• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

|OT| Next-Gen PS5 & Next Xbox |OT| Speculation/Analysis/Leaks Thread

Next Gen Consoles Power Level


  • Total voters
    560

joe_zazen

Member
May 2, 2017
2,193
2,169
430
Fuck dis noise bro. If it’s only 11 Bit Studios then they can have them.
getting 11 bit would allow sony to raid employees from other polish studios with shitty working condition and expand organically instead dropping 6 billion for Witcher corp. I have my issues with sony, but there are a tier one employer.

thin edge of the polish wedge...
 

Clear

Member
Feb 2, 2009
9,570
3,045
980
How does the SSD drive contribute to the *processing* of hi fidelity next gen 4k graphics? How does this make graphics better? Its a friggin storage device. If PS5 version is more faster and efficient that's fine. I am sure it promotes to graphical fidelity in an indirect way by *storing* more graphical assets like backgrounds, levels, etc. It can also get rid of unnecessary CPU tasks of compression/decompression so it can freeing up the CPU to do more important things.

Sony putting such a strong emphasis on SSD drive, as if it promotes to better graphics is strange to me.
Its huge.

Its all very well bragging obout TFlops of power, but its meaningless when its not being fed enough fresh data to really utilize it. You can do the same old shit faster and at a higher resolution, but to increase detail and complexity you need faster i/o.

From a design standpoint its also incredibly liberating, delta-states are problematic. Say you want to quickly intercut between scenes happening in two places, you need to swap assets in and out. This effectively requires either both instances to be resident in memory simultaneously, or to pause the action while you unload/reload data. SSD can in theory make this user transparent or at the very least minimize switching delay.

The same principle applies to any scenario requiring rapid delta handling. Be it traversing a world map at incredible speed, switching between game modes, changing characters and scene assets on the fly, the traditional bottleneck has always been not the systems ability to render stuff, but getting the new data into the processing queue fast-enough.
 

Tiago07

Neo Member
Dec 31, 2019
48
45
145
I think what Heisenberg is trying to say is that Sony may custom-optimize a few very specific things in particular, not necessarily that MS is gonna hulk-smash their way to a solution. Because honestly, that would run contrarian to the optimization they've done for XBO and the X.

Both of them are going to have some very smart and critical hardware/software optimizations; you'll probably just seen one really specific area or two where they differ.



Based on what? I mean think about it; Zen 2 processors support up to 24 PCIe 4.0 lanes. Why would MS limit a NAND memory controller interface to just 1x PCIe 4.0 lane? Even if these systems cut down on PCIe lane interface totals, they are still leaving a lot on the table.

The 40x comment was probably never meant to be taken literally, it was just a general estimate and maybe based on a slower-speced SSD they were using for testing at the time. I expect both systems to have between 7-8 GB/s NVMe SSD support over 4x PCIe 4.0 lanes.

At least that is for the custom drive; assuming the systems will have a custom drive as a memory-mapped cache and allow for external drives, it's possible the 2 GB/s number was in reference to the optional 2nd drive, not the custom one (which will probably be non-removable, for both systems). I guess in that case 2 GB/s could be an issue down the line for that secondary drive, but since it would basically be for cold storage, it would not be a big bottleneck whatsoever. In fact, for cold storage you likely wouldn't be using too much anyway, 2 GB/s is pretty hot.
Is not something from someone, it's only a thought, Sony talks so much in SSD like they "great differencial", I can assume this "great differencial" is to "outperform" the competition.

But I'll be happy if this is true and you is right, we have escaped from 2.5GB/s or 4/5 GB/s to talk in 7 GB/s and 8 GB/s

It's not like a fanboy trying to keep "your favorite console safe". I'm only seeing the context made by Sony and the others on that "PS5's SSD"

Sorry if I looked like a fanboy 😅😅😅

I hope you is right 👍
 

Kazekage1981

Member
Apr 7, 2019
195
216
230
Its huge.

Its all very well bragging obout TFlops of power, but its meaningless when its not being fed enough fresh data to really utilize it. You can do the same old shit faster and at a higher resolution, but to increase detail and complexity you need faster i/o.

From a design standpoint its also incredibly liberating, delta-states are problematic. Say you want to quickly intercut between scenes happening in two places, you need to swap assets in and out. This effectively requires either both instances to be resident in memory simultaneously, or to pause the action while you unload/reload data. SSD can in theory make this user transparent or at the very least minimize switching delay.

The same principle applies to any scenario requiring rapid delta handling. Be it traversing a world map at incredible speed, switching between game modes, changing characters and scene assets on the fly, the traditional bottleneck has always been not the systems ability to render stuff, but getting the new data into the processing queue fast-enough.
Hmm.. similar to Wifi6 analogy, what's the point of faster connection speeds, if its inefficient in sending the signals to phones, computers, etc. Appreciate your explanation. Was trying to figure out this tipping the scale thing between Xfridge and PS5. They are both so close.
 

ThaMonkeyClaw

Member
Apr 4, 2018
275
330
275
Its huge.

Its all very well bragging obout TFlops of power, but its meaningless when its not being fed enough fresh data to really utilize it. You can do the same old shit faster and at a higher resolution, but to increase detail and complexity you need faster i/o.

From a design standpoint its also incredibly liberating, delta-states are problematic. Say you want to quickly intercut between scenes happening in two places, you need to swap assets in and out. This effectively requires either both instances to be resident in memory simultaneously, or to pause the action while you unload/reload data. SSD can in theory make this user transparent or at the very least minimize switching delay.

The same principle applies to any scenario requiring rapid delta handling. Be it traversing a world map at incredible speed, switching between game modes, changing characters and scene assets on the fly, the traditional bottleneck has always been not the systems ability to render stuff, but getting the new data into the processing queue fast-enough.
You couldn't have described this any better! One of the perfect examples of where an Ultra fast SSD would come into play is switching characters on GTA5, it is like pulling teeth when you have to switch between people (or even loading the game for that matter). I personally can't wait to have an incredibly fast SSD in consoles, just the obvious benefits are worth it and I look forward to see what innovative ways developers decide to use it!
 
Last edited:

Clear

Member
Feb 2, 2009
9,570
3,045
980
Hmm.. similar to Wifi6 analogy, what's the point of faster connection speeds, if its inefficient in sending the signals to phones, computers, etc. Appreciate your explanation. Was trying to figure out this tipping the scale thing between Xfridge and PS5. They are both so close.
You likely have no idea how much work is involved in mitigating and hiding data shifting delays. Teams like Naughty Dog are masters at it, but it requires massive effort and careful planning to create the illusion of seamless continuity. It also adds bulk to file-sizes as data needs to be duplicated for ease of access.

I'm sure you've come across games that use untouched in-engine graphics in their pre-rendered movie cut-scenes. This is probably *the* classic workaround for i/o limitations.
 

Shin

Member
Feb 4, 2013
4,580
2,344
760
I somewhere I can’t read that. Can you give me a summary what it says ? Thanks
Some industry figure (writer/author or along those lines) is saying that Destination PlayStation isn't happening in February.
It got moved, so naturally there's something important (assumption) happening around then - that's my take about the Tweets.
Verified account, 9+ years in the industry, some retailer will host Destination PlayStation instead since it's popular.
 
Last edited:
Aug 28, 2019
840
885
305
Is not something from someone, it's only a thought, Sony talks so much in SSD like they "great differencial", I can assume this "great differencial" is to "outperform" the competition.

But I'll be happy if this is true and you is right, we have escaped from 2.5GB/s or 4/5 GB/s to talk in 7 GB/s and 8 GB/s

It's not like a fanboy trying to keep "your favorite console safe". I'm only seeing the context made by Sony and the others on that "PS5's SSD"

Sorry if I looked like a fanboy 😅😅😅

I hope you is right 👍
No problem dude, and I hope I didn't look like I was accusing you of being a fanboy. I just do a lot of looking into tech like NAND, PCIe (and equivalent sort of interconects like SRIO) and even when WCC posted the 2GB/s spec for XSX I thought that was pretty low.

But can't blame them, they were just taking the 40x claim and "doing the math". If I were to guess tho, yeah, the 2 GB/s speed might be for the optional drive (personally hoping both systems have an internal drive memory-mapped as a fast speed cache, even if it's not removable. Let that one be the fast drive and the 2nd optional drive the slower cold storage).
 
  • Like
Reactions: Tiago07

Kazekage1981

Member
Apr 7, 2019
195
216
230
Another car anology for the SSD is the engine can only go up to its power (TFLOP) with enough fuel and fuel coming in (SSD storage and bandwidth + RAM)
 
Last edited:

Agnostic2020

Member
Oct 24, 2017
624
1,208
465
Some industry figure (writer/author or along those lines) is saying that Destination PlayStation isn't happening in February.
It got moved, so naturally there's something important (assumption) happening around then - that's my take about the Tweets.
Verified account, 9+ years in the industry, some retailer will host Destination PlayStation instead since it's popular.
So he is insinuating that ps meeting is in feb ?
 

Bogroll

Likes moldy games
Jan 25, 2018
894
572
410
England
Another car anology for the SSD is the engine can only go up to its power (TFLOP) with enough fuel and fuel coming in (SSD storage and bandwidth + RAM)
And sometimes you can have too much fuel coming in which cause sputtering. Not enough flops ( engine not big enough to burn that much fuel ) hence frame drops etc.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Kazekage1981

Tiago07

Neo Member
Dec 31, 2019
48
45
145
Zenimax
Remedy
Bluepoint
11 Bit Studios

It is one of these probably.
Remedy would be a super surprise, Bluepoint "a great strategy to remaster/remake games", 11Bit I don't see like a "BIG thing", but would be great too and Zenimax "well PS5 will focus on RPG games too"
 
Last edited:

ksdixon

Member
Jul 31, 2010
2,422
125
775
Take Two are all about that online/microtransaction money. Look at how they've killed wwe series with towers and lootboxes etc. No way they're parting with GTA and RDR online.
 

ethomaz

Member
Mar 19, 2013
26,978
6,644
835
37
Brazil
Post points to a 2011 thread of a reply/user that doesn't exists (tried 3x).
Because he hit quote in RE and pasted here... so the ID is pointing to RE forum but the ID here shows a 2011 post.

But you have the tweet so you don't need the RE link lol


Go here and see what he liked.
 
Last edited:

ethomaz

Member
Mar 19, 2013
26,978
6,644
835
37
Brazil
Anybody feels weird about that tweet?


Who thinks Sony won't reveal PS5 in a event? :messenger_tears_of_joy: :messenger_tears_of_joy: :messenger_tears_of_joy:
He probably thought people should think that and posted when nobody even talked about that lol
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Blindarchangel82