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Multiple sources are saying Last of Us Remake will come out this year

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kyliethicc

Member
Oh, this will absolutely be a $70 game.
Licking Charles Barkley GIF by NBA
 
Expecting a significant technical change otherwise Sony will be roasted to hell and back by everyone, rightfully so.

Yup.

If this doesn't look as good or better than UE5 demos, it will be a failure of a project IMHO.

They had 2.5 years to remake a game and optimize for the PS5 for a linear type of game. It needs to be mind blowing. Using TLOU2 assets from the PS4/PS5 will not cut it.
 
They have 3 projects going on right now

Sure, but they should have only had 1 or 2 projects, mainly being a new IP or Uncharted 5 for next-gen only.

They didn't have ANYTHING to move onto other than factions and a remake of TLOU. That's a failure of proper transition planning. They literally had no teams doing much pre-development work setting the foundation for their next big project.
 

ChiefDada

Member
I tried playing tlou remaster on ps5 a few weeks back and it does look pretty rough now. I'm in.

Lol, exactly. It looks very dated today. I don't blame people's flawed memories, it's just a testament to how great these games looked for their time.

What’s the point of cross gen games?

I think people need to prepare themselves for this being a ps4 game with ps4 quality graphics at 4k. This is likely being packaged with factions and that’s a cross gen game. I highly doubt they will have a fancy Matrix quality remake and a last gen mp game on the same disc.

Et tu, Slime??? The tech team has already alluded to the idea of not having to reinvent the wheel. Remakes are the perfect candidate for current gen. It's low hanging fruit.

 
So what is it remaster or remake , because it was remastered on ps4 and now its being remade on ps5?or is it remastered remake ?
 

SlimySnake

Member
Lol, exactly. It looks very dated today. I don't blame people's flawed memories, it's just a testament to how great these games looked for their time.



Et tu, Slime??? The tech team has already alluded to the idea of not having to reinvent the wheel. Remakes are the perfect candidate for current gen. It's low hanging fruit.

Im not sure what to take away from the clip. I watched till the end.

Are you saying the game will be PS5 only? The Abby model upgrade looks good I suppose.
 
This would be perfect to release for “PSPLUS mega platinum” or whatever they are calling it. I’m in day one regardless. One of my favorite games ever.
 

kyliethicc

Member
Sure, but they should have only had 1 or 2 projects, mainly being a new IP or Uncharted 5 for next-gen only.

They didn't have ANYTHING to move onto other than factions and a remake of TLOU. That's a failure of proper transition planning. They literally had no teams doing much pre-development work setting the foundation for their next big project.
Because their other creative director, Shaun Escayg, left after Lost Legacy and didn’t come back until 2021. And Druckmann had to help on the HBO show and was out in Calgary for a while.

Naughty Dog can’t let just any jackass take creative control of their next singleplayer game. They have over a decade of major success to continue. As we saw with Anthem, Fallout 76, Mass Effect Andromeda, and CyberPunk, a big name studio can seriously hurt their brand’s rep if they ship a flop. Deciding what to do next is a major decision for many reasons. So they need proven creative directors. Last gen around they got lucky having both Hennig and Druckmann simultaneously. That’s rare. (And their next project after TLOU2 was already in development - the TLOU multiplayer service game.)

And the remake wasn’t their idea. Apparently they weren’t even leading that project until Hulst took over and changed things.
 
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Because their other creative director, Shaun Escayg, left after Lost Legacy and didn’t come back until 2021. And Druckmann had to help on the HBO show and was out in Calgary for a while.

Naughty Dog can’t let just any jackass take creative control of their next singleplayer game. They have over a decade of major success to continue. As we saw with Anthem, Fallout 76, Mass Effect Andromeda, and CyberPunk, a big name studio can seriously hurt their brand’s rep if they ship a flop. Deciding what to do next is a major decision for many reasons. So they need proven creative directors. Last gen around they got lucky having both Hennig and Druckmann simultaneously. That’s rare. (And their next project after TLOU2 was already in development - the TLOU multiplayer service game.)

And the remake wasn’t their idea. Apparently they weren’t even leading that project until Hulst took over and changed things.

If this is the case....a studio with hundreds of people that depends so highly on two individuals means that studio has a failure in management

Hulst never forced them to make it, they just saw San Diego making it, had nothing else to do, and thought they should be the ones to do it instead
 

adamsapple

Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
Yup.

If this doesn't look as good or better than UE5 demos, it will be a failure of a project IMHO.

They had 2.5 years to remake a game and optimize for the PS5 for a linear type of game. It needs to be mind blowing. Using TLOU2 assets from the PS4/PS5 will not cut it.

My dude you're setting up some extremely unrealistic expectations for a project that was in development before TLoU 2 even came out.

This will look like TLoU 2 but with higher native resolution than 1440p on PS5.
 

kyliethicc

Member
If this is the case....a studio with hundreds of people that depends so highly on two individuals means that studio has a failure in management
The most awarded studio of the last decade? You should go show they how to do things LOL

Hulst never forced them to make it, they just saw San Diego making it, had nothing else to do, and thought they should be the ones to do it instead
He reportedly moved the project to ND because he felt it was too expensive for a support studio to be given.

It was described by Schreier as a financially driven decision. Hulst felt it’s budget would only be justified as a ND game.
 
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My dude you're setting up some extremely unrealistic expectations for a project that was in development before TLoU 2 even came out.

This will look like TLoU 2 but with higher native resolution than 1440p on PS5.

I don't really care if it's unrealistic. I am preparing to be disappointment. The only way TLOU remake will be a success if it if properly shows of next-gen capabilities.

2.5 years with a game already made. Should not be difficult to tweak things for next gen, that's all they really have to do.
 
He reportedly moved the project to ND because he felt it was too expensive for a support studio to be given.

It was described by Schreier as a financial driven decision. Hulst felt it’s budget would only be justified as a ND game.

He said it was too expensive so he was going to cancel it for San Diego (limited studio resources there). ND came aboard, had a gap in projects and said "we're in". Hulst never forced anything.
 

kyliethicc

Member
He said it was too expensive so he was going to cancel it for San Diego (limited studio resources there). ND came aboard, had a gap in projects and said "we're in". Hulst never forced anything.
Nah that’s not what the article said.

At that time, Sony was going through a management shuffle and the new boss wasn’t impressed. Hermen Hulst, the former head of Guerrilla Games, was named head of PlayStation’s Worldwide Studios in November 2019. He thought the remake project was too expensive, according to people familiar with the matter, and asked why the planned budget for T1X was so much higher than remakes Sony had made in the past.
Sony sent word that after the completion of The Last of Us Part II, some people from Naughty Dog would help out with T1X.
The game was moved under Naughty Dog’s budget, which Sony gave more leeway than the Visual Arts Service Group.
 

SlimySnake

Member
Yup.

If this doesn't look as good or better than UE5 demos, it will be a failure of a project IMHO.

They had 2.5 years to remake a game and optimize for the PS5 for a linear type of game. It needs to be mind blowing. Using TLOU2 assets from the PS4/PS5 will not cut it.
VSG studios, the original developer, actually started this in 2018. ND took over in 2022 after shipping TLOU2 so they had 4 years to make this a PS5 only game.

In comparison, Bluepoint remade Demon Souls in 2 years in 8 months.

Sure, but they should have only had 1 or 2 projects, mainly being a new IP or Uncharted 5 for next-gen only.

They didn't have ANYTHING to move onto other than factions and a remake of TLOU. That's a failure of proper transition planning. They literally had no teams doing much pre-development work setting the foundation for their next big project.
From Jason's article, it seems they did have a MP team working on Factions which Sony Bend was helping them with. They actually had nothing to do with the remake and only took over because they had nothing to work on after shipping TLOU 2 which itself was delayed for months. Just exactly what the hell are the studio heads and producers doing while Neil directs the game, and devs finish it?

I actually think this fuck up might be on Neil. I know everyone hates the guy here, but i hold him in very high regard. However, he cowrote all ten episodes of the last of us tv show with Craig Mazin. He also directed an episode and had to leave the studio for weeks if not months since they are shooting the tv show in Canada. He is the Co-President of Naughty Dog and I bet he was like no one is working on anything unless its directed by me.

That's the only explanation for why they didnt have a single player game ready for the dev team to move on to. Typically, artists move on well before the game ships to work on creating assets for the next game. It seems the artists had nothing to work on so they started fucking with the VSG remake. Neil didnt come up with a story for the third game until summer of last year iirc. that means he held up development for a good year.

Lastly, there were rumors that the third game they have in development is not tlou3 and they hired the lost legacy and avengers narrative director back last year so its possible that Neil decided to push TLOU3 till the end of the gen. it could be another uncharted or a new IP that Neil isnt directly involved in.
 

SlimySnake

Member
Nah that’s not what the article said.
This just makes me believe that its a last gen game. How can Herman not be impressed by a next gen only game? I bet it looked even worse than the last of us 2 and Herman was like at least get ND on board to make it look as good as TLOU2.
 

kyliethicc

Member
Hulst didn't go over to ND and demand they take it over, that article suggests nothing of the sort.
It literally does say this lol

It says Sony moved the game’s budget to Naughty Dog’s books, making it their game, and sent word that people from ND would start working on the game. It was a Sony decision and literally says Hulst was not happy with Mumbauer.

This just makes me believe that its a last gen game. How can Herman not be impressed by a next gen only game? I bet it looked even worse than the last of us 2 and Herman was like at least get ND on board to make it look as good as TLOU2.
He was unimpressed with its record high budget lol. Not the visuals. He’s a business man.
 
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VSG studios, the original developer, actually started this in 2018. ND took over in 2022 after shipping TLOU2 so they had 4 years to make this a PS5 only game.

In comparison, Bluepoint remade Demon Souls in 2 years in 8 months.


From Jason's article, it seems they did have a MP team working on Factions which Sony Bend was helping them with. They actually had nothing to do with the remake and only took over because they had nothing to work on after shipping TLOU 2 which itself was delayed for months. Just exactly what the hell are the studio heads and producers doing while Neil directs the game, and devs finish it?

I actually think this fuck up might be on Neil. I know everyone hates the guy here, but i hold him in very high regard. However, he cowrote all ten episodes of the last of us tv show with Craig Mazin. He also directed an episode and had to leave the studio for weeks if not months since they are shooting the tv show in Canada. He is the Co-President of Naughty Dog and I bet he was like no one is working on anything unless its directed by me.

That's the only explanation for why they didnt have a single player game ready for the dev team to move on to. Typically, artists move on well before the game ships to work on creating assets for the next game. It seems the artists had nothing to work on so they started fucking with the VSG remake. Neil didnt come up with a story for the third game until summer of last year iirc. that means he held up development for a good year.

Lastly, there were rumors that the third game they have in development is not tlou3 and they hired the lost legacy and avengers narrative director back last year so its possible that Neil decided to push TLOU3 till the end of the gen. it could be another uncharted or a new IP that Neil isnt directly involved in.

Exactly, they should have had a core team prototyping a new game in 2017/2018 while TLOU2 was in full production mode.

It literally sounds like they had no one at the studio working on that. It is crazy to me how mismanaged even some of the highest quality studios are. This isn't rocket science.
 
It literally does say this lol

It says Sony moved the game’s budget to Naughty Dog’s books, making it their game, and sent word that people from ND would start working on the game. It was a Sony decision and literally says Hulst was not happy with Mumbauer.


He was unimpressed with its record high budget lol. Not the visuals. He’s a business man.

Sony deciding to move the project over to ND doesn't mean Hulst FORCED it on ND.

Hulst not being happy with the budget for VGS, so he went over to discuss with ND. It was likely ND that greenlit working on it because they were very low on work.
 

kyliethicc

Member
Sony deciding to move the project over to ND doesn't mean Hulst FORCED it on ND.

Hulst not being happy with the budget for VGS, so he went over to discuss with ND. It was likely ND that greenlit working on it because they were very low on work.
Story literally says it was a decision made by Sony (Hulst.) Not Naughty Dog.
 
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SlimySnake

Member
Exactly, they should have had a core team prototyping a new game in 2017/2018 while TLOU2 was in full production mode.

It literally sounds like they had no one at the studio working on that. It is crazy to me how mismanaged even some of the highest quality studios are. This isn't rocket science.
This nonsense started way back when they started fucking with Amy Henning's uncharted 4 after shipping Left Behind in Feb 2014. Amy and Justin Richmond had been working with a small team on prototyping Uncharted 4 on next gen and waited patiently for Neil and Bruce to finish their game so that the full production team could seamlessly transition to Uncharted 4. But then Neil took another 8 months to do left behind, and when Amy finally got her team back in February of 2014, they started fucking with her vision and the direction of the game. Like wtf are you doing? Go prototype TLOU2 and leave Amy alone.

I know everyone says Amy Henning being forced out story was fake news, but even Jason said that there were creative differences between Neil, Bruce, Justin Richmond and Amy, but there didnt need to be. They had nothing to do with that franchise after shipping Uncharted 2 way back in 2009 so why did they even have a say in it? It's not your game anymore. If they had just minded their own business, they wouldve started work on TLOU2 immediately in 2014 and be ready for full production in 2016 for a 2018 release. Amy's uncharted team wouldve then taken over and they wouldve had something for the PS5 launch in 2020.

