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New 3D Mario game shown in Nintendo Switch trailer

Aldric

Member
I really don't give a fuck about 64 anymore. I enjoyed it when I played it but I like the last 2 3D Marios significantly more than the others. You're telling me we can't stay in the past and yet everyone's saying that it needs to go back to how 64 was. I like the latest games buddy.

Good for you. Maybe you can go play the dozens of pixel perfect precision platformers available on the market then or just simply wait for the next iteration of 2D Mario and let fans of traditional 3D platforming have fun with that game?
 
On SM64 there is no visible connections between levels, while in Sunshine is one big map. You can see other areas of the game in all levels. Sunshine also relys more on the story aspect.

That's what I meant by "superficially." They're not actually connected; it only gives the illusion of such. It's a neat trick, but mechanically, they're no more connected than in 64.

I do think Sunshine is different than SM64, and I think the "adventure" in SM64 is not a mechanic per se but a thing the player generates in their minds, while Sunshine try to create that sense of an adventure. Hope that made some sense.


I totally respect that you felt that way, but I felt the opposite. Mario Sunshine felt more linear and structured, whereas Mario 64's more open nature is why I felt a greater sense of "adventure" from it
 

ika

Member
I'm just glad there's an actual world to explore, instead of blocks floating in the middle of space. That's why my favorite 3D Mario games were 64 and Sunshine.

280px-Whomp's_Fortress_64.png


Bowser-in-the-Sky.png


msun_0723_screen007.jpg


You have a point with some levels, but "block floating in the middle of space" is a thing in those games, too.

On topic, I'm very excited to see what are they planning for this new game... the mexican inspired level reminds me to Delfino town, an the sand level has Mario 64/Galaxy/3D Worlds vibes... I'm sure there's something new they're hiding... I hope that, at least. Also, I love the light effects (especially the shiny bullet bill).
 
280px-Whomp's_Fortress_64.png


Bowser-in-the-Sky.png


msun_0723_screen007.jpg


You have a point with some levels, but "block floating in the middle of space" is a thing in those games, too.

On topic, I'm very excited to see what are they planning for this new game... the mexican inspired level reminds me to Delfino town, an the sand level has Mario 64/Galaxy/3D Worlds vibes... I'm sure there's something new they're hiding... I hope that, at least. Also, I love the light effects (especially the shiny bullet bill).

I feel like 64's Bowser and Sunshine's bonus levels don't really count--those are kind of their own thing.

Whomp's Fortress I suppose is technically true, in that it literally floats in space, but I think his point was that it feels like a mostly realized world. I mean, if it were set on the ground, I don't think I'd be responding to a point like this :p
 

Hakai

Member
That's what I meant by "superficially." They're not actually connected; it only gives the illusion of such. It's a neat trick, but mechanically, they're no more connected than in 64.

Sure, but SM64 don't even go that route. Actually it goes away by stating that each painting is a different world.


I totally respect that you felt that way, but I felt the opposite. Mario Sunshine felt more linear and structured, whereas Mario 64's more open nature is why I felt a greater sense of "adventure" from it

As I said SM64 don't atempt at that, it "feels"that way, but is not something built in the game is just a consequence. Sunshine tries to be an adventure, building a more developed story, having tons of NPCs and so on.
 
As I said SM64 don't atempt at that, it "feels"that way, but is not something built in the game is just a consequence. Sunshine tries to be an adventure, building a more developed story, having tons of NPCs and so on.

I see what you're saying. It's largely a matter of perspective I suppose; I'd agree that Sunshine tries to be more of an adventure, but 64 feels like more of an adventure to me for the aforementioned reasons. Sunshine's framework makes it feel more structured and less explorative to me, whereas 64 had comparitively little structure and encouraged exploration and to go off the beaten path
 
Can't agree with that. People always like to say how 3D World is more focused on the platforming than SM64.

How can it be more focused when you have a reduced moveset?? The difference is that in SM64 everything can be a platform and you can interact with, while in 3D world they specify what is a platform to streamline the experience.

SM64 has a much wider moveset, but all of those abilities and physics basically don't matter in most of the game, and are only relevant in the parts of the game that are linear Galaxy/3D World-style obstacle courses.
 

Hakai

Member
SM64 has a much wider moveset, but all of those abilities and physics basically don't matter in most of the game, and are only relevant in the parts of the game that are linear Galaxy/3D World-style obstacle courses.

It's open ended. They are not required, but they enhance your playthrough if you know how to apply them and the game encourage you to play with the moveset.
 

NathanS

Member
How can it be more focused when you have a reduced moveset?? e.

