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Pach-Attack!

Owzers

Member
Mar 10, 2005
25,345
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0
Dedication Through Light said:
No one ever presents alternatives for how to monetize those hours of online play, lol. Or at least I havent seen any
I think what publishers don't want to talk about is the fact that a healthy online base for a game encourages future sales. No one wants to buy a game 6 months after release if the online community is dead. If there is not a huge amount of people playing your game online then you also won't have anyone to sell map packs or trinkets to.
 
Dec 1, 2004
26,791
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South Carolina
www.neogaf.com
Dedication Through Light said:
No one ever presents alternatives for how to monetize those hours of online play, lol. Or at least I havent seen any
Something that isn't spawned from conversations similar in vein to this:

Well, the problem is that ignorant investors will listen to this guy's comments and will start bringing it up to these companies as if its the right thing to do. Then, all of a sudden, it won't just me Michael saying "It's crazy these guys get to play these games online for free!" it will be your favorite publisher CEO of game director.
There's something seriously wrong and unsustainable with the industry when even stones gushing blood are squeezed this intently and wishfully for even more blood.
 

szaromir

Banned
Apr 26, 2006
14,216
0
1,125
Dedication Through Light said:
No one ever presents alternatives for how to monetize those hours of online play, lol. Or at least I havent seen any
Last time I checked games cost $60. There goes your monetization (+map packs further down the road)
 

yurinka

Member
Jan 19, 2007
10,962
1,772
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Barcelona, Spain
www.capcom-town.es
Dedication Through Light said:
No one ever presents alternatives for how to monetize those hours of online play, lol. Or at least I havent seen any
There are some sucessful monetization examples in free MMOs(mainly in Asia) and Facebook (worldwide). But Patcher doesn't know how this market works.

They (or well, we) make a shit ton of money, and even without paying $60+ to start playing the game.

The main idea is to release the full game free, designed to play at least quick plays of some minutes frequently during a long period of time. And then to put a shit ton of cheap DLC to skip all these time of level up / gold farming to be able to purchase certain game items using the game currency.

And also to sell some paid only items that gives you some exclusive features in the game. In addition to that, reward people for inviting their friends to play the game.

Only a small portion of people pay to play, so it make sense as monetization system when you handle it sucessfully to get a shit ton of players. And a tiny portion of gamers will spend a shit ton of money in the game.

The Activision approach will fail if they are going to make you pay $70+ for the game + suscription + extra $ for DLC. Console install base is so limited when comparing to Facebook and non-high end PCs, the $70+ and suscription is a huge barrier for most people, and don't have a proper method to know if a user invited to play the game to another.
 

michaelpachter

He speaks, and we freak
Jan 24, 2007
160
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I suppose I'm really talking about converting the games into a service model. You buy the single player game, and maybe get some multiplayer as part of the price, but accessing value added services will cost you. For example, ladders, achievements, tournaments and virtual goods will cost money. The car analogy, as lame as it is, can even be defeated by pointing out that you must pay a license fee and must pay for fuel. The more you drive, the more gasoline costs, and some states (California, for example) require proof of insurance. So you can't drive your car as much as you want "for free".

I think that the better analogy is the cell phone, PC or TV. All are far more useful with "subscriptions" (to cell phone service, Internet access or cable). If you want premium content on the TV, you pay more for HBO, for example. Activision will sell you the equivalent of broadcast TV, but will charge you for the extra services.

I am not advocating that Activision or anyone else charge for multiplayer, nor do I think that shareholder pressure will increase because I mentioned it. I am merely basing my opinion on an educated guess as to what Activision will do, based upon recent statements by their CEO and COO, and based upon past behavior. It is really foolish to think that they haven't thought of this before, and equally foolish to think that they would adopt a subscription model because I predicted it. Just as foolish as believing that Iwata will authorize a Wii HD because I predicted it (over two years ago) ;-)

The open questions are when and how much. My guess is that they will try an a la carte payment plan, with a subscription giving you access to everything, but of course, I could be wrong.
 

chubigans

y'all should be ashamed
Dec 7, 2006
27,115
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www.vertigogaming.net
I definitely see Activision doing something like that. It doesn't make sense not to.

I kinda think the next generation of consoles will have subscription plans built in a bit better...so that you have your EA pass, your Activision pass and so on built right into the OS. But who knows.
 

Tmac

Member
Dec 26, 2006
819
1
880
I tend to agree with patcher, something gotta change, because the currently scenario of a ever increasing used games market combined with longer game experiences because of online play is a huge problem for game companies.
 

thirty

Banned
Sep 23, 2005
6,505
0
0
looked more like an independent chain. 360s were there. and is his wife someone famous? he's like "these 13 year olds arent going to know who you are"
 

Wag

Member
Mar 23, 2008
14,324
128
1,200
www.cs.helsinki.fi
thirty said:
looked more like an independent chain. 360s were there. and is his wife someone famous? he's like "these 13 year olds arent going to know who you are"
I doubt she's famous. I guess she just wanted privacy. Now whether he seriously considers his main audience made up of 13 and 14 yr olds is more interesting...
 

Dennis

Banned
Jul 7, 2009
46,556
1
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Wag said:
I doubt she's famous. I guess she just wanted privacy. Now whether he seriously considers his main audience made up of 13 and 14 yr olds is more interesting...
All those kids saw Pachters Porsche and his sweet game room and now they all want to be games analysts when they grow up. Pachter, what have you done!
 

Cynar

Member
Sep 18, 2007
5,935
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0
Canada
Fularu said:
Once you buy your car, the manufacturer has no more costs related to it. When you buy "Online game xxx with servers provided by publisher YYY" your game still costs money to maintain for the publisher.

Your analogy really doesn't work. Also car manufacturers sell maintainance packages when you buy a car :p (that covers more than the base insurance obviously)
Except that's only for MMO's or when they provide dedicated servers. Games that are just matchmaking with peer 2 peer don't fit that. Companies like activision with MW that want to monetize multiplayer and people who don't know any better would fall for it.
 

chubigans

y'all should be ashamed
Dec 7, 2006
27,115
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1,290
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That was awesome. I've been waiting for this. :D

While I do love the Pach I hope they get some more interesting questions to ask. It's been pretty basic stuff these last few times.
 

Draft

Member
Mar 30, 2005
18,402
2
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Pachter's crib :lol

Pachter's awesome.

It's probably about 3-3.5 years old (can't be older, didn't work at GT then). It's an independent store in LA.
Whatever you say, man. I'm not gonna load the video again but I seem to remember them moving a lot of Gamecubes and there being like used N64 games on the walls.
 

p01ar

GameTrailers
Mar 8, 2005
860
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38
Los Angeles, Ca
www.gametrailers.com
Draft said:
Pachter's crib :lol

Pachter's awesome.

Whatever you say, man. I'm not gonna load the video again but I seem to remember them moving a lot of Gamecubes and there being like used N64 games on the walls.
It's a used video game store, they also have a bunch of NES games, but that doesn't mean the footage is from the 80s.
 

Draft

Member
Mar 30, 2005
18,402
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p01ar said:
It's a used video game store, they also have a bunch of NES games, but that doesn't mean the footage is from the 80s.
In spite of what I said, I did go back and watch a few seconds of it. That cannot be a Gamestop from 2007, I just don't believe it. I saw a Halo 3 poster, and maybe a GTA4 poster too, but there's a wall of Xbox games. Not Xbox 360, Xbox. They had rows of SNES cartridges. It must be a mish mash of old stock footage and some new stuff. Why don't you get to the bottom of this?
 

Dennis

Banned
Jul 7, 2009
46,556
1
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Draft said:
In spite of what I said, I did go back and watch a few seconds of it. That cannot be a Gamestop from 2007, I just don't believe it. I saw a Halo 3 poster, and maybe a GTA4 poster too, but there's a wall of Xbox games. Not Xbox 360, Xbox. They had rows of SNES cartridges. It must be a mish mash of old stock footage and some new stuff. Why don't you get to the bottom of this?
:lol
 

p01ar

GameTrailers
Mar 8, 2005
860
0
0
38
Los Angeles, Ca
www.gametrailers.com
Draft said:
In spite of what I said, I did go back and watch a few seconds of it. That cannot be a Gamestop from 2007, I just don't believe it. I saw a Halo 3 poster, and maybe a GTA4 poster too, but there's a wall of Xbox games. Not Xbox 360, Xbox. They had rows of SNES cartridges. It must be a mish mash of old stock footage and some new stuff. Why don't you get to the bottom of this?
time travel explains it all
 

Wag

Member
Mar 23, 2008
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Pachter, you have a nice house, a nice life, nobody cares. Now everyone knows where you live.

What the hell was that all about? :lol
 

Master

Banned
Apr 22, 2005
339
0
0
Seattle
What a bunch of haters. I loved the cribs segment.

I can honestly say Pach is one of the main reasons I visit gametrailers.com
 

clip

Member
Aug 20, 2008
1,723
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805
Master said:
What a bunch of haters. I loved the cribs segment.

I can honestly say Pach is one of the main reasons I visit gametrailers.com
But why? He's arrogant and consistently wrong in his analysis and predictions of gaming announcements and software sales.
 

Master

Banned
Apr 22, 2005
339
0
0
Seattle
clip said:
But why? He's arrogant and consistently wrong in his analysis and predictions of gaming announcements and software sales.
It is fun to watch. I don't rely on him or anybody else for reliable analysis so I can buy stock or manage a fund, but that doesn't make his opinions less interesting. Should I only be allowed to enjoy it if I agree with him, or if I think he is always right? Who cares? Not I.

I watch it because it is fun.
 

ZealousD

Makes world leading predictions like "The sun will rise tomorrow"
Apr 17, 2007
29,342
1
0
Certainly, if any company has a chance of entering the crowded game market, it's going to be Apple. I used to think that it might have been Dell a few years ago, but with the success of gaming on the iPhone, I think that Apple is going to look at using at doing a video game console as their next major consumer product, and give it a "magic box" focus. Internet capabilities, media playback, integrated Apple TV, etc.

Now Pachter's right that Apple doesn't really have any internal game studios atm, but that's nothing a couple acquisitions can't fix. I mean, what did Microsoft really have before they acquired Rare? Age of Empires and Flight Simulator?

Don't agree with Pachter that they're going to try the iPhone model for their first console though. Apple's smarter then that.
 

DaBuddaDa

Member
Sep 12, 2004
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A four console world is unsustainable. It's never, ever gonna happen in the traditional sense.
 

faridmon

Member
Dec 6, 2008
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I am sure Pach is alright chap in real life and i respect the work he does for the industry, But his views on the whole industry is very wrong.

I really wonder why some poeple enjoy his shows...
 

Wag

Member
Mar 23, 2008
14,324
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faridmon said:
I am sure Pach is alright chap in real life and i respect the work he does for the industry, But his views on the whole industry is very wrong.

I really wonder why some poeple enjoy his shows...
I enjoy seeing someone closer to my own age who's a gamer sharing his opinions, and I'm sure a lot of people share that view. I think people tend to forget that gamers tend to skew a wide range of ages (I'm in my 40s and grew up with games). The >40 gamer is far under represented.
 

Draft

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Mar 30, 2005
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DaBuddaDa said:
A four console world is unsustainable. It's never, ever gonna happen in the traditional sense.
An Apple console won't be traditional. It will be AppleTV with an App Store that only has "AppleTV compatible" games on it.
 

shwimpy

Member
Oct 20, 2009
10,364
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0
ZealousD said:
Now Pachter's right that Apple doesn't really have any internal game studios atm, but that's nothing a couple acquisitions can't fix. I mean, what did Microsoft really have before they acquired Rare? Age of Empires and Flight Simulator?
They still don't have much of anything, lost Bungie and Rare went to shit... yet they're doing pretty damn well.
 

qwerty2k

Member
Oct 11, 2007
903
0
0
Draft said:
An Apple console won't be traditional. It will be AppleTV with an App Store that only has "AppleTV compatible" games on it.
have you seen Apple's new AirPlay? soon new iPhones and iPod touches will be nearly as powerful as PS3/360, you can game on the go, come home and hit AirPlay button and have the game running from your iPhone streamed to your tv etc, i think thats the way Apple gets into the gaming industry.
 

itsgreen

Member
Mar 28, 2007
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qwerty2k said:
have you seen Apple's new AirPlay? soon new iPhones and iPod touches will be nearly as powerful as PS3/360, you can game on the go, come home and hit AirPlay button and have the game running from your iPhone streamed to your tv etc, i think thats the way Apple gets into the gaming industry.
well no.

nowhere near that yet.

the resolution and overall fidelity of home consoles is not within reach yet...

iPhone is currently at 960x640 I believe so that is still quite a way from the 1280x720 or 1920x1080

An Apple console would cater to the casual games like Zuma or something
 

Fuzzy

I would bang a hot farmer!
Jan 11, 2005
31,107
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I really think Apple has to expand the iPhone->iPad connectivity for games. Watching Victor Lucas use his iPhone to control Chopper 2 on his iPad while it outputs the video to a TV was extremely cool.
 

qwerty2k

Member
Oct 11, 2007
903
0
0
itsgreen said:
well no.

nowhere near that yet.

the resolution and overall fidelity of home consoles is not within reach yet...

iPhone is currently at 960x640 I believe so that is still quite a way from the 1280x720 or 1920x1080

An Apple console would cater to the casual games like Zuma or something
by soon i mean the next 2-3 years, which even carmack has said is likely.
 

offshore

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May 26, 2009
8,292
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Apple is a great company
Give me a break. What kind of company only lets people who are on Macs watch their live stream? What kind of company tells people how to hold their phone? What kind of company then attempts to drag other companies into a problem of thier own creation by highlighting them at their conference?

Apple are the worst kind of company.
 

shwimpy

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Oct 20, 2009
10,364
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offshore said:
Give me a break. What kind of company only lets people who are on Macs watch their live stream? What kind of company tells people how to hold their phone? What kind of company then attempts to drag other companies into a problem of thier own creation by highlighting them at their conference.
If you don't have a mac/ipod/ipad/iphone, why do you care about the conference showing more of the same product?

They said they were sorry and gave everyone a free bumper to fix the issue.

EVERY COMPANY.

Sounds like you have a problem with a company you don't even care about.
 

MedIC86

Member
Sep 5, 2009
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Netherlands
Well Apple can and probarly will try, but imo they will fail...
hipster douchebags cannot take there apple console with them in there pocket showing everyone what they have