The studio that shipped Uncharted 1, 2, 3 and TLOU in a span of 6 years is now struggling to put out mp only games and last gen remakes. No new IP in sight. No sequels in sight 2 years after they last shipped a game. The multi team formula was working. They didnt have to fire Amy.
 
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This nonsense started way back when they started fucking with Amy Henning's uncharted 4 after shipping Left Behind in Feb 2014. Amy and Justin Richmond had been working with a small team on prototyping Uncharted 4 on next gen and waited patiently for Neil and Bruce to finish their game so that the full production team could seamlessly transition to Uncharted 4. But then Neil took another 8 months to do left behind, and when Amy finally got her team back in February of 2014, they started fucking with her vision and the direction of the game. Like wtf are you doing? Go prototype TLOU2 and leave Amy alone.

I know everyone says Amy Henning being forced out story was fake news, but even Jason said that there were creative differences between Neil, Bruce, Justin Richmond and Amy, but there didnt need to be. They had nothing to do with that franchise after shipping Uncharted 2 way back in 2009 so why did they even have a say in it? It's not your game anymore. If they had just minded their own business, they wouldve started work on TLOU2 immediately in 2014 and be ready for full production in 2016 for a 2018 release. Amy's uncharted team wouldve then taken over and they wouldve had something for the PS5 launch in 2020.

The studio that shipped Uncharted 1, 2, 3 and TLOU in a span of 6 years is now struggling to put out mp only games and last gen remakes. No new IP in sight. No sequels in sight 2 years after they last shipped a game. The multi team formula was working. They didnt have to fire Amy.

Yeah the studio fell into disarray when Neil ultimately took full control. Instead of having Neil absorb the entire studio, they should have grown the studio larger under Amy giving her full autonomy of her projects, with Neil having autonomy over TLOU.

That was really the breaking point of when the studio went downhill from a management standpoint (the gaming quality was still good, they just started slipping on management). Now they are in a position where they really don't seem to be anywhere near as ambitious as they were in the late PS3 days where they can surprise us with a second team working on a new IP like TLOU. They just double down on safe projects with only one main AAA in the background.
 
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SlimySnake

Member
Nah that’s not what the article said.

Sony sent word that after the completion of The Last of Us Part II, some people from Naughty Dog would help out with T1X.
The game was moved under Naughty Dog’s budget, which Sony gave more leeway than the Visual Arts Service Group.
This is ALL it says

"The game was moved under Naughty Dog’s budget, which Sony gave more leeway than the Visual Arts Service Group. "
Jason elaborated on this in a podcast i will try to find a link for. Basically, ND was always involved in the remake from day one. The game was being built on the last of us 2 engine so ND had engineers and artists help out the VSG guys since they were more familiar with the engine. However, it was just some guidance here and there and VSG was the lead and only studio working on the remake. AFTER shipping TLOU2, the devs had nothing to work on (factions was mp only and didnt require the SP guys) so they started taking a bigger role in the VSG remake which caused friction since this is Naughty Dog's baby, and eventually the leads/directors over at VSG quit in protest. Once they left, ND took over the project and VSG became the secondary studio.

Around this time, bored ND devs also started taking a bigger role in Sony Bend's Uncharted reboot. Bend had actually hired hollywood talent to write the reboot, but ND became so overbearing that Sony Bend was like thanks but no thanks. We will just make a new IP instead. Both hollywood writers then left Bend.
 

kyliethicc

Member
Jason elaborated on this in a podcast i will try to find a link for. Basically, ND was always involved in the remake from day one. The game was being built on the last of us 2 engine so ND had engineers and artists help out the VSG guys since they were more familiar with the engine. However, it was just some guidance here and there and VSG was the lead and only studio working on the remake. AFTER shipping TLOU2, the devs had nothing to work on (factions was mp only and didnt require the SP guys) so they started taking a bigger role in the VSG remake which caused friction since this is Naughty Dog's baby, and eventually the leads/directors over at VSG quit in protest. Once they left, ND took over the project and VSG became the secondary studio.

Around this time, bored ND devs also started taking a bigger role in Sony Bend's Uncharted reboot. Bend had actually hired hollywood talent to write the reboot, but ND became so overbearing that Sony Bend was like thanks but no thanks. We will just make a new IP instead. Both hollywood writers then left Bend.
Jeff Ross said the Uncharted idea was purely an on paper idea. His idea was a young Sully game in the 70s. Never even began production.
 
Jason elaborated on this in a podcast i will try to find a link for. Basically, ND was always involved in the remake from day one. The game was being built on the last of us 2 engine so ND had engineers and artists help out the VSG guys since they were more familiar with the engine. However, it was just some guidance here and there and VSG was the lead and only studio working on the remake. AFTER shipping TLOU2, the devs had nothing to work on (factions was mp only and didnt require the SP guys) so they started taking a bigger role in the VSG remake which caused friction since this is Naughty Dog's baby, and eventually the leads/directors over at VSG quit in protest. Once they left, ND took over the project and VSG became the secondary studio.

Around this time, bored ND devs also started taking a bigger role in Sony Bend's Uncharted reboot. Bend had actually hired hollywood talent to write the reboot, but ND became so overbearing that Sony Bend was like thanks but no thanks. We will just make a new IP instead. Both hollywood writers then left Bend.

Yeah my point is mostly that ND was involved and it wasn’t forced by Sony or Hulst
 

kyliethicc

Member
Yeah my point is mostly that ND was involved and it wasn’t forced by Sony or Hulst
Mike Mumbauer literally said to Jaffe in an interview that the goal of the project was to prove to Sony that his team could make a game on their own. To show that they didn’t need help from Naughty Dog or anyone else.

He wanted to create his own lead studio. It’s why he left Sony after TLOU2 shipped as Naughty Dog took over his project. He went and founded his own studio. (Took a bunch of Sony people with him.)

The article says the big change occurred when Hulst took over WWS. That Hulst’s decisions made the leads at VASG quit because they felt their leadership was undermined and they had lost control of their own project. Hulst is in charge and he had final say ultimately.
 

SlimySnake

Member
Yeah the studio fell into disarray when Neil ultimately took full control. Instead of having Neil absorb the entire studio, they should have grown the studio larger under Amy giving her full autonomy of her projects, with Neil having autonomy over TLOU.

That was really the breaking point of when the studio went downhill from a management standpoint (the gaming quality was still good, they just started slipping on management). Now they are in a position where they really don't seem to be anywhere near as ambitious as they were in the late PS3 days where they can surprise us with a second team working on a new IP like TLOU. They just double down on safe projects with only one main AAA in the background.
Evan Wells did an interview last year where he admitted that they just cant become a multi team studio no matter how hard they try. Later in the interview he states that they still only have 300 employees. Umm, maybe THAT is your problem? 300 employees at the premiere Sony studio in 2022 is a fucking joke.
The PlayStation developer first attempted to embrace a multi-project model following the completion of 2009’s Uncharted 2: Among Thieves, with designers Bruce Straley and Neil Druckmann establishing a second team to create The Last of Us, alongside the group working on a third Uncharted.

However, Evan Wells told the AIAS in a new Game Maker’s Notebook podcast (transcribed by VGC) that Naughty Dog was ultimately unable to maintain two full productions, with one project inevitably gaining favour and pulling resources from the other, and it’s an issue the studio still struggles with today.

“We tried our first major multi-project development with The Last of Us,” Wells said. “At the end of Uncharted 2, Bruce Straley and Neil Druckmann went off to start designing [that], although they did spend a good, solid three or four months working on Jak and Daxter before they decided to shelve it and focus on something new.

“They embarked on that and the idea was we would build a team around it and have two teams going at once, and we just did not achieve that at all.

He added: “The amount of effort that was required to finish Uncharted 3 at the time was stealing resources away from The Last of Us, and we never got to the point where we had two full productions going.

“I would say even today we’re just short of that. We definitely have multiple projects, but only one that is getting the lion’s share of focus at any time.

“We don’t have two projects that have several hundred people on them. We have one [project] and then some that are in pre-production, or maybe just creeping out of pre-production, but will have to wait until the main focus has completed before we move everybody off of that project.”

I mean this is such an easy problem to solve. Hire more people. You are in LA, you dont even have to ask people to relocate from other states or countries. SSM, Crystal Dynamics, Insomniac, Respawn, Infinity Ward, Riot Games (league of legends dev), Treyarch, Blizzard... they are all in the LA county. Just go and out bid everyone. You are Sony. You make $25 billion in revenue.

It's crazy to me that they did not grow in the PS4 era like at all. They were 75 devs in 2007, 150 devs in 2009 when they shipped U2 then 250 devs by the time they shipped TLOU. So only 50 new devs from 2013-2022? wtf? Everyone knows its taking longer than ever to make games and they are just acting like its 2009.
 
