see the lineup at NetherRealm studios. i see Ed Boon is the president. who is the team that made this game? i would be surprised if there were many women. usually in cases like this, it's a game made by a mostly male team, directors, producers, writers, etc. all male, so they have to do this lame male feminism to show how woke they are.

IMO if these games were made by primarily women they wouldn't be itching so hard to project how woke they are being.

>community manager
>sad ed boon
>male feminist douche who retweets trans and feminist shit
>some other guy
That's all I know about the people that work there.
 

zeorhymer

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Nov 9, 2013
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Hahahaha! These radical lefts are like a chicken with it's head cut off. Just running around and spouting shit. It's sexist to dress females in form fitting clothes/bikinis. It's sexist to cover up females! Just rip the skin off like attack on titan and be done with it. Oh wait, they'll probably say it's sexist to have no skin either.
 

Christopher

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Mar 19, 2005
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Developers need to understand that sometimes, if you don't comment on things, they'll eventually fizzle out and die out. The phrase "Stop feeding the trolls" comes to mind.

Absolutely.

If you’re that offended don’t buy the fucking game
 

Dice

Member
Jun 6, 2004
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It does seem like it may be WB upper management forcing this. Note that their character design lead is "new" and well apparently the design guy for Injustice 2 ran into some issues. There was other weird stuff with Injustice 2 like Supergirl getting her pretty dial turned down while Aquaman became very handsome. What I find strange is how this is only happening in videogames while in TV and Film it's the standard bombardment of hotties.
 

Elcid

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Jul 27, 2018
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Fucking disgusting bullshit designed by a male chauvinist pig. Look at how much of her neck and arms are exposed. Not good enough for MK11.



>community manager
>sad ed boon
>male feminist douche who retweets trans and feminist shit
>some other guy
That's all I know about the people that work there.
Sad Boon indeed. You used to be cool Ed....
 

Cunth

Fingerlickin' Good!
May 22, 2018
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Developers need to understand that sometimes, if you don't comment on things, they'll eventually fizzle out and die out. The phrase "Stop feeding the trolls" comes to mind.
This would be true if the press ignored them as well. The problem with this shitty industry is that the ‘journalists’ are just as much rage babies as the other screaming twitter twits. Makes it hard to promote a game.