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Mortal Kombat |OT| Going back in time!

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Uzumaki Goku

Junior Member
RelentlessRolento said:
Not to discredit anything and opinions are always good to hear, but a retcon is exactly what its suppose to be: a retcon. redo the story. I'm fine with this honestly, even with the raiden stupidity you mentioned ^_^

also, the other people in MK1 surprisingly appearing in the story is actually valid. Their storylines extend before and during every MK game.

Same can kinda be said about the tournament setup. the original MK1 just had people fighting in what was called a tournament... there's nothing saying that random "official" bouts happened.

also, MK story is never something to be taken seriously so I guess we are both at fault >_<

good video, but if you can get a better mic since it semi sounded like you were talking through a cardboard tube. I had a hard time wanting to turn the volume up even though I wanted to hear what you had to say.

No, retcons is just contradicting. I mean, you follow a story and then you're told: "Oh no, that's wrong. This is how it happened now." I find that annoying.

And actually there's line there in the MK2 intro that says only 7 warriors survived the tournament... I wanted to highlight it but didn't know how.

Yeah, but if that was the case then what's to stop Shang Tsung from going: "Hey, Johnny Cage. You must now fight Goro, Kintaro and Sheeva all at once!" They could've saved it by having someone go: "Hey, this isn't a tournmaent" but everyone goes: "Oh, okay" like it's the norm.

Maybe, maybe not. But if you're gonna put in a story in a game, it better be damn good. It's part of the experience.

As for the mic, yeah it was a problem I had a hard time fixing, the pitch was lower at certain parts. Also, for some very weird reason, the footage was lower pitched and I really couldn't explain why. Might've been the Dazzle. Anyway, I decided to use this as a stepping stone to iron out the kinks for any future reviews I might do. I mean, even AVGN had kinks to work out I'm sure.

"Worse&#65279; review than Neogaf's shitty taste at games."

NeoGaf has shitty taste in games? Why didn't anyone tell me?! LOL
 

fernoca

Member
It has been a well known fact that Mortal Kombat as a tournament doesn't follow traditional rules of brackets and elimination (even that awesome College Humor video recognized that :p). Heck, there's no elimination or actual rules other than "if eveyrone from that realm loses, we have the right for merge with said realm". In the original cannon, the moment Shang Tsung took control of the tournament; he tainted it by not only alllowing warriors from other realms to participate on it (it was supposed to be a tournament between the realm evading merging and the one merging it); but Shang added fatalities into the mix, to avoid possibilities of strong warriors returning later an have an advantage.

The story is not "oscar worthy" but still pretty great in terms on content. The original games had no actual "main story", but they created one during the years from bits and pieces of each endings; instead of having one cohesive story. (For example Jax and Sonya created the OIA after winnign the "tournament", but cannon-wise they never won; but still created the OIA) In this game, this is what they did (or at least tried to), because to me the only "bulshit" part of the story was killing every "good" character in oen scene; when if the intention was to kill them tehy could've spread their deaths a little more.

Also agree what was said earlier. Quan Chi was (and other characters too) introduced in this game earlier basically to imply that he has been through the story all the time and that he has been in the shadows twisting things to his advantage. That was well known through the years, even the original cannon recognizing Quan Chi as the real disruptor of the realms; because he's the one that literally caused everything that lead to Armageddon; yet many ignored about it.

As a note, the reason Raiden didn't intereferd to stop Sub-Zero from been taken away by the Lin Kuei was because they were right in front of Shao Kahn and Raiden is not allowed (well, he assumed at least) that he couldn't directly interfere with Shao Kahn there (as the yall susumed he was just their mentor/guide and not a contestant). It wasn't till later that he realzied that he could, which is why he kills Motaro; but then that causes Shao Kahn to get pissed off and eliminate Shang Tsung which results into Sindel bveen stronger and killing everyone.

Yeah, many things were done in the plot that it was obvious were done for the sake of moving the story rather than actual development, but still no biggie. In the end it's a matter of preferences. Overall impressions has been quite positive of this game's story mode, many really liked how it was done because reminded them to the original movies from the 90s. I liked it, had no problems with the retcons, some were handled good (like Mileena's creation); some were interesting (Cyber Sub-Zero), some were unexpected (Shao Kahn eliminating Shang Tsung and giving his powers to Sindel; thus Sindel stays on the evil side).