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SlimySnake

Member
Found it. Jason talks about his remake article in a lot more detail here. He left out a lot of detail because the bloomberg article was written for a mainstream audience.

Timestamped.


The way he talks about it shows that the game was basically made to run on the PS4 engine with TLOU2 gameplay and visuals being applied to the original. That's it. No mention of next gen stuff. Which is weird because his article stated this was a PS5 game.

Im hoping that since ND took in 2020, they probably increased the scope of this game and made it a true next gen only game with UE5, Avatar, Matrix quality visuals. And thats why it is taking so long. I dont understand why a simple asset upgrade would take a big team like ND 2+ years when the game had already been in development for 2 years before they took it over.

All this secrecy is annoying. They hold off on revealing these games as cross gen until the very end. Probably because of fear or backlash. Factions was announced way back in 2020 and they have kept it a secret since. Why? And its supposed to release this year? They should have a beta for it in June if they are aiming for a big PvE style release later this year. If Bungie did one thing right with Destiny was that they had 2 betas in june and july before launching in september. You cant do a beta one month before launch for these GaaS games. Not enough time to fix things.
 
Found it. Jason talks about his remake article in a lot more detail here. He left out a lot of detail because the bloomberg article was written for a mainstream audience.

Timestamped.


The way he talks about it shows that the game was basically made to run on the PS4 engine with TLOU2 gameplay and visuals being applied to the original. That's it. No mention of next gen stuff. Which is weird because his article stated this was a PS5 game.

Im hoping that since ND took in 2020, they probably increased the scope of this game and made it a true next gen only game with UE5, Avatar, Matrix quality visuals. And thats why it is taking so long. I dont understand why a simple asset upgrade would take a big team like ND 2+ years when the game had already been in development for 2 years before they took it over.

All this secrecy is annoying. They hold off on revealing these games as cross gen until the very end. Probably because of fear or backlash. Factions was announced way back in 2020 and they have kept it a secret since. Why? And its supposed to release this year? They should have a beta for it in June if they are aiming for a big PvE style release later this year. If Bungie did one thing right with Destiny was that they had 2 betas in june and july before launching in september. You cant do a beta one month before launch for these GaaS games. Not enough time to fix things.

PS4 visuals would be utter incompetent management

If you’re a Sony fan it’s time to boycott this kind of cash grab nonsense
 

kyliethicc

Member
Found it. Jason talks about his remake article in a lot more detail here. He left out a lot of detail because the bloomberg article was written for a mainstream audience.

Timestamped.


The way he talks about it shows that the game was basically made to run on the PS4 engine with TLOU2 gameplay and visuals being applied to the original. That's it. No mention of next gen stuff. Which is weird because his article stated this was a PS5 game.

Im hoping that since ND took in 2020, they probably increased the scope of this game and made it a true next gen only game with UE5, Avatar, Matrix quality visuals. And thats why it is taking so long. I dont understand why a simple asset upgrade would take a big team like ND 2+ years when the game had already been in development for 2 years before they took it over.

All this secrecy is annoying. They hold off on revealing these games as cross gen until the very end. Probably because of fear or backlash. Factions was announced way back in 2020 and they have kept it a secret since. Why? And its supposed to release this year? They should have a beta for it in June if they are aiming for a big PvE style release later this year. If Bungie did one thing right with Destiny was that they had 2 betas in june and july before launching in september. You cant do a beta one month before launch for these GaaS games. Not enough time to fix things.
Hate to break it to you but no game shipping anytime soon will look like that Matrix demo.

Especially since it’s got a rather “cinematic” frame rate lol


 

SlimySnake

Member
Hate to break it to you but no game shipping anytime soon will look like that Matrix demo.

Especially since it’s got a rather “cinematic” frame rate lol


Maybe not the Matrix but hopefully a significant next gen leap.

You have randos on youtube making shit like this in their spare time. I expect Naughty Gods to do better than PS4 quality visuals. I want to them at least give it a shot.


It's all about expectations. No one should be ok with ND wasting 2.5 years working on a last gen game, let alone a last gen remake of PS3 game. It's a gigantic waste of everyone's time.
 

kyliethicc

Member
Maybe not the Matrix but hopefully a significant next gen leap.

You have randos on youtube making shit like this in their spare time. I expect Naughty Gods to do better than PS4 quality visuals. I want to them at least give it a shot.


