krypt0nian
Banned
Convergys said:
Not in my firefox.
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Hey Guest. Check out your NeoGAF Wrapped 2025 results here!
New ES4:Oblivion Video
- Thread starter FallenOne666
- Start date
Not in my firefox.
Eel O'Brian
Member
Wow, that was a badass video. So much stuff going on. I've had $5 down on this at BB since before the 360 launch - looks like it'll be well worth the wait.
SteveMeister said:Castrated? Hardly. Did you even read the quote?
The only thing that was taken out was shadows from objects sitting in the world -- things like apples and furniture. There's just too much clutter in the world, and you can interact with most of it. We could have left shadows on such objects in, but then we would have HAD to reduce their count and/or their interactivity. And we thought that maybe people might prefer having lots of stuff to interact with over reducing content just so that that apple can be nicely self-shadowed.
You can interact with everything on that table except the candles. Every apple, strawberry and carrot, the books, plates, silverware, bottles of wine, etc. All the stuff on the shelves in the background can all be picked up, moved around, etc. You can fire an explosive spell into the middle of it and it'll all go flying. You can eat all the food, or combine it in various ways to make potions. You can drink the liquor in the bottles, read the books. You can take all the items and sell them, or just pile them up or display them in your OWN house if you want. And you and NPCs can sit in the chairs.
It's that type of thing that doesn't cast shadows and isn't self-shadowed -- though character shadows play realistically over them.
So again -- would you rather we remove that interactivity and that number of objects in the world, just so what's left can cast shadows?
I didn't think so.
I remeber how cool it was taking over some little castle and filling it up to the brim with cool weapons, armor, and other junk. I wish i had pics of it handy.
Willy Wanka
my god this avatar owns
I can't believe I missed this thread last night. Great video even though I didn't understand much of the commentary.
Fallout-NL
Member
Hate to agree, but the animation looks pretty horrible. Stuff like that becomes harder and harder to accept after having played a game like Condemned.
Can you get houses legitimately in Oblivion? As fun as it was to clear out an entire town in Morrowind and have each house dedicated as a display for individual items (my overtaken city ended up with Utensil Lane, a street filled with houses full of different utensil; one house full of spoons, one of forks, knives, etc.) I always wanted to be able to just buy a house outright rather than have to kill the person residing inside. Plus it'd be cool to have BuG's House on the door instead of the previous owner.
SteveMeister
Hang out with Steve.
pj325is said:
Nope.
BuG said:
Yeah, there are houses you can buy in each city, of varying prices and quality.
Fallout-NL
Member
pj325is said:
Oh come off it, length and linearity have nothing to do with the way objects in a game world move.
Bebpo said:
I dont remember Doom 3 being poorly animated and personally I think the enemies in Condemned reacted pretty lifelike when you smacked em around (unlike those bouncing goblins in the ES4 video).
krypt0nian
Banned
Fallout-NL said:
I thought the point was a lack of character models, compared to a game like Oblivion.
Fallout-NL
Member
krypt0nian said:
Oh, I thought I mentioned the animation, and in that case, you should point out to the other dude that his remark had nothing to with mine.
krypt0nian
Banned
Fallout-NL said:
No they are related. If you have few models, then you can rightfully spend more time on their animation. Not an excure for bad animation, but the comparison is not a fair one.
Mike Works
Member
No it doesn't.Convergys said:
Fallout-NL said:
Yes it does. Length and non linearity = time and $$$$, animation = time and $$$$, monolith and bethesda choose to put their time and $$$$ into different things.
Do you think it would be fair to say "Hate to agree, but the short length, small size, limited environment interaction, limited music, limited item variety, limited npc variety, limited enemy variety, limited voice acting variety, and complete lack of stats in Condemned look pretty horrible. Stuff like that becomes harder and harder to accept after having played a game like Oblivion."
No, it wouldn't
Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
Steve,
what I would like (I take that question as asked to all forum goers here) would be a few less objects on the table, maybe simpler objects with simpler materials applied to them, the release date moved to Summer and objects casting and receving shadows including their own.
IMHO, lighting and shadowing go hand in hand: you cannot expect the users to suspend disbelief when everything gets more realistic, you can interact with objects and move them and see HOW the light affects them and remove the shadowing element from them... they are going to look off. The more things get detailed, the more graphics advance the more difficult will be to take short-cuts and not have the user to notice the small omisses or rendering flaws here and there.
IMHO lighting is not realistic if shadowing is not realistic also.
what I would like (I take that question as asked to all forum goers here) would be a few less objects on the table, maybe simpler objects with simpler materials applied to them, the release date moved to Summer and objects casting and receving shadows including their own.
IMHO, lighting and shadowing go hand in hand: you cannot expect the users to suspend disbelief when everything gets more realistic, you can interact with objects and move them and see HOW the light affects them and remove the shadowing element from them... they are going to look off. The more things get detailed, the more graphics advance the more difficult will be to take short-cuts and not have the user to notice the small omisses or rendering flaws here and there.
IMHO lighting is not realistic if shadowing is not realistic also.
It´s not for making it easier, but the opposite. Many players got overpowered in Morrowind taking some items at the middle game that made the main quest a walk in the park. With the scaling thing they pretend enemies adjust to your gear, that way the game will be solid at combat for the playtime (of course, if you go to the bad place you will still be doomed, the enemies scale at a certain degree).
I played it some weeks ago for some hours. Great stuff. Both versions looked great (Xbox 360 was a little better but the PC version lacked some graphic features that they are still polishing). The PC Vs Console is becoming a pretty common discussion here and it shouldn´t at all, but well.
I suppose I will get both version, so no worries for me
About animation, for the type of game it is, I think is pretty good. We are a speaking of a behemont of game afterall, and some years ago. Seeing how all has evoluted from the Might & Magics to now, I think Oblivion is a huge jump for RPGs. The only animation I didn´t liked at all was the horse one.
Fallout-NL
Member
pj325is said:
Thats actually a good point and well made, but:
I admit I have no programming skills or whatsoever, although it seems to me that the amount of work needed to improve the animation (even a little) pales in comparison to the large amount of time it took to make all the stuff you just mentioned?
And apart from that, Condemned is not the type of game to need stats and the last thing it needs is lots of NPC's, but a game like Oblivion wouldnt suffer from having better animation. And it's just such a glaring fault, it just looks cheap and to me it looks like it would take from the immersion. While there is nothing that takes from the experience in condemned.
I would like to apologize for the comparison which is pretty horrible, but I only used condemned as an example of animation that looks good (to me at least).
Please, if you are going to take a sentence of mine, take it fully.
It looked a little better, but was minor details and the PC demo didn´t have some graphical options activated. So both products will be very close at the technical aspect for what I got.
Both version looked very nice. That is what you need to know.
The game will be something special, I am sure of that.
Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
SnakeXs said:
Sorry, but when a game I really like and that is the successor to one of the games that made worthwile my purchasal of the original Xbox and that I have anticipated from the day it was first mentioned I would like it to be released really "when it is done" also because I think that we will have to wait for XBOX Next-Next and PLAYSTATION 4 to see an Elders' Scrolls V game. If we are only being able to purchase one ES game this generation, I say give us the most polished version that can be thought of
.Panajev2001a said:Sorry, but when a game I really like and that is the successor to one of the games that made worthwile my purchasal of the original Xbox and that I have anticipated from the day it was first mentioned I would like it to be released really "when it is done" also because I think that we will have to wait for XBOX Next-Next and PLAYSTATION 4 to see an Elders' Scrolls V game. If we are only being able to purchase one ES game this generation, I say give us the most polished version that can be thought of
You're making a big fuss, over, a few, shadows.
C'mon now.
Fallout-NL said:
I oversimplified and exaggerated to make the point. I also have no idea how much good animation costs vs the cost a huge non linear world (probably because "good" and "huge" are vague, subjective terms), but I think the reason oblivion doesn't have better animation is because of time and money constraints, not lack of skill or something like that.
FallenOne666
Banned
Panajev2001a said:
Do not listen to this man. March or die Bethesda!
according to the german website http://www.oblivion-game.de/ the PC version has received a downgrade from the original videos shown at E3. Soft shadows are gone and parallax mapping is downgraded due to performance reasons.
old:
new:
No mention about the 360 version. PC gamers am cry?
edit:
old:
new:
No mention about the 360 version. PC gamers am cry?
edit:
Oblivion Xbox 360 version si really far, far away of Morrowind Xbox version. I remember laughing myself when I saw Morrowind in Xbox compared to how it looked on my new PC (I think HD really helps here).
The game looks really nice and they were wise to give themselves some months for polishing. Given the scale of the game and taking in count the evolution of the genre, I think animation is quite good (of course, it is if you compare it with Morrowind, not with Prince of Persia).
hadareud said:according to the german website http://www.oblivion-game.de/ the PC version has received a downgrade from the original videos shown at E3. Soft shadows are gone and parallax mapping is downgraded due to performance reasons.
old:
new:
No mention about the 360 version. PC gamers are cry?
edit:
Why the hell would they downgrade the pc version?
If there are performance issues, they can just increase the recommended specs for all the eye candy and turn them off by default
What are the specs of the pc running the second picture? The textures are blurrier, wouldn't that lead you believe it's just running on a crappy pc? No, that would be too easy.
DOWNGRADE TOTAL
hadareud said:according to the german website http://www.oblivion-game.de/ the PC version has received a downgrade from the original videos shown at E3. Soft shadows are gone and parallax mapping is downgraded due to performance reasons.
old:
new:
No mention about the 360 version. PC gamers are cry?
edit:
Yeah, this was talked about on the previous page and SteveMeister basically said "do you want an actual next-gen game with next-gen lighting and shadowing OR DO YOU WANT A MILLION OBJECTS TO THROW AROUND WHEEEEEE".
But yeah, it doesn't look nearly as good now.
Fallout-NL
Member
Zilch said:
Real pity (no really).
krypt0nian
Banned
360 version, y'all!
Terrible screenshot...
No, it doen´t look like that.
They were very close, but for some reason I fail to understand, Xbox 360 looked sightly nicer.
As I have said, PC version demo didn´t have some features activated. So I think is for that. But the game was nothing like that screenshot, it looked really nice.
Fallout-NL
Member
Sure as hell hope not.
FallenOne666
Banned
Bebpo said:
Or in this case, a delayed game = no dynamic shadows for objects and lowered paralax mapping. lawl, amirite?