None of the "current" democratic candidates can beat Trump and the DNC is letting things fly.

Afro Republican

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Aug 24, 2016
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#1
Biden is sill winning in the polls despite not announcing, though he likely will, but he's the only one with a "chance" of beating Trump, the issue is most of the candidates running and campaigning on radical socialist issues might actually screw-up a Biden run as well since they hold a no-compromise stance against the independents and GOP.

As for the many (19-20?) democratic candidates that are running this election, none of the ones that have announced, or have a committee are bale to beat Trump and all for one simple reason, the socialist arm of the democratic party, including the voters that support that arm, want to fight and have zero compromise.

For example, if Bernie won the nomination in 2016, he would still move toward center and work with top members of the party to get things done and to run against Trump in the final stretch of the campaign. In 2020 Bernie and many other democratic candidates are running against the party, instead using the party term "democrat" for what's in reality, a third-party as it's the only way to have a chance of winning.

When you look at some local, congressional, and presidential politics you see the same across the board, the socialist arm, which itself is fractured, is running a losers game intentionally. No compromise, isolate potential allies, cause chaos and disorganization, imaginary promises, and not even remotely trying to draw people toward their orbit.

So many voters are falling for the Socialist arm for many different reasons, among them people being dumber than normal, and this destroys the possibility of unity and falling in line IN Nov, and instead creates a scenario that's quite inevitable: several protest and absent votes. We already saw a small sample of this very thing in 2016, but this time the socialist arm is more than 3-4% of the party.

After Hillary loss it almost seemed like lessons were learned but those were buried and we had a continuation of Bernie and Hilary fans blaming the other for the loss. However, Hillary's compromise to slightly implement some of Bernie and his supporters policies to try and gain their votes, along with other politicians following her lead, led to to problem we have today. By doing so many states and large city districts in high-populace states quickly started accepting the Socialist ideals and within two years the arm has taken a large chunk of democrat politics.

So with no unity it is near impossible for any of the current candidates to actually win making this a magic hat show but we never see the rabbit come out of the hat. It's all phony. It's basically the same as a third-party integrating into one of the two main platforms. It's a done deal.

The only way a democrat will win is if Biden runs and the party helps bury most of the other candidates, he might be able get some independents and moderates along with the normal arm of the party, but most of the socialist arm will likely still cut him off. Of course at the moment the DNC or the pelosi/shumer arm of the party aren't doing anything at all and letting this run longer than it needs to.

I predict another Trump win and both arms of the democratic party collapsing as the party attempts to repair itself and come back to order in 2024. Just like how a good chunk of the Hillary/Pelosi arm of the party crumbled after 2016 giving the Socialist arm more power over the next two years till now, I think we'll have a 3rd "democratic party collapse, in the countries history where like the previous 2 times n history, the democratic party was fractured and fell to pieces and taking 2 terms to come back to stabilization.
 
Dec 18, 2018
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I hope you're right. My theory is, the Democrats understand that an incumbent Prez is very tough to beat. Clinton and Obama got rekt in their midterms even worse than Trump did, yet both were re-elected.

So, any Democrat who has a real chance is going to wait until 2024 to run. The current clown car of socialists and reparations advocates are just sacrificial lambs destined to lose in 2020.
 
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I also feel like the Dems are making it easy for Trump to caricature them, and he will be able to use easy one line catchphrases and dogwhistles that his base will eat up. How much you wanna bet half his campaign will be a bunch of AOC hyperbole.

The thing I don't know is whether he had increased or decreased his voting base over the last 2 years.
 

cryptoadam

... and he cannot lie
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Nice long post, thanks for the effort.

After the SOTU I saw no chance for anyone to beat Trump.

The Dems have nothing to run on except racism, Russian collusion, and giving everyone free stuff. Trump is also going to wipe the floor with anyone he debates.

Dems are going to rely on the media again to try and do their dirty work, and hold out hope that Mueller or one of the 60 other investigations they have will be enough to derail Trump.

With the issues with Jews and Blacks the Dems are having, if they lose a few of those voters its probably game over. 55% Jews vote Dem (down from 70%) and lets say 80% blacks (down from like 95%) they will be finished in 2020.
 
Dec 18, 2018
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Trump could certainly defeat himself though. Recently he called for a lot more legal immigration, which will drive down wages for Americans.

A few more facepalm moments like that and his base might just stay home next November.
 
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#8
I'm not sure I see things to be quite so dire for Democrats, at least in relation to the presidential election. To me it looks like a repeat of 2016, except this time around they have years of media conditioning in their favor. The Dems have shown they like to overplay their hand, so who really knows how it will all shake out between now and Nov 2020.

I still think Harris is going to get the nomination (unfortunately), she's the establishment dressed in progressive clothing. If Biden jumps in it's because the party views Bernie as a real threat (as do Howard Schultz and Mark Cuban), I suspect he'd just hand over his delegates to Harris. Pelosi's made it clear it's a woman's time to shine and Harris would tow the party line the same way Obama did.
 

Afro Republican

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With the issues with Blacks the Dems are having,
I saw the Omar thing for the jewish issues, but what Black issue are you referring to?

I still think Harris is going to get the nomination (unfortunately), she's the establishment dressed in progressive clothing.
The progressives have already threw her off, you can even see a preview of that on the other gaming board on a smaller scale. The socialist arm has tarred her record and if she makes it past the first couple of debates they'll probably put out her dirty laundry and try to bust her poll numbers. It won't be hard to do since she's not that popular outside her home state.
 
Dec 1, 2017
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It will certainly be very interesting to watch the Dems rip each other apart during the primaries.

Frankly I don't know how these candidates will or should approach this. In order to stand out, they cannot kumbayah each other, but at the same time, they have to be careful not to provide low hanging ammo and meat for Trump.

There are too many candidates, imo and it feels like marginalization imo. It's going to be a shitshow.
 
Likes: hariseldon
Oct 3, 2004
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#12
The progressives have already threw her off, you can even see a preview of that on the other gaming board on a smaller scale. The socialist arm has tarred her record and if she makes it past the first couple of debates they'll probably put out her dirty laundry and try to bust her poll numbers. It won't be hard to do since she's not that popular outside her home state.
They can try, but she'll withstand the hits because she'll have the major players in her corner. California's primary is now on "Super Tuesday," March 3rd, which is extremely convenient for Harris because if she can secure most of the delegates that day then you know the media will turn against Bernie again, making the case that if he sticks around the same way he did in 2016 he'll give the election over to Trump. Just like that, Bernie will become the bad guy again for depriving yet another woman from the presidency (stupid to say in 2016, but good luck explaining that to Hillary supporters, some of which still haven't come to terms with the Trump presidency). The only way Bernie (and progressives) can win the nomination is if his campaign team can knock Harris down before March.

Warren's been far better at explaining her policy ideas, but her attempts to come across as a politician the average voter can relate to backfired, not to mention her DNA test. She didn't do herself any favors by attacking social media giants either. I imagine that if you're a progressive or one of those far leftist anti-Trumpers bemoaning corporate interests then it really is Bernie or bust. Harris and the others will give you another 4-8 years of Obama-like governing - his respectable character and charisma aside, do Dem supporters really want that? I don't think so, but you can bet the corporate media does.
 
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cryptoadam

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I saw the Omar thing for the jewish issues, but what Black issue are you referring to?.
You have movements like Blexit and Walkaway. And you also have the low black unemployment. Its not necessarily issues but there is a hard core press from black conservatives to recruit people away from the democratic party. I had read somewhere that if Dems drop below 85% of the black vote they wouldn't have a chance of winning an election.

So I think its possible if more blacks go Republican that the Democrats are going to be in big trouble. Its only really about the Republicans getting another 10-15% of the black vote. If the Trump is racist fails and the economy keeps up not sure what the Dems are going to have to offer to keep all the black votes.
 

Afro Republican

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Aug 24, 2016
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Walk away was started by a gay white male.

But yeah, Trump really doesn't need that much of a percentage of Black voters, 2016 already showed what a small drop could do. All he has to do is hit over 10% and the democrats lose again since where they historically segregated the largest populations of blacks happen to be in the states that are basically required.

If he can get more than that and the GOP manages to hold it for generations the Dems may not ever win an election against for who knows how long.
 
Oct 21, 2018
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Lots of assumptions about the future are being made in this thread, based on nothing more than personal political opinion, but there seems to be little awareness about the present.

Here's something new that will help Democrats and hurt this terrible excuse for a president: Trump's new budget proposal has massive cuts to domestic spending, breaking his own campaign promises about not cutting Medicare and Medicaid. That sure seems like it was timed to blow a hole in your equation.

There's also little awareness about the past. The GOP had a ton of candidates during the primary too and they fought each other rather harshly, even with petty insults and other offenses. It didn't stop most of them from coming together months later, so the same can happen with the Democrats, whether you want it or not.
 
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cryptoadam

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Feb 21, 2018
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Walk away was started by a gay white male.

But yeah, Trump really doesn't need that much of a percentage of Black voters, 2016 already showed what a small drop could do. All he has to do is hit over 10% and the democrats lose again since where they historically segregated the largest populations of blacks happen to be in the states that are basically required.

If he can get more than that and the GOP manages to hold it for generations the Dems may not ever win an election against for who knows how long.
Walkaway, Blexit, Turning point they all kinda blend together for me. Even though Walkaway was statred by a white gay guy and its not exclusivly black, it does attract many blacks.

But you hit on the head, if Trump can flip 10-15% of the black vote the Dems are in big trouble. If the economy stays strong, black unemployment low I think he can. Its going to be hard to convince people seeing jobs and money that you have to stay away from Trump because he is racist. After 4 years and the fact that Trump didn't put all blacks into concentration camps its going to be real hard to sound the racism alarm when most people really only care about how much money they have in their pocket.

And with Obama we already had the first POC president. So Booker or Harris can't ride those coattails.
 

Afro Republican

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Aug 24, 2016
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Walkaway, Blexit, Turning point they all kinda blend together for me. Even though Walkaway was statred by a white gay guy and its not exclusivly black, it does attract many blacks.
None of them really attract that many, a lot of local state organizations and such is where most of the disdain toward the democrats are coming from, hence why the it's primarily Black Men switching (or voting GOP first time) and the women are still kind of in a manipulative state, which isn't surprising since the democrats and corporations will give them better QOL, top job positions, and other things intentionally so they don't see the same things the men do.

But like I said Trump only needs to break 10 to win, he doesn't need 15, if he got 15 that could be the start of the end if the next republican candidate hold that 15 or increases it. The states the switching populations are in are states the Dems can't afford to lose, and in some cases can't make up.
 
Likes: cryptoadam
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If Biden is the Democrats best chance, well, good luck.

Also, with as much crap that has stuck to Sanders, I cant see how he has any chance of beating Trump.
 

sahlberg

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Oct 27, 2017
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#24
Far as I see it, Biden is their best chance. He is moderate and experienced. And he would be the only candidate in their nominations that is not a crazy alt-left intersectionalist or socialist?

Now, how will the crazy left handle Biden getting the nomination? I am not sure the democratic party could survive the infighting that would result.
 

i_am_ben

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Feb 5, 2008
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Are any of the challengers weaker than Hillary though?

cos the EC map for Trump remains challenging. He only just won certain states against Clinton and now needs to do all that again.

From the midterms we saw that Democrats were very motivated by healthcare and Trump.
 
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#28
Lots of assumptions about the future are being made in this thread, based on nothing more than personal political opinion, but there seems to be little awareness about the present.

Here's something new that will help Democrats and hurt this terrible excuse for a president: Trump's new budget proposal has massive cuts to domestic spending, breaking his own campaign promises about not cutting Medicare and Medicaid. That sure seems like it was timed to blow a hole in your equation.

There's also little awareness about the past. The GOP had a ton of candidates during the primary too and they fought each other rather harshly, even with petty insults and other offenses. It didn't stop most of them from coming together months later, so the same can happen with the Democrats, whether you want it or not.
Nailed it!

I don't see anyone making a thread about the Medicaid/Medicare cuts or any of the domestic spending cuts ... And the giving even more tax breaks to the wealthy and big corporations.
 
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JordanN

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Apr 21, 2012
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#30
If Biden is the Democrats best chance, well, good luck.

Also, with as much crap that has stuck to Sanders, I cant see how he has any chance of beating Trump.
Bernie can't even control his own microphone.

He might do better when it comes to the working class, but that's about it. I don't even see independents going to him like they would have in 2016.

Trump would make mince meat of this socialist.

 
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You have movements like Blexit and Walkaway. And you also have the low black unemployment. Its not necessarily issues but there is a hard core press from black conservatives to recruit people away from the democratic party. I had read somewhere that if Dems drop below 85% of the black vote they wouldn't have a chance of winning an election.

So I think its possible if more blacks go Republican that the Democrats are going to be in big trouble. Its only really about the Republicans getting another 10-15% of the black vote. If the Trump is racist fails and the economy keeps up not sure what the Dems are going to have to offer to keep all the black votes.
Trump will not get a significant increase in the black vote. You fundamentally misunderstand why black people vote Democrat.
 
Jul 19, 2018
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Bernie can't even control his own microphone.

He might do better when it comes to the working class, but that's about it. I don't even see independents going to him like they would have in 2016.

Trump would make mince meat of this socialist.

Andrew Yang gonna steal all the Bernie bros. I’m ready for some Yang Bux.
 
May 22, 2018
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I disagree. I think Sanders, Biden, Harris and O'Rourke all have extremely good odds of beating Trump in 2020. Trump couldn't even win the popular vote against Clinton and thats before the circus that has been his presidency. And he only seems to be continuing the trend of damaging himself and the GOP as time goes on so I definitely like the Democrat's odds.
 
Jul 19, 2018
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I disagree. I think Sanders, Biden, Harris and O'Rourke all have extremely good odds of beating Trump in 2020. Trump couldn't even win the popular vote against Clinton and thats before the circus that has been his presidency. And he only seems to be continuing the trend of damaging himself and the GOP as time goes on so I definitely like the Democrat's odds.
Anyone on the Democrat side has a good chance at beating Trump. It has nothing to do with anything you said though. It comes down to 2 things. Demographics, and the softening support from a segment of his base. Hashtag YangGang
 
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Lol @ the people who will just never understand that Bernie cannot win. Someday you will realize a few loud people don't speak for everyone.

The ticket is going to include Harris. She is that minority women vote that is the Democratic platform. Whether it is President or VP, will depend on if Biden wants to run. He is just debating on whether he wants his name to further be dragged through mud, for his eventual loss to Trump.
 

JordanN

Junior Member
Apr 21, 2012
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#41
I disagree. I think Sanders, Biden, Harris and O'Rourke all have extremely good odds of beating Trump in 2020. Trump couldn't even win the popular vote against Clinton and thats before the circus that has been his presidency. And he only seems to be continuing the trend of damaging himself and the GOP as time goes on so I definitely like the Democrat's odds.
Bush lost the popular vote in 2000 but he won it in 2004. And this was after he launched a war based on lies.




While it's unlikely, I could see Trump winning the popular vote if the Democrats elect a candidate that causes them to infight over issues (i.e choosing a straight white male for example, would cause minorities and women to sit out the election for example).
 
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I just can't see the Democrats unifying for this election. The far-left wing are annihilating their chance of attracting Republicans, independents and are even shedding moderate Dems. A moderate like Biden isn't going to satisfy that wing of the party, either.

I'll be pulling the lever for Trump, most likely. A few years ago I'd never have believed that possible, but with the Green New Deal, "the future is intersectional", the NY abortion bill, their inability to handle unambiguous anti-semitism within their ranks and now talk of reparations, I know the Dems aren't an option for me this time around.
 

JordanN

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Apr 21, 2012
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#43
I just can't see the Democrats unifying for this election. The far-left wing are annihilating their chance of attracting Republicans, independents and are even shedding moderate Dems. A moderate like Biden isn't going to satisfy that wing of the party, either.

I'll be pulling the lever for Trump, most likely. A few years ago I'd never have believed that possible, but with the Green New Deal, "the future is intersectional", the NY abortion bill, their inability to handle unambiguous anti-semitism within their ranks and now talk of reparations, I know the Dems aren't an option for me this time around.
I'm going to be honest.

Republicans are the moderate/centrist party.

I wouldn't even call them right-wing. If you want to see what a real right-wing leader looks like, then look at Duterte, Bolsonaro, Pinochet, Netanyahu etc.

Compared to them, Trump is hella soft. If he really was the scary "Nazi" the media makes him out to be, America would have built two walls already , and the police would be executing drug dealers in the street.

But he's not even close to doing those things. He hasn't even attempted to repeal gay marriage that Obama had left in place before him.
 
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Oct 21, 2018
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Republicans are the moderate/centrist party.
They sure don't govern like "moderates" or centrists. In fact, a number of past Republican candidates and presidents would be too "liberal" for the GOP of today. Trump's budget proposal isn't centrist. It cuts Medicare and Medicaid while expanding an already high military spending. To say nothing of the fact Obamacare was, in fact, objectively close to Republican healthcare policy proposals and yet the modern GOP didn't support it.

Trump doesn't need to be a literal "Nazi" in order to pander to racists and isolationists as well as actual Nazis.

Anyone who seriously thinks that's either not the case or doesn't matter is, well, not being consistent.

Calling the GOP of 2019 "moderate" doesn't stand up to serious analysis.

But he's not even close to doing those things. He hasn't even attempted to repeal gay marriage that Obama had left in place before him.
He merely appoints people who were against gay marriage into positions of power and influence.

How moderate of him. I guess everyone should thank him for not being worse than he is.
 
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Afro Republican

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Aug 24, 2016
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Trump will not get a significant increase in the black vote. You fundamentally misunderstand why black people vote Democrat.
Black women. Men are moving away and they have been a topic since 2016 every year including the mid terms. Also those percentages are inflated and bogus and it's not clear what they are based on because you can find sources with other percentages as well.
 

Afro Republican

GAF>INTERNET>GAF, BITCHES
Aug 24, 2016
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#46
He merely appoints people who were against gay marriage into positions of power and influence.

How moderate of him. I guess everyone should thank him for not being worse than he is.
Gay marriage was a political fake issue anyway as they had an alternative that would have done the same but they moved the battle to marriage and using the gimped understanding of the certain laws intentionally to make it "legal" despite the fact that is BS interpretation and GM is actually unconstitutional, and they knew the knew the meaning of those laws when they were written and the time period. It can easily be overturned due to how weak the argument was which is why so many people were scared of Trumps appointments to the Supreme court, but if it was a legitimate ruling you wouldn't be scared in the first place.

It wasn't even a real victory, they already had it, they had no reason to move to a new word, it was all a political stunt to cause division till this day and there was no reason for it and caused additional backlash toward the community they 'claimed' to be doing this for. The fact the LGBT community consider being used as pawns as victory baffles me because they do it when they are used as a check-list clearing object in movies and companies as well, if a Black person is "ok we need 3 black people at this company ok we checked off the list" or "we need this black guy to act sterotypical in this movie" people go to protest, when the same happens with LGBT, it's considered "progress" and a "step-forward" and you continue to wonder why there's still so much resistance, THINK people.

I disagree. I think Sanders, Biden, Harris and O'Rourke all have extremely good odds of beating Trump in 2020. Trump couldn't even win the popular vote against Clinton and thats before the circus that has been his presidency. And he only seems to be continuing the trend of damaging himself and the GOP as time goes on so I definitely like the Democrat's odds.
This is dumb, if the popular vote is your ONLY primary metric on how he 'struggled" in 2016 you basically never understood how and WHERE Trump lost to gain his wins. Oddly enough there's another thread on part of the reason why he won right under this. Dems aren't going to win if they don't go to states they still don't care about and are not going to NOW IN 2019.

Tell your candidates to stop campaigning in states they can't lose, that's a good first step, or at least not waste an insane amount of money on it.
 
Sep 12, 2017
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Trump doesn't need to be a literal "Nazi" in order to pander to racists and isolationists as well as actual Nazis.


Calling the GOP of 2019 "moderate" doesn't stand up to serious analysis.
Would you mind explaining what you consider a Nazi? I'm sure you'll agree it's misused quite a lot. If you mean literal National Socialists: what sort of percentage of the American public would fall under that label?

To the second point: I know it doesn't necessarily follow, but do you consider the Democrats moderate at this particular point in time?
 
Likes: pramod
Oct 21, 2018
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Would you mind explaining what you consider a Nazi? I'm sure you'll agree it's misused quite a lot. If you mean literal National Socialists: what sort of percentage of the American public would fall under that label?

To the second point: I know it doesn't necessarily follow, but do you consider the Democrats moderate at this particular point in time?
In the modern U.S. context, that would be people who actually walk around with Nazi flags or other associated symbols during public rallies and chant slogans like "Jews will not replace us". No, they aren't many, but they are not being improperly called Nazis if they choose to use their symbols in public. I wouldn't call Trump himself one, obviously.

I think the Democratic party is less united, less disciplined and more diverse than the GOP at this point in time. There are Democrats I'd consider moderates, but also some that aren't. Bernie isn't a moderate, obviously, and neither is AOC. But they're not the entire party. Even among the progressives you have those that are more radical about certain issues while holding moderate stances in other areas.
 

Arkage

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Sep 25, 2012
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Biden is sill winning in the polls despite not announcing, though he likely will, but he's the only one with a "chance" of beating Trump, the issue is most of the candidates running and campaigning on radical socialist issues might actually screw-up a Biden run as well since they hold a no-compromise stance against the independents and GOP.

As for the many (19-20?) democratic candidates that are running this election, none of the ones that have announced, or have a committee are bale to beat Trump and all for one simple reason, the socialist arm of the democratic party, including the voters that support that arm, want to fight and have zero compromise.

For example, if Bernie won the nomination in 2016, he would still move toward center and work with top members of the party to get things done and to run against Trump in the final stretch of the campaign. In 2020 Bernie and many other democratic candidates are running against the party, instead using the party term "democrat" for what's in reality, a third-party as it's the only way to have a chance of winning.

When you look at some local, congressional, and presidential politics you see the same across the board, the socialist arm, which itself is fractured, is running a losers game intentionally. No compromise, isolate potential allies, cause chaos and disorganization, imaginary promises, and not even remotely trying to draw people toward their orbit.

So many voters are falling for the Socialist arm for many different reasons, among them people being dumber than normal, and this destroys the possibility of unity and falling in line IN Nov, and instead creates a scenario that's quite inevitable: several protest and absent votes. We already saw a small sample of this very thing in 2016, but this time the socialist arm is more than 3-4% of the party.

After Hillary loss it almost seemed like lessons were learned but those were buried and we had a continuation of Bernie and Hilary fans blaming the other for the loss. However, Hillary's compromise to slightly implement some of Bernie and his supporters policies to try and gain their votes, along with other politicians following her lead, led to to problem we have today. By doing so many states and large city districts in high-populace states quickly started accepting the Socialist ideals and within two years the arm has taken a large chunk of democrat politics.

So with no unity it is near impossible for any of the current candidates to actually win making this a magic hat show but we never see the rabbit come out of the hat. It's all phony. It's basically the same as a third-party integrating into one of the two main platforms. It's a done deal.

The only way a democrat will win is if Biden runs and the party helps bury most of the other candidates, he might be able get some independents and moderates along with the normal arm of the party, but most of the socialist arm will likely still cut him off. Of course at the moment the DNC or the pelosi/shumer arm of the party aren't doing anything at all and letting this run longer than it needs to.

I predict another Trump win and both arms of the democratic party collapsing as the party attempts to repair itself and come back to order in 2024. Just like how a good chunk of the Hillary/Pelosi arm of the party crumbled after 2016 giving the Socialist arm more power over the next two years till now, I think we'll have a 3rd "democratic party collapse, in the countries history where like the previous 2 times n history, the democratic party was fractured and fell to pieces and taking 2 terms to come back to stabilization.
You talk about repeated Democratic party collapses when literally all Republicans candidates during the primarily were destroyed by a Birther billionaire who was a Democrat and best friends with Hillary up until the very point where he realized his only chance of winning was going Republican and running against her. The Republican party is literally completely beholden to a single man who would've ran Democrat on a liberal platform if thought he could've swung it with better odds. All of this is to say: pot meet kettle.