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PlayStation PC games revenue so far; to Have 50 / 50 % Investment on new & existing IP By 2025; +20 games for VR2 launch + more

yurinka

Member
Tiago Rodrigues Tiago Rodrigues it would be nice to include this in the OP, from page 29:

From now until FY25 Sony will increase their investment on PS5 GaaS, but not at the expenses of traditional PS5 games. They will also increase their investment on traditional PS5 games.






lol at $26.2 million. All this for $26 million. Remember, they made $25 billion last year from their console business.

And $300 million next year means every single game is coming to PC and most probably on day one. Pretty sure I was called chicken little here when i called this 2 years ago. This was always the end game.

I'd say some apologies are in order, but i know im still not gonna get any.
Notice that they never said day one PC games, and the chart mentioning the percent of games planned to be released on each platform has a PS4+PS5 group but not a PS5+PC group, very likely meaning that they will continue releasing on PC ports or remasters of old games.

These $26.2M have been generated in the first 2 months and a half (will sell way more) by a port of a 4 years old game. Nothing to laugh at, are impressive numbers. These 3 ports generated $100M until March, you can fund the development of a nice game with that. And with $300M a big ass AAA.

The 300M means GoW only did a portion of its sales in the previous FY so will continue selling (like the previous two), plus they'll release U4+ULL and very likely TLOU2DC (which I assume will include the TLOU1 remake too).

Correct, which is why sales is different.
Well, GoW sold 20M on PS and 1M on PC because the PC version is also a full priced 4 years old port and only has the sales of the first 2 and a half month and after has been being sold in console during 4 years, heavily discounted and even included in the game subs, so a ton of people interested on it already owns the game. And sold that in a market (PC) where sales are mostly done when discounted. I think it will sell more this FY once it gets a big discount than in the previous one.

I think these numbers are impressive and promising. To port old hits to PC seems to provide them a good chunk of revenue for a little cost, so I understand they'll keep porting more stuff.

12 live service games?

1. MLB
2. Factions
3. Haven game
4. Deviation Game
5. GG's shooter (by ex-Rainbow Six Siege director)
6. Firewalk game
7. Firesprite game
8-12: ??
Pretty much confirmed to be released before 2026:
1. MLB 22
2. MLB 23
3. MLB 24
4. MLB 25
5. Gran Turismo 7
6. Factions
7. Bungie new IP 1
8. Bungie new IP 2
9. Haven game
10. Deviation game
11. Firewalk game
11. Guerrilla MP game
12. Firesprite MP game

Bonus track (they may not exist, may not be GaaS or even a MP focused game, or not ready for before 2026):
13. Helldivers 2
14. London Studios game
15. Insomniac game featuring MP
16. Sucker Punch game featuring MP
17. Bend new IP
18. PS Home 2
19. Crypto MetaKnackVerse VR

But that game might get delayed to 2023 to coincide with the show.
The director of the TLOU tv show said they plan to release it early next year. In this case, I'd release TLOU1+2 DC and Factions on PS4 and PS5 in November and half a year later on PC.

TLOU1+2 DC would be a bundle of TLOU remastered and TLOU2 on PS4, and would include TLOU1 remake and TLOU2 PS5 on PS5.

They are releasing Factions and TLOU Remake day one on PC and PS5. Watch that happening.
edit: Actually Jim said the PC growth forecast is connected to the 2 live service games strategy...so the 2 unannounced live service games will be day one on PS5 AND PC. It's basically confirmed now. Factions and...something else.
They plan to release "at least one" new Bungie IP before 2025. Future Bungie games will be GaaS and will release day one on PC.

How in the hell are they going to get to 300M in 2022?

They will probably need to unleash all kinds of PS4 games and PS5 games on PC for that to happen. I'm talking stuff like Spiderman, Horizon: FW, Gran Turismo, The Last of Us, etc...
The $80 figure includes $26 from GoW, that only has there for two months and a half so pretty likely will sell more this year. Add pretty likely TLOU remake+TLOU2, plus extra Horizon and Days Gone sales. Then maybe Spider-Man+Spider-Man Miles Morales too, in order to release it some months before the PS5 only release of Spider-Man 2.
 
