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|OT| Next-Gen PS5 & XSX |OT| Speculation/Analysis/Leaks Thread

Investor9872

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Sony done something with their cooling, all we have is that Sony patent on back side cooling of the apu (and in small print / no picture allows cooling both sides in a sandwich). We have no idea if it has been used on ps5...but its highly suspicious.

I cant wait to see the ps5 cooling on teardown.
This is why I believe Sony will use axial fans in the PS5, which will be more efficient at funneling air and cooling both the front and back side of the apu as per the Sony patent.
 

Bladed Thesis

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Yeah. But what MS has is like a super tanker full of gaming oil. You don’t turn that ship around unless there’s a good reason.

That’s the question - what is the reason?




Well yeah it could be. If correct, I guess the MS definition of “showcase” is a little different to mine then.

I mean I’d say what Sony did was a “showcase” - you know, people waiting around for it on twitch and YouTube, and making plans around it as an event.

It’s difficult to do something of that scale every month of course. But MS chose to describe it that way and offer a monthly schedule.

If it’s just gonna be the normal gaming content on YouTube then “showcase” is mis-marketing in my opinion. Not a first for MS but disappointing nonetheless.
I think the same reason Sony delayed there event.

World events combined with COVID made it a rough look to announce an event while give Soy their space.

As much as people like to talk about MS or Sony responding or dropping things to keep up the mindshare, both companies are aware of having some space for their own products and not dropping too soon before or after. So with what has been going on in the US and EU, they probably were between a rock and a hard place to announce and event that was in the initial stages of planning.

But if you don't announce and event and end up not doing it, you didn't push it back. That's my understanding. So all this "M$ lying" stuff is just warring. Things change, events change. The world is in a weird place right now.
 
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ToadMan

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i mean its clear they have a close relationship considering Unreal engine seems to be made with PS5 in mind :)
And yet the majority of MS first party games use Unreal while Sony’s first parties mostly use their own engines and as far as anyone knows that will continue to be true for the coming gen...

Seems like Epic have little to gain from marketing for Sony - certainly Sony couldn’t pay Epic enough to jeopardise their relationship with Xbox game studios and Xbox/PC 3rd parties.

In fact, if this is all about marketing and money for epic, they’d be better off pushing that their engine is better for PC and Xbox to market to 3rd party devs and cut sony loose.

So yeah, presumably epic chose the PS5 for technical reasons rather than marketing or business ones....
 

ToadMan

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A showcase yes, are several videos not a showcase? Several videos where they show stuff about XSX is not a showcase? They even said right from the beginning JUNE WILL BE DIFFERENT.

They said Well, a video is exactly doing that.



Why would you think they would to the SAME EVENT in june? Doesn't make any sense at all.
Stop making shit up.
Why so aggressive?

If you had the courage of your conviction you’d have taken my challenge. Instead you’re offering an unrelated video ...

Xbox 20/20 was announced to be a monthly showcase of what’s next for Xbox. They did one in May and then cancelled June.

That’s not a lie, it’s not even inaccurate.

You may apologise for calling me a liar and fud spreader now ....
 
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Darius87

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A showcase yes, are several videos not a showcase? Several videos where they show stuff about XSX is not a showcase? They even said right from the beginning JUNE WILL BE DIFFERENT.
i don't really know what ms revealed in june for xsex if they did seems they were left in ps5 shadow anyway doesn't seems worthy of anouncement if it was just several videos like you said.
 

Apollo Helios

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i am gonna assume the June event was cancelled because of the backlash to the Inside Xbox, they didnt wanna have another show full of indies or smaller 3rd party games... i think they had to make sure that the next time you saw an event on XSX that it was impressive or atlest showed the big guns
Having "another show full of indies or smaller 3rd party games" wasn't the problem, it was having almost NO real gameplay in a showing touted as a gameplay show.... great logical fallacies and goalpost moving after the fact here. It was most likely planned as July from the beginning, but backlash to terrible Inside Xbox might have changed the content of this July show behind the scenes without us knowing the details, we will never know though.


I guess we are going to have to get used to Alex covering PS5 content :/
God first 5 minutes and already he's throwing doubts all around and displays his intent of spreading FUD (one part of FUD is doubt and he says that a lot, so.....)
 

Neo Blaster

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oh yeah, sure you are curious about xbox, especially looking at your tag.




jesus, what a load of crap this post is. wow.

Tell, me where did they say that they will have an event in June? Where? They even said the OPPOSITE!

Beginning of may they said:




And that's actually what they did! Developer interviews from Dirt5, how Smart Delivery works etc.




I think it's actually the opposite. PS5 having very high clocks is brute force. XSX is highly customized, too.















How many posts in a row? like 11 posts in a row? are you ok?
Another day, another neo account.

I'm fine, thanks for asking.
 

Dibils2k

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Having "another show full of indies or smaller 3rd party games" wasn't the problem, it was having almost NO real gameplay in a showing touted as a gameplay show.... great logical fallacies and goalpost moving after the fact here. It was most likely planned as July from the beginning, but backlash to terrible Inside Xbox might have changed the content of this July show behind the scenes without us knowing the details, we will never know though.
I mean there was plenty of gameplay, they were just inside the trailers and looked very average (as majority were crossgen with smart delivery)

AC:O not having actual gameplay is what killed them and left the impression that there was "almost no real gameplay" and it became the narrative
 

Apollo Helios

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I mean there was plenty of gameplay, they were just inside the trailers and looked very average (as majority were crossgen with smart delivery)

AC:O not having actual gameplay is what killed them and left the impression that there was "almost no real gameplay" and it became the narrative
Dude just Clank in trailer section had more 'gameplay' than entire Inside Xbox event, and that's not even counting the gameplay portion that was the second one! Add that one and GT and you have only two games showing more... show me "plenty of gameplay" pls and no 'inside the trailers' that doesn't even say in-engine but rather target renders lol
At this point I question did we watch the same thing and how come arrive at completely different takes, as one has to be wrong. It wasn't just AC lacking gameplay, it was truly the entire show lacking so that narrative is correct not just a story told by guys on the other side, xbox fans themselves agree too, but just not you apparently.
 

Metroiddarks

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I guess we are going to have to get used to Alex covering PS5 content :/
Perfect now we have the game dev authority who barely knows how to run/open a project in Unreal engine and accept
invitations to discord groups which shared FUD.


I don't know if this a punishment for him or for us.

so what's happened in june for ms does anyone knows?
Probably bought a couple of green screens and hire a couple of video editors while the dev teams suffers to have in time a demonstration for its games. :lollipop_neutral:
 
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Dibils2k

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Dude just Clank in trailer section had more 'gameplay' than entire Inside Xbox event, and that's not even counting the gameplay portion that was the second one! Add that one and GT and you have only two games showing more... show me "plenty of gameplay" pls and no 'inside the trailers' that doesn't even say in-engine but rather target renders lol
At this point I question did we watch the same thing and how come arrive at completely different takes, as one has to be wrong. It wasn't just AC lacking gameplay, it was truly the entire show lacking so that narrative is correct not just a story told by guys on the other side, xbox fans themselves agree too, but just not you apparently.
maybe we have different ideas of gameplay

literally the only games that didnt have gameplay was AC and Madden.

the inside xbox showcase was obly 25-30mins, it wasnt about deep dives
 

pasterpl

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Seems like Epic have little to gain from marketing for Sony
except promoting their game engine with one of the biggest brands in the games market, you guys said it multiple times, it is about creating the mindshare And brand association
 
Mar 27, 2020
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Is that why you are called neoblaster? You blast the new posters.
You mean this guy?

Given by
Our Moderation Team Yesterday at 9:46 PM
Details of warning
Tracker: May be our Alt friend

what does this even mean? I'm your alt friend in May? What?
I mean if that doesn't make him a little bit suspicious then I don't know what to tell you.

Edit: Confirmed alt of Meirl.
 
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Daneel Elijah

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except promoting their game engine with one of the biggest brands in the games market, you guys said it multiple times, it is about creating the mindshare And brand association
The best way to promote a game engine is with the games that will be made with it. Microsoft will have a lot of games using Unreal Engine, Hellblade 2 for example. But they still choose to use the PS5 for their debut and praise it instead of Microsoft. There is a marketing part in it because it wouldn't be in the Official PlayStation Magazine otherwise but that do not make the praise less genuine in my opinion.
 

Clandsiota

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The best way to promote a game engine is with the games that will be made with it. Microsoft will have a lot of games using Unreal Engine, Hellblade 2 for example. But they still choose to use the PS5 for their debut and praise it instead of Microsoft. There is a marketing part in it because it wouldn't be in the Official PlayStation Magazine otherwise but that do not make the praise less genuine in my opinion.
Of course it does, if they only say it because of the marketing deal. I mean it’s the official PlayStation magazine after all. And we all know the history of Sony and Epic games.
tim Sweeney even said that PS3 is „very easy“ to develop for.
 
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ToadMan

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except promoting their game engine with one of the biggest brands in the games market, you guys said it multiple times, it is about creating the mindshare And brand association
Hmmmm. Why would they market with a company whose in house studios don’t use their engine?

They’d have much better marketing synergy with MS where the first party pretty much all use Unreal.

So yeah, your logic is .... well illogic lol.
 
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Daneel Elijah

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Of course it does, if they only say it because of the marketing deal. I mean it’s the official PlayStation magazine after all. And we all know the history of Sony and Epic games.
tim Sweeney even said that PS3 is „very easy“ to develop for.
Does Sony or Microsoft need that kind of deal more? Especially when Microsoft will heavily use Unreal engine in their new studios ? The Unreal Engine demo was on May. We are almost in July now. Unless Epic show the same kind of demo in the Xbox July event and/or begin to praise the Xbox SX as much as they have the PS5 I will continue to believe that that praise is at least in part genuine. Of course Epic goal is to sell the Unreal Engine 5 as much as possible but their lack of acknowledgement of the SX strengths is glaring. I find it weird that Microsoft did not make them talk about the Xbox SX.
 

X-Fighter

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Is this a serious comparison?
Because the June 4th event has been posponed due to some serious events going on in the world. How is that a lie?
I am quite sure you can find an example for Sony "lying" that isn't complete bullshit though.
Is the actual quote I responded to for real?
 

Brudda26

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Of course it does, if they only say it because of the marketing deal. I mean it’s the official PlayStation magazine after all. And we all know the history of Sony and Epic games.
tim Sweeney even said that PS3 is „very easy“ to develop for.
The official playstation magazine isnt actually part of sony/playstation at all. They are part of future publishing.
 

T-Cake

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Does anyone think the XSX will get slightly increased clocks before launch? Or will they stay as they are to prevent loud fan noise?
 
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Metroiddarks

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Does anyone think the XSX will get slightly increased clocks before launch? Or will they stay as they are to prevent loud fan noise?
I think will exists but will be minimum the main reason for this is any increment of this type also increment the failure rate and probably
could depend in how good or not is the silice which Microsoft bought this affect the consume and heat generated.
 
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Daneel Elijah

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Does anyone think the XSX will get slightly increased clocks before launch? Or will they stay as they are to prevent loud fan noise?
For the GPU I do not see the need: 12TF is already better than the PS5 by a marketable amount. Unless it is to go for 13 TF there is probably no incentive for Microsoft. For the CPU I suppose that they could do it but it would probably be marginal.

That question will be more interesting for the PS5 in my opinion. With their variable clock strategy there will be more leeway in a sense to change clocks in the future. The developers have a power budget that use a specific PS5 as model. But that model may be too prudent or not adapted to certain situations unforeseen by Sony (for example in really hot climates 10.3 TF may be harder to maintain in very rare cases). I can see Sony change that model given to the developers during the PS5 life time after analyzing the data of millions of PS5.
 

icerock

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For a supposed 'marketing deal' between Sony and Epic, Sony have never shared anything related to the tech on any of their sites or social media accounts. There hasn't even been a passing reference. Quite the complete opposite, when you think about a publisher paying a fat stack of cash for said 'marketing'.

But hey, whatever helps one sleep better at night?
 

Brudda26

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For the GPU I do not see the need: 12TF is already better than the PS5 by a marketable amount. Unless it is to go for 13 TF there is probably no incentive for Microsoft. For the CPU I suppose that they could do it but it would probably be marginal.

That question will be more interesting for the PS5 in my opinion. With their variable clock strategy there will be more leeway in a sense to change clocks in the future. The developers have a power budget that use a specific PS5 as model. But that model may be too prudent or not adapted to certain situations unforeseen by Sony (for example in really hot climates 10.3 TF may be harder to maintain in very rare cases). I can see Sony change that model given to the developers during the PS5 life time after analyzing the data of millions of PS5.
There whole thing with power budgets etc is there to help with hot climates of other countries. It's not throttled by heat etc
 

Raoul_Duke

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May 27, 2020
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For the GPU I do not see the need: 12TF is already better than the PS5 by a marketable amount. Unless it is to go for 13 TF there is probably no incentive for Microsoft. For the CPU I suppose that they could do it but it would probably be marginal.

That question will be more interesting for the PS5 in my opinion. With their variable clock strategy there will be more leeway in a sense to change clocks in the future. The developers have a power budget that use a specific PS5 as model. But that model may be too prudent or not adapted to certain situations unforeseen by Sony (for example in really hot climates 10.3 TF may be harder to maintain in very rare cases). I can see Sony change that model given to the developers during the PS5 life time after analyzing the data of millions of PS5.
Most importantly people would think that higher clocks are for real a big deal, not good for their marketing
 
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LeVictorien

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Do you seriously believe Sony made the PS5 clocks variable because they were thinking of those in hotter temperature countries?!? Next gen will be a funny one!
 
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Neo Blaster

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For the GPU I do not see the need: 12TF is already better than the PS5 by a marketable amount. Unless it is to go for 13 TF there is probably no incentive for Microsoft. For the CPU I suppose that they could do it but it would probably be marginal.

That question will be more interesting for the PS5 in my opinion. With their variable clock strategy there will be more leeway in a sense to change clocks in the future. The developers have a power budget that use a specific PS5 as model. But that model may be too prudent or not adapted to certain situations unforeseen by Sony (for example in really hot climates 10.3 TF may be harder to maintain in very rare cases). I can see Sony change that model given to the developers during the PS5 life time after analyzing the data of millions of PS5.
I doubt Sony will increase frequency cap limit, Cerny said they couldn't went further without compromising chip logic.
 

Daneel Elijah

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There whole thing with power budgets etc is there to help with hot climates of other countries. It's not throttled by heat etc
Do you seriously believe Sony made the PS5 clocks variable because they were thinking of those in hotter temperature countries?!? Next gen will be a funny one!
Wow that was fast!
The hot climate was just a bad example. The idea is that the model that Sony choose for the developers to use can be upgraded. It could be because it was too prudent of for unforeseen reasons .I then tried to give one but I understand that it was a bad one.
Most importantly people would think that higher clocks are for real a big deal, not good for their marketing
Maybe, but not making your product better because you fear the answer will not be positive is really unsettling to me.
I doubt Sony will increase frequency cap limit, Cerny said they couldn't went further without compromising chip logic.
Yep it was more in the sense that the drops in clocks would be less frequent.
 
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J_Gamer.exe

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The grotesque amount of IO speed designed into PS5, and the amount of work done on improving random read performance and latency is not about faster loading times, but enabling it to do what was talked about in the Road to PS5 video, and what was demonstrated in the Unreal Engine 5 tech demo.

They wouldn’t have budgeted for the performance they’ve decided on if it wasn’t necessary for what they have in mind.

Cerny also said it’s why 16 GB of RAM felt right for PS5. In theory (and in practice once engine developers get their hands on it) the RAM only needs to contain what is in or just off screen in that moment.

How much you can trim out of (or cram into, depending on how you look at it) RAM is a function of how fast your IO is, and how fast a player is expected to be able to pan the view or move around.

I thought this would only really matter for first-party stuff until Epic Games revealed they’ve been working with Sony on this kind of rendering concept for years already.

In fact the whole idea may have stemmed from Karis at Epic Games, and convinced Sony to steer their architecture towards it.
Yes this is what I was saying. So can we speculate as to how much less ram the xbox might have available with at least half as fast ssd and io speed?

If it needed to hold the data for the next 2 seconds worth of gameplay , 3 seconds maybe 4.... to be potentially used...

Having to load where you could travel to a few seconds in any direction could be quite a lot of assets. I've no idea how much but I would have thought it would reduce the ram in active use by a fair bit for me...
 

sircaw

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A local pond.
The pages on this thread take so long to load. You guys are writing novels and doing mental gymnastics 😂
I want to revisit this after July
Well if you stopped filling the pages up with useless junk like what you just wrote and concentrate more on quality posting like mine it would zoom along nicely.

Oh wait, never mind. Fs pot kettle all that sigh :messenger_winking:

I almost had you, didn't I.
 
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