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Pig to Skunk: "Is it just me or does it stink in here?"

soldat7 said:
There is no way to prove that this would have been the case. I personally don't think that MS 'wouldn't have had a chance' had the PS3 been the same price.

Games like Gears of War, Halo 3, Mass Effect, and Bioshock, in addition to the rash of former Sony-only-now-multiplatform titles should make one think twice about Sony's "what might have been" dominance.

If the PS3 had launched at $399 with adequate shipments, I honestly believe Sony would be at least 5 million ahead of MS at this point instead of the reverse. This is assuming they skimped on Blu Ray of course. If they had skimped on power instead, and the multiplatform competition was PS3/Wii vs 360/PC, Sony might even be further ahead.

Private Hoffman said:

Despite Sony's best efforts to out-Westernize MS with their emphasis on shooters and action games, the 4 largest online shooter communities (COD4, Halo 3, GTAIV, Gears of War) are all on 360, and the only 3rd party Western PS3 exclusives that haven't been published by Sony are Haze and timed Unreal Tournament 3. So while Sony has made some inroads, they still haven't had the breakout hit needed to break the PC/360 stranglehold on shooter mindshare, and unless Killzone 2 is that game (and it might be), they'll have abandoned a fairly substantial portion of their fanbase just to pay lip service to MS' strongest genre.

It's great if you're a fan of shooters like I am, but they aren't exactly what carried their last two consoles.
 

MoogPaul

Member
a $299 PS3 at launch would have cost sony only about 2398402409280 dollars considering how much they were losing on the console at launch at 599. a 299 ps3 at launch that wouldn't crush the company leaves you with no HD no blu-ray and basically a wii without the unique controls.

Edit:
Sho_Nuff82 said:
If the PS3 had launched at $399 with adequate shipments, I honestly believe Sony would be at least 5 million ahead of MS at this point instead of the reverse. This is assuming they skimped on Blu Ray of course. If they had skimped on power instead, and the multiplatform competition was PS3/Wii vs 360/PC, Sony might even be further ahead.

except for the fact the the main money coming into nintendo is people who didn't usually play video games because of the controls. A fancy ps2 called ps3 without the wii controls is in the same boat as current ps3. not to mention all the "2 PS2 taped together" jokes coming from all the xbox users. Plus skimping on power on the PS3 looses the few big hits the system has. If the Xbox360 wasn't good enough for MGS4, do you think a more powerful PS2 would have been more attractive that an HD machine?
 
MoogPaul said:
a $299 PS3 at launch would have cost sony only about 2398402409280 dollars considering how much they were losing on the console at launch at 599. a 299 ps3 at launch that wouldn't crush the company leaves you with no HD no blu-ray and basically a wii without the unique controls.

They were only losing that much money because of the included Blu-ray drive of the PS3. Remember, when the PS3 first launched even Sony's own stand alone Blu-ray players were selling at retail for $1,000. Also, Blu-ray was blamed by Sony themselves for the delay from the original Spring 06 launch.

Who knows how much the PS3 would have cost if they cut it out of the system.
 

snatches

Member
MoogPaul said:
If the Xbox360 wasn't good enough for MGS4


wait wait wait you still believe this hype? what about mgs4 looks like it wouldn't be possible on 360

seriously OT but I can't believe people still believe this marketing drivel
 

soldat7

Member
snatches said:
Let me say it again:

If Sony had launched in November 2005 with the current 40 gb configuration and no blu ray for $399 AND they had always stayed price competitive with similarly equipped 360's.....MS WOULDN'T HAVE STOOD A FUCKING CHANCE

The PS3 wouldn't have magically become easy to program for and Microsoft wouldn't have just lied down and died as you seem to be stating.

And judging by the lineup of PS3 software over the past couple of years I'm pretty sure MS WOULD have stood a chance. Attributing Microsoft's success to the failures of the PS3 is faulty reasoning IMO.

snatches said:
wait wait wait you still believe this hype? what about mgs4 looks like it wouldn't be possible on 360

seriously OT but I can't believe people still believe this marketing drivel

This is something we can agree on. I love MGS4 and am amazed by how good it looks etc. but to say that MGS4 is not possible on the 360 is a bit silly IMO.
 
snatches said:
Let me say it again:

If Sony had launched in November 2005 with the current 40 gb configuration and no blu ray for $399 AND they had always stayed price competitive with similarly equipped 360's.....MS WOULDN'T HAVE STOOD A FUCKING CHANCE

Sure its just lame "what might have been" speculation, but ever since e3 2006 when Sony announced the pricing I have been saying this and it is no less true today.

And surely a lot of those "exclusives" wouldn't have stayed that way, as we are seeing with the shoe on the other foot.....


That's a lot of "ifs". So many, in fact that your scenario is not but pure fantasy, as it requires Sony to have today's hindsight 3 years ago. And if they had that, they damn sure wouldn't have done what they did.
 

snatches

Member
DeaconKnowledge said:
That's a lot of "ifs". So many, in fact that your scenario is not but pure fantasy, as it requires Sony to have today's hindsight 3 years ago. And if they had that, they damn sure wouldn't have done what they did.

because it takes hindsight to know the market doesn't want a 600 dollar console.
 
MoogPaul said:
a $299 PS3 at launch would have cost sony only about 2398402409280 dollars considering how much they were losing on the console at launch at 599. a 299 ps3 at launch that wouldn't crush the company leaves you with no HD no blu-ray and basically a wii without the unique controls.

