• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
  • Hey Guest. Check out the NeoGAF 2.2 Update Thread for details on our new Giphy integration and other new features.

News Persona 5 Royal To Be Censored In the West, Bigotry of Low Expectations for the Gay Community. Reddit Censors Gay Voices!

CAB_Life

Gold Member
Dec 12, 2019
951
2,160
510
Toronto
christianadrianbrown.com
The gays sure dont know their history. Tell em to google search John Wayne Gacy.

John Wayne Gacy was an American serial killer who raped, tortured and murdered at least 33 teenage boys and young men between 1972 and 1978. Nope, no gay men are violent lol.


Everyone seems to have forgotten NAMBLA too. And that was only 20 or so years back.
 
Last edited:

Whitesnake

Banned
Jan 31, 2018
2,206
6,676
650
I'm outraged that now gays can't be portrayed as perverse and degenerates anymore. This is censorship, i need to laugh at gays, you can't deny me that, Atlus.


/s

It was a joke, but it was insensitive and it's good they have made some tweaks.



But these guys are not just flamboyant, they literally want to sexually harass Ryuji, Yusuke and Ren, they are forced to run. It was a bit too far to be a light hearted joke.

So gay people cannot ever be portrayed doing anything wrong?

Do you want gay people to be portrayed realistically, the same as everyone else? Or do you want them to be railroaded into being either uninteresting mary sues or background props?

You can’t have it both ways. Either you believe gays should portrayed realistically (which indeed means that sometimes they can be predators) or you want them to be given special treatment which would deny reality and bankrupt creativity but would be less “insensitive”.

Pick one.
 
Last edited:

SLB1904

Member
Oct 24, 2017
1,103
1,372
505
Imagine you were gay. Would you be happy that the only gay presence in Persona 5 would revolve about two guys behaving like this? Would you take it as a joke? I wouldn't.
Can you tell whats so negative about their behaviour. I havent play persona 5. And the only thing ive seen was a clip where one of the characters react negatively when they hit on him.
 

bigol

Member
May 15, 2008
1,675
165
910
Can you tell whats so negative about their behaviour. I havent play persona 5. And the only thing ive seen was a clip where one of the characters react negatively when they hit on him.

Here are the two scenes



You can’t have it both ways. Either you believe gays should portrayed realistically (which indeed means that sometimes they can be predators) or you want them to be given special treatment which would deny reality and bankrupt creativity but would be less “insensitive”.

Of course gays can be evil and criminals too, but that's not the point. In Persona 5 gays are only shown as degenerates, while evil white males are shown as evil individuals.

It's really obvious that those two guys are portrayed as evil BECAUSE they are gays not because they are jerks as individuals.
 
Last edited:
Dec 22, 2019
595
441
270
Well in the last 24 hours Iv seen more people cancel pre orders and DM/contact atlus about these changes then sit down shut up and take it. What funny is that the people madly upset about "that scene" most of them haven't even played the game and if they did they missed the whole IMPORTANT Concept/Context of that scene which is about Unwanted sexually advances. But if funny because the other stuff these people try to claim other stuff like
naoto is trans: no naoto is just a tomb boyish type of girl that likes male type stuff same with chie
Kanji is gay: no kanji is a guy that likes actives that are girlish
yusuke is gay: no yusuke is just a weird artist
Most of these people have to be blind so from just those comments alone I guarantee most of these people didn't even pay any attention to anything that happened in the entire games. I just picked and choose stuff so they could go on twitter and rant about why is this x this there and not that. Same thing these people did with CP2077 and that vending machine ad.
Either this is going to end two ways this is going to get censored in all versions of the game "o yea these people want the jp ver.the asian ver, and the us ver to get censored"
Or atlus is going to stealth release this game and do what Catherine full body did which was change one word and pretty much have the game be the same and let the fans roast all the whiners on twitter and REEEera into oblivion
 

bigol

Member
May 15, 2008
1,675
165
910
Also, let me laugh at the hypocrisy. People that make fun of Resetera (with good reason) for being part of outrage culture and then easily switch to the outrage culture side because "censorship".

Is this what you call censorship?
 

DunDunDunpachi

Patient MembeR
Apr 18, 2018
29,314
70,149
1,375
USA
dunpachi.com
Also, let me laugh at the hypocrisy. People that make fun of Resetera (with good reason) for being part of outrage culture and then easily switch to the outrage culture side because "censorship".

Is this what you call censorship?
One of these things is not like the other. One group doxxes and threatens developers who don't fall in line. The other group is pointing out why that's a bad thing.

Is this what you call hypocrisy? lol okay
 

bigol

Member
May 15, 2008
1,675
165
910
Never try to appease the deranged radicals on Twitter and Reeeset. Nothing will ever be good enough, and they’ll demand more from you next time, and more, until your creative vision is thoroughly crushed and sales are in the gutter. They aren’t your customers.

These people are hyenas, and brutally exploit perceived weakness. Stay strong. Be the lion.

Who cares about Resetera. Atlus localization team did good to have less homophobic content in Persona 5 Royal and that's what is important.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Makoto Niijima

Whitesnake

Banned
Jan 31, 2018
2,206
6,676
650
Of course gays can be evil and criminals too, but that's not the point. In Persona 5 gays are only shown as degenerates, while evil white males are shown as evil individuals.

They’re “only shown as degenerates” because these bit characters are the only men openly attracted to other men. The only other times sexuality even comes up are in cases of predation (Kamoshida or the people abusing Futaba’s friend) or when it’s directed towards the player character (waifus).

And the cases of straight sexual abuse are way more serious and are treated as such.

Unless you want to claim that Atlus ALSO hates straight people?

And you very clearly don’t believe gays can be evil, because you’re literally saying right now that people MUST be bigoted in order to portray an evil character as gay.

It's really obvious that those two guys are portrayed as evil BECAUSE they are gays not because they are jerks as individuals.

Pulled straight out of your ass. If you want to accuse people of bigotry you can’t just do it on a hunch.

If your only gripe with a scene is “I bet the people who made this non-bigoted content secretly thought bigoted thoughts while making it!”, then you’ve lost both the argument and your mind.

Get help.
 
Last edited:
Oct 2, 2017
864
1,194
440
I never like censorship, but I am definitely still getting this game. Have been waiting too long to have something so minor stop me from playing.

If it was something like removing Mara or covering up Ann's costume I would boycott for sure. This is just changing/localizing some inconsequential dialogue from some no-name characters.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Pallas and Danjin44

Whitesnake

Banned
Jan 31, 2018
2,206
6,676
650
Also, let me laugh at the hypocrisy. People that make fun of Resetera (with good reason) for being part of outrage culture and then easily switch to the outrage culture side because "censorship".

Is this what you call censorship?

orange forum bad

Who cares about Resetera. Atlus localization team did good to have less homophobic content in Persona 5 Royal and that's what is important.

It wasn’t homophobic.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Vanitymachine

RokkanStoned

Member
Jan 14, 2018
2,593
3,069
635
Norway
Whenever these types of situations come to light, I immediately wonder what other material could have potentially been adjusted on the sly, after it tweaked the sensibilities of someone on the localization team. It doesn't help revealing this change is nothing but the company marketing to a specific consumer segment.

To be fair, it has happened for a long time. It's just that nowadays it's not christians, but people who feel offended for minority groups. There's also been attempts at changing things to be more attractive to a region's consumers, not necessarily as some brownie point or otherwise virtue signaling.
Heck, Persona 1 turned a character black, from what I understood to make the cast more diverse in order to be more appealing in NA. Then you have the whole Poison debacle. Changes in Final Fantasy IV to not offend christians. So much. Personally I view it all in poor taste, especially when it further is drummed up from outrage by a vocal minority of consumers. That said, it's part of marketing, so it's business overthrowing the creative. It also creates an overall dissonance when it comes to the product.
I laugh at people celebrating it, because they're just giving Atlus just what they want, without them having to apologize for the original scene nor remove it. It's like someone trying to use correction fluid in a book and writing a different word over it. It doesn't make the fact of the original scene go away and it just makes you look weak in not handling its existence.
 
