Guilty_AI
Member
Ever heard of V-sync? Adaptive V-sync? The ones in the graphics card control panel, not the shit some devs usually implement in their games.
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Pc is a strong platform, because it doesnt need next gen hardware
kingfey
Banned
Dlss is only exclusive to nvidia cards. New gen hardware is AMD based. So they wont get it. This system is only exclusive to RTX cards from 20s series and 30s series. Its their way of saying, buy our new cards, and Fk you. While AMD has their own system, which supports even the GT1060.
Same thing as how DX12 would be mainly exclusive to Windows 11. MS said they would put it on windows 10. But I expect the full package to be fully exclusive to windows 11.
squarealex
Member
And Fallout 3 not run on W10 + Old game need bug fixe for modern harware... You spent more time to research for working it instead of playing it
Can't run some game requires DX11 or DX12 with a DX9-10 GPU.
Yeah sure... until your CPU Limited for some game, or low memory bandwich (DDR3 low speed can cause many stuttering). Spoiler alert : You need to change motherboard...
wat
Games won't die, but game can be delisted on the store
Hey check mate, I have 300 games on Steam, but i'm playing every evening TF2/DOTA2/LOL/PUBG/R6S/Fortnite/Warezone/Destiny
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tmlDan
Member
Guilty_AI
Member
it literally takes a minute to activate v-sync on the control panel. So much pain.
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Md Ray
Member
kingfey
when more devs like 4A Games start to require minimum RDNA 2 and RTX GPUs for their engines, will you still be saying that "no next gen hardware is needed"?Because we're absolutely moving in that direction. Once the cross-gen period is over, and devs stop developing for PS4 and XB1, we'll definitely see devs abandoning GTX-based systems very soon.
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tmlDan
Member
yes because games should automatically work when I buy it I shouldn't have to find solutions because most devs suck at making PC games....especially when my PC is top of the line, common now don't be silly.
DeltaPolarBear
Member
PC IS next gen hardware. All the time.
It's just that ever since console gaming took over, majority of games are made with Console hardware as the base. it isn't that PC doesn't care about being cutting edge, there is just no money in targeting the cutting edge.
There was a time when it was a selling point that a new PC game needed you to upgrade your computer to run. "Look at this game! it must be REAL pretty if I need a new computer to run it!"
But at this point we have people over the age of 18 who never remember that at all. They only ever remembered console games ported to PC. Market realities means games are just not made to push PC hardware.
It's just that ever since console gaming took over, majority of games are made with Console hardware as the base. it isn't that PC doesn't care about being cutting edge, there is just no money in targeting the cutting edge.
There was a time when it was a selling point that a new PC game needed you to upgrade your computer to run. "Look at this game! it must be REAL pretty if I need a new computer to run it!"
But at this point we have people over the age of 18 who never remember that at all. They only ever remembered console games ported to PC. Market realities means games are just not made to push PC hardware.
kingfey
Banned
this is fallout 3.
DOS, Amiga, IBM PC: 4 Ways to Run Old Games on Your Modern PC
Want to play retro computer games on Windows 10 or 11? The older a game is, the less likely it is to work right out of the box on a new PC. These tricks can help.
That doesnt effect the PC games. Its only you, and you will have to upgrade your system. The games are still there. Any external system, are the users responsibility. All pc does is hold the games for you. You dont need a mod to access them. Just like upgrading from ps4 to ps5. Both play the same game. Just the other is superior at it. But they are still the same game. Unlike ps3 to ps4. Despite ps4 being stronger than ps3, it cant play its games.
If the dev is still alive, they will get paid. Its the same thing Xbox is doing with OG xbox games, which you can on their store. Those money will go to the devs. Unlike Ps1-ps3 games, which are lost on those systems, and no one can buy them digitally for ps4 or ps5.
That is why we have a guy with a hat and a ship. He secures every game in the world.
Guilty_AI
Member
You were complaining about stutters just now, what do i do to fix the stuttering mess that is bloodborne on the base ps4?
It doesn't work as it should neither automatically nor manually. So much for curated experiences.
Not the only game i had problems either. For all the complaints about Nier Automata PC port, ps4 versions runs even worse, and theres no way to fix it.
kingfey
Banned
How long will those graphics be expensive? Would they not be able to play past games?
Because we're absolutely moving in that direction. Once the cross-gen period is over, and devs stop developing for PS4 and XB1, we'll definitely see devs abandoning GTX-based systems very soon.
The entire point of pc. is that games wont get lost.
The only way PC can change, is IF MS changed the windows OS, and made past pc gaming useless. Like ps2 to ps3 cell system to ps4.
Your first point is describing Ps5. It can run also run Ps4 games.
Until all devs used those system, people will still play on their old devices. and upgrade their graphics when they have to. But that still wont change PC at all.
ethomaz
Banned
It progress is carried by minimum specs that increase over time.
Sure it hardware minimum increase very slow and perhaps the top end hardware is very underutilized for years.
But old hardware will end not playing new games anymore.
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Optimus Lime
(L3) + (R3) | Spartan rage activated
If you're 'touching capacitors and what not', PC gaming definitely isn't for you. Stick to the consoles, son.
abstract alien
Member
Aren't current cards alone more expensive than the next gen systems themselves?
Rickyiez
Member
PC is awesome for those who loves tinkering , like me . I love modding or even adjusting AA solution until I get the sharpest possible image quality with the best performance possible . However I do understand certain technical issue could be frustrating for average users . There was once I was helping my friend adjusting the gpu scaling for Dead to Daylight for an hour just because the game doesn't support proper ultrawide properly .
EDMIX
Member
This.
PC needs upgrades to play the latest games just like console needs them.
I have no clue where this fucking myth came from that its just this eternal thing that um "doesn't need next gen hardware". If the logic is one can just play older games and choose not to upgrade...one can still fucking play a Gamecube, its a moot point.
Even the bullshit like "play on lowest settings" thats not a fucking thing in which you can just play forever all games with this mind set.
Over time, developers move on, they'll require DX features, only support certain cards etc.
I have a few builds that are older that are just used for home theater stuff, but thats like me fucking saying my HD 5770 build or my 8800gtx build will play Starfield or Elder Scrolls 6, no upgrade needed broz
yea, you have to do work arounds to get games to run properly. You can try to minimize this point as much as you can, but this is simply something that doesn't need to be done on other platforms to the same degree. As someone that games on both PC and console, I enjoy knowing that when I put a game in a console or handheld, it works.... I don't need to do several things and google and research how to get the product I fucking paid money for to actually work.
So I don't mind PC game as to why I still game on PC, but lets stop pretending thats not an issue or some positive thing to waste fucking time fixing the developers game and giving them free labor on reddit on how the game can work on certain builds. I don't know who is seeing that as some positive. As if someone wants to spend the night they first download a game they are hype to play, on reddit trying to see if V sync is fucking their game up or not to address blue screens and white screens and hard crashes and shit lol PC has many positives, lets highlight that vs trying to defend such a concept.
^^^
Modular hardware is a double edge sword. The ability to have the most powerful hardware doesn't mean developers care to actually optimize it for your exact build. Having a $5K PC doesn't magically make Arkham Knight work lol
Rickyiez
THIS! Thank you! Thats such a common thing in PC gaming to, you play a new game and you have to keep tinkering and adjusting things. I literally have note pads for many games with shit like "turn off V sync" or "turn off AA" or turn this program on or off etc. When you have shit like XONE X or PS4 Pro or even better Series X and the majority of 3rd party AAA are no longer solely on PC, it makes it easy to have the platform as an option. Hardware exist to play at 4K without all the fucking shit involved with PC.
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Optimus Lime
(L3) + (R3) | Spartan rage activated
EDMIX
Member
Excess
Member
Optimus Lime
(L3) + (R3) | Spartan rage activated
EDMIX
Member
EDMIX
Member
I started to read, but as your whining intensified, this truth offered itself to me:
Its hard to make much of a debate when you have users that own both that are bringing up many valid issues...
Soooo I feel its easier for you to just be like "i can't read" or but you was "whining" as its very hard to argue against those facts about the platform. Your own comments don't help when you are telling people to simp, shill, research and troubleshoot for the publisher to get their game to work that you paid for. Apparently you also paid to beta test and do free testing for them =)
I mean shit, whats your argument going to be? Come on bro, you just have to do the work of the developer for free and find out what the problems are for them to get it to work right, no big deal /s
Its easier to just be like "oh shit, ummmm...i can't read, tldr and or whining" (jumps under bed) lol
To this day I'm not sure. Just random blue screens.
Optimus Lime
(L3) + (R3) | Spartan rage activated
What would you like me to debate you on? Tell you what. Give me five bullet points. Not a wall of incoherent rambling. Just five, succinct bullet points that you'd like me to respond to, respectfully, and I'll respond in kind.
EDMIX
Member
I'm saying! I need one, but will settle for a 3080.
EDMIX
Member
tldr =)
Optimus Lime
(L3) + (R3) | Spartan rage activated
Okay, well - I'm not sure what you want from me. I'm not going to parse your walls of idiotic rambling. I gave you an opportunity to talk about this in a rational way, if you can't, or won't, then put me on ignore. As I said already:
Guilty_AI
Member
I think his point is, if taking a minute to change a bunch of settings or downloading some fix from the net to play an old game is too much for you, then pc gaming might not be for you.
Also, on your previous post:
This is a fucking lie. One of the major reasons i left console gaming is precisely because games there don't always work as they should.
And the worst thing is you can't even try to fix it yourself, you have to just suck it up and play in whatever way the devs make you, assuming the game isn't completely broken. Or maybe pray for the console gods for some patch.
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EDMIX
Member
Don't know what you are talking about as I own a gaming PC.... I have built them for decades bud, the point isn't to argue some either or, simply pointing out those issues that exist.
I literally played hundreds of games last gen on PS4, only 1 game crashed dozens of times and was many times unplayable regardless of workarounds and that was Cyberpunk 2077.
So...you can't tell me what I'm playing is a "lie" based on you. That sucks it happened that way for you, but I have not had much issues with handheld or consoles in regards to a game not playing and needing many workarounds. That is simply more common on PC, even your own fucking post is confirming this when you say "some fix from the net to play an old game", buddy...that is happening with almost all games to some degree on PC, not simply an old game here and there.
Just replayed Resident Evil 2 remake on PS4, no crash, no workaround, no blue screen etc
So you "left console gaming" , I game on both.
I don't know how you are going to tell me about a platform of gaming you "left" =)
Optimus Lime
(L3) + (R3) | Spartan rage activated
Exactly. A PC is not a console. You will run into problems. 99% of the time they are fixable if you can be bothered finding out. If you can't be bothered, consoles are there for you.
Optimus Lime
(L3) + (R3) | Spartan rage activated
You've built PC's for years, but you don't know how to do basic troubleshooting of software?
Maybe you weren't very good at it.
EDMIX
Member
I have no issue with the comment, its a con against PC regardless and a valid one.
Someone tolerating it doesn't change that the issue exist and is a valid one at that.
"You've built PC's for years, but you don't know how to do basic troubleshooting of software?
Maybe you weren't very good at it"
Not my job to fucking correct the publishers issues.
Until they send me a check, that is their issue to correct.
Thats like saying one should know how to fix Arkham Knight or something.
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Optimus Lime
(L3) + (R3) | Spartan rage activated
Nobody has claimed that there are never problems with PC software, or that the issue doesn't exist.
The point is that while it exists, it is a part of an enthusiast platform, and in most cases, is nowhere near the cataclysm of pain and regret that you seem to think it is.
And, that if you don't want to deal with troubleshooting, consoles are there for you.
Guilty_AI
Member
Bloodborne -> Unplayable stuttering mess
BotW -> literally runs at 15 fps, no workaround besides playing it through an emulator
GoW -> Faced stutters right from the first fight
FFXV on ps4-> Another game that runs at 15 fps
Last guardian -> Cosntant Stutters and frame drops
Nier Automata on ps4 -> 60 fps game in theory, plays at 40, stutters.
Far Cry 2 on ps3 -> Ran like complete crap.
Midnight Club LA on ps3 -> somehow would take 5 minutes to just enter the game
Those are only titles that affected me particularly, cause i know full well theres more like Genshin's Impact ultra crappy performance, Ghostrunner's blurry mess at launch, Returnal crashing and making people lose 2 hour progress runs.
None of these are or were low profile titles either.
Just means i don't use any console unless its absolutely necessary.
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EDMIX
Member
Already own both.
You seem obsessed with making it some either or lol
You got triggered as soon as other PC gamers started to bring up those problems, shit simply chock it up to "it exist, its part of an enthusiast platform" etc, vs tldr and trying to fucking avoid the topic and trying to force an either or the moment other PC gamers start to confirm such issues.
Guilty_AI
Nothing you stated is some hard stop that would stop anyone from plaything those games.....When you are saying you left, you should have just stated only for certain titles, what else am I suppose to believe when you state you "left console gaming" ?
So I'd say we are on different set ups in terms of majority use, as I game on PC when its absolutely necessary or IP i prefer on PC.
I'll give you Far Cry 2 lol Own it on PC, but heard horror stories on its PS3 port. Only Far Cry I played on console was the last one 5, so I can't speak on how the series continued on console if Ubisoft fixed those versions as I'd expect they are now lead sku for consoles vs how it was back then.
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Optimus Lime
(L3) + (R3) | Spartan rage activated
Mm. Cool.Already own both.
You seem obsessed with making it some either or lol
You got triggered as soon as other PC gamers started to bring up those problems, shit simply chock it up to "it exist, its part of an enthusiast platform" etc, vs tldr and trying to fucking avoid the topic and trying to force an either or the moment other PC gamers start to confirm such issues.
When you are saying you left, you should have just stated only for certain titles, what else am I suppose to believe when you state you "left console gaming" ?
So I'd say we are on different set ups in terms of majority use, as I game on PC when its absolutely necessary or IP i prefer on PC.
Can't decide
Member
You're forgetting that's the thing with PC though, you can do that even if the games don't come with it. Assetto Corsa is a perfect example, it's a 2013 Indie game that only supported one light source, no weather, no rain, no day-night cycle and very few basic graphics settings.
Then the community got to work and basically, thanks to mostly one guy in his spare time, added probably more than 100 extra graphical features by using injectors, including rain, day-night cycle, procedurally generated grass/foliage, multiple lights, AMD FidelityFx, GI and extra bounce lighting, HBAO+, TAA and so much more.
It's PC, you can achieve anything, you can give a 2013 game rain and night, or you can tweak it to almost look like real camera footage, even in bright day light settings and not easier to achieve overcast settings, or even like an old TV broadcast.
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Wonko_C
Member
Tell that to my PC that refuses to play Phantasy Star Online 2: New Genesis unless I buy a new CPU... and by extension a new motherboard that supports that CPU, and new RAM, a SSD, new PSU, etc.
kingfey
Banned
What game cant gt1060 and rx570 cant play right now?This.
PC needs upgrades to play the latest games just like console needs them.
I have no clue where this fucking myth came from that its just this eternal thing that um "doesn't need next gen hardware". If the logic is one can just play older games and choose not to upgrade...one can still fucking play a Gamecube, its a moot point.
Even the bullshit like "play on lowest settings" thats not a fucking thing in which you can just play forever all games with this mind set.
Over time, developers move on, they'll require DX features, only support certain cards etc.
I have a few builds that are older that are just used for home theater stuff, but thats like me fucking saying my HD 5770 build or my 8800gtx build will play Starfield or Elder Scrolls 6, no upgrade needed broz
yea, you have to do work arounds to get games to run properly. You can try to minimize this point as much as you can, but this is simply something that doesn't need to be done on other platforms to the same degree. As someone that games on both PC and console, I enjoy knowing that when I put a game in a console or handheld, it works.... I don't need to do several things and google and research how to get the product I fucking paid money for to actually work.
So I don't mind PC game as to why I still game on PC, but lets stop pretending thats not an issue or some positive thing to waste fucking time fixing the developers game and giving them free labor on reddit on how the game can work on certain builds. I don't know who is seeing that as some positive. As if someone wants to spend the night they first download a game they are hype to play, on reddit trying to see if V sync is fucking their game up or not to address blue screens and white screens and hard crashes and shit lol PC has many positives, lets highlight that vs trying to defend such a concept.
^^^
Modular hardware is a double edge sword. The ability to have the most powerful hardware doesn't mean developers care to actually optimize it for your exact build. Having a $5K PC doesn't magically make Arkham Knight work lol
When you have shit like XONE X or PS4 Pro or even better Series X and the majority of 3rd party AAA are no longer solely on PC, it makes it easy to have the platform as an option. Hardware exist to play at 4K without all the fucking shit involved with PC.
You really dont need a rtx 3090 to play pc gaming. Its like saying, you have to get ps5, to play ps4 games, when ps4 does actually play the games.
Those who wants 4k 120 fps will get rtx 3090. Regular folks, still have their old cards.
Console use amd now. With amd new architecture supporting rx570 and gt1060, what games do you think these cards wont play?
Console used to do 30fps. These cards can do 30 fps on high settings.
This is my pc specs. And Guess what the new AMD graphic upgrade did for it.
Only non pc players, or PC elites who spend $ thousands of money have this assumption, that you need to spends tons of money to play new games.
Flight sim on rx570
Re village
Cyberpunk2077
i have bought this pc as prebuilt in for 500$. And its already running these games. The card was released in 2017.
Now this is gt1060
cyberpunk2077
Re8 village
Flight Sim
This card was from goddamn 2016.
What games do you guys think these cards cant handle?
EDMIX
Member
Agreed. This comes down to developers and overall PC support. That isn't really a hardware thing as much as its a developer thing.
So of course PS4 did that, but based on a team that was funded to do so. So the whole hardware thing is irrelevant and the only relevance is the developer. Kunos exist to make such a game on PC.
kingfey
? Never said anyone needed a 3090 to play a game.A card from 2016? Ohhh so you mean a card bought after the generation started, is able to play a game within that generation? -_-
Thats like saying a PS4 game can play on PS4 Pro and be like "what games do you think PS4 Pro can't dat are PS4 games" lol
If someone from 2013, had to even upgrade to a 2016 card, it simply proves the point a upgrade is needed if you even need to select 2016 as some point lol
Guilty_AI
Thats definitely a each his own situation for sure. I'm just assuming you mean left as in no longer games on said platforms vs barely use. We are in similar situations simply on different platforms.
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Guilty_AI
Member
A skill-based game like Bloodborne stuttering all around? No way i'm playing that unless i'm willing to leave with a headache every session.
Wouldn't even care if it ran at 720p smooth 30 fps as long as ran decently.
What am i supposed to say besides "left console gaming" when i barely use consoles anymore. The only game i finished on the ps4 so far was Gravity Rush.
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kingfey
Banned
Flight sim on gt1060.
and these guys say you need new graphic cards for new games. Honestly ignorance is a bliss.
kingfey
Banned
kingfey
Banned
Agreed. This comes down to developers and overall PC support. That isn't really a hardware thing as much as its a developer thing.
So of course PS4 did that, but based on a team that was funded to do so. So the whole hardware thing is irrelevant and the only relevance is the developer. Kunos exist to make such a game on PC.
A card from 2016? Ohhh so you mean a card bought after the generation started, is able to play a game within that generation? -_-
Thats like saying a PS4 game can play on PS4 Pro and be like "what games do you think PS4 Pro can't dat are PS4 games" lol
If someone from 2013, had to even upgrade to a 2016 card, it simply proves the point a upgrade is needed if you even need to select 2016 as some point lol
This is what you stated
I showed you a 2016 card, and a 2017 card which plays a 2021 game. Which are high demanding games.
EDMIX
Member
I mean sure, but a 2013 console ran some of those games too King.
Again...I NEVER stated you need a fucking 3090, I have no clue where you got that from and you might just be replying to the wrong user. Never stated anything remotely like NEEDING a 3090.
Those games are not demanding sir. Think about what you are saying, what does that say about the fucking PS4 and XONE from 2013 that run those games? I'd argue that is even MORE impressive tbh.
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IntentionalPun
Ask me about my wife's perfect butthole
Part of the platform's weakness is how games don't do monster day one numbers as much, or sell much at full price.
Part of the platform's strength is games can and do sell really well for years and years, even if it's on a deep sale, it's still revenue and mindshare.
Part of the platform's strength is games can and do sell really well for years and years, even if it's on a deep sale, it's still revenue and mindshare.
kingfey
Banned
You mean they can run cyberpunk2077? The pro and the one X has problems with the game. The one X cant even run Flight SIM. Yet these cards run them. The one X is the most powerful console in that generation, and yet It cant run Flight sim.
These were optimized for consoles. Aside of cyberpunk2077 and flight Sim, which crushed those gen consoles. This what happens when you release a game, that takes advantage of pc.
rnlval
Member
DirectX12U (Feature Level 12_2) is "next-gen" since the geometry pipeline is different from the legacy DirectX12 (Feature Level 12_1).