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kyliethicc

Member
Absolutely. That's why they hired the ex-Rainbow Six director. Pretty sure that's going to be a MP shooter.
He’s mentioned “hitting things, big and small” in a hiring post about the game he’s making.

Doesn’t sound like a shooter. Sounds like it might be melee focused.
 
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kingfey

Banned
He’s mentioned “hitting things, big and small” in a hiring post about the game he’s making.

Doesn’t sound like a shooter. Sounds like it might be melee focused.
That might mean smaller and bigger IPs.
You dont talk about melee stuff. That stuff makes no sense for the investors.
 

kyliethicc

Member


What I find most interesting about this slide is the description of Valkyrie Entertainment. Now, we had all assumed that they were brought on as just support. But it was also said that they had been working on internal projects prior to acquisition. Others on Twitter, such as Zuby, listed Valkyrie as working on some kind of strategy game. We know they've worked on mobile style games like Guns Up. Unlike Nixxes, who gets listed as being focused on PC porting, Valkyrie is listed as a Game Developer of console, PC, and mobile titles. Firesprite is also given this label but with the addition of VR. Again, people like Zuby have claimed Firesprite is working on a mobile title and we already know they are working on a Horizon VR game.

So what do we think? Is Valkyrie actually more than just a support studio based on this?
Yeah they’re probably doing a mobile game as well.

They recently ported their last game they made with Sony (Guns Up) to mobile. Was already on PC.

That might mean smaller and bigger IPs.
You dont talk about melee stuff. That stuff makes no sense for the investors.
LOL Simon Larouche wasn’t talking to investors.

He was trying to hire a combat designer on Linkedin.
 
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pratyush

Member
Considering 300m sales projections, Last of us collection and GOT is pretty much given that it is coming to PC. Wont be surprised if Horizon Forbidden West is also released next year and ending the year with God of War R
 

kingfey

Banned
LOL Simon Larouche wasn’t talking to investors.

He was trying to hire a combat designer on Linkedin.
Oh. I thought that was in the report. Nevermind.

If it's melee, I hope they do a good mmorpg games.

Most good ones are only PC exclusives.
 
Imagine what kind of numbers PS5 could have had if not for Covid/Shortages.

Covid hurt Sony tremendously while significantly helping both Nintendo and MS.

Typically hardware sales slow in the last 2 years of a life cycle but with Covid Nintendo got a huge boost. Xbox didn't have the demand PS5 did but the hardware gap between them is artificially lessened because PS5 can't produce enough to extend the gap. I actually think PS5 could have hit like 40 million sales by now.

Going forward will be telling though if my theory is correct
 

yurinka

Member
We still don’t know what Nixxes is working on. Rumor is Ghost of Sushi. Could be ready later this year. They’ve gotta be doing something over there.
Very likely on the PC ports of TLOU 1&2 and Spider-Man Remastered+Morales in order to have them in time to crosspromote the TLOU tv show and the PS5 only release of Spider-Man 2.

It's all to do with those 12 Live Service games.
Notice it says "PC" and not "PS5 + PC". There is another group that is "PS4 + PS5". So pretty likely by "PC" they mean more PC ports of old games.
 
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Three

Member
How in the hell are they going to get to 300M in 2022?

They will probably need to unleash all kinds of PS4 games and PS5 games on PC for that to happen. I'm talking stuff like Spiderman, Horizon: FW, Gran Turismo, The Last of Us, etc...
Bungie most probably. Destiny 2 is estimated to bring in anywhere from $100-$500 million dollars in revenue every year. Not sure what share is PC.
 

yurinka

Member
GOW was on top of the charts on Steam for several weeks and it didn't even sale 1 million? PC sales are way smaller than I thought. Where is this huge untapped market?
A full priced port of a 4 years old game selling around 1M copies in two months and a half are great sales for PC. It will sell way more over time specially when heavily discounted in sales.

