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My Kickstarter Nightmare: Soul Saga Edition
- Thread starter Elessartelrunya
- Start date
I'm just going to post what I would like for him to answer
- Everything about the trip and how it was funded
- What percentage of the Kickstarter funds has gone into the multiple redesigns and artists (I know this might be a little too personal, but it's just something that seems like an issue to this game's development)
I really don't want to see this game fail (why I backed it), but my feelings of the game have taken a 180 since the Kickstarter ended (and no, I don't think Mike is a scammer, he is doing something that he loves, but sometimes...dreams take over reality)
- Everything about the trip and how it was funded
- What percentage of the Kickstarter funds has gone into the multiple redesigns and artists (I know this might be a little too personal, but it's just something that seems like an issue to this game's development)
I really don't want to see this game fail (why I backed it), but my feelings of the game have taken a 180 since the Kickstarter ended (and no, I don't think Mike is a scammer, he is doing something that he loves, but sometimes...dreams take over reality)
DangerMouse
Member
Me either, I backed it too.
I don't think it's that easy FusionCode. Finding one nearby seems impossible if you want a Japanese artist.
With the international thing involved it may not be that simple. I don't remember the details but I remember some behind the scenes anime specials or podcasts mentioning that you'd have virtually no luck signing up an anime series or even talent (such as in anime terms, I guess the OP songs from certain bands) unless you had a representative in Japan or something like that. I think this is why a while back we always used to see e-mails/tweets or announcements of Funi/ADV/Sentai etc. talking about taking their latest trips to Japan prior to con-season and licensing announcements.
While it's true he probably should have said in advance why he was taking the trip, it's supposed to be a JRPG, I'd think given that and that he pitched the game with an anime art style he was right to at least get another Japanese artist if he had to change artists.
If he hadn't and gone local and suddenly changed to a western artist he'd probably be getting refund demands from probably the majority of backers. Heck, just look at how Unsung Story is getting hammered as a "non-Matsuno" game and many are skeptical of it, even beyond the fact we haven't seen gameplay, plenty due to just the western-looking concept art many think the game will hardly be a Matsuno-like game and that he'll have minimum impact on it and even after getting Yoshida until Yoshida's art is shown in-game many are apparently still skeptical (not necessarily wrongfully so either). Imagine if Soul Saga had gone from it's old art style to a western art style for what's supposed to be a game made in the style of a classic JRPG, most of which's fans would riot at a change to some typical western art style unless it was something really special looking.
Looking at that reaction I think him sticking with a Japanese artist for the game was a good choice since that's what the game is supposed to be even if the artist has changed.
I dunno, I haven't had the time to follow it that closely but it's possible the opposite happened regarding input on the character designs, I liked the original art style that I backed with but when the need for it first came up it kinda sounded like for some reason he got a ton of feedback that backers wanted it changed from the Dreamcast-like superdeformed look (like in the 2 old Evolution games) to something more normally proportioned.
I don't think it's that easy FusionCode. Finding one nearby seems impossible if you want a Japanese artist.
With the international thing involved it may not be that simple. I don't remember the details but I remember some behind the scenes anime specials or podcasts mentioning that you'd have virtually no luck signing up an anime series or even talent (such as in anime terms, I guess the OP songs from certain bands) unless you had a representative in Japan or something like that. I think this is why a while back we always used to see e-mails/tweets or announcements of Funi/ADV/Sentai etc. talking about taking their latest trips to Japan prior to con-season and licensing announcements.
While it's true he probably should have said in advance why he was taking the trip, it's supposed to be a JRPG, I'd think given that and that he pitched the game with an anime art style he was right to at least get another Japanese artist if he had to change artists.
If he hadn't and gone local and suddenly changed to a western artist he'd probably be getting refund demands from probably the majority of backers. Heck, just look at how Unsung Story is getting hammered as a "non-Matsuno" game and many are skeptical of it, even beyond the fact we haven't seen gameplay, plenty due to just the western-looking concept art many think the game will hardly be a Matsuno-like game and that he'll have minimum impact on it and even after getting Yoshida until Yoshida's art is shown in-game many are apparently still skeptical (not necessarily wrongfully so either). Imagine if Soul Saga had gone from it's old art style to a western art style for what's supposed to be a game made in the style of a classic JRPG, most of which's fans would riot at a change to some typical western art style unless it was something really special looking.
Looking at that reaction I think him sticking with a Japanese artist for the game was a good choice since that's what the game is supposed to be even if the artist has changed.
I dunno, I haven't had the time to follow it that closely but it's possible the opposite happened regarding input on the character designs, I liked the original art style that I backed with but when the need for it first came up it kinda sounded like for some reason he got a ton of feedback that backers wanted it changed from the Dreamcast-like superdeformed look (like in the 2 old Evolution games) to something more normally proportioned.
So what, he just isn't allowed to spend money on expensive vacations? Is he allowed to spend money on video games or movies? That money could be spent on food to keep him alive longer so he can spend more time on the project. Is he allowed to eat out occasionally, or is that just a waste of money as well? Where do you draw the line and why do you draw it there?
I think the problem is that people are funding his business, and he's presenting this as a "business trip." And you don't need to have an MBA to figure out that this is a trip that didn't need to happen.
First, finding contract artists is not something you have to do in person. That's kind of the point of contract artists. We have hired literally hundreds of them, and we do it all online - they apply, we send them a test, they send the test back, we send them work if they pass the test, they send us completed work, we Paypal them money. It's 100% percent done online, through e-mail.
Second, he purports to have a "Japanese Branch HR Manager," Nozomi. Wouldn't the purpose of such a position be to scout local talent so that he doesn't have to visit in person?
His attempt to try and make it sound like a business trip doesn't really hold up under any level of scrutiny, at least how he's presented it.
The problem with this post is that it assumes you need a Japanese artist to make Japanese style art. A quick look online shows that there's plenty of non-Japanese artists capable of the style. There are also Japanese online art services, and he supposedly has connections there too. Not to mention whatever artists he did meet there clearly weren't up to scratch considering the response to the redesigns and that they're basically just Final Fantasy rehashes.
And just from a perspective... you don't spend 3-5% of your total budget on a trip for a chance to find an artist.
Again, not to necessarily take sides, but what is it about Kickstarter that makes you think that the developer has to listen to anyone's input? Kickstarting a project neither makes you a partner, producer, or anything other than someone who has faith in the project and in some cases hope to see something in return.
Is he obligated to listen? No. Should he listen? It would be nice. Should he be banning people and deleting their posts for sharing their opinions? Not if he's a mature person.
Nobody here thinks he has to take the OP's concerns and change the game as a result or that he's legally obligated to give a refund. His behavior in regards to it (if he was just nicer to the OP this would have never come up) put a crosshair on his head though, and more and more evidence has come to light showing how unready he is for this project in many different ways.
element
Member
I have friends that make indie games, and they are so frugal with their money, because they know they have no income. What is in the bank is it.
Considering the scope of the game and the size of his team (himself), he should be living the life of a starving artist.
Quote
Member
What element above me said, but also probably the parts of the Kickstarter that say things like:
"= Being part of the closed beta allows you to get your voice heard when it matters most! Your input can directly effect how Soul Saga ends up to help make it a game we all love![*]"
*I might ban you.
Are you debating about necessities vs. luxury before or after he's had to change the scope of the game due to budget issues?
Great to hear. What about the part where he banned one of the people that funded him and wanted provide feedback?
My question was intended to be about luxuries versus necessities in general, and not just within the context of this Kickstarter project. Sorry if I wasn't clear enough about that. Banning a backer who is providing constructive feedback is certainly mean-spirited and unprofessional behavior.
Also, did you mean to quote my post twice?
Elessartelrunya
Member
Got a reply from Jason, said he was swamped but might be able to put up an article next week 
Quote
Member
Whoops, nope. Fixed.
DangerMouse
Member
I think we'll leave that alone since that's a much touchier topic going by the endless debates that occur regarding non-Japanese anime-style art. Not that there isn't good stuff out there.
Also, on the scale of a game like a JRPG I have no clue how much cheaper or perhaps more expensive that would be depending on the artists.
Was it going for a chance to find an artist or had he actually been in contact with an artist or two and was going to finalize the deal would be a good question for him to answer.
As others have said too, I get his reaction and first reaction is indeed to sympathize but as others have also said I too also don't know enough to take sides (or even if he's even still banned since in an earlier post there's talk of him being unbanned now, nor do I know the other side's full story) but I don't know both sides or even what the warnings truly were if there were any since the post sited indicates that Mike supposedly warned him of abrasive posts (maybe they really weren't abrasive though). As zhorkat just said, generally speaking, unless called for, banning a backer who is providing constructive feedback is certainly mean-spirited and unprofessional behavior.
But:
What about the feedback he's taken from other backers without issue? There are 5000+ backers, some of their comments seem to have gotten positive reception and many of which ofcourse aren't banned. And then on the twitch streams he's responded to plenty of suggestions both favorably and negatively or constructively.
Yeah, I agree
I'm a firm believer in good games eventually finding a way into consumers' hands, with or without KS/crowdfunding/etc, and I'll be there to open my wallet. That said, people are welcome to throw money wherever which way they see fit, just as long as they understand how these things work. This is small potatoes compared to some of the things that's transpired on Kickstarter (Ouya games funding competition comes to mind).
Okay, didn't realize this was part of the KS so I was in the wrong. So yeah, really nothing to add beyond that. I hope he can turn this around, though.
DangerMouse
Member
Agreed, I hope he can turn this around and this works out since the game started with so much potential and, like Gez, I like the now final designs such as Elise's final design as cited in LegionX and graywolf323's post.
Bboy AJ
My dog was murdered by a 3.5mm audio port and I will not rest until the standard is dead
No, I get it plenty. You just disagree. That doesn't mean you can characterize me as not getting it.
LegionX
Member
Probably more a technicality... but that whole beta access thing is at a higher tier than the OP pledged for.. plus the beta isn't ready yet.. so probably not so relevant to the current issue he's having with the project
I find your dislike of Kickstarter to be quite confusing, tbh.
Yes, it puts way too much power in the hands of the developers. Yes, I would like to see them have more responsibility and accountability.
But to characterize the developers as "begging"?... Why can't you treat this as just another form of funding (rhetorical question; you don't need to answer it; I know you're not changing your opinion)? Albeit, one that has some important issues to iron out; that shouldn't make it any less viable though. If people want to give and are not being co-erced, why the hell not?
I think the lines are a bit grayer than that. Investment implies a certain level of "legitimacy" which I don't think a Kickstarter pledge provides. I mean, you can sue if you want... but you haven't signed any legally-binding contract as far as I'm concerned.
There's just a simple disclaimer on the Kickstarter website, and that's about it. They get to keep their hands clean while raking in the commission.
ZehDon
Gold Member
Well, in the purest sense, an investment results in some kind of a return of your investment. With Kickstarter, you're not investing your money, because you're not seeking to have it returned in any quantifiable way. You do not get a share of the profits of the game once it is completed, either directly or indirectly through some kind of share system.
I do not think it's about "legitimacy", or lack thereof, either; anyone can invest in just about anything. Rip-off ponzi-style investment schemes have caused literally hundreds of millions of dollars in damages, and they appeared entirely legitimate. Kickstarter is a donation system, wherein the market forces of the platform have dictated that a successful video game Kickstarter campaign gives a copy of the finished game to the people who donated. There is no law requiring this, nor any requirement from Kickstarter themselves. It's simply what the market has dictated.
So, Kickstarter is a gamble, plain and simple. It's like giving money to someone you don't know; they might do something good with it, like use it to buy food, or they might do something bad with it, like use it to buy drugs. However, even within that context, it wouldn't be difficult to argue that Kickstarter campaigns promising a game to backers are entering into an agreement with said backers. Unlike a donation, wherein nothing is agreed to be supplied, these campaigns are stating in no uncertain terms that an end product will be provided. That's not an investment - its simply selling goods, even if they do not exist at the time. I suspect violating that agreement might fall under common retail law, or the digital equivalent should one exist in the countries in question, even if no contract has been signed. They sold something, and you paid for that something. At the very least, refunds would be issued in full.
I imagine something like XKCD's point wouldn't be too far off the mark:
Anyway, in my opinion the open platform has dangers, as we're currently seeing, but as long as people are informed of those dangers, it should remain open. It falls to the individual to make the decision, as it should. Abuse of the system can still be policed using the legal system; I'd argue that it wouldn't be difficult to take this person in question to court for a full refund of a given backer's pledge, and on top of that he would need to pay the legal costs. A two or three thousand backer class action would make it easy for international backers to be represented as well.
Personally, I don't think bringing in the shiny red-tape of "legitimacy" does anything to solve the problem of people abusing the system, and ultimately I fear it would simply damage the success of Kickstarter and what it's goals are. In the end, I guess its a trade off.
My two cents, of course.
I do not think it's about "legitimacy", or lack thereof, either; anyone can invest in just about anything. Rip-off ponzi-style investment schemes have caused literally hundreds of millions of dollars in damages, and they appeared entirely legitimate. Kickstarter is a donation system, wherein the market forces of the platform have dictated that a successful video game Kickstarter campaign gives a copy of the finished game to the people who donated. There is no law requiring this, nor any requirement from Kickstarter themselves. It's simply what the market has dictated.
So, Kickstarter is a gamble, plain and simple. It's like giving money to someone you don't know; they might do something good with it, like use it to buy food, or they might do something bad with it, like use it to buy drugs. However, even within that context, it wouldn't be difficult to argue that Kickstarter campaigns promising a game to backers are entering into an agreement with said backers. Unlike a donation, wherein nothing is agreed to be supplied, these campaigns are stating in no uncertain terms that an end product will be provided. That's not an investment - its simply selling goods, even if they do not exist at the time. I suspect violating that agreement might fall under common retail law, or the digital equivalent should one exist in the countries in question, even if no contract has been signed. They sold something, and you paid for that something. At the very least, refunds would be issued in full.
I think "keep their hands clean" lends a bit of a "bad" slant to Kickstarter that isn't warranted, in my opinion. Kickstarter is a platform for people to use, and has successfully helped literally thousands of projects become reality. Asking Kickstarter to intervene, or expecting something more than an open platform, would alter the platform's success entirely. Legal contracts would need to be drawn up, reviewed, mailed out, signed, entered into and held. Of course, Lawyers would also need to be involved, and the barrier of entry in terms of sheer funding costs goes through the roof. Kickstarter would need more than the current ~5% to cover their costs, and backers would need to start included legal costs in their funding requirements.
I imagine something like XKCD's point wouldn't be too far off the mark:
Anyway, in my opinion the open platform has dangers, as we're currently seeing, but as long as people are informed of those dangers, it should remain open. It falls to the individual to make the decision, as it should. Abuse of the system can still be policed using the legal system; I'd argue that it wouldn't be difficult to take this person in question to court for a full refund of a given backer's pledge, and on top of that he would need to pay the legal costs. A two or three thousand backer class action would make it easy for international backers to be represented as well.
Personally, I don't think bringing in the shiny red-tape of "legitimacy" does anything to solve the problem of people abusing the system, and ultimately I fear it would simply damage the success of Kickstarter and what it's goals are. In the end, I guess its a trade off.
My two cents, of course.
Admiral Woofington
Member
Honestly this got as much funding as it did because the guy had a somewhat finished video that looked professionally done and then because of the video most folk just took the very vague 'I worked at Microsoft' as a hint that he worked for Microsoft Game Studios at a somewhat decently important position as we associated the product we say in the video to his possible position, cementing the deal to back him.
If he's a guy with more than decent developing skills that hasn't caught a break, that's great for him if he found Kickstarter so he can prove himself.
The issue here isn't that he's scamming us. Because he's not. The issue here is that he doesn't have the experience with a business or money handling a professional would have. If he would've had more experience he would have known how much money he needed to hire a decent artist, or bring somebody with him to help out. The youtube artist I'm fine with as that'd be like giving somebody a chance as well. Kickstarter for the most part has been about people who are experienced in the regular industry starting fresh in a new environment and using the skills and knowledge they've developed from the publisher method to manage their own game.
If everything as we read it, this kickstarter is being done by somebody who is both inexperienced in the business and the developing aspect. When myself and other backers told him "Don't you think you'll need more money? Seems like a low amount for something so ambitious" he told us he had it under control. More importantly when we asked him if he could still realistically meet the June 2014 release date he also said that he had everything planned out and that it was going fine. The warnings that developers with bigger teams, more experience and less ambitious games were not making deadlines didn't phase him and it was a bit like a kid refusing to admit the truth. He's lost more than enough money on the artist search and he's still not 100% done. We already know the scope/size of the game was brought down because he didn't calculate the money correctly.
It's fine if Kickstarter is a learning experience but fail to deliver here and you're basically doomed to go into the publisher developed method as you'll lose all the confidence from direct backers. I give this 2-3 months before he sends an update basically saying "guys I gotta be honest with you, this isn't happening. I plan on repaying all of you with the bigger tiers back as soon as I can afford it" then never do. This is to put it simply a sad gamble based on misinformation, plain and simple. It will be used by haters as a reason to not do Kickstarter. And it's a shame as it only brings down creativity.
If he's a guy with more than decent developing skills that hasn't caught a break, that's great for him if he found Kickstarter so he can prove himself.
The issue here isn't that he's scamming us. Because he's not. The issue here is that he doesn't have the experience with a business or money handling a professional would have. If he would've had more experience he would have known how much money he needed to hire a decent artist, or bring somebody with him to help out. The youtube artist I'm fine with as that'd be like giving somebody a chance as well. Kickstarter for the most part has been about people who are experienced in the regular industry starting fresh in a new environment and using the skills and knowledge they've developed from the publisher method to manage their own game.
If everything as we read it, this kickstarter is being done by somebody who is both inexperienced in the business and the developing aspect. When myself and other backers told him "Don't you think you'll need more money? Seems like a low amount for something so ambitious" he told us he had it under control. More importantly when we asked him if he could still realistically meet the June 2014 release date he also said that he had everything planned out and that it was going fine. The warnings that developers with bigger teams, more experience and less ambitious games were not making deadlines didn't phase him and it was a bit like a kid refusing to admit the truth. He's lost more than enough money on the artist search and he's still not 100% done. We already know the scope/size of the game was brought down because he didn't calculate the money correctly.
It's fine if Kickstarter is a learning experience but fail to deliver here and you're basically doomed to go into the publisher developed method as you'll lose all the confidence from direct backers. I give this 2-3 months before he sends an update basically saying "guys I gotta be honest with you, this isn't happening. I plan on repaying all of you with the bigger tiers back as soon as I can afford it" then never do. This is to put it simply a sad gamble based on misinformation, plain and simple. It will be used by haters as a reason to not do Kickstarter. And it's a shame as it only brings down creativity.
DarkSiegmeyer
Neo Member
Can you post the threads/messages you posted/sent?
Sorry for the wall of text, but recent events with this project have really pissed me off, here's my "story"...
Needless-to-say, I'm no longer interested in this project.
Elessartelrunya
Member
On the forum? I don't have access to that section of the forum, he locked down the dev diaries. I know he deleted 2-3 of my posts (no longer in my history), but there is no way for me to pull them. I've tried to do my best to "quote" my old posts from memory. Exact words, no, but *almost* verbatim, maybe, conveying the tone? Yes.
I think I'm NOT the only one who would like to see my original posts to try and add perspective to this. But Mike either refuses or ignores the requests.
Solid Samus
Banned
edit: not worth it
I did an interview with Mike Gale a year and a half ago (and it touches on monetary issues he was having with his Soul Saga art assets)
http://gamesauce.org/news/2012/08/31/no-fear-of-failure-an-interview-with-mike-gale/
http://gamesauce.org/news/2012/08/31/no-fear-of-failure-an-interview-with-mike-gale/
thiscoldblack
Unconfirmed Member
I took a look at the kickstarter and I think I would've backed it up based on the info and art style presented there. If he's drastically changing the art style after funding, he's basically dumping half of my interest on the game down the drain.
Parakeetman
No one wants a throne you've been sitting on!
I talked with my friend who had backed the project and he agrees with the others notion that the change in art stlye is very uncool. While changes to existing style and such is understandable, but the whole total rehauling of the characters and style doesnt seem to sit well.
Elessartelrunya
Member
There he goes again, misleading people. I mean, until he speaks up, this isn't 100% confirmed, but all sources indicate he was contracted by a third party to do QA testing. That =/= being a Microsoft employee.
I assume by "apps" he's referring to his work on mods?
It's starting to look that way. Seems like the troubles started long before the Kickstarter days.
mattiewheels
And then the LORD David Bowie saith to his Son, Jonny Depp: 'Go, and spread my image amongst the cosmos. For every living thing is in anguish and only the LIGHT shall give them reprieve.'
I sort of get why people would want this story to spread through the news channels like Polygon/Kotaku like I've seen people attempt here...but what does having this become an exposé really do in the end? Are you simply trying to warn people about this guy in case of future projects? As far as the current project, its not like he took the money and vanished, he's still at work, even if you've lost faith in him he's still got a window to give you a product in. What does tearing him a new asshole via Kotaku accomplish right now?
Elessartelrunya
Member
Principle. Warning. The fact that he's changed so many things and wasted so much money. Had I know how much of a fraud he was, I would have backed a different project.
I'd like it to serve as:
- A massive wake up call to the developer that he's bitten off more that he can chew and answer questions about finances, art and credentials that he's currently ignoring. He's dismissed us as trolls, but when a journalist comes knocking that's a different story. He can still change his game to something he can actually deliver/return the money at this point.
- A cautionary tale for people to look closely at the details before backing a Kickstarter. Not to deter people from using KS, but I'd like them to inform themselves about how/where the money they're spending is going. I'd like KS to be something everyone uses responsibly.
zeopower6
Member
I'm just going to say that you must have said something in those dev diaries to really set him off because for the most part, he's pretty easy to talk to...
I just hope this game isn't going to be stuck for months because of what happened here.
I asked him if he had any writing or game development experience in a very polite manner and he deleted my post. It's not hard to set him off.
That's a pretty baseless assumption.
Why would it get stuck for months because of this thread?
I don't see how this is going to delay development for the game. People have to deal with criticism everyday and you know what? You just have to live with it and move on, there's no need to get so worked up over it
As a game developer myself, who might -eventually- try to raise funds on Kickstarter, I feel ashamed that some developers are acting like this, even getting away with it.
Why in the world do you need to take a trip to anywhere to hire an artist, and spend the money people pledged for your project?
How is it possible to completely reboot your project -art and gameplay wise- after raising funds? There was a moment for that.
Why fucking turning your back to those who helped you to reach your goal? Specially, when all they are doing is stating their opinions about your sudden change of heart.
This case reminds me of that Rainfall project, also on KS...
I'll never understand how could anyone ask for money to make a game before even knowing what the main character will look like.
I've been waiting for several years now before even considering to make a KS campaign, just to be sure I'm able to make the goddamn thing all by myself. Not to mention the time I spent designing everything. And even now, after entering in production stage and having adquired decent skills for everything, I'm still not 100% sure about it...
Well, I suppose this is what happens when people like these deves. see veterans like Keiji Inafune raising over 2mill. $ on KS, thanks to some concept art he showed. Makes you think that making a game is all about that. "oh, I have this cool idea, I'll draw some crappy concept art, code a walk cycle, and ask for money".
TL;DR.- Making games is not the same that playing games. Every gameplay hour has behind it like 100 hours of work, if not more. You have to be really sure about what you are going to do or you'll fail miserably.
Why in the world do you need to take a trip to anywhere to hire an artist, and spend the money people pledged for your project?
How is it possible to completely reboot your project -art and gameplay wise- after raising funds? There was a moment for that.
Why fucking turning your back to those who helped you to reach your goal? Specially, when all they are doing is stating their opinions about your sudden change of heart.
This case reminds me of that Rainfall project, also on KS...
I'll never understand how could anyone ask for money to make a game before even knowing what the main character will look like.
I've been waiting for several years now before even considering to make a KS campaign, just to be sure I'm able to make the goddamn thing all by myself. Not to mention the time I spent designing everything. And even now, after entering in production stage and having adquired decent skills for everything, I'm still not 100% sure about it...
Well, I suppose this is what happens when people like these deves. see veterans like Keiji Inafune raising over 2mill. $ on KS, thanks to some concept art he showed. Makes you think that making a game is all about that. "oh, I have this cool idea, I'll draw some crappy concept art, code a walk cycle, and ask for money".
TL;DR.- Making games is not the same that playing games. Every gameplay hour has behind it like 100 hours of work, if not more. You have to be really sure about what you are going to do or you'll fail miserably.
Elessartelrunya
Member
That's your opinion, but I stand by my word that my posts since DAY 1 have always been critical, yet constructive. I outlined the issues with the game up to that point (last Sunday) and my issues with the "new path" and "major" changes that were coming. Yet I ended my post with a simple "I'll patiently wait for these changes, but worst case, I'll ask for a refund."
He didn't take kindly to that and supposedly "warned" me, which is BS. He countered and said something about asking for a refund could hurt the project, etc, etc., then he locked down the dev diaries. THAT'S when my [final] post was more critical and less constructive, but it still wasn't worth banning. I simply skipped the pleasantries and asked for an immediate refund if he was going to "run and hide" with the important project information.
If Mike were to un-delete/view those posts (and not edit them since he's an admin), I'm 87% confident people would agree my posts were critical but not worth being banned. And as others have pointed out, Mike is quick to delete posts that question him or his handling of the project. He also likes to ignore requests...
zeopower6
Member
Hmm, well, just before this thread was made, I think he mentioned that for a day or two after whatever happened in the Dev Diaries forum, there was no progress made on the game. Now that dozens of other people are involved and likening him to a scammer/calling him a fraud/etc, I'm just worried.
When did you ask him this? I think if you asked at some point before during a Twitch session or just at any time before these events happened, he'd probably have answered you.
On the Facebook page during the Kickstarter campaign.
Elessartelrunya
Member
I don't think you're the only one to have a question/comment/post deleted that way...as I've said, and others have pointed out as well, Mike really don't like critical/negative comments. As he said in the forum, everything basically has to be sunshine and roses... *rolls eyes*
Perhaps we'll get lucky and a big site or two will post about this and Mike will have to grow up. One can hope at least.
That.... why the hell is he calling Skyrim an 'easternized western game'? What is possessing him to call Catherine a 'procedural' story? Does he really think 'branching' means 'procedural'? Minecraft is procedural. DayZ is procedural. Catherine isn't freaking procedural! This man has no idea what he's talking about.
Also I don't think this is that big of a story though right? Projects to develop games fall apart all the time at all levels from indie all the way up to Duke Nukem Forever level budgets.
Edit: And the final line of 2d vs 3d? Man didn't even know until AFTER he ordered the art assets that you can't just dynamically switch items around on a 2d sprite but can on a 3d model? I think I'm better qualified to develop a game than this guy!
Edit2: I mean sure he made that mistake before the kickstarter... but this guy was starting from absolute 0 in terms of knowing anything about games, smh.
I'm wondering if he's using the term in the dramatic sense, a'la a 'police procedural' - 'going through the motions', for want of a better term. Which still doesn't particularly fit for Catherine.
But you *can* dynamically switch items on a 2D sprite, provided you plan for it carefully in advance; it's a similar principle to the 'paper doll' system of some RPGs Whether the workload to do so is too great is another matter, but there's a few tricks and workarounds that are possible - layering multiple sprites ought to work. Doesn't Rogue Legacy do precisely that?
Here's the thing, though: If you're designing a game, and there is a feature you wish to implement which requires a total overhaul of the engine... you drop the feature, you don't overhaul the engine. Which is sort-of addressed by the last question:
This suggests to me that this is truly a passion project for him, but the backers really needed to be aware of the statement because it highlights the risks in funding this project.