Next Gen Consoles Will Be Absolutely Insane.

solidus12

Member
Just give me a PS6 with a combination of next generation Emotion-Engine and Cell processor that are easy to use and hard to master.

But I also want FULL disc based backwards compatibility with PS1/2/3/4/5 🥹
 

ChiefDada

Member
I remember gamers nexus was comparing some PS5 games to a GTX 1070. which goes back to the same point. speaks badly about the dev porting the game to PS5.

Awesome. Did you also remember how GN got universally ripped to shreds for the apples to oranges comparison??? They were presenting CPU bottlenecks as GPU related and used cpu miles ahead of ps5 specs.


memory swapping happens because 3070 does not have the same budget as ps5 has to video games in spiderman

if you contain settings to your own budget (high textures instead of ultra textures), 3070 will still outperform the ps5 by a large margin. memory swapping is not an INTENDED or WANTED behaviour. THAT is the crucial part. you cannot design games around memory swapping. memory swapping was a thing since 2013s. it always butchered the card's performance. it always happened whenever you breached your VRAM budgets /which is what happened in spiderman. it is not special/

you actively nerf and destroy your card's performance by forcing it to memory swap. when the card memory swaps, it loses a huge portion of its actual performance to a point a comparison becomes moot (similar to how a comparison between gtx 960 2 gb and ps4 at ultra textures is moot. at ultra ps4 equivalent textures in rdr 2, gtx 960 slows down to a crawl. it does not mean ps4 is punching above 960 2 gb. it just meants you're gimping 2 gb 960's performance. 4 gb 960 performs as how you would except out of a "960" chip and punchs above ps4. this example alone should explain the situation to you

ps5 is not punching above its weight. it simply has more weight, in terms of total vram budget, compared to 8 gb variant cards

vram budget =/= performance

you simply sacrifice huge amounts of performance if you are hellbent on using super high quality textures on limited vram budget. this hold true for older gpus, it will also hold true for 8 GB GPUs. its a simple math.

memory swapping is not and never will be a standard in PC gaming environment.
even a mere 3060 has 12 gb memory which is enough budget to cover all needs of all futuregen console ports. the standard is instead lowering the texture quality to fit your own memory budgets. simply breaching budget and causing card to lose huge amounts of performance is not a proper metric of saying "ps5 is outperforming 3070 in memory intensive applications". you're so wrong in your judgment, memory intensive does not mean high memory usage at all, it just means memory bandwidth intensive, which is not the case here.

you conciously make the game consume super high memory by breaching your allocated vram.

say you upgraded rdr2's textures in a way that it uses 16 gb of vram. it would destroy the 3070's performance to a crawl due to not having enough buffer.

this has nothing to do with anything punching their above weight. its a misconception spread by certain "reviewers".

please stop the misinformation from spreading and understand actual meanings behind such incidents


Yam I have great respect for you but it's strange to me how you can't see how the consoles that are designed to rely on very quick data movement to compensate for limited RAM will result in less than 1:1 performance on PC (FOR NOW, not permanently) because of the philosophy difference surrounding data management. You get all the credit for recommending Nixxes increase VRAM budget to alleviate the particular issue with Spiderman RM, but the underlying takeaway still looms over like a dark cloud. In fact, the bolded parts of your quote makes it seem as though you're agreeing with me at least in principle. I think we begin to diverge where you say VRAM doesn't effect performance. That would be true if both console and PC had similar treatment for data movement. But if a PC can't load and unload data as quickly (i hope we both agree at least that PC currently can not), then it will need much more RAM as the size of data and latency tolerance gets larger and smaller, respectively. You mention using high textures instead of Ultra to remain within VRAM budget, but ultra textures is as much a graphics feature as it is a memory constraint, like RT. So no, I do not believe even a 12gb card is enough to maintain GPU performance parity for a port of a hypothetical PS5 game that flexes i/o on a constant, fundamental basis.

Spiderman RM, being a last gen game at heart, is just the tipping point and thankfully increasing VRAM budget on dev side is enough to resolve at least in part (I haven't seen any updates on performance post patch)? Again I credit you for single handedly being responsible for that particular update. Curious to see if/when/how PC gpu decompression will remedy this issue for future PS5 ports specifically.
 

TGO

Hype Train conductor. Works harder than it steams.
Nonsense, people will be demanding 120fps or higher claiming 60fps is a slide show.
Games will look the same but slightly better running at a higher frame rate
 

Zathalus

Member
A port being optimized on PlayStation from a Sony first party studio and not as good in optimization on pc doesn’t make the ps5 a better hardware

The ps5 is not even close to a 3070’s fart.
The 3070 is anything from 0-25% faster then a PS5 in optimized games. Hardly that big a difference.
 

The_Mike

I cry about SonyGaf from my chair in Redmond, WA
Next gen will be incredible 8k 30 fps machines.

Still won't have Ray tracing tho
 

xPikYx

Member
With the recent announcement of the 4090 RTX cards I am absolutely blown away at how fast and how big the leaps are in technology when it comes to GPUs and just tech in general. I know there are 2 threads on the 4090 already but I wanted to make one that specifically covers next gen systems and by next gen I am talking about the PS6 and the Next Xbox.

IMPORTANT THINGS TO NOTE - I know tFlops is not really a a perfect metric to explain how powerful a leap is in the GPU power but it's the only metric that's easiest to digest and give you a some sort of a ballpark. There are many other factors that should also be taken into account when you are talking about overall GPU performance increase.

Also, there are other factors to also consider how powerful next-gen hardware systems and not just the GPU. CPU and RAM/Memory/SSD will be another major factor, but this is strictly a GPU thread so we are only talking about GPU increases here.


First and foremost - let's lay everything out on the table here too see what we are looking at for the last 2 generations of consoles.

The PS4 and Xbox One launched in 2013

The PS4 was sitting at measly 1.84 tFlops
Xbox One was sitting at even lower 1.31 tFlops

The PS4 Pro later launched in 2016 and was sitting at 4.2 tFlops
The Xbox One X launched a year later in 2017 with 6.2 tFlops

The PS5 and Xbox Series X launched in 2020.

The PS5 is sitting at 10.28 tFlops (10.3 if we round up, so let's just stick with 10.3)
The Xbox Series X is at 12.3 tFlops (2 tFlops higher than the PS5) and is a bit higher in tFlops measurement than the 2080 RTX Super which is sitting at 11.1 tFlops. A 2080 Ti however, is 13.5 tFlops which makes it superior to both the PS5 and the Xbox Series X when talking about the GPU specifically.

Now let's look at the 3000 series and the 4000s series since we have the official numbers now.

3090 Ti is sitting at 40 tFlops which is 4x more than the PS5 and Xbox Series X and was launched earlier this year in March 2022.

3090 is sitting at 36 tFlops which is almost a 4x increase than the PS5 and Xbox Series X and was launched on September 17th 2020, 2 months before the launch of the PS5 and Xbox Series X. The consoles we already locked in to basically utilize the power of GPUs that were equivalent to the 2000 series so 1 generation behind.

3080 is sitting at 34.1 tFlops which again is a massive increase compared to the PS5 and Xbox Series X.

Another difference with these GPUs is the amount of ram and type of ram, but let's be honest RAM was never a problem anymore for console systems. The last time we had major ram/memory issues was the PS3 and 360 era and we are well past that and I highly doubt we will ever that problem again.

The PS4 and Xbox One biggest issue was the CPU, it was super outdated crappy Jaguar x86.

With how weak and pathetic PS4 and Xbox One is looking these days the wizards over at the Naughty Dog and Sony Santa Monica still have the best looking games to date. The Last of Us Part II and God of War Ragnarok are very good examples of that.




We have seen absolutely nothing yet what the PS5 and Series X could truly do until we get those true current-gen goodies.

Anyways - back to the GPUs

We now have the specs for the 4090 and its releasing next month on October 12th with the following specs:

4090 has 84.3 tFlops that is more than double the increase of the 3090 Ti which was 40.3 tFlops.

Fast forward to 2024 we will be getting the 5000 series which will once again make the 4090 probably look like a little baby and the trend seems to always double the performance of the previous generation of the GPUs. According to Nvidia the 4090 is 2-4 times more powerful than the 3090 Ti depending on the application/game/software.

I am suspecting the 5000 series to finally break the 100 tFlops barrier, I mean that's guaranteed at this point. Don't forget there will also be a 4090 Ti and honestly that will probably very close to 100 tFlops already.

IMPORTANT THINGS TO NOTE - In 2026 it will be the 6000 series. When are the new consoles coming? I have no clue, but I am probably expecting them around 2026-2028 with 2028 at the latest and 2026 at the earliest. If the new consoles come out in 2026 then they will most likely be utilizing and be equal to the power of the 5000 series in terms of GPUs specifically, if they release in 2028 then the 6000 series. But then again, there might be some sort of a crazy curveball, I am just going of the last 10 years of how everything went. The PS6 has already entered R&D/Concepting in 2021. The PS5 started development in 2015 which is 1.5 years or so after the launch of the PS4.

What are you all expecting for the power of the GPUs out of next-gen systems?
This generation is a fail, 10tf range is ridiculously low and we can see that by 2 and probably more years of games looking identical to their previous gen couterpart except for loading times, 60fps and better resolution. Next gen will be even worse, companies will try to keep the 600$ price tag but in 2026, where inflation and average cost will be higher (it's been already a mistake now). But doesn't really matter, consoles are nowadays toys for teenager and media center for casual. Consoles are dead, the mass market killed them
 
This generation is a fail, 10tf range is ridiculously low and we can see that by 2 and probably more years of games looking identical to their previous gen couterpart except for loading times, 60fps and better resolution. Next gen will be even worse, companies will try to keep the 600$ price tag but in 2026, where inflation and average cost will be higher (it's been already a mistake now). But doesn't really matter, consoles are nowadays toys for teenager and media center for casual. Consoles are dead, the mass market killed them

you're right about inflation, xbox series consoles are being sold at a loss: $100-$200, plus increase in cost for node shrink. Will bringing another fab of TSMC to arizona usa bring the cost down?
 

Buggy Loop

Member
Will bringing another fab of TSMC to arizona usa bring the cost down?

Hell no

American labour costs can’t be cheaper than Taiwan. Having a fab on US soil is plan B for when China takes Taiwan and start a war. It’s too important nowadays strategically to ignore, If China takes Taiwan and control of TSMC and choke US-Europe supply of chips, it would have huge consequences, basically putting a stick on the wealth’s generators, including the army with their supply of chipsets.

But it’s not about cheaper costs.
 
Consoles and PCs can already do pretty much anything a developer can imagine. Looking back at Deux Ex, Shenmue, Half Life, and God of War 3 you'd think games would be so much more advanced already by now in all kinds of way they mostly still aren't. AI. Scale. Simulation. Interactivity. The Matrix demo should be a tip of the iceberg. This gen's consoles can be insane if devs are talented enough and aren't throttled by the need to make the same old boring genre shit people have already played a thousand times, demanding high framerates instead of game design advances as if the former is some kind of end all.
 

David B

Member
I think 240 fps TVs will come out 2027 to 2030. In that time frame. Also OLEDs will be in the 500 range by 2025. PS6 likely 600 starting price like PS3 was. Xbox the same. Games will remain 70. But the gen after that, 2034, games will probably start at 80 or 100 and that depends on the economy and USA national debt.
 
no way in hell next gen will be RDNA 3. it's going to be RDNA 3+ or RDNA 4. Highly likely it's going to be RDNA 4 paired with Zen5 or Zen6. Zen5 is rumored to be incorporating NPU's. Time will tell. Don't know much about Zen6
 

clampzyn

Member
no way in hell next gen will be RDNA 3. it's going to be RDNA 3+ or RDNA 4. Highly likely it's going to be RDNA 4 paired with Zen5 or Zen6. Zen5 is rumored to be incorporating NPU's. Time will tell. Don't know much about Zen6
If nextgen consoles is gonna be on 2028 as the leak says, it'll probably be rdna4+. I doubt it'll be rdna3+ since rdna3 is already out this year.
 
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RJMacready73

Gold Member
This generation is a fail, 10tf range is ridiculously low and we can see that by 2 and probably more years of games looking identical to their previous gen couterpart except for loading times, 60fps and better resolution. Next gen will be even worse, companies will try to keep the 600$ price tag but in 2026, where inflation and average cost will be higher (it's been already a mistake now). But doesn't really matter, consoles are nowadays toys for teenager and media center for casual. Consoles are dead, the mass market killed them
jesus theres so much shite in this post to unpack... 10tf is ridiculously low? have you seen Forbidden West?
 

clampzyn

Member
jesus theres so much shite in this post to unpack... 10tf is ridiculously low? have you seen Forbidden West?
yep, can't wait till developers made their games system requirement minimum to be 8cores/16threads cpu and an rtx 3070/amd rx 6800 to run the game properly so majority of the gamers won't be able to play their game.

people think 99% of the gamers lives in the US or any higher wage countries where they can afford a decent hardware and not break banks for playing there games, I wonder why Microsoft is trying to enter them mobile market, hmmm..?

I wonder if next-gen games will be developed for steam deck, is the steam deck gonna hold back next-gen games? hmmm..? if not, i don't think steam deck performance is anywhere near current gen consoles. I wonder where would game development be heading? Because all I see is them trying to enter the "mobile hardware" market because that's where the money at.
 
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NahaNago

Member
This generation is a fail, 10tf range is ridiculously low and we can see that by 2 and probably more years of games looking identical to their previous gen couterpart except for loading times, 60fps and better resolution. Next gen will be even worse, companies will try to keep the 600$ price tag but in 2026, where inflation and average cost will be higher (it's been already a mistake now). But doesn't really matter, consoles are nowadays toys for teenager and media center for casual. Consoles are dead, the mass market killed them
The 10 tf is okay. They are just trying to do too much this gen. This generation should be treated more as a transition to true next gen. The resolution bump for next gen shouldn't be as harsh, the 60fps will be more of the norm, and ray tracing should be more mature for consoles.

I have no idea how much the next gen consoles will cost. I originally had it priced at 600 but like you mentioned inflation could easily have it be much higher.
 

clampzyn

Member
The 10 tf is okay. They are just trying to do too much this gen. This generation should be treated more as a transition to true next gen. The resolution bump for next gen shouldn't be as harsh, the 60fps will be more of the norm, and ray tracing should be more mature for consoles.
Every next-gen hardware will deliver true next-gen, there is no such thing as fake/false next-gen. We are just seeing diminishing returns when it comes to visuals, ofc they can still push the visuals and we'll probably see the best visuals for games when the next-gen consoles are about to launch.
 
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PUNKem733

Member
no way in hell next gen will be RDNA 3. it's going to be RDNA 3+ or RDNA 4. Highly likely it's going to be RDNA 4 paired with Zen5 or Zen6. Zen5 is rumored to be incorporating NPU's. Time will tell. Don't know much about Zen6

If nextgen consoles is gonna be on 2028 as the leak says, it'll probably be rdna4+. I doubt it'll be rdna3+ since rdna3 is already out this year.
These consoles are coming out in like 2028 or 2029, right, so I expect closer to an RDNA 5. RDNA 3 is this year, next year is RDNA 4, I can't see them putting in 5-7 year old tech in. Hell RDNA 5 is like coming in 2024 or so that is still years from PS6/xboxnext. Anyone thinking these consoles are gonna be 30-40 TF LMAO!!!!
 
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NT80

Member
This generation is a fail, 10tf range is ridiculously low and we can see that by 2 and probably more years of games looking identical to their previous gen couterpart except for loading times, 60fps and better resolution. Next gen will be even worse, companies will try to keep the 600$ price tag but in 2026, where inflation and average cost will be higher (it's been already a mistake now). But doesn't really matter, consoles are nowadays toys for teenager and media center for casual. Consoles are dead, the mass market killed them
2026? A PS5 Pro might come out in 2026 but the proper next gen is more likely 2029/30.
 
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