And yeah, retcons/retelling may be annoying for some, but are done to just start anew. Heck Marvel did recently with all their main franchsies (X-Men, Spider-Man, etc.). In the case of MK it was needed the story got too big and while it was interesting and big; people in general didn't cared of gave a fuck about stuff like were Quan Chi got his medallion of what the hell happened to Tanya, etc. Yeah some may not like the changes or many technical aspects (but..bu..Jax wasn't around MK One!!! wtf?!!!); but was cool. The story team is working on the next game right now, so hope it's as good as this one was (well, if it's MK related at least). :)
 

Uzumaki Goku

Junior Member
fernoca said:
It has been a well known fact that Mortal Kombat as a tournament doesn't follow traditional rules of brackets and elimination (even that awesome College Humor video recognized that :p). Heck, there's no elimination or actual rules other than "if eveyrone from that realm loses, we have the right for merge with said realm". In the original cannon, the moment Shang Tsung took control of the tournament; he tainted it by not only alllowing warriors from other realms to participate on it (it was supposed to be a tournament between the realm evading merging and the one merging it); but Shang added fatalities into the mix, to avoid possibilities of strong warriors returning later an have an advantage.

The story is not "oscar worthy" but still pretty great in terms on content. The original games had no actual "main story", but they created one during the years from bits and pieces of each endings; instead of having one cohesive story. (For example Jax and Sonya created the OIA after winnign the "tournament", but cannon-wise they never won; but still created the OIA) In this game, this is what they did (or at least tried to), because to me the only "bulshit" part of the story was killing every "good" character in oen scene; when if the intention was to kill them tehy could've spread their deaths a little more.

Also agree what was said earlier. Quan Chi was (and other characters too) introduced in this game earlier basically to imply that he has been through the story all the time and that he has been in the shadows twisting things to his advantage. That was well known through the years, even the original cannon recognizing Quan Chi as the real disruptor of the realms; because he's the one that literally caused everything that lead to Armageddon; yet many ignored about it.

As a note, the reason Raiden didn't intereferd to stop Sub-Zero from been taken away by the Lin Kuei was because they were right in front of Shao Kahn and Raiden is not allowed (well, he assumed at least) that he couldn't directly interfere with Shao Kahn there (as the yall susumed he was just their mentor/guide and not a contestant). It wasn't till later that he realzied that he could, which is why he kills Motaro; but then that causes Shao Kahn to get pissed off and eliminate Shang Tsung which results into Sindel bveen stronger and killing everyone.

Yeah, many things were done in the plot that it was obvious were done for the sake of moving the story rather than actual development, but still no biggie. In the end it's a matter of preferences. Overall impressions has been quite positive of this game's story mode, many really liked how it was done because reminded them to the original movies from the 90s. I liked it, had no problems with the retcons, some were handled good (like Mileena's creation); some were interesting (Cyber Sub-Zero), some were unexpected (Shao Kahn eliminating Shang Tsung and giving his powers to Sindel; thus Sindel stays on the evil side).

And yeah, retcons/retelling may be annoying for some, but are done to just start anew. Heck Marvel did recently with all their main franchsies (X-Men, Spider-Man, etc.). In the case of MK it was needed the story got too big and while it was interesting and big; people in general didn't cared of gave a fuck about stuff like were Quan Chi got his medallion of what the hell happened to Tanya, etc. Yeah some may not like the changes or many technical aspects (but..bu..Jax wasn't around MK One!!! wtf?!!!); but was cool. The story team is working on the next game right now, so hope it's as good as this one was (well, if it's MK related at least). :)

Yes, I'm aware of that video. I considered saying: "Heh, I guess college humor was right afterall." and then showing a clip from it, but I didn't want to risk getting in trouble with college humor/didn't know I could do that. But even then, if Shang could do this why doesn't he just make them fight Goro, Kintaro and Sheeva all at once?

Did I expect an oscar worthy story? No. But a decent plot, a so-so plot. A good one? One that didn't make me shake my hand at the God of Blunder's stupidity every 10 minutes. Yeah, I think I'd like that.

As for Quan Chi, yes, I know he's been around but my point was that he shouldn't been in the spotlight so much, he should've been influencing things from the shadows. Besides, he's obviously going to be a main villain in the next game, so there's no way to shorthand Shang Tsung to give him a bigger role. Quan Chi should've just been built up to take over the next game.

I actually addressed that. Shao Kahn doesn't do shit to stop Liu Kang from unchaining Kitana and he probably wouldn't have minded the Lin Kuei being chased off.

Hate to disagree on Mileena, but that retcon absolutely ruins her character now she's just a one-dimensional psychopath. And Cyber Sub-Zero is an abomination, a one-note gimmick character who never should've been considered he's an insult to fans who have followed Sub-Zero for nearly 20 years. ...but I ranted enough about that.

As for making it accessible to new fans, yeah sure, but that doesn't mean you have to alienate your old. A lot of the MK fansites I used to visit frequently share their same criticisms about the story as I did (some of them even encouraged me to make this)

I'm aware of just how many comic books retcon things and honestly I can't comment on that too much since I'm not much of a comic book reader but I imagine many fans find it annoying. It's part of the reason why I prefer media adaptations to comic book characters than the comics themselves but hey, that's me.

Anyway, we agree to disagree I suppose? :)
 
The problem with MK9's story is that it's tied to the other games with the time travel angle.

If it was a complete reboot, an alternate universe that mirrored MK1-3, but with all the changes they made in 9 (Some of which seem like change for change sake, some of which are improvements), sure, it would be fine.

But the fact that it is supposedly the same universe as the old games, lends credit to your complaints of inaccuracies with them.

That and the later part of the story sucks, it should have just accurately followed MK3 and ended in the same way, then branched off in the next game with new characters, some of the post 3 characters not being brought back, some of the classic characters still being there, etc.

I'm okay with Cyber Sub because I'm not a Sub-Zero fan, but like MK9's Human Smoke.
 

Barrage

Member
Uzumaki Goku said:
Hate to disagree on Mileena, but that retcon absolutely ruins her character now she's just a one-dimensional psychopath. And Cyber Sub-Zero is an abomination, a one-note gimmick character who never should've been considered he's an insult to fans who have followed Sub-Zero for nearly 20 years. ...but I ranted enough about that.


Yeah, because Mileena had so much depth in the first place.

She was a ZERO DIMENSIONAL CHARACTER. There was nothing there to ruin. Any supposed depth is a result of slobbering manchildren fanfiction. Mileena had no thematical depth, if you look cannon-wise.
 

sleepykyo

Member
fernoca said:
And yeah, retcons/retelling may be annoying for some, but are done to just start anew. Heck Marvel did recently with all their main franchsies (X-Men, Spider-Man, etc.). In the case of MK it was needed the story got too big and while it was interesting and big; people in general didn't cared of gave a fuck about stuff like were Quan Chi got his medallion of what the hell happened to Tanya, etc. Yeah some may not like the changes or many technical aspects (but..bu..Jax wasn't around MK One!!! wtf?!!!); but was cool. The story team is working on the next game right now, so hope it's as good as this one was (well, if it's MK related at least). :)


You mean DC unless you're referring to Marvel Ultimate, which was established as an alternate universe instead of a retcon, right?
 

Uzumaki Goku

Junior Member
Barrage said:
Yeah, because Mileena had so much depth in the first place.

She was a ZERO DIMENSIONAL CHARACTER. There was nothing there to ruin. Any supposed depth is a result of slobbering manchildren fanfiction. Mileena had no thematical depth, if you look cannon-wise.

Right, ever read her Deception bio, she's mentioned to have a pathological hatred of Kitana and in her MKG ending, she shows some brief sorrow over the fact that she's a clone...

this game... no, she's not even a character.

Even if I were to ignore that, this whole retcon that Mileena was created during MK2 is terrible because even if there was no emotional depth to it, this was a chance to provide some, and they blew it.
 
Slamtastic said:
The problem with MK9's story is that it's tied to the other games with the time travel angle.

If it was a complete reboot, an alternate universe that mirrored MK1-3, but with all the changes they made in 9 (Some of which seem like change for change sake, some of which are improvements), sure, it would be fine.

But the fact that it is supposedly the same universe as the old games, lends credit to your complaints of inaccuracies with them.

That and the later part of the story sucks, it should have just accurately followed MK3 and ended in the same way, then branched off in the next game with new characters, some of the post 3 characters not being brought back, some of the classic characters still being there, etc.

I'm okay with Cyber Sub because I'm not a Sub-Zero fan, but like MK9's Human Smoke.
I doubt we'll see Cyber Sub return, he was killed. If he gets resurrected, he'll be normal again.
 

Uzumaki Goku

Junior Member
infinityBCRT said:
I doubt we'll see Cyber Sub return, he was killed. If he gets resurrected, he'll be normal again.

And you can bet that he will, no way Sub-Zero's missing an MK game. ...which is what they should've freakin' considered BEFORE he was turned into a cyborg. Human Sub-Zero is far too iconic to be removed from the series, Cyber Sub-Zero is one-note gimmick character.
 
Uzumaki Goku said:
Meh, after trying Human Sub-Zero out more, I've gained an appreciation for how he fights. He's actually very good.

He's just too damn slow. His startup and recovery on moves makes me want to claw my eyes out. Also, he can't slide under projectile spam, which is infuriating.
 
Uzumaki Goku said:
And you can bet that he will, no way Sub-Zero's missing an MK game. ...which is what they should've freakin' considered BEFORE he was turned into a cyborg. Human Sub-Zero is far too iconic to be removed from the series, Cyber Sub-Zero is one-note gimmick character.
A one note gimmick character who ruined Smoke's character by simply existing. Such a goofy and arbitrary change that ultimately changed nothing but switching Smoke from a tragic villain to a generic hero with absolutely no personality.
 
If they wanted to really piss off the fans, they could use the whole "Sub-Zero is a code name that different people have had" angle and make
Frost
"Sub-Zero" in MK10/2

Green Mamba said:
A one note gimmick character who ruined Smoke's character by simply existing. Such a goofy and arbitrary change that ultimately changed nothing but switching Smoke from a tragic villain to a generic hero with absolutely no personality.
MK9 Smoke has an original design and moves though, and is a better character for it.

WNW3H.png
 

Uzumaki Goku

Junior Member
Green Mamba said:
A one note gimmick character who ruined Smoke's character by simply existing. Such a goofy and arbitrary change that ultimately changed nothing but switching Smoke from a tragic villain to a generic hero with absolutely no personality.

As well as ruining Sub-Zero's whole story. Someone who fought tooth and nail to avoid automation and choose his own destiny becoming a hero and all that was thrown out the window for this stupid change.
 

Nemesis_

Member
MK Arcade HD Collection hits next week.

Anyone making an OT? I *could* do it but I'm not sure how good it would be considering how much time I have =/
 

fernoca

Member
Yep. As fas as story in this game, as said earlier is better to agree to disagree. :p
I had no problems and enjoyed some of the changes, other had many and hated those smae hings I liked. It happens with everything, so no biggie. I tend to like stuff many don't like, Mortal Kombat included; at the same time I can recognize the problems and stuff others didn't enjoyed; so guess I was just happy with a new MK. XD

And yep, Arcade Kollection will be released on August 30/31, so guess the rumors were right:


Welcome back to where it all began! Warner Bros. Interactive Entertainment today announces the Mortal Kombat Arcade Kollection will officially be available for download in the United States on August 30, 2011. Launching on PlayStation®Network for $9.99, this will mark the first time the original Mortal Kombat arcade trilogy - Mortal Kombat, Mortal Kombat 2 and Ultimate Mortal Kombat 3 - have been brought together in a single collection. On the next day, August 31, 2011, the game will also be available globally for PSN, for Xbox Live (800 MS Points) and PC ($9.99).​



No word on who's making an OT, so Nemesis you're free to make one if you want to. :p
 

Nemesis_

Member
How depressing, I was planning something much better using assets from all three games (lifebars, fonts, sprites), something more akin to the MK9 OT. I actually sat down to do it with a BIG COFFEE and then came to check this thread for last minute updates.

Oh well :( I would've loved to given the games a huge and nostalgic OP :(
 

fernoca

Member
Nemesis556 said:
How depressing, I was planning something much better using assets from all three games (lifebars, fonts, sprites), something more akin to the MK9 OT. I actually sat down to do it with a BIG COFFEE and then came to check this thread for last minute updates.

Oh well :( I would've loved to given the games a huge and nostalgic OP :(
I was planning something like that too (instead of the like 15 posts of this, only 3 posts each dedicated to one game with bios and moves for all characters) but new computer (and no editing programs), coupled with my mom at the hospital and Hurricane Irene this past sunday + no electricity... I had no time during the last 2 weeks. :/

I think infinity just made a quick OT because the date was announced officially at the last minute. You can still make a few and give them to infinity, doubt he will get pissed off or something. :p
 
Teknoman said:
Let my friend borrow the game for awhile, so i've been away for a while. Are the online matches over PSN any better now?
To me, there is an improvement, at least since the online patch came about 2 months ago.

Ok, guys, this might be a stupid question, but are you able to do an non-hitting xray after it says finish him, and still do a babality? Does the block pressed during the xray count?
 

Kai Dracon

Writing a dinosaur space opera symphony
I may be late to the party, but I'm trying to play this online again and cannot get almost a single solitary match to load. Ranked or joining rooms. Every time loading finishes, desynch error.

I do not have the retro costume pack (heard you had to redownload that to fix it) but I do have retro reptile from pre-order code. I even re-downloaded that pack in case there was something screwy with it. Didn't help.

Or is the online just still totally broken?

On 360, forgot to say.
 

Fantasmo

Member
Mr. E. Yis said:
To me, there is an improvement, at least since the online patch came about 2 months ago.

Ok, guys, this might be a stupid question, but are you able to do an non-hitting xray after it says finish him, and still do a babality? Does the block pressed during the xray count?
Press block all you want. Xray, enhanced moves, or just randomly and Babalities still work. The only criteria is you can't actually block something.
 

VariantX

Member
Kaijima said:
I may be late to the party, but I'm trying to play this online again and cannot get almost a single solitary match to load. Ranked or joining rooms. Every time loading finishes, desynch error.

I do not have the retro costume pack (heard you had to redownload that to fix it) but I do have retro reptile from pre-order code. I even re-downloaded that pack in case there was something screwy with it. Didn't help.

Or is the online just still totally broken?

On 360, forgot to say.

I also have issues with Reptile, albeit different ones. I do get the occasional desynch but even stranger is that i simply Cannot use that costume online. It just will not appear in the costume selection. But, I can use all of the free alt costumes that have come out since. Reptile MK1 costume has been broken for me online ever since i think the retro costumes came out.
 

fernoca

Member
Desync problems, were mostly caused by the preorder codes, not the (full) retro packs. So delete the Reptile costume/code then try to play online. If it works, then don't download the costume again. :p

Those codes also affected the options to use secondary costumes (non retro ones). For example, my friend wasn't able to choose any secondary costume by having a Toys R Us-Kitana costume; even when not selecting it. Everything was fine, but when he tried to choose any alt; it got desynced.

So the only alternative was to delete the Kitana costume. Redownloading the costume, didn't fixed it, as it maybe the save file was "corrupted" by it and therefore the "fix" never worked. But, since the problem was fixed for most people by redownloading, it became the official solution and nothing else was done to fix it by other means.

That aside, online overall was fixed (even more) by that patch from a few months ago. Yeah, some people still reported laggy matches here and there; but for all intents and purposes it was fixed. No word on other possible patches, other than to fix/balance stuff.
 

Kai Dracon

Writing a dinosaur space opera symphony
Well frack. OK I deleted the pre-order Reptile, I'll try again tonight and see if I get constant desynchs.
 

djkimothy

Member
Lttp on the Freddy hate. I know this is old but just played a series of games where my projectile goes through him. He is beyond S tier...

-.-
 

djkimothy

Member
junkster said:
Easy 40-50% combos too... weeeeee!!

Yah seriously. And all he does is his stupid ground claw thing. Couple that with his teleport keep away game and no one can zone him.

His projectile recovery/execution is the fastest in the game to boot.

Did Warner bros. Put them up to this?
 
djkimothy said:
Yah seriously. And all he does is his stupid ground claw thing. Couple that with his teleport keep away game and no one can zone him.

His projectile recovery/execution is the fastest in the game to boot.

Did Warner bros. Put them up to this?

Boon specifically asked on Twitter before the game came out if Xbox 360 fans would want someone from the Warner Bros. collection such as Freddy Krueger or Jason Voorhees as DLC to combat with Kratos on the PS3.
 

fernoca

Member
NetherRealm is having a mini-tournament tomorrow and will stream it; more details later...I guess. :p

The team at NetherRealm Studios is having an in-house MK tournament tomorrow during the day and we will stream the matches live. Stay tuned for further details including URL and time.​

Link: Their Facebook page.
 
_dementia said:
It'll be interesting to see if their PR team has anywhere near a quality stream as their community. Capcom-unity sure doesn't, not by a long shot.
60 fps, also they're answering questions in the chat if anyone has any.
 

fernoca

Member
Well, Vincent Proce released another update/info through his blog. This time, related to his designs for MK9 before leaving Midway back then:






It's been a long time since I posted and the MK fans out there have been asking to see some of the concept art that I did for MK9.

I was only asked to do a few and with some very specific direction, but I also took the liberty of presenting a few concepts more to suit my own taste, hoping they would want to take the game in that direction.

The first three concepts I did (Reptile, Johnny Cage and Cryax) I had no interaction with the team and are the ones in which I branched out on my own.

I had just rolled off of another project and moved right to MK9 and these were the first pieces I showed to the guys. The first version of Cryax had a face that Ed Boon pointed out to look like Howard the Duck (he was right it did have the shape of Howard the Duck) so I changed that, but that was all I changed.






The next three I did (Milena, Sub Zero & Nightwolf) were directed by the team to look like what they did in MK2. I think they all turned out pretty good, but I was a little disappointed with what I did with Sub-Zero, he was always my fav of the MK characters and I think I could have iterated on him a few more times.





These were the last images I did for Midway Games before I left. I do have a bunch of earlier concepts from different MK pitches that have never seen the light of day. I will post them when the time is right I suppose...


 
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