Edit:


except for the fact the the main money coming into nintendo is people who didn't usually play video games because of the controls. A fancy ps2 called ps3 without the wii controls is in the same boat as current ps3. not to mention all the "2 PS2 taped together" jokes coming from all the xbox users. Plus skimping on power on the PS3 looses the few big hits the system has. If the Xbox360 wasn't good enough for MGS4, do you think a more powerful PS2 would have been more attractive that an HD machine?

You have to consider that quite a few hits that MS 'stole' from the PS3 were only feasible because the systems were on par in power.

Imagine if

Tekken 6
DMC4
FFXIII
Virtua Fighter 5
Resident Evil 5
Monster Hunter 3
Dynasty Warriors/Gundam

were multiplat, but NOT on 360, and you have a very different situation, particularly in Japan.
 

MoogPaul

Member
snatches said:
wait wait wait you still believe this hype? what about mgs4 looks like it wouldn't be possible on 360

seriously OT but I can't believe people still believe this marketing drivel

I'm not saying it is impossible. In fact, it's all damn possible. I'm saying this is the BS excuse Hideo made for making the game on PS3. If Hideo actually wanted to make the game on the game console with the greatest performance, a cheap launch ps3 with no blu-ray and no HD wouldn't of been it.
 

justchris

Member
DeaconKnowledge said:
That's a lot of "ifs". So many, in fact that your scenario is naught but pure fantasy, as it requires Sony to have today's hindsight 3 years ago. And if they had that, they damn sure wouldn't have done what they did.

Fixed for grammar. That's the correct phrase.
 

Nizz

Member
Vorador said:
elainestare2.gif
:lol :lol
 
Sho_Nuff82 said:
If the PS3 had launched at $399 with adequate shipments, I honestly believe Sony would be at least 5 million ahead of MS at this point instead of the reverse. This is assuming they skimped on Blu Ray of course. If they had skimped on power instead, and the multiplatform competition was PS3/Wii vs 360/PC, Sony might even be further ahead.

Doubtful.

A few key features, outside of price, were prohibiting PS3's success:

1) Software

2) The HD Media Battle

These reasons, along with the high price, prevented the PS3 from being successful early on in the US.

If they had skimped on Blu-Ray, the PS3 would lease a key differentiating factor for new consumers needing to decide between a 360 and a PS3 as their console to get. Blu-Ray is an important feature now and longterm, and is evidenced by the boost in PS3 sales when Blu-Ray won. Without it, the PS3 would be looked at as a more expensive Xbox 360 with nothing else to distinguish it. It'd be a lot like if the Wii had removed its key differentiating feature with the Wii Mote.


Despite Sony's best efforts to out-Westernize MS with their emphasis on shooters and action games, the 4 largest online shooter communities (COD4, Halo 3, GTAIV, Gears of War) are all on 360, and the only 3rd party Western PS3 exclusives that haven't been published by Sony are Haze and timed Unreal Tournament 3. So while Sony has made some inroads, they still haven't had the breakout hit needed to break the PC/360 stranglehold on shooter mindshare, and unless Killzone 2 is that game (and it might be), they'll have abandoned a fairly substantial portion of their fanbase just to pay lip service to MS' strongest genre.

It's great if you're a fan of shooters like I am, but they aren't exactly what carried their last two consoles.


Sony's best shooter efforts (Resistance 2, Killzone 2, MAG) haven't been released yet.

Most of the shooter titles that have released on the PS3 were launch titles or shortly after launch (Resistance and Warhawk).

Killzone 2 is going to be Sony's premier FPS when it launches, and I genuinely believe it will be their breakout blockbuster FPS hit that has the potential to do millions and really propel the series into the limelight. Essentially doing what its predecessor failed to do.

Resistance 2 remains to be seen, but it's possible it will do much better than the original, though I personally don't feel it will do quite as well as Killzone 2 in the long term.

While this isn't what carried them last-gen, it's undeniable that the landscape changed last-gen with Halo being such a breakout series and popularizing online competitive FPS on consoles. This was a deficiency of Sony's last gen, and it still persists right now with a few weeks and months leading up to the release of a few key titles that will change all of that.

However, while Microsoft may dominate the shooter arena (currently), Sony has done a good job of releasing titles that still appeal to the core base of previous PS2 owners. Adventure titles like Uncharted, platformer/shooters in Ratchet, and now they are going to be releasing something completely unique and revolutionary with LittleBigPlanet. The only people I can see being disappointed are the JPRG fans...

I do not see JRPG fans as being a "substantial portion" of the PS3's userbase. I find them to be a vocal minority, especially considering the sales of those titles (at least in the west). Yes, those titles are popular in Japan, but apparently Sony doesn't feel like investing in 1 small market is as important as investing in 2 much larger markets. Again, I agree with that decision.
 

Redd

Member
Private Hoffman said:
I do not see JRPG fans as being a "substantial portion" of the PS3's userbase. I find them to be a vocal minority, especially considering the sales of those titles (at least in the west). Yes, those titles are popular in Japan, but apparently Sony doesn't feel like investing in 1 small market is as important as investing in 2 much larger markets. Again, I agree with that decision.

You doubt the power of the final fantasy series? Final Fantasy sells consoles, period.
 
Redd said:
You doubt the power of the final fantasy series? Final Fantasy sells consoles, period.


Oh, I know the power of the Final Fantasy series. Don't get me wrong, that's a damn important series, but everyone else not called Final Fantasy (again, at least in the west?)...meh, not so much. That's the only JRPG I know of that has some serious popularity over here.
 
stinks in here


smells like meat
rotten meat

kids why would bring that rotten meat in here of all places



kids you stupid mothafuckas, what the hell's wrong with you, kids
 
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