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Staff No conspiracy theories or fringe content on the Politics board

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The Pleasure

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Jan 8, 2019
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I don’t know, what do you think?

Exhibit A: Invasion of the United States Capital on 6 January 2021
That's a short to mid term game. The long game has it blow up in majestic fashion and that's a lot worse in the sense that they are far more deadly when contained for long amounts of time. But maybe I'm not looking at it from the right lens?
 

Zefah

Gold Member
Jan 7, 2007
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Not a bad change. I stopped mostly reading here for a few weeks after the election because it got insane.

But your thread about not posting conspiracy theories has a conspiracy theory ad embedded in it :messenger_grinning_smiling:


Gold foil trading card?

They really missed an opportunity not going with tin foil.
 

MrMephistoX

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May 18, 2007
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Personally I'd prefer it if Politics stayed out of NeoGAF and we stuck to talking about videogames and other stuff.

But in light of recent events, I think it's important that people keep the political conversation alive. Especially since Big Tech decided to silence all right wing dissent and is now actively hunting down dissenters.

But EviLore EviLore is right in keeping a tight rein on what should be acceptable as news or not.
To be honest I’ve always liked the fact that politics is a separate tab: part of Era’s problem is that they allow political stuff in Etc/Off Topic.
 
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Johnny Silver

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Oct 24, 2018
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It's your forum Evilore, so it's your rules.

However, this will be the downfall of Gaf in the long term, whether by making the forum unattractive to people who wish to have a free and open discourse and thus making them voluntarily leave, or by gradually creating an environment where everyone is walking on eggshells and eventually anyone can suffer repercussions.

I don't know what kind of pressure you must be facing from your end, especially from people, such as those from Era, who wish you harm, but I know that ultimately this won't end well for any of us and least of all for Gaf's future.
 
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Meicyn

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Jan 22, 2010
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That's a short to mid term game. The long game has it blow up in majestic fashion and that's a lot worse in the sense that they are far more deadly when contained for long amounts of time. But maybe I'm not looking at it from the right lens?
I honestly am trying to understand what you are saying. The capital was invaded as we allowed these folks to yap away.
 
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oagboghi2

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Apr 15, 2018
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We saw a lot of violent acts and incidents of criminality during the riots last year, and many mainstream sources denied their existence or just lied.

For example, would the people who had posted Andy Ngo videos and video clips cut from streams have been banned if this new policy had been in effect back then?
 

Hazu

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Jul 23, 2011
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It's your forum Evilore, so it's your rules.

However, this will be the downfall of Gaf in the long term, whether by making the forum unattractive to people who wish to have a free and open discourse and thus making them voluntarily leave, or by gradually creating an environment where everyone is walking on eggshells and eventually anyone can suffer repercussions.

I don't know what kind of pressure you must be facing from your end, especially from people, such as those from Era, who wish you harm, but I know that ultimately this won't end well for any of us and least of all for Gaf's future.
Thing is, there won't be any place to have these kinds of discussions pretty soon.
 

GreyHorace

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To be honest I’ve always like the fact that politics is a separate tab: part of Era’s problem is that they allow political stuff in Etc/Off Topic.
I've kept out of the Politics message board in recent weeks for the sake of my own sanity. On occasion I'll take a peek and chime in on any subject that takes my interest.

So long as this place doesn't become like ResetEra and keeps the discussion free and fair, I'll support this forum.
 

Rentahamster

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Jun 26, 2007
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So we can't discuss whether or not the election was stolen? Or is it just unconfirmed sources from randoms that are banned?
I think the takeaway here is that advocating for a position that cannot be empirically proven with evidence, which also has precedent of manifesting into real world violence needs to be discouraged in order to maintain order and integrity.

The closer you get to the position of the election was stolen so imma riot or the the USA is racist so imma riot while justifying it with no evidence or citing kooky ass sources, the closer you get to the line.

I think we can all generally agree what constitutes reasonably justified evidence and reasonably justified belief. Discussions are fine. Talking out your ass with inflammatory or baseless rhetoric is not.
 
Mar 3, 2014
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To be honest I’ve always like the fact that politics is a separate tab: part of Era’s problem is that they allow political stuff in Etc/Off Topic.

100% agree. keeping politics on a different section is a great move. for the longest time I had not even click into that side once. it's only after the last week or so I had came in to really start reading and posting due to the current events. Gaming and OT being kept relatively pleasant is a great result of this decision. and Era, while having more content, the overzealous nature would often made these content less enjoyable IMO.
 
Oct 15, 2019
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The closer you get to the position of the election was stolen so imma riot or the the USA is racist so imma riot while justifying it with no evidence or citing kooky ass sources, the closer you get to the line.
That wont lead to a ban and you know it. This is because Amazon killed Parler's hosting and people are gonna come for Gaf's hosting if they aren't already.
 
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EviLore

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We saw a lot of violent acts and incidents of criminality during the riots last year, and many mainstream sources denied their existence or just lied.

For example, would the people who had posted Andy Ngo videos and video clips cut from streams have been banned if this new policy had been in effect back then?
I don't see why that would be the case. Andy Ngo is a regular conservative journalist who writes for the WSJ and formerly Quillette etc., appears regularly on Fox News and podcasts like Joe Rogan and Dave Rubin. On Twitter he mostly posts primary source on-the-ground video reporting and public record mugshots.
 

OSC

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Jun 16, 2018
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Understandable, however what is "fringe content"? Some guidance would be useful.
I think a lot of bitchute, infowars, etc.

Big tech is targeting any free speech platform that doesn't self-censor. In any case it doesn't matter if things are discussed or not, that does not change whether the claims are in the end true or false. Any claim about the real world that has any truth to it, eventually will also be covered by mainstream media.
 
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Rentahamster

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That wont lead to a ban and you know it. This is because Amazon killed Parler's hosting and people are gonna come for Gaf's hosting if they aren't already.
Directly advocating for violence leads to bans. Always has. Just look at the ban page.

There are ways to air grievances without directly advocating or encouraging violence.
 

SlimySnake

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Probably for the best. I think a lot of websites allowed this kind of nonsense to fester and thats how we got to a place where we have a country with half of the population living in an alternate reality.

We have always had the fringe, but they never really entered the mainstream like this. Thanks to social media, everyone is buying into this shit, and drastic measures like this are necessary if not already too late. The damage is done. The country will never be the same again.
 

EviLore

Expansive Ellipses
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I understand the need to dial it back a bit from some of the crazier stuff but are we still allowed to discuss the election irregularities in the 2020 election?
Trump lost the election, was unable to prove any of his widespread fraud claims in a court of law, and conceded to Biden. The sacred landslide is an unsubstantiated conspiracy theory only given any credence because the POTUS himself pushed it. We're done with the 2020 election.
 

Vestal

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Sep 26, 2007
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I have personally stayed in the fringes of forum engagement here on GAF since the big divide 4 years ago(The primary threads and people I engaged with like NBAGAF and large swath of Center/Left political actors moved away). I was banned back in the other place because of the execssive moderation and reading too much into everything someone says that occurred there last year. For the past 6-7 months I have spent my time jumping back between here and there, reading the takes of both forums. I'll be brutally honest and say that looking at some of the stuff here, made the hair on the back of my neck standup and I just couldn't bring myself to engage once again in discussions on GAF. Seeing this post from EviLore EviLore gives me hope that this forum will be a bit more in the middle of the divide that currently exist in politics and in social discourse in general.

Honestly that is what GAF was before the great divide, at least to me. I can only hope that is where this is heading, and the country as well follows suit. We get off the fringes and look towards the middle for solutions.
 

Johnny Silver

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Oct 24, 2018
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Trump lost the election, was unable to prove any of his widespread fraud claims in a court of law, and conceded to Biden. The sacred landslide is an unsubstantiated conspiracy theory only given any credence because the POTUS himself pushed it. We're done with the 2020 election.

But under the first amendment, can a person not post an opinion about how they disagree with the results and the methods used to validate them?
 

Guilty_AI

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Apr 12, 2020
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Kinda sad seeing these political events creeping in like that. Personally i'm fine as long as i'm not banned for not agreeing CDPR is transphobic, or for not making a lenghty post about black lives matter. I'm not here for the politics and only take a look at them occasionally.

That said though, there's still the danger of the site being deplatformed even with these restrictions in place.
No idea where else i'd run off if that happened, every place in the internet seems crazy nowadays.
 

HE1NZ

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This being so particular about 2020 election sounds like a heavy outside pressure.

But I guess it's primarily a gaming forum anyway. Unlike the other place.
 
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Stouffers

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Trump lost the election, was unable to prove any of his widespread fraud claims in a court of law, and conceded to Biden. The sacred landslide is an unsubstantiated conspiracy theory only given any credence because the POTUS himself pushed it. We're done with the 2020 election.
Election reform moving forward im sure is acceptable.
 
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Mista K

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I knew things were getting weird when there were anonymous source 4chan posts being spread as fact. Just like what The Atlantic did. All this left vs right stuff shows that they're just two sides of the same coin, so I appreciate your stance on keeping the forum straight down the middle.
 

SpartanN92

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Sep 7, 2012
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Kentucky, it’s not as bad as Australia
Trump lost the election, was unable to prove any of his widespread fraud claims in a court of law, and conceded to Biden. The sacred landslide is an unsubstantiated conspiracy theory only given any credence because the POTUS himself pushed it. We're done with the 2020 election.
I have a lot of respect for you but I think this is not the right course of action here.
Having legitimate discourse about the way the election was handled, specifically in regards to the actions of States county officials, and States Executives is vital to pushing the discourse for election reform and election transparency in the future.

This is your site of course but I respectfully think you should reconsider or at least be more surgical in what topics are taboo. A blanket “2020 is over get over it” approach is not the way to handle the recent events.
 

Amiga

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But the slippery slope reality we face, and which has been proven several times so far for several political themes of discussion, will make sure more and more become "off-limits".
I think if something crazy did actually happen, with verified sources, then it would be OK to discuss it. but outrageous stuff without known sources is not. it's like walking on eggshells but that is the environment at the moment.
 

ShadowLag

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Jun 4, 2013
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Makes sense when ISPs, hosting providers, social media, and every other arm of big tech is going scorched earth and Thanos snapping everyone off the Internet that dares post words they don't like right now. I was wondering what you would continue to allow on GAF in light of all this - I was slightly worried for the site for a bit.

It's a sad day in my opinion, even if I only occasionally drive-by the political section and barely come out with my sanity, but GAF must continue.
 

Xenon

Gold Member
I never really engage in them but this reminds me of what neogaf was before, not so much how it will be moderated, but the use of fear of being banned for some unknown standard that changes on the whim of social outrage. Of course this is the site as a whole that is threatened so the stakes are much higher. The effect will be the same, many will abstain from topics that should be discussed out concern of reprisal. This is a more effective form of censorship as it uses a person's own fear as their moderator.
 
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SF Kosmo

...please disperse...
Jul 7, 2020
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Everyone here knows where I stand on right wing conspiracies, but always prefer engaging the debate rather than muting it.

But there are some greater good concerns for the health of the forum so, if that's how it is then that's how it is.
 
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EviLore

Expansive Ellipses
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I never really engage in them but this reminds me of what neogaf was before, not so much how it will be moderated, but the use of fear of being banned for some unknown standard that changes on the whim of social outrage. Of course this is the site as a whole that is threatened so the stakes are much higher. The effect will be the same, many will abstain from topics that should be discussed out concern of reprisal. This is a more effective form of censorship as it uses a person's own fear as their moderator.
It's not particularly nebulous and you can just ask if you're not sure.
 

Papa

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I think the takeaway here is that advocating for a position that cannot be empirically proven with evidence, which also has precedent of manifesting into real world violence needs to be discouraged in order to maintain order and integrity.

The closer you get to the position of the election was stolen so imma riot or the the USA is racist so imma riot while justifying it with no evidence or citing kooky ass sources, the closer you get to the line.

I think we can all generally agree what constitutes reasonably justified evidence and reasonably justified belief. Discussions are fine. Talking out your ass with inflammatory or baseless rhetoric is not.

I agree, but I think that the clear lack of consistency when it comes to left wing conspiracy theories like Patriarchy theory and White Privilege theory is as much to blame as anything Trump did or said. Trump lit the fuse on Jan 6, but the powder keg was placed there by the media and big tech institutions perpetuating clear double standards.

Right wing conspiracy theories tend to be overt and are easily clamped down on. Meanwhile, left wing conspiracy theories run rampant through our institutions and are dogmatically browbeaten into the populace. I see it as the masculine-feminine, yin-yang dynamic. The masculine (right) manifests physically and is easily dealt with by law and order. The feminine (left) manifests socially and culturally and is not easily addressed by law and order.

There's no balance here and nothing good will come of these censorious crackdowns, be it on GAF or elsewhere.
 

MrMephistoX

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Makes sense when ISPs, hosting providers, social media, and every other arm of big tech is going scorched earth and Thanos snapping everyone off the Internet that dares post words they don't like right now. I was wondering what you would continue to allow on GAF in light of all this - I was slightly worried for the site for a bit.

It's a sad day in my opinion, even if I only occasionally drive-by the political section and barely come out with my sanity, but GAF must continue.


I’m honestly curious if Cloudflare and AWS sent out some kind of notice to their customers that right wing conspiracies are verboten?
 
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