Since when on Earth did moveset size and amount of platforming have anything to do with one another? By that logic SMB3 has less platforming then SM64!

Lord every time The bleeding "open vs linear" debate shows up it makes it clear how poorly both side actual try and understand Mario level design outside of super obvious surface level stuff.

Give me a second to get a good writer up going...
 

Hakai

Member
Since when on Earth did moveset size and amount of platforming have anything to do with one another?

A lot!?

Platforming is about jumping and crossing places, so if you give the player tons of ways of doing those things, and set them up into toyboxes designed for them to play around with the moveset, this is a heck lot of platforming.

i love 3D Land and 3D World, don't even think they are less of a 3D Mario. But i don't agree with the argument that they are "purer" Mario.
 
It's open ended. They are not required, but they enhance your playthrough if you know how to apply them and the game encourage you to play with the moveset.

>Focused
>Open ended

Mario 64 and Sunshine are my least favorite 3D Mario games by a longshot. Sometimes I consider replaying them for the stellar obstacle courses they have, but each time I stop when I remember the sheer amount of wandering in each game.
 

NOLA_Gaffer

Banned
It's always been fascinating to me that the Mario games some folks say "isn't a true 3D Mario game" are the games that actually have "3D" in their respective titles.
 

BGBW

Maturity, bitches.
It's not going to be like 64/Sunshine.
It's not going to be like the Galaxies.
It's not going to be like 3D Land/World.

It'll be a new style of 3D Mario. Look at his perfectly straight run path in both clips.

What's we're seeing is Super Mario and The Secret Rings!

Enjoy.
 
It's not going to be like 64/Sunshine.
It's not going to be like the Galaxies.
It's not going to be like 3D Land/World.

It'll be a new style of 3D Mario. Look at his perfectly straight run path in both clips.

What's we're seeing is Super Mario and The Secret Rings!

Enjoy.

What have you done
 

ffdgh

Member
It's not going to be like 64/Sunshine.
It's not going to be like the Galaxies.
It's not going to be like 3D Land/World.

It'll be a new style of 3D Mario. Look at his perfectly straight run path in both clips.

What's we're seeing is Super Mario and The Secret Rings!

Enjoy.

Who's gonna rock the place, place, place. ♫
I unironically liked secret rings.
 

sanstesy

Member
I don't think the game is based on Mexico, otherwise we would be seeing a huge & thick wall no one can cross far in the distance.
 

MagnesD3

Member
Good for you. Maybe you can go play the dozens of pixel perfect precision platformers available on the market then or just simply wait for the next iteration of 2D Mario and let fans of traditional 3D platforming have fun with that game?
Exactly this there is plenty of 2d Mario for 2d Mario fans let us 3D Mario fans have our game, instead of trying to make it another 2d Mario in a sea of 2d Mario games.
 
Exactly this there is plenty of 2d Mario for 2d Mario fans let us 3D Mario fans have our game, instead of trying to make it another 2d Mario in a sea of 2d Mario games.

past 6 years of mainline Mario games:

Super Mario Galaxy 2 2010 Nintendo EAD Tokyo Wii 3D
Super Mario 3D Land 2011 Nintendo EAD Tokyo Nintendo 3DS 3D
New Super Mario Bros. 2 2012 Nintendo EAD4 Nintendo 3DS 2D
New Super Mario Bros. U 2012 Nintendo EAD4 Wii U 2D
New Super Luigi U 2013 Nintendo EAD4 Wii U 2D
Super Mario 3D World 2013 Nintendo EAD Tokyo Wii U 3D

that's 3 3d games and 3 2d games.

"a sea of 2d Mario games" only makes sense if you consider every indie platformer to be a real Mario game
 

Choomp

Banned
So yeah, looks very 3D World-esque. The first screen almost looked like a hub world of some sorts? Not really sure.
 

emb

Member
"a sea of 2d Mario games" only makes sense if you consider every indie platformer to be a real Mario game
I think people feel like this partially because 2 of the recent 3D games, World and Land, adopt a lot of 2D style and mechanics. And since the 2D games you mentioned were all clustered around a similar time frame, with very similar aesthetics, settings, and gameplay.

I like both sub-series a ton, so I'll be happy with whatever. I'm really excited to try out this new 3D entry we got a glimpse of.
 

RagnarokX

Member
qd2T4Q2.jpg


Chaos emeralds?

Good for you. Maybe you can go play the dozens of pixel perfect precision platformers available on the market then or just simply wait for the next iteration of 2D Mario and let fans of traditional 3D platforming have fun with that game?

What precision 3D platformers are there? Most 3D platformers followed Mario 64's example and are more like adventure games. 3D platformers that actually focus on 3D platforming like 3D World does are very uncommon, but there are plenty of games in the Mario 64 adventure style. You got Yooka-Laylee coming out.
 

Puruzi

Banned
Good for you. Maybe you can go play the dozens of pixel perfect precision platformers available on the market then or just simply wait for the next iteration of 2D Mario and let fans of traditional 3D platforming have fun with that game?
How about you stop whining about me wanting the games to be the way I like them. My opinion isn't going to change what Nintendo does, but I hope they do what they did with the latest games. That's it. Get over it.
 

Aldric

Member
What precision 3D platformers are there? Most 3D platformers followed Mario 64's example and are more like adventure games. 3D platformers that actually focus on 3D platforming like 3D World does are very uncommon, but there are plenty of games in the Mario 64 adventure style. You got Yooka-Laylee coming out.

Ok now l'm starting to think l'm getting trolled. That must be a troll right?
 

MagnesD3

Member
past 6 years of mainline Mario games:

Super Mario Galaxy 2 2010 Nintendo EAD Tokyo Wii 3D
Super Mario 3D Land 2011 Nintendo EAD Tokyo Nintendo 3DS 3D
New Super Mario Bros. 2 2012 Nintendo EAD4 Nintendo 3DS 2D
New Super Mario Bros. U 2012 Nintendo EAD4 Wii U 2D
New Super Luigi U 2013 Nintendo EAD4 Wii U 2D
Super Mario 3D World 2013 Nintendo EAD Tokyo Wii U 3D

that's 3 3d games and 3 2d games.

"a sea of 2d Mario games" only makes sense if you consider every indie platformer to be a real Mario game
3D world and 3D land play like 2d Mario so you might as well call them that and lest the forget the infinity of Mario Maker. So honestly it's been a sea of 2d Mario this gen. 3D Mario fans have gotten the shaft and deserve at least one game that plays like a 3D Mario title by Nintendo.
 

muteki

Member
280px-Whomp's_Fortress_64.png


Bowser-in-the-Sky.png


msun_0723_screen007.jpg


You have a point with some levels, but "block floating in the middle of space" is a thing in those games, too.

On topic, I'm very excited to see what are they planning for this new game... the mexican inspired level reminds me to Delfino town, an the sand level has Mario 64/Galaxy/3D Worlds vibes... I'm sure there's something new they're hiding... I hope that, at least. Also, I love the light effects (especially the shiny bullet bill).
At least in 64's case (since I don't remember hardly anything about Sunshine), a large part of the game was figuring out where the star was based off of a handful of words hint.

So you could have these floating block levels and at least one star was usually get to the top, but the rest required a little more exploration and puzzle solving to figure out first time through. That is what I miss the most, and some levels of Galaxy were the last to really do that sort of thing.
 

ec0ec0

Member
SM64 has a much wider moveset, but all of those abilities and physics basically don't matter in most of the game, and are only relevant in the parts of the game that are linear Galaxy/3D World-style obstacle courses.

i would say that they were most needed in the open levels, in a different way. Cartriges limited the number of level that could be included in the game, so we ended up having many stars on the each level, meaning that you had to replay the same level multiple times. Mario's advanced moveset helped to keep things varied.
 
3D world and 3D land play like 2d Mario so you might as well call them that and lest the forget the infinity of Mario Maker. So honestly it's been a sea of 2d Mario this gen. 3D Mario fans have gotten the shaft and deserve at least one game that plays like a 3D Mario title by Nintendo.

"If we count these 3D games as 2D games, then there are more 2D games."
 
...Mario's advanced moveset helped to keep things varied [in SM64].
Interesting interview, where Miyamoto describes some of the design choices in SM64:
http://shmuplations.com/mario64/
Miyamoto: ...An eternal theme for me with game design has been to let the players create their own vision... I want a game that allows players to try come up with their own solutions and playstyles and test them out there on the spot... One of our big development themes was letting the players move Mario around any way they wanted. We wanted to make a game where just moving Mario around was fun... Our thinking was that as players got good at the controls, they’d want to try out more and more button combinations, and if there was nothing past the basics it would be disappointing for them. So we created movements for all button combinations—of course, that means a few useless ones got left in too. (laughs)... And yet, while we were all telling ourselves “walking around leisurely can be fun too!”, I have to admit that internally, I was a little worried… normally games have a faster pace... Truth be told, we did something with Mario 64 that we don’t usually do: we had children playtest it... seeing [my son] try dozens of times, over and over, to get up this unclimbable hill, as a parent I couldn’t help but think, “Geez, does this kid have any brains?” (laughs) Afterwards we asked the children what they thought of the game, and they said it was fun, and that they wanted to play it again. Up to now, I think there’s been this image with games that if you can’t beat it, it’s not a fun or good game, right? That’s a philosophy we’ve stuck to at Nintendo, too, but I figured that if a game was this fun to play even if you weren’t getting anywhere, well, it must be alright. Until this game, I was very skeptical about something like this being fun...
 

Sendou

Member
According to a French journalist from Gamekult.com, Mario Switch development was started on Wii U devkit a long time ago.
https://twitter.com/boulapoire/status/789499368709591042

Makes sense. EAD Tokyo were done with 3D World 3 years ago. Was there even a Switch dev kit then? Considering the amount of ports Switch is supposedly getting porting from Wii U to Switch could be relatively easy. Wouldn't surprise me if other games were like this too.
 

Aldric

Member
im kind of confused of how a game where you can move in 3 axis, X, Y, and Z, "plays like a 2d game"

Because their level design, pacing, movement options, powerups and structure are far more similar to 2D sidescrollers than to the 3D Marios that came before, even Galaxy.

Of course l know this is a completely pointless thing to say as it's probably going to be countered by some witty "it has 3D in the title it's a 3D game!!" rebuttal.
 

Pancake Mix

Copied someone else's pancake recipe
I'm really enthusiastic about what this might turn into.

And if it really started on a Wii U devkit (which probably goes for a lot of Switch titles) it might be coming next year, perhaps Q4.

But we won't know which generation of 3D Mario it really leans towards for the time being. Here's hoping for the earlier.
 

sinxtanx

Member
Because their level design, pacing, movement options, powerups and structure are far more similar to 2D sidescrollers than to the 3D Marios that came before, even Galaxy.

Of course l know this is a completely pointless thing to say as it's probably going to be countered by some witty "it has 3D in the title it's a 3D game!!" rebuttal.

I don't think you understand the level you are wrong on. It's incredibly fundamental, hard-set and not subjective at all. They are three dimensional games where you control characters through a three dimensional space. There is no talking your way around that.

So you dislike the gameplay, big whoop. I dislike CoD but CoD ain't a point and click adventure game because of that.
 

Camaway2

Member
I don't know, the lack of any on screen HUD could signal this is just a prototype/mock up, put together using real game assets from the next Mario to showcase the concept for the trailer. I won't be too surprised if a year or two from now, we'll be looking back at this and smile at all the conjectures that are made from this 6 second video.
 

oti

Banned
I don't know, the lack of any on screen HUD could signal this is just a prototype/mock up, put together using real game assets from the next Mario to showcase the concept for the trailer. I won't be too surprised if a year or two from now, we'll be looking back at this and smile at all the conjectures that are made from this 6 second video.

Just assume that everything shown was just some sort of demo. There are some hints here and there in Mario but again, demos.
 

Aldric

Member
I don't think you understand the level you are wrong on. It's incredibly fundamental, hard-set and not subjective at all. They are three dimensional games where you control characters through a three dimensional space. There is no talking your way around that.

So you dislike the gameplay, big whoop. I dislike CoD but CoD ain't a point and click adventure game because of that.

I sincerely have no clue how "3D Land/World feel more like 2D sidescrollers than the 3D Mario games that came before them" somehow gets translated to "so you're saying Mario doesn't move on three dimensions in these games what are you dumb???". l don't think anybody could possibly take things that literally so l suppose it's just a way for 3D World fans to discredit people who don't like the game by portraying them as these sort of mouthbreathing imbeciles who can't recognize a three dimensional game.
 
I sincerely have no clue how "3D Land/World feel more like 2D sidescrollers than the 3D Mario games that came before them" somehow gets translated to "so you're saying Mario doesn't move on three dimensions in these games what are you dumb???". l don't think anybody could possibly take things that literally so l suppose it's just a way for 3D World fans to discredit people who don't like the game by portraying them as these sort of mouthbreathing imbeciles who can't recognize a three dimensional game.

This.
 

Davey Cakes

Member
Including the triple jump in the video was a damn fine move. I think taking it out in 3D World was quite divisive, so bringing it back gets people more excited for a more mobile Mario akin to 64 through Galaxy.
 

JonnyKong

Member
Amongst these 17 pages, have you guys talked about the bit on the video where the girl takes the game to the party then her friend joins in?

So it must be Mario they're still playing. So again another multiplayer co-op adventure like 3D World maybe?
 
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