• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
  • The Politics forum has been nuked. Please do not bring political discussion to the rest of the site, or you will be removed. Thanks.

|OT| |OT| Ray-Traced Games Discussion

VFXVeteran

Professional Victim (Vetted)
Nov 5, 2019
5,460
12,408
805
But Crysis remastered runs like shit does it not? It's not even better looking than modded versions of the original based on what I've seen.

It runs at a good 30FPS @ 4k with all options set to VERY HIGH and a few on "CAN IT RUN CRYSIS". Perfectly playable. The original version doesn't come close to the lighting/textures in the remaster.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Mister Wolf

Zathalus

Member
Jul 16, 2020
623
1,439
395
Crysis Remastered has great RT implementation, pity that it is fundamentally broken at the moment and based on a worse version of the original.
 

Rikkori

Member
May 9, 2020
2,424
4,488
425
Crysis Remastered really does look great, despite its shortcomings in some areas. Gives me hope for even better remasters for 2 & 3. And who knows - maybe by that time they'll be able to do a fully path-traced Crysis 4 if they find their balls again. :messenger_sunglasses:
 

Denton

Member
Mar 11, 2014
6,504
1,755
715
I dunno what the fuck you are smoking OP but you are completely, bizzarely wrong and should feel bad.

Metro, Control and Q2 are best raytracing showcases. Metro having bad art direction? Getouttahere
 
  • Like
Reactions: Redlancet

TheCockatrice

Member
Jun 16, 2019
2,856
5,657
620
It runs at a good 30FPS

 

Starfield

Member
Aug 13, 2015
5,070
6,869
915
Are you working at Crytek OP? I've heard Cloud Imperium Games is currently looking for developers, in case Crytek goes bust...just so you know
 
  • Like
Reactions: Redlancet

Night.Ninja

Banned
Feb 21, 2016
4,076
4,818
850
Only the DF thread.

Opinions and facts. What happened to that thread you was going to make with your opinions on both consoles games.
 

Trilobit

Member
Jun 15, 2015
257
183
410
I think it’s indisputably Minecraft. Regardless of how one feels about the art style, it is, by far, the most impressive, wide-ranging implementation I’ve seen.

The OP puts a game to each category (and generally, each game only does that category), but Minecraft seems to be doing it all, and more ambitiously than anything else. Which, it kind of helps when you look, in some ways, more primitive than an N64 game, but still. I think it’s a sneak peak at the future of the tech, when it’s not so restricted.


I'm not well versed in the intricacies of RT, but that Minecraft video at 24:35, in the room with different glass cubes, was delicious. Delicious like melted chocolate on a strawberry delicious.
 
  • Love
Reactions: -Arcadia-

LordOfChaos

Member
Mar 31, 2014
11,834
7,229
985
Exodus sold me on ray tracing more than any other game. Crysis Remastered somehow doesn't impress me so much, sure it looks great, but I dunno.
 
  • Like
Reactions: YawerhasPower

Redlancet

Banned
Jun 7, 2020
1,675
3,180
525
if anything this thread proves that anything vfsx says,do the contrary,crysys rtx is broken beyond belief
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Lethal01

Lethal01

Member
Jun 15, 2019
2,283
3,764
550
My favourite looking game with Raytracing is Battlefield.
If we are talking the one I feel benefits most from RT It would be a hard choice between Control and Metrod

That's about to change real quick though Ratchet and Clank: RIft Apart along with Demon's Souls has already blown everything else out of the water.
Just gotta wait a month for it to actually release but there's noway they could be downgraded enough to not look several times better than anything else we have right now.
 

VFXVeteran

Professional Victim (Vetted)
Nov 5, 2019
5,460
12,408
805
My favourite looking game with Raytracing is Battlefield.
If we are talking the one I feel benefits most from RT It would be a hard choice between Control and Metrod

That's about to change real quick though Ratchet and Clank: RIft Apart along with Demon's Souls has already blown everything else out of the water.
Just gotta wait a month for it to actually release but there's noway they could be downgraded enough to not look several times better than anything else we have right now.

We have to be careful when judging a game based on RT. I don't consider BF5 much of a contribution to RT because it only traces reflections. That barely takes up any of the overall games' visuals. The feature is thrown in sporadically and only appearing on certain assets.

A game can look better than a RT heavy game and not use RT at all. I don't want to turn this into a "Best graphics period" thread. The games you mention look great without RT reflections.
 

VysePSU

Member
May 9, 2019
4,328
9,327
1,030
I distinctly remember this and being able to see Mario reflected in it was in the original GameCube version too. Not sure if it's cube-mapping because I've never seen characters reflect in the mirrored images using the technique (only the background and at a lower resolution).
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: -Arcadia-

-Arcadia-

Banned
Aug 20, 2019
9,661
33,483
910
I distinctly remember this and being able to see Mario reflected in it was in the original GameCube version too. Not sure if it's cube-mapping because I've never seen characters reflect in the mirrored images using the technique (only the background and at a lower resolution).

I just posted it for a joke, as you can see from the spoiler text at the bottom. I don’t know what it is though, but those are actually some crazy reflections.
 
  • Like
Reactions: KyoShiRo330

mindfreak191

Member
Jun 1, 2013
563
561
815
Phew, good thing there's no poll option so that everyone here can prove you wrong...I'm sorry, but Metro Exodus RT GI is way better than the one in Crysis remastered.
 

VysePSU

Member
May 9, 2019
4,328
9,327
1,030
I just posted it for a joke, as you can see from the spoiler text at the bottom. I don’t know what it is though, but those are actually some crazy reflections.
I know but I've always been curious about it. There were some other games that utilized the same dynamic mirrored reflections like Bully, Hitman 2, maybe Splinter Cell: Chaos Theory, but it was always one small part of the level. Anyway, I wonder if VFXVeteran VFXVeteran knows what I'm talking about.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: -Arcadia-

VFXVeteran

Professional Victim (Vetted)
Nov 5, 2019
5,460
12,408
805
Phew, good thing there's no poll option so that everyone here can prove you wrong...I'm sorry, but Metro Exodus RT GI is way better than the one in Crysis remastered.

Way better how? I have both games and have examined them extensively.
 

VFXVeteran

Professional Victim (Vetted)
Nov 5, 2019
5,460
12,408
805
I know but I've always been curious about it. There were some other games that utilized the same dynamic mirrored reflections like Bully, Hitman 2, maybe Splinter Cell; Chaos Theory, but it was always one small part of the level. Anyway, I'm curious if VFXVeteran VFXVeteran knows what I'm talking about.

Rerender the scene to texture. Pretty simple.
 
  • Like
Reactions: -Arcadia-
May 8, 2020
3,833
9,299
640
All of those games are using just reflections for RT. They can stand alone on their own merits with SSR.

Clearly if you are going for a pure technical interpretation of that then Minecraft with full-path ray tracing would be at the top. But your thread clearly says "Best looking Ray Traced Game" Those will apply and take the graphics crown easily.
 
Last edited:

VFXVeteran

Professional Victim (Vetted)
Nov 5, 2019
5,460
12,408
805
Clearly if you are going for a pure technical interpretation of that then Minecraft with full-path ray tracing would be at the top. But your thread clearly says "Best looking Ray Traced Game" Those will apply and take the crown easily.

Minecraft could go up there because it's using RT heavily. The last 3 games I mentioned were using 1 feature from RT - hardly a significant impact to the overall look of the game. I mentioned them for completeness. If you plan on crowning those games as the best looking just because they have RT reflections in them and could stand alone without using it - it's a little disingenuous.
 

VFXVeteran

Professional Victim (Vetted)
Nov 5, 2019
5,460
12,408
805
I was wondering if it had a name. It reminds me of ray-tracing but at a much lower resolution.

Yea, it's really a trick. What's sad is that most of the RT reflections in the newer games will look no different - and yet, that's not how RT reflections look in the realworld because most materials are not complete mirrors. Water puddles and mirrors are OK for it, but putting it on metal and other objects will look wrong.
 
May 8, 2020
3,833
9,299
640
Minecraft could go up there because it's using RT heavily. The last 3 games I mentioned were using 1 feature from RT - hardly a significant impact to the overall look of the game. I mentioned them for completeness. If you plan on crowning those games as the best looking just because they have RT reflections in them and could stand alone without using it - it's a little disingenuous.

It's not disingenous when the end goal is to improve the visual fidelity and quality of the game. Ray-tracing is not implemented as a purity technical contest, it has a purpose - which is to improve visual fidelity. To imply otherwise is what's disingenuous. Those games would then qualify as an example of smartly choosing and managing techniques and budgets constraints, old and new, including ray tracing, with the end goal of improving overall visual fidelity and delivering the best graphics possible.
 
Last edited:

VFXVeteran

Professional Victim (Vetted)
Nov 5, 2019
5,460
12,408
805
It's not disingenous when the end goal is to improve the visual quality of the game. Ray tracing is not implemented as a purity contest, it has a purpose - which is to improve visual fidelity. To imply otherwise is what's disingenuous.

Yes, it does improve visual fidelity when using it with several rendering algorithms - not just reflections. The games you mentioned will only apply to various props that wont even take up 10% of the world. The visual fidelity of water or mirrors? That doesn't make a relevant impact in the game's visuals - and that's not an opinion. If you went SSR in either of those games you menioned, they would still have great visual fidelity. But I digress. I can tell I'm about to waste my time trying to explain.
 

-Arcadia-

Banned
Aug 20, 2019
9,661
33,483
910
On the Sunshine thing, that’s neat. I’m used to the thing, where like in MGS2, they’d just render the entire scene twice and use one of the scenes as the ‘reflection’ (thank you DF). I guess this is that, but straight to a texture, explaining its different look.

It’s obvious why SSR took over, as that seems way less expensive, but it’s kind of ironic that this GameCube game, alongside others, is doing stuff that we wouldn’t see again until ray-tracing.

It’s kind of crazy to sit on the Sunshine mirror, and see off-screen objects, even ones behind you, rendered with no problem, on such ancient hardware. Or look into the Bianco Hills water and see the entire tower reflected at just the right angle. I’m sure there’s stuff missing (I can actually spot a few minor details), and the mirror stuff (the water was cool) was really low-res in the GC version, but it’s just neat.
 
Last edited:
May 8, 2020
3,833
9,299
640
Yes, it does improve visual fidelity when using it with several rendering algorithms - not just reflections. The games you mentioned will only apply to various props that wont even take up 10% of the world. The visual fidelity of water or mirrors? That doesn't make a relevant impact in the game's visuals - and that's not an opinion. If you went SSR in either of those games you menioned, they would still have great visual fidelity. But I digress. I can tell I'm about to waste my time trying to explain.

You're right in that you should not waste your time. It's clear to me you're creating caveats and criteria on the fly to leave certain games out of the discussion. The overall argument and point is clear and reasonable. Ray-tracing as a technique is a mathematical algorithm used to more acurately portray bounce lighting. The end goal is improving visual fidelity and realism. Those games I mentioned use Ray-tracing as well as other techniques to reach that end goal of improving visual fidelity while working under hardware contraints. Each developer weights the costs of each technique in their overall mix as they search for the optimal visual fidelity output relative to performance in their games. The end result is what ultimately matters. If you wanted to discuss purity, you could have worded your thread title differently, including your OP, to better describe your criteria of what counts and doesn't count. Definitely, in my opinion, not |OT| worthy under those arbitrary personal conditions.
 
Last edited:

Closer

Member
Nov 19, 2018
654
633
325
Brazil
You're right in that you should not waste your time. It's clear to me you're creating caveats and criteria on the fly to leave certain games out of the discussion. The overall argument and point is clear and reasonable. Ray-tracing as a technique is a mathematical algorithm used to more acurately portray bounce lighting. The end goal is improving visual fidelity and realism. Those games I mentioned use Ray-tracing as well as other techniques to reach that end goal of improving visual fidelity while working under hardware contraints. Each developer weights the costs of each technique in their overall mix as they search for the optimal visual fidelity output relative to performance in their games. The end result is what ultimately matters. If you wanted to discuss purity, you could have worded your thread title differently, including your OP, to better describe your criteria of what counts and doesn't count. Definitely, in my opinion, not |OT| worthy under those arbitrary personal conditions.

I mean, this is a subjective thread as OP said, but you clearly missed the "uses RTX heavily" part.
 
Last edited:

VysePSU

Member
May 9, 2019
4,328
9,327
1,030
Yea, it's really a trick. What's sad is that most of the RT reflections in the newer games will look no different - and yet, that's not how RT reflections look in the realworld because most materials are not complete mirrors. Water puddles and mirrors are OK for it, but putting it on metal and other objects will look wrong.
Here's an example of what I mean:



Similar to the Super Mario Sunshine example, you see your character and others reflected in the mirrored image. But in newer games they went with cube-mapping which, to me, felt like they were taking a step back because you no longer saw characters reflected, only the environment, and it looked "off". But now with RTX the mirrored reflections in games start to look normal again, like a more fully-realized version of what we saw during the PS2/Xbox/GameCube era of games.
 
Last edited:
May 8, 2020
3,833
9,299
640
I mean, this is a subjective thread as OP said, but you clearly missed the "uses RTX heavily" part.

I didn't miss that. I also read this:

So I've played the new Crysis Remastered and thought I would open up a thread for comparing and contrasting current games using RT and see what opinions people have on which one looks the best at this current time (no future games should be compared unless they have been released). This thread is purely subjective although any objective tech comments are welcome.

What is it about the games I mentioned having Ray-tracing and qualifying not a subjective take? Specially when considering the purpose of Ray-tracing as a technique, and the end goal - which is to improve visual fidelity and realism. All the developers of those 3 games have all decided what's best for them in terms of technique mix - the end result being what's judged.

Unless only OP's subjective take qualifies but then why call it an |OT| if that were the case?. Which again goes back to my comment of needing clarification by OP in that regard.
 
Last edited:
May 8, 2020
3,833
9,299
640
Having it is not Using it heavily.
So?

OP literally has 2-3 games on his comparison list that are in line with Miles Morales, Demon Souls Remake and Godfall. He could make a big fat disclaimer on his thread, but it would be a far cry of an OT (in name only), and only filled with ugly ass games trading their budgets for purity. It all circles back to the point I made any way it's spun.
 
Last edited: