Isn't raising prices just before a big sale illegal in a lot of countries?
The price hike itself happened a while ago, it's just exploding now because paradox just released two new DLCs for both HoI4 and EU4 a few days ago, neither of which contains a great deal of content. Anger against their business practises has been boiling under the surface for a long time within the paradox community, and there's grumbling about it frequently.
Firstly, old and unsupported games also got a price hike. This happened across the board with their catalog. The price of EU4 and CK2 almost doubled in my region. I'm not sure why they think the purchasing power of my country doubled overnight (or even over the course of the last two years for that matter). And all these patches they work on are supported by DLC sales. EU4 has over 40 DLCs. CK2 has over 60 DLCs. Think about that for a second. It's a crazy number of extra bits of content. The price of the DLCs has gone up too.
Victoria II is most definitely an unsupported game.
Paradox's patches may be accompanied by a fair amount of notes, but they usually pale in comparison to what their own modding scene offers, and in terms of the gameplay change/price ratio rarely seem like a fair ask. Not to mention I think they actually are oversupported - the constant tinkering with very small changes disrupts the modding scene by forcing everyone to focus on compatability rather than developing new content.
Saying 'these games go on sale regularly' is not a fair defense. If there is no reason to ever purchase a game except at the sale price and this happens on a regular occasion, why would you not just make the sale price the standard price? What benefit is it to the consumer making them wait another month for the next opportunity to buy to come around?
Sure, they are still supporting their games, and they make changes to the base game, but the vast majority of important features are gated behind DLC.
For instance in EU4, 2 of the most significant mechanics - estates and province development - are DLC only. A lot of diplomatic options are as well.
That's not even counting the revenue from cosmetic DLCs.
And if they really wanted to adjust for purchasing power, why do it for the base game and their old DLCs, and not just have the new DLCs be adjusted?
Every friend I recommend EU4 to is already super turned off by just the insane amount of DLC expansions, the fact they're even more expensive now doesn't help increase their player base by any stretch of the imagination. If anything, it will get people to stop buying any future expansions, or at least reduce their purchases.
I love EU4 but I have stopped purchasing the DLC expansions for the last few patches now simply because I can't afford dropping 15 or 20 on an expansion every few months while also trying to buy other games/content.
Okay, looking over the actual data on this, the price increases seem to be focussed on currencies which have lost value versus the Euro in the past few years (with Paradox obviously accounting in Euros). As an example, the Ruble has lost approximately 32% of its value to the Euro since EU4 launched. As far as I can tell, it has been selling at the same 699 Ruble price from launch until today's price increase. Even after the price increase, it's still at an almost 50% discount compared to people buying in Euros.
Looking at their main games, this seems to be a recurring theme; prices have gone up alongside exchange rates, but are still heavily discounted outside the Eurozone. In fact, checking EU4, HoI4, Stellaris, CKII, Cities: Skylines, Pillars of Eternity, and a variety of DLC, I haven't found a single situation where Paradox are charging any other region more than they charge in the Eurozone, and the countries with the biggest price increases still seem to have the largest savings versus Euros. While I understand it's annoying, I can't muster up all that much sympathy when you're still able to buy these games for a lot less than I'd have to pay.
Pretty substantial here in Canada. Up around 31%. Won't consider PoE at its new price for a long time.So,how much the price increased?
For the regions affected alot.
In Brazil, Victoria II went from R$35 to R$53. In Russia, it went from ₽350 to ₽700. In India, ₹565 to ₹805.
Victoria 2 is 7 years old and isn't being supported anymore by patches or DLC.
...Basically this is just inflation. If you don't like it, give out to your government and central bank. It'll do a lot more good than complaining about video game prices on the internet...
I only explained why they charged for the dlc's. I did not justify them raising the prices on dlc and base game. Like I have said in other posts, I totally understand that people are pissed about the price increase. Especially when it ends up a lot more expensive in some countries.I think you misunderstood my point.
You brought up the continued support and dlc as a reason for them to hike the price up of the base game because they keep working on them years after the base game has released.
I am making a point that the dlc itself costs money and thus they make a profit on dlc and that's why it makes little sense the hike the base game price up as the game gets older.
They are trying to make more money on the base game even after it's 5+ years old, that's not how the market works and as you can see from the outcry against it not a lot of people are happy about it.
They went from offering good post-release content and fans supporting it to being too greedy and the fans having a backlash because of it.
Okay, looking over the actual data on this, the price increases seem to be focussed on currencies which have lost value versus the Euro in the past few years (with Paradox obviously accounting in Euros). As an example, the Ruble has lost approximately 32% of its value to the Euro since EU4 launched. As far as I can tell, it has been selling at the same 699 Ruble price from launch until today's price increase. Even after the price increase, it's still at an almost 50% discount compared to people buying in Euros.
Looking at their main games, this seems to be a recurring theme; prices have gone up alongside exchange rates, but are still heavily discounted outside the Eurozone. In fact, checking EU4, HoI4, Stellaris, CKII, Cities: Skylines, Pillars of Eternity, and a variety of DLC, I haven't found a single situation where Paradox are charging any other region more than they charge in the Eurozone, and the countries with the biggest price increases still seem to have the largest savings versus Euros. While I understand it's annoying, I can't muster up all that much sympathy when you're still able to buy these games for a lot less than I'd have to pay.
Basically this is just inflation. If you don't like it, give out to your government and central bank. It'll do a lot more good than complaining about video game prices on the internet.
While I understand it's annoying, I can't muster up all that much sympathy when you're still able to buy these games for a lot less than I'd have to pay.
I think you severely underestimate the amount that gets added to Paradox games over time (which is easy to do, given how long many of their games have been out and how many patches they've had over that time). You can actually go back and play the 1.0 versions of EU4 and CKII using Steam's betas feature, and you'd be amazed at how much basic functionality is missing from them that we take for granted playing on current versions.
I can't muster up all that much sympathy when you're still able to buy these games for a lot less than I'd have to pay.
It's not that unusual. The App Store does its currency adjustments retroactively/universally: publishers set a price in USD, and then Apple decides "0.99 USD is 0.99 CAD", or "0.99 USD is 1.29 CAD", and when they switch the price over, a five year old 2.99 app goes from 2.99 CAD to 3.89 CAD overnight, with no input from the dev.
Given that it's so easy to gift Steam games across borders, it's easy to see why they'd want to change prices retroactively to avoid arbitrage, which would just be plain lost money for them.
You really want to compare game prices with brazil and say "you can't muster sympathy because we pay a lot less than you", bud?
I think you severely underestimate the amount that gets added to Paradox games over time (which is easy to do, given how long many of their games have been out and how many patches they've had over that time). You can actually go back and play the 1.0 versions of EU4 and CKII using Steam's betas feature, and you'd be amazed at how much basic functionality is missing from them that we take for granted playing on current versions.
[...]
Some worthwhile features are gated behind DLC, but that's pretty much inevitable, as otherwise nobody would actually buy the DLC. Even if you completely ignore the DLC, though, the amount of support that Paradox gives its games is well beyond any comparable developer. As I mentioned to Crab above, you can play the 1.0 versions of their games on Steam, and if you compare them to the DLC-disabled latest builds you'd be amazed at how much has changed. The only similar level of support over such a long term I can think of is games like Minecraft and Terraria, which have a larger audience than most Paradox games by an order of magnitude or two.
I have sympathy over your high levels of unemployment, I have sympathy over the amount of corruption in Brazilian politics, I have sympathy over the high level of violent crime and I even have sympathy over the crazily high prices you have to pay for games consoles (as the import taxes on them are just nuts). But no, I don't have a whole lot of sympathy that a PC game cost a bit more than it used to.
Oh, you're just trolling. Should have told me from the start.
Both Crab and I have played Paradox games very often
To be fair to Thraktor, he actually put up a valid argument, and you've been hostile to him from the start.
I did terrible things to earn my tag.
It would make sense if it was true. Brazil's economy is still awful, and I'd say that my purchasing power has only lowered for a few years now, so it's weird to me that they'd increase the prices here because we're apparently loaded now.
I don't even think the current prices are unfair, as they're still lower than the US ones, but the reasoning is bullshit.
Should've just kept the "we wanted more global parity" part, and maybe added something about key resellers or the exchange rate or whatever. It would suck, but it'd be understandable. Namco increased their prices here as well last year, but at least they didn't, as far as I know, tell me that it's because I have more money now. That's kind of insulting.
No, that's bulshit. They are increasing prices on games that are quite old. In addition as described a few times above, those free patches actually screw the game up for you if you don't have appropriate DLCs.Bad business practices? This is nonsense. How many other developers support their releases with as many FREE updates and features?
If anything they remain the poster child for how to do things right
Bad business practices? This is nonsense. How many other developers support their releases with as many FREE updates and features?
If anything they remain the poster child for how to do things right
Bad business practices? This is nonsense. How many other developers support their releases with as many FREE updates and features?
If anything they remain the poster child for how to do things right
Most other publishers already have higher prices then Paradox charges for their games though.
Guess I just buy games differently then the people angry about this. I just think "is this game worth my money?" and leave it at that. And everyone can make that decision for themselves. If they decide to charge a higher price, I buy another game, not like there isn't enough choice on Steam of all places.
But that is how the market works. The UK for example has seen price increases due to exchange rates. The market changes, so do prices.
Because I have too much time on my hands I made a table:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1FN_lahpNpd0fyTbzaEdwf-S9eETfuqxpC6uiLn6na_g/edit?usp=sharing
It shows the price increase for Europa Universalis IV Extreme Edition and the exchange rates weighted for purchasing power.
It's a bit rough but the end result is the price change "in real terms" in USD.
Japan's purchasing power has decreased and it still saw a price hike, so that puts paid to that excuse.
Russia, Mexico, South Africa, South America in general all got shafted.
Damn, Pillars of Eternity is getting hammered. Poor Obsidian.
http://store.steampowered.com/app/291650/Pillars_of_Eternity/
Not like being a stream moderator for a person that eventually joined Paradox and adds moderators based on their skill at beating certain games means anything.Both Crab and I have played Paradox games very often (and I am a stream moderator for one of the designers on EU4 as well).
Published by Paradox.Wow, that is really lame.
Published by Paradox.
It is a little weird to do them retroactively; typically you set a fixed price in each currency at the time of release and update as new products release. But for Paradox I guess a lot of their income is passive catalogue income so they felt the need to do it retroactively.
Not like being a stream moderator for a person that eventually joined Paradox and adds moderators based on their skill at beating certain games means anything.
general consensus on EU4 is that you need at least 3 DLC packs to get the proper game experience ($95 total, or currently $36 on sale)
also base game content actually getting REMOVED by patch if you don't own the new DLC is pretty much the opposite of doing things right. correct me if im wrong, i'm only going by what i researched when i was considering a purchase recently
I didn't realize that the increase in some places was quite that significant, it's nearly doubled in price in India and Russia.
Meh, I don't mind it. But I also disagree with this post (not CDPR though, love them):That was obvious before my post. Still lame af.
Mob mentality at it's finest. Attack everything paradox without regard.
No company is my friend. That includes companies that usually treat their customers fair like CDPR or Paradox.
I know, I have a 2-year-sub badge after all. Just wanted to point out that being a moderator for him is nothing special and doesn't mean too much. That you are knowledgeable and not unknown should be clear to regular EU4 viewers on Twitch.He does feature streams of upcoming expansions, and generally streams a lot of EU4 (not as much as he used to, but still). I've been there since very early in his streaming career and have been actively participating in his stream chat, which is full of EU4 players and often talks about the game's mechanics.
The poster I quoted was implying that I don't have any idea how EU4 looked like in its early iterations, or that I don't know what's going into Paradox's patches, when in fact I do, as I have played the game since very early on, its predecessors, and have watched the streams of a skilled player and designer on the game.
I know, I have a 2-year-sub badge after all. Just wanted to point out that being a moderator for him is nothing special and doesn't mean too much. That you are knowledgeable and not unknown should be clear to regular EU4 viewers on Twitch.
And that Thraktor has chosen the wrong people to argue with was pretty clear early on, in my opinion at least.
Have had my eye on CKII and EUIV for years, but never pulled the trigger. Always thought I'll get them down the road sometime during a sale, but guess not anymore :-(
Just wait for a 60-80% sale where you can get base game and DLC package
The DLCs generally only go on a 50% sale, unless they're really old I think.