It's all about expectations. No one should be ok with ND wasting 2.5 years working on a last gen game, let alone a last gen remake of PS3 game. It's a gigantic waste of everyone's time.
I think a realistic expectation for the remake is around what a remaster of TLOU2 can also look like. A settings bump, 60 FPS, etc. Maybe some RT shadows or something like that. I doubt the goal of the remake is to suddenly make Part 2 look bad. It’s more about creating 2 cohesive parts of 1 larger story franchise.

The only issue for the remake is they have to reuse the original performances that lacked facial capture data for animation. They didn’t start using full facial capture tech until TLOU2. The faces will have to be fully hand animated, like the original.
 

SlimySnake

Member
I think a realistic expectation for the remake is around what a remaster of TLOU2 can also look like. A settings bump, 60 FPS, etc. Maybe some RT shadows or something like that. I doubt the goal of the remake is to suddenly make Part 2 look bad. It’s more about creating 2 cohesive parts of 1 larger story franchise.

The only issue for the remake is they have to reuse the original performances that lacked facial capture data for animation. They didn’t start using full facial capture tech until TLOU2. The faces will have to be fully hand animated, like the original.
A realistic expectation in 2022? 2 years after the launch of Sony's next gen console? And thats if it doesnt get delayed to 2023 like every other game this year.

For reference, 2.5 years after the PS4's launch, ND had a full fledged sequel to Uncharted 4 that was by far the best looking game on ANY platform.
 

kyliethicc

Member
A realistic expectation in 2022? 2 years after the launch of Sony's next gen console? And thats if it doesnt get delayed to 2023 like every other game this year.

For reference, 2.5 years after the PS4's launch, ND had a full fledged sequel to Uncharted 4 that was by far the best looking game on ANY platform.
Yeah things change.

There’s diminishing returns to stronger hardware. (They can only use PBR for the first time once lol.)

Plus there are financial, temporal, & human limits to pushing fidelity now.

Don’t expect the same exact linear leap in fidelity every gen on the same timeline. You’ll be disappointed.

And there was a pandemic. It caused a lot of delays.
 
remake?!?! was this always a thing? WTF

Please stop. Why the fuck are you remaking a game that already ran well and looked good... On top of that a damn game the was ALREADY remastered! As a long time PS dude bro I can confirm that they do some shit a few times a year where I am left scratching my head... like WTF dudes. I sometimes really hate them :messenger_tears_of_joy:
 

SlimySnake

Member
Yeah things change.

There’s diminishing returns to stronger hardware. (They can only use PBR for the first time once lol.)
I think Matrix, the first UE5 demo and Avatar have all shown that diminishing returns are still not a factor. You can still have a generational leap.
Plus there are financial, temporal, & human limits to pushing fidelity now.
This should never be an excuse for the premiere studio at the biggest most successful console manufacturer of the last three decades. But the cyberpunk trailer above shows that random youtubers can come together to borrow UE5 assets and release tech demos that look next gen. No gameplay sure, but its never been easier to generate assets which is basically what the remake is. It's literally a copy pasta.

Anyway, dont want to turn this into an argument. My beef is with Naughty Dog, not you, so dont take this the wrong way.
 

Wohc

Banned
remake?!?! was this always a thing? WTF

Please stop. Why the fuck are you remaking a game that already ran well and looked good... On top of that a damn game the was ALREADY remastered! As a long time PS dude bro I can confirm that they do some shit a few times a year where I am left scratching my head... like WTF dudes. I sometimes really hate them :messenger_tears_of_joy:
They sold ~13 million PS4 remasters so i guess they hope to sell another 13 million PS5 remakes. Easy money.
 

SlimySnake

Member
This is another real time tech demo created by ONE person In UE4. He used his own photogammetry scans. Didnt even borrow the megascans from Quixxel which are now free to use for everyone using UE5. This is realtime running on typical technical budget for games.


Published in June 2020. Didnt need UE5 to do these photorealistic visuals.

Lets go back one more year. March 2019. Unreal Engine rebirth demo running on a 1080 Ti. An 11 tflops console with no ray tracing capabilities. Photorealistic visuals.


The entire Matrix demo was made by 80 people in just under 8 months. A fully next gen open world with A.I simulations, chaos physics, photorealistic visuals, cutscenes, and an incredible car chase sequence done from scratch. 80 people, not all of them were even game devs. So why is it taking ND 2-4 years to do an asset flip a PS3 game? And why is this asset flip last gen?

And finally, this incredible storm demo from 3 years ago made by one person with full physics and destruction, running on a GTX 970. A 3.5 tflops card. At 35-60 fps at 1080p


Just what has Naughty Dog been up to?
 

kyliethicc

Member
I think Matrix, the first UE5 demo and Avatar have all shown that diminishing returns are still not a factor. You can still have a generational leap.

This should never be an excuse for the premiere studio at the biggest most successful console manufacturer of the last three decades. But the cyberpunk trailer above shows that random youtubers can come together to borrow UE5 assets and release tech demos that look next gen. No gameplay sure, but its never been easier to generate assets which is basically what the remake is. It's literally a copy pasta.

Anyway, dont want to turn this into an argument. My beef is with Naughty Dog, not you, so dont take this the wrong way.
Oh no worries I understand you have high hopes and expectations.

I just tend to expect less to avoid disappointment. Hopefully they blow us away.

The good news is - the worst case scenario is we get a masterpiece game remade to look & play better.

The bad news is you’ll probably be disappointed when they reveal it lol.
 

SlimySnake

Member
Here is another incredible video by Epic Games. They asked a few artists to make some environments in a few days and they ended up producing over 40 different environments in just a few days each. All of them in 90 days.

Some of these are absolutely mind blowing, especially towards the end.


The Ninety Days project kicked off with just three core artists and a simple concept: make something beautiful and inspiring, keep it real-time, and if possible, build each environment in just three days.

Although this was originally intended as a fun experiment and an opportunity to get hands-on experience with Unreal Engine 5, what our small team was able to accomplish far exceeded our wildest expectations, creating over 40 distinctly stunning environments in just a few days each–something that would’ve been unimaginable just a few years ago.
As the team gained momentum, we invited a handful of additional artists from inside Epic to join us, all from completely different disciplines. Not only would this be more interesting and diversify the look and feel of the end product, but it would also test a mantra we keep here at Quixel: ‘Make art easy’.

We wanted to know, was what we were doing truly ‘easy’?

The answer to that question may be different for everyone, but what we quickly discovered was that with Unreal Engine 5 and Quixel Megascans, creating high-quality content is easier and faster than ever before.

“Working on several different environments that convey varied stories and moods was extremely fast and iterative using Unreal Engine 5 and Quixel Megascans. This project made me realize how quickly you can put scenes together that hit the detail level of animated films in real time.” Alec Tucker, Cinematic Environment Artist, Quixel, Epic Games.

To me, this is just proof that these studios are stuck making last gen games in their dated last gen engines and simply cannot create assets fast enough. UE5's megascans are a total gamechanger and while some of Sonys studios use them, they need to go all in and just leave their last gen engines behind because they are simply taking too long. And i say this as a big fan of proprietary engines. this shit is simply taking too long. Love Decima, but its gotta go. it shouldnt take them 5 fucking years to make a sequel.
 

KungFucius

Member
You realise it's not a remaster? It's not just some fancy polish on top of the original.. This is a remake. I'm not sure how this is unnecessary. Was Demon's Souls remake unnecessary?
There was a PS4 port that is playable on PS5 and it sold a shit ton. That is not true for DS3. Comparing the 2 is kind of ridiculous.
 

Stooky

Member
Evan Wells did an interview last year where he admitted that they just cant become a multi team studio no matter how hard they try. Later in the interview he states that they still only have 300 employees. Umm, maybe THAT is your problem? 300 employees at the premiere Sony studio in 2022 is a fucking joke.





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I mean this is such an easy problem to solve. Hire more people. You are in LA, you dont even have to ask people to relocate from other states or countries. SSM, Crystal Dynamics, Insomniac, Respawn, Infinity Ward, Riot Games (league of legends dev), Treyarch, Blizzard... they are all in the LA county. Just go and out bid everyone. You are Sony. You make $25 billion in revenue.

It's crazy to me that they did not grow in the PS4 era like at all. They were 75 devs in 2007, 150 devs in 2009 when they shipped U2 then 250 devs by the time they shipped TLOU. So only 50 new devs from 2013-2022? wtf? Everyone knows its taking longer than ever to make games and they are just acting like its 2009.
Hiring good talent is not easy. In some cases 1 really good artist or programer can do the work of 3. Look at massive teams and their quality of work and then compare that ND.
 
Yeah they have a good opportunity to clean up the little issues with this remake.

Part 2 is much improved across all aspects, thankfully. Would be great to have Part 1 at a similar level.


Nope it’s just a remake. Same as with Demon’s Souls.
Then it's the same game with better graphics just like a remaster, so again I don't see the point in doing another remake of TLOU.
 
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