  • Like
Reactions: EviLore

McCheese

Member
Jan 7, 2018
1,922
4,745
600
Valve's Digital Distribution Platform
Atlus localization team did good to have less homophobic content in Persona 5 Royal and that's what is important.

Nope.

good would be if Atlus japan decided to tone it down and made the change, then the localization team just did a soft-touch translation without injecting any western politics into the mix.

I didn't like the scene, it is mildly offensive if you are over-sensitive. But either change it at the source or leave it alone, I hate knowing stuff is being changed in localisation, especially when the sort of people who worm themselves into localization positions seem intent on pushing a very specific narrative. I don't want to give an inch to them, look at what they've done to western games already.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: stickkidsam

Danjin44

The nicest person on this forum
Mar 22, 2017
15,561
24,705
1,035
I never like censorship, but I am definitely still getting this game. Have been waiting too long to have something so minor stop me from playing.

If it was something like removing Mara or covering up Ann's costume I would boycott for sure. This is just changing/localizing some inconsequential dialogue from some no-name characters.
Same here, I agree that people overrated way too much over this scene but at same time that scene is too minor for me get upset and skip entire game for it.
 
Last edited:

Madonis

Member
Oct 21, 2018
1,527
1,111
365
I didn't care for those scenes, but I forgot they even existed until this news came up. That's how small of an impression they left on me.

In other words, they were never a factor in terms of my playing or purchasing the game.

Therefore...if I eventually decide to pick up Persona 5 Royal, probably during a sale, it still won't be a factor.
 
Last edited:

bigol

Member
May 15, 2008
1,675
165
910
Nope.

good would be if Atlus japan decided to tone it down and made the change, then the localization team just did a soft-touch translation without injecting any western politics into the mix.

I didn't like the scene, it is mildly offensive if you are over-sensitive. But either change it at the source or leave it alone, I hate knowing stuff is being changed in localisation, especially when the sort of people who worm themselves into localization positions seem intent on pushing a very specific narrative. I don't want to give an inch to them.

Let's not kid ourselves. If Atlus Japan changed the scene in Japanese P5R people would have called censorship compared to the original Persona 5 Japanese release. People always try to find something to be outraged at.

I see no narrative being pushed by localization team, it's not about injecting western politics. What is political about not being homophobic?

Isn't human decency something that everyone should have as part of being human?
 

stickkidsam

Member
Jan 7, 2018
939
878
505
I get it localization people. Ya don't want players thinking all of the gay are lurkin around the corner ready to tickle your taint. If you censor this though, you're making the point that they CAN'T be shitty people. How is that normal or better?

Last I checked, who ya wanna bang doesn't change your ability to be a bastard.
 

Cybrwzrd

Banned
Sep 29, 2014
8,057
14,861
1,020
Imagine you were gay. Would you be happy that the only gay presence in Persona 5 would revolve about two guys behaving like this? Would you take it as a joke? I wouldn't.

What does how two characters are portrayed have to do with you? This fucking representation crap is so fucking stupid. Its a game, it isn't real life.

Isn't human decency something that everyone should have as part of being human?

No.

I don't have to like or respect someone, or even be nice to someone if I don't like them personally or what they stand for or who they want to rub genitals with. I don't have to like someone because of what race they are either, or what religion they follow.

The thought of being forced to be "decent" (which is subjective) is quite frightening.

And making jokes isn't indecent.
 
Last edited:

Danjin44

The nicest person on this forum
Mar 22, 2017
15,561
24,705
1,035
P5 is for women / betas any way.
Never been interested in the series.
??? How so? It’s a game both woman and men can enjoy but how does this game makes it exclusively for “woman”?
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: RokkanStoned

RokkanStoned

Member
Jan 14, 2018
2,593
3,069
635
Norway
I see no narrative being pushed by localization team, it's not about injecting western politics. What is political about not being homophobic?

Isn't human decency something that everyone should have as part of being human?

It wasn't homophobic, so I have no idea what your angle is here. It contained a couple of "predatory" gay men in a joke. It's definitely something I've personally had experience with as well, but it's not exclusive to gay people or straight people. The whole joke works because in this context the Persona guys are straight, thus the attention they don't want is from other men. Trying to somehow tip-toe around gay people would be much more a kinda homophobia than inclusion in a joke.
Once you take the joke too seriously, then you've failed it. Once you do that then slapstick humor becomes callousness or assault. That's why a healthy understanding of what humor and jokes entail is needed.
 

bigol

Member
May 15, 2008
1,675
165
910
You do know that those characters in the game aren't humans, right?

But the potential gay customers playing this are human, aren't they?

What does how two characters are portrayed have to do with you? This fucking representation crap is so fucking stupid. Its a game, it isn't real life.



No.

I don't have to like or respect someone, or even be nice to someone if I don't like them personally or what they stand for or who they want to rub genitals with. I don't have to like someone because of what race they are either, or what religion they follow.

And making jokes isn't indecent.

I don't respect someone only if he treats me like shit. If a straight man treats me like shit i hate him, if it's a gay treating me like shit i hate him because of what he said to me, because of what he did to me, not because of his sexual preference.
 

McCheese

Member
Jan 7, 2018
1,922
4,745
600
Valve's Digital Distribution Platform
What is political about not being homophobic?

Is your argument that if a character in a videogame is gay, they must receive protected status and be good and heroic else it's homophobic? Kanji and Nao are pretty great Atlus characters who just happen to be gay, and there are many characters in PS5 of reputable character, across all races, genders and sexuality.

The same game has a drag-queen who runs a bar and flirts with an underage schoolboy constantly, yet as they are a "good" character they somehow get through localization, it's just odd.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Yakuzakazuya

Saber

Member
Jan 30, 2019
3,671
3,375
660
But the potential gay customers playing this are human, aren't they?

And why would they care? Buddy, its a video game. Nothing is real. Those characters you speak of are nothing but fictional, like the rest of characters in the game. They aren't supposed to represent anything.

If you think this represents the whole gay people, theres something wrong with your head.
 

Cybrwzrd

Banned
Sep 29, 2014
8,057
14,861
1,020
I don't respect someone only if he treats me like shit. If a straight man treats me like shit i hate him, if it's a gay treating me like shit i hate him because of what he said to me, because of what he did to me, not because of his sexual preference.

Yes, that's fine. You can also hate them because they pick their nose and lick the boogies off their fingers. Hating people for any reason shouldn't be off limits.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Vanitymachine

sensui-tomo

Member
Sep 14, 2011
5,864
1
655
What in the flying fuck is with some of these posts. Christ almighty what the fuck happened to this site.
 

infinitys_7th

Gold Member
Oct 1, 2006
11,681
20,806
1,885
It's really obvious that those two guys are portrayed as evil BECAUSE they are gays not because they are jerks as individuals.

Question: Do all gay men try to pick up teenage boys?

Your statement creates an underlying assumption that they do.

What in the flying fuck is with some of these posts. Christ almighty what the fuck happened to this site.

The tumors finally sloughed off and started growing in their own sewer, and now we are healing.
 
Last edited:

Thorrgal

Member
Sep 28, 2016
900
91
300
Paris
Why are you guys so offended they removed the homophobic shit from the game?

How does this alter their "vision" of the game?

Pathetic
 

SweetShark

Member
Feb 28, 2019
584
329
325
Why are you guys so offended they removed the homophobic shit from the game?

How does this alter their "vision" of the game?

Pathetic

Because it was funny.
They want to ruin the funny moments cause of being offensive.
It seems there is an law now we must NEVER say/write offensive jokes anymore.
Pathetic.
 

sensui-tomo

Member
Sep 14, 2011
5,864
1
655
Man you guys must be some sort of special snowflake to get your jimmies rustled about some negative stereotype being pulled. I had fun with the 100 hour video game but once they took a joke out .... it went to far! Fucking lol .
 
Last edited: