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Oh, Working Designs and your wacky translations!

Negator

Member
Feb 5, 2009
6,911
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ethelred said:
No way, man. Those hardcover manuals were fucking ace.

And actually, thinking back to the manuals, that reminds me of one of my favorite Working Designs jokes...


WOW! This is amazing! :lol
 

vireland

Member
Jul 21, 2004
4,535
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Good lord. We did more than sexytime explosion jokes, but if you were reading this thread you'd never know it. There was a pretty good concentration of straight up funny and a fair amount of literary references to balance out the pop culture and sexy stuff!

(That Diek page almost got pulled by SCEA, but it made it - I love that double entendre)
 

RevenantKioku

PEINS PEINS PEINS PEINS PEINS PEINS PEINS PEINS PEINS PEINS PEINS PEINS oh god i am drowning in them
Jun 6, 2004
23,072
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www.bookofrevenant.com
Segata Sanshiro said:
Sex jokes and pop culture references are funny, though, and legitimately funny moments are something that are seriously underrepresented in gaming.

Sometimes it seems like game design is filled with people who take themselves and life too seriously, but I guess a lot of the fans are that way, too.
Yeah, but I dunno, that Alundra joke is really stretching it. Something like "You're lucky I give good rides, loverboy." would have worked better and maybe even gotten through? Who knows. I am thoroughly ignorant of WD's localizations. Alundra was an awful game that I couldn't get far into and most of their other stuff I missed the opportunity for.
 

vireland

Member
Jul 21, 2004
4,535
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0
IrishNinja said:
do you still have these about in a warehouse, or was it just an idea? cause if you're looking to unload a few, my ghaleon puppet has been lonely for years now.

It was never mass produced because it was intended for the PC version that didn't make release. Only 7 completed prototypes exist, and all of them are different. When I started garage cleaning project 1.0, I actually thought I'd sell maybe half of them since I don't need seven of them, but my reserve was like $1500 and it never got over that, so I just kept all seven. I also have the original molded heads (and the unproduced Borgan and Lucia puppet wax masters) to do a mass production, which is why I thought a PSP premium would be so boss, but...
 

Lindsay

Dot Hacked
Jul 21, 2004
7,840
1
0
Mineral Town
This "translation" was terrible. Jokes of that nature were kinda funny in Lunar but for MKR? Just awful! I played the game for the first time just after viewing the anime for the first time and that kind of stuff totally did not fit! I haven't played the game recently and being made to remember this stuff kinda makes me not want to play it again, which is a shame since its really good.

Shig said:
Mreh, not so much. I'll grant you that the number of its female fans in the US that actually had a Saturn was probably a pittance, though, so I don't think it was necessarily a misguided decision to skew the humor a bit towards boys. They just skewed it a bit too far.

That kind of thinking is what caused Sailor Moon, Card Captor Sakura, Tokyo Mew Mew, etc, to be butchered and why shoujo stuff is still more or less kept off the air in the US. -_-
 
Nov 17, 2006
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Koga, Ibaraki, Japan
vireland said:
It was never mass produced because it was intended for the PC version that didn't make release. Only 7 completed prototypes exist, and all of them are different. When I started garage cleaning project 1.0, I actually thought I'd sell maybe half of them since I don't need seven of them, but my reserve was like $1500 and it never got over that, so I just kept all seven. I also have the original molded heads (and the unproduced Borgan and Lucia puppet wax masters) to do a mass production, which is why I thought a PSP premium would be so boss, but...
Haha, Borgan would have been so bad-ass.
 

Sixfortyfive

He who pursues two rabbits gets two rabbits.
Dec 19, 2006
16,848
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1,450
vireland said:
Good lord. We did more than sexytime explosion jokes, but if you were reading this thread you'd never know it. There was a pretty good concentration of straight up funny and a fair amount of literary references to balance out the pop culture and sexy stuff!
True enough, true enough.

I only remember one dick joke in Dragon Force, and if I know my kana then I'm pretty sure that was in the original script anyway.
 

Shouta

Member
Jun 6, 2004
33,375
1,329
1,755
Lindsay said:
That kind of thinking is what caused Sailor Moon, Card Captor Sakura, Tokyo Mew Mew, etc, to be butchered and why shoujo stuff is still more or less kept off the air in the US. -_-

No, it's kept off the air because it isn't that popular here.
 

IrishNinja

Member
May 12, 2009
40,052
9
1,150
vireland said:
It was never mass produced because it was intended for the PC version that didn't make release. Only 7 completed prototypes exist, and all of them are different. When I started garage cleaning project 1.0, I actually thought I'd sell maybe half of them since I don't need seven of them, but my reserve was like $1500 and it never got over that, so I just kept all seven. I also have the original molded heads (and the unproduced Borgan and Lucia puppet wax masters) to do a mass production, which is why I thought a PSP premium would be so boss, but...

wow. prolly for the better; I cant say i wouldve treated a Borgan doll very well after the trauma that battle induced. one of the few times a victory caused me to yell loud enough to get the neighbors checking in. still, awesome knowing these things exist.
 

Regulus Tera

Romanes Eunt Domus
Mar 2, 2008
50,646
1
0
twitter.com
Shig said:
Ew, you bought Vay?

Wait, did they change the names in this translation too? In the source, their names were Umi, Fuu, and Hikaru.

I actually never knew their original names until now. I'm just calling them by what they were called in the Chilean dub.
 

Stop It

Perfectly able to grasp the inherent value of the fishing game.
Jan 19, 2007
8,926
1
0
Biggleswade, UK
WWW.neogaf.com
vireland said:
Okay, found it. This is the puzzle where you have to stand on Meia's head and let her carry you across a gap.

Here's the part where she's carrying you:



And this is what she originally said when she dropped you off on the other side:



We literally got calls from almost all the reviewers cracking up and saying "are you REALLY shipping with that in?" I was happy because I knew they actually were PLAYING the game they were reviewing to the end (becoming a rarity, even back then). We intended to leave it, but SCEA made us take it out. Only time that ever happened (besides the other exchange in this same game that was axed at the same time).
Aww, I can see why it had to be pulled, but :lol :lol :lol

To be frank, after seeing the stale, ultra clean translations of Square games over the years, proper, true to source stuff like the WD localisations just hit home just what most people missed.

Shame the Saturn utterly tanked in the UK, hardly anyone got to see this.
 

GhaleonEB

Member
Jun 7, 2004
77,906
3
1,490
Oregon
vireland said:
Good lord. We did more than sexytime explosion jokes, but if you were reading this thread you'd never know it. There was a pretty good concentration of straight up funny and a fair amount of literary references to balance out the pop culture and sexy stuff!
Nall's one-liner about the crushed jar of iced tea ("Ruthless bastards.") still cracks me up.
 

batbeg

Member
Dec 2, 2007
13,073
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835
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vireland said:
Still working on a PSN release...

You said this about Arc the Lad before as well, I think...

...so get Sony to fucking work on it, I want to play these games I never got to before :(
 

LegatoB

Member
Apr 9, 2006
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www.colonydrop.com
I enjoy a good localization -- a literal translation is always a bad one -- but frankly, all this thread has reminded me is that Saturn-era WD mistook "rewrite trite dialog to be entertaining" with "insert double entendres wherever possible." There's kind of a massive (heh, heh) difference between the two.

I mean, it sure didn't help that WD often picked total stinkers. I was almost relieved when I got to the PMS jokes in plot scenes, since that meant I could stop playing Albert Odyssey with no remorse.
 

Gestahl

Member
Dec 5, 2008
2,277
1
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Negator said:
WOW! This is amazing! :lol

Arc the Lad Collection is the only super duper collectible set I have from Working Designs. Still has the little buttons and everything.

I definitely remember that page.
 

ethelred

Member
Dec 19, 2005
16,019
1
1,525
vireland said:
Good lord. We did more than sexytime explosion jokes, but if you were reading this thread you'd never know it. There was a pretty good concentration of straight up funny and a fair amount of literary references to balance out the pop culture and sexy stuff!

(That Diek page almost got pulled by SCEA, but it made it - I love that double entendre)


Yeah, it's just that some of that stuff is more memorable. Like, the quality of the overall localizations is what made the biggest impression on people, I think, but in terms of specific lines that tend to stand out in the memory ten years later?

I'm glad the Diek page stayed. It's priceless. Part of why it works so well is that the context of the joke is so appropriate given the way the mechanics it's describing actually work.
 

Nekofrog

Banned
Nov 3, 2007
13,583
1
0
My only real problem with the localizations of WD games was the Bill Clinton and the Rock references (the latter case directly quoting the Rock with "Do you smell what the Rock is cookin'?!"). It'll be really tough to introduce some of these games to my kids when they have no idea who the Rock is.
 

Red Scarlet

Member
Jan 29, 2005
23,348
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I wanted to make random avatars from the game, but it has a scratch that makes the game lock up shortly after meeting Clef, so I can't until I get it resurfaced. :(

Damn you Hikaru version!
 

TheYanger

Member
Dec 24, 2008
11,742
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How could anyone hate Alundra? /boggle.
WD was one of the first companies I genuinely loved as a company. Their ads and games were always instantly recognizeable, and I was insanely jealous of anyone that had a Sega CD back when they were releasing stuff there.
I even remember playing the Warlords clone on the PSX Lunar a crapload, it was all so good.

People seem to get hung up on the localizations, but WD did so much more than just translate text and pack-in extras, the amount of dedication (Fixing bugs, improving interfaces, writing songs and stuff? C'mon).
Heck, if I'm not mistaken the original Alundra intro was....This?
And they turned it into basically into a fan video ?
Maybe I'm mistaken, my copy of ALundra was long since stolen :(

In fact...didn't you guys do some super user-friendly stuff with the game like, make all of the bosses deal more damage but have half as much life, since the original version had 30-40 minute boss fights or some garbage? I'd have to read the translation notes in the manual again.
 

Nose Master

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Mar 3, 2008
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Nekofrog said:
My only real problem with the localizations of WD games was the Bill Clinton and the Rock references (the latter case directly quoting the Rock with "Do you smell what the Rock is cookin'?!"). It'll be really tough to introduce some of these games to my kids when they have no idea who the Rock is.

Yeah cause, those two random NPCs are so integral to the plot. :lol
 
Nov 17, 2006
24,417
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Koga, Ibaraki, Japan
Nekofrog said:
My only real problem with the localizations of WD games was the Bill Clinton and the Rock references (the latter case directly quoting the Rock with "Do you smell what the Rock is cookin'?!"). It'll be really tough to introduce some of these games to my kids when they have no idea who the Rock is.
Well, unless you're showing them the SEGA CD version, you don't have to worry about the Clinton joke, and as for the Rock... well, I guess they'll miss that joke.
 
Jun 6, 2004
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goodcow said:
I don't understand why people liked Albert Odyssey. I own it and always found it to be boring. Same thing with Shining Wisdom.

Dragon Force/MKR are amazing though. I still need to buy a copy of Iron Storm some day.

im still sad we never got dragon force 2 in america
 
Jul 18, 2008
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Philadelphia
vireland said:
Still working on a PSN release...

Thank god. I've never been able to find a retail copy. :D

I remember I bought Lunar: SSSC the day it came out for PS1, and shortly thereafter it was stolen from my locker in school after someone returned it to me from borrowing it. I've never been able to fully deal with that loss.
 

BlazeHedgehog

Member
Sep 11, 2007
8,465
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www.bltn.net
I'm a fan of localization. I think there are a lot of games (and anime!) out there that try and preserve the original intent of the language they are translating from so much that no matter how much you try and "clean it up", it comes off as stilted, awkward, and unnatural. Word-for-word translations are bad news.

I think over-localization is definitely a slippery slope, though. On one hand, you have something like Samurai Pizza Cats, which to my understanding, had a good 75-80% of its dialog completely re-written from the ground-up for it's dub, and was definitely better off for it.

But at the same time, intentionally changing the tone of a translation bothers me on a principal level. The subjective nature of humor comes in to play, too - not everybody's in to fart jokes, after all. Censorship is also a big deal. On the flip side, adding vulgarity where there originally was none also bothers me.

Unfortunately, I only ever owned a single Working Designs game (Lunar SSSC) and I never got very far in to it because it was too difficult - and because it's Lunar, I couldn't just grind past the boss that was giving me trouble.
 

SovanJedi

provides useful feedback
Oct 20, 2006
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I came in here expecting another example of horrid translations and found lots of innuendo-filled text. Awesome!

Shame that "head" joke never made it in. I would never have known about its true meaning had I played this at the time it came out.
 
Nov 17, 2006
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Sega1991 said:
I'm a fan of localization. I think there are a lot of games (and anime!) out there that try and preserve the original intent of the language they are translating from so much that no matter how much you try and "clean it up", it comes off as stilted, awkward, and unnatural. Word-for-word translations are bad news.

I think over-localization is definitely a slippery slope, though. On one hand, you have something like Samurai Pizza Cats, which to my understanding, had a good 75-80% of its dialog completely re-written from the ground-up for it's dub, and was definitely better off for it.

But at the same time, intentionally changing the tone of a translation bothers me on a principal level. The subjective nature of humor comes in to play, too - not everybody's in to fart jokes, after all. Censorship is also a big deal. On the flip side, adding vulgarity where there originally was none also bothers me.

Unfortunately, I only ever owned a single Working Designs game (Lunar SSSC) and I never got very far in to it because it was too difficult - and because it's Lunar, I couldn't just grind past the boss that was giving me trouble.
Vulgarity fucking rules, dude. Er, cock dude. Er shit ass twat dude. Er... dude.

As for Samurai Pizza Cats, the number is closer to 100%. They actually didn't receive any of the soundtrack or scripts with the episodes when they licensed the English version, so they all just got drunk and wrote whatever they wanted to match the video. They actually directly refer to this in the opening credits.
 

HouseofGlass

Neo Member
Jan 10, 2009
38
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0
I really don't like the idea of showing so little respect to the original and so much respect to your own ability to tell a joke. Not that I have any problem with replacing a cultural joke with a localized joke. I just think if the original game was boring, the translated version should be boring too, since that's just what the game was. Actually changing the nature of the script so you can tell as many knee-slappers as the "clever guy" at the office can come up with is in my mind really insulting to the profession. It reeks more of a writer who wants to show the world how funny he/she is but couldn't make it any business that lets them in front of a microphone. The difference between translation and localization is a real gray area but I guess I personally would rather it be honest than an entertaining lie.

That being said, WD really did do a good job in everything else. Their translations were labors of love and that just didn't happen (and doesn't happen) that terribly often. And sure, my opinion boils down to personal taste, it's just something I feel strongly about.

Also: I am shouting into the whirlwind here but holy SHIT that Alundra joke is bad. I'm not even sure they can make jokes that childish in Japanese, and I say this knowing there's a comedian there made popular by counting funny.
 

EmCeeGramr

Member
Jun 25, 2005
38,451
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0
HouseofGlass said:
I'm not even sure they can make jokes that childish in Japanese, and I say this knowing there's a comedian there made popular by counting funny.
agreed. all hail to glorious nippon and its superior, sex-free humor.
 

RevenantKioku

PEINS PEINS PEINS PEINS PEINS PEINS PEINS PEINS PEINS PEINS PEINS PEINS oh god i am drowning in them
Jun 6, 2004
23,072
1
1,725
39
Nara, Japan
www.bookofrevenant.com
HouseofGlass said:
I'm not even sure they can make jokes that childish in Japanese, and I say this knowing there's a comedian there made popular by counting funny.
People will sometimes, when toasting, say "Let's say cheers in Itallian!" and then say "Chinchin" which means penis.
And by sometimes I mean I've heard it a lot. But what the fuck do I know, I talk to real Japanese people.
 

Llyranor

Member
May 17, 2006
12,169
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1,525
WD's localizations were great. Really enjoyed Lunar 1/2 (even if I didn't like the gameplay much), Vanguard Bandits, and Arc the Lad (1/2 missed some of the humor, but 3 largely made up for it).
ethelred said:
a host of 360 Cave shmups confirmed for GainjinWorks localization!
I'LL KILL YOU IF YOU DON'T
Segata Sanshiro said:
As for Samurai Pizza Cats, the number is closer to 100%. They actually didn't receive any of the soundtrack or scripts with the episodes when they licensed the English version, so they all just got drunk and wrote whatever they wanted to match the video. They actually directly refer to this in the opening credits.
And it was awesome for it!
 

Yaweee

Member
Feb 3, 2008
10,595
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0
Llyranor said:
WD's localizations were great. Really enjoyed Lunar 1/2 (even if I didn't like the gameplay much), Vanguard Bandits, and Arc the Lad (1/2 missed some of the humor, but 3 largely made up for it).

I remember one of the women in that commenting about getting sand in places that sand should most certainly not be.
 

Angelcurio

Member
Jul 18, 2006
3,196
59
1,510
Dominican Republic
vireland said:
Okay, found it. This is the puzzle where you have to stand on Meia's head and let her carry you across a gap.

Here's the part where she's carrying you:



And this is what she originally said when she dropped you off on the other side:



We literally got calls from almost all the reviewers cracking up and saying "are you REALLY shipping with that in?" I was happy because I knew they actually were PLAYING the game they were reviewing to the end (becoming a rarity, even back then). We intended to leave it, but SCEA made us take it out. Only time that ever happened (besides the other exchange in this same game that was axed at the same time).

I really loved Alundra. Who were the original devs of that game and what are they up to these days? also whyAlundra 2 is like a whole different game?

vireland said:
Still working on a PSN release...

I would buy a psn release on day one. So WD still have the rights of the us version, i hope it is release before years end.

Is it possible to ever see a proper sequel or remake of this game?

Sorry for the ocean of questions victor, i really love Alundra and those types of adventure games are a rarity these days.
 

Baloonatic

Member
Dec 5, 2008
4,465
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0
Angelcurio said:
I really loved Alundra. Who were the original devs of that game and what are they up to these days? also whyAlundra 2 is like a whole different game?



I would buy a psn release on day one. So WD still have the rights of the us version, i hope it is release before years end.

Is it possible to ever see a proper sequel or remake of this game?

Sorry for the ocean of questions victor, i really love Alundra and those types of adventure games are a rarity these days.

Matrix Software. They've recently worked on the Final Fantasy DS remakes. I don't know what the hell happened with Alundra 2, the original is my favourite game of all time so I couldn't have been more disappointed with the sequel.

The translation really is excellent, I'm kind of glad that too much stuff like that didn't make it's way in. Although I do remember a line about hemorrhoids...
 

charlequin

Banned
Oct 19, 2005
26,635
1
1,405
john tv said:
Alundra was such a great game.

Troo dat. Underrated gem of the PS1 library.

vireland said:
I was pushing for the Alex puppet to rise again as a premium with the PSP remake, but it wasn't to happen.

Segata's had a long week! Don't tease him like this. :(

vireland said:
Good lord. We did more than sexytime explosion jokes, but if you were reading this thread you'd never know it.

Well, these are the ones that stand out, if you will. :lol

I've been playing Eternal Blue Complete recently, and I actually keep being surprised by the vintage of some of the pop-culture gags. I would have figured the game came out too early to make a Harry Potter joke.

(and the unproduced Borgan and Lucia puppet wax masters)

Oh my god Borgan.

What would've been really amazing though is a Mystere puppet.

Angelcurio said:
also whyAlundra 2 is like a whole different game?

Made by a completely different developer. ISTR it might not even have actually been intended as an Alundra game originally.
 

eXistor

Member
Feb 22, 2006
14,515
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I've always loved WD's releases. I don't care if they're not the most accurate, they were very funny to me when I was younger and I think the majority of people that played the games back then were young enough to appreciate the sometimes crass humor.

On a related note, one of the games I've never played before was Alundra and I'm rectifying this as we speak. I got the game off of eBay last week and I've been playing it for the last few days. It's fucking great. It seems to have a fairly straight localization, but it certainly does the job. But the game itself is very high quality. Makes me realise that I miss pixelart pretty badly.
 
Jun 3, 2005
18,616
1
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Gaijinworks should publish Seven and Venus & Braves for a US release.

Just throwing that out there.

The only Working Designs games I ever purchased were RayStorm and RayCrisis. :/
 

Ledsen

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Mar 25, 2007
12,259
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RevenantKioku said:
People will sometimes, when toasting, say "Let's say cheers in Itallian!" and then say "Chinchin" which means penis.
And by sometimes I mean I've heard it a lot. But what the fuck do I know, I talk to real Japanese people.

I love when that happens :lol
 
Jun 11, 2005
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Whimsical Phil said:
Magic Knight Rayearth is a shojo manga/anime. It's intended for teenage girls. I don't read Japanese myself, and I haven't played the original, untranslated MKR Saturn game, but I can pretty much assure you that it didn't contain any felching jokes.

It's a CLAMP title, you can't be too sure.