Imagine what kind of numbers PS5 could have had if not for Covid/Shortages.

Covid hurt Sony tremendously while significantly helping both Nintendo and MS.

Typically hardware sales slow in the last 2 years of a life cycle but with Covid Nintendo got a huge boost. Xbox didn't have the demand PS5 did but the hardware gap between them is artificially lessened because PS5 can't produce enough to extend the gap. I actually think PS5 could have hit like 40 million sales by now.

Going forward will be telling though if my theory is correct
They post insane numbers and broke many records even with covid and chips shortages. Without these issues Sony would have broke all records and would have been a very distant leader for this generation. Something I think Sony will sell all these units as soon as they are able to get enough chips.

Why am I always zooming in on your avatars?
Do not click on them multiple times, they get bigger.
 
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Shmunter

Member
A full priced port of a 4 years old game selling around 1M copies in two months and a half are great sales for PC. It will sell way more over time specially when heavily discounted in sales.
His point is not just solely the sales quantity however. It is the relationship of chart vs quantity. I can see where he is coming from, one would expect higher sales being so far up on the chart for a prolonged period. It informs that PC sales overall as a platform are underwhelming.

Again, this points to AAA single player creations being feasible only when there is a user base to sustain it, aka console platforms are fundamental to game development investment.
 

yurinka

Member
His point is not just solely the sales quantity however. It is the relationship of chart vs quantity. I can see where he is coming from, one would expect higher sales being so far up on the chart for a prolonged period. It informs that PC sales overall as a platform are underwhelming.

Again, this points to AAA single player creations being feasible only when there is a user base to sustain it, aka console platforms are fundamental to game development investment.
Well, we know many top AAA games like FIFA, Fortnite, GTA or Ubisoft have PS as their best selling platform. It isn't a surprise to see AAA games selling less in PC. And obviously in this case, when looking only at the first 2 months and a half sales of port of a 4 years old game that has been super discounted and included in game subs.
 
Wait wait wait....

Does that chart suggest Sony PlayStation will be putting more money into Live Service by 2025 than traditional games?

Am I reading that correctly?
 

Tutomos

Member
You start to see more acquisitions from Sony are devs doing live service games. Watch out for Ubi as a favourite target for Sony as both of their future visions align.
 

GhostOfTsu

Member
A full priced port of a 4 years old game selling around 1M copies in two months and a half are great sales for PC. It will sell way more over time specially when heavily discounted in sales.
It's not really about GOW. My point is *any* game that is 3 weeks at no 1 on Steam and still didn't reach 1 million (months later) means sales on PC must be low. No matter the game.

That's like 200k worldwide per week for the #1 game 😳 It might be good for indies like V rising but not AAA.

His point is not just solely the sales quantity however. It is the relationship of chart vs quantity. I can see where he is coming from, one would expect higher sales being so far up on the chart for a prolonged period. It informs that PC sales overall as a platform are underwhelming.

Again, this points to AAA single player creations being feasible only when there is a user base to sustain it, aka console platforms are fundamental to game development investment.
Thank you! ❤
 
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StreetsofBeige

Gold Member
Wait wait wait....

Does that chart suggest Sony PlayStation will be putting more money into Live Service by 2025 than traditional games?

Am I reading that correctly?
Correct.

It's well known Sony has a shitload of MP/GAAS games being developed right now at their studios.

Sony's business model going forward is skewing to GAAS and more spread out across platforms too. PC and mobile are getting big boosts in game support. Hardcore fans can deny all they want about day one games being released on PC, but mobile is it's own thing getting their own games. And with the big surge in the PC game ratio, it's not like a handful of old 4 year games will represent that giant light blue box. You're going to get a lot of games coming out for PC. Maybe not day one, but definitely a lot faster than 4 years later kind of thing.

I suspect the PS5 only games in the dakr blue box will be heavily skewed to PSVR2 games. Unless Sony makes their PSVR2 games multiplat with PC VR gear, 100% of all the PSVR2 games will be PS5 exclusive. PSVR2 games arent even compatible with PSVR1 (PS4).
 
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hlm666

Member
It's not really about GOW. My point is *any* game that is 3 weeks at no 1 on Steam and still didn't reach 1 million (months later) means sales on PC must be low. No matter the game.
Elden Ring had more concurrent players than GoW had sales and is possibly the largest platform sales wise for that game, Are you sure whoever was providing you with these GoW steam #1 sales stats didn't screw up and used their region top ten instead of the global top 10?
 

KyoZz

Gold Member
The 300M means GoW only did a portion of its sales in the previous FY so will continue selling (like the previous two), plus they'll release U4+ULL and very likely TLOU2DC (which I assume will include the TLOU1 remake too).
Remember the Nvidia leak:
  • Demon's Souls
  • Ghosts of Tsushima
  • God of War ✅
  • Gran Turismo 7
  • Helldivers 2
  • Horizon Forbidden West
  • Ratchet & Clank
  • Returnal
  • Sackboy: A Big Adventure
  • Uncharted: Legacy of Thieves Collection ✅
With these games, you have your 300 million for 2023. In fact, I think that's a perfect goal with big year-over-year growth but easily achievable with these releases.
 

reksveks

Member
Wait wait wait....

Does that chart suggest Sony PlayStation will be putting more money into Live Service by 2025 than traditional games?

Am I reading that correctly?
Reading that right.

55% of PS studio cost/investment will be for live service games
45% will be for traditional games
 
Very interesting information. Looks like sony are expecting stock shortage to end and for ps5 to go into beast mode. How else will they pass ps4 in the same timeframe? Its currently behind when aligned with ps4.
 
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reksveks

Member
Kinda expected decline in full game sales per device.



Think that's a downward revision in Console growth





Another self explanatory chart, almost 50% investment into Live Service games in FY22.



Not sure I have seen this number before obviously doesn't include the mtx from fifa/madden. Does beg the question, does Sony try to charge users for their live service game or is it f2p?

 

zedinen

Member
The biggest news

1. Unprecedented China demand




2. PS5 is expected to overtake again




3. MAU PS4 84M




4. PS4 remains key driver of PS Store Revenue

 

StreetsofBeige

Gold Member
So digital revenue is now at 80%, software sales (disc and digital) are trending down, but it's all made up and beyond on MTX and sub plans.

Makes sense. People love sub plans and GAAS hooks people to play as long as possible. No wonder non-GAAS games sputter unless it's a hit game. People would rather milk it playing FIFA and Fortnite and COD all year (with some of the big name games being F2P) than risk buying new games upfront.
 

reksveks

Member
PS5 Top Selling Countries (March 2022)
1. US (~7M)
2. UK (~1.7M)
3. Japan (1.5M)
4. Germany
5. France
6. China (670K)
7. Canada
8. Australia
9. Italy
10. Spain
11. Saudi Arabia
 
Not sure how to feel about Sony going full speed into the whole GAAS/multiplayer games thing.

Logic would dictate that some people lose either way it goes. On one hand Sony have awfully little experience making decent multiplayer games. If their multiplayer games aren't good, they'll flop and Sony will have wasted money and resources they could've better spent elsewhere. Their multiplayer users would also suffer. However, if they actually make some bangers, then they'll inevitably focus more on them, instead of their usial singleplayer games, which are incredibly expensive to make.

Sony going so hard for that GAAS money will either largely fail, or see success... which will lead to the demise of their singleplayer games.
 

Shmunter

Member
Not sure how to feel about Sony going full speed into the whole GAAS/multiplayer games thing.

Logic would dictate that some people lose either way it goes. On one hand Sony have awfully little experience making decent multiplayer games. If their multiplayer games aren't good, they'll flop and Sony will have wasted money and resources they could've better spent elsewhere. Their multiplayer users would also suffer. However, if they actually make some bangers, then they'll inevitably focus more on them, instead of their usial singleplayer games, which are incredibly expensive to make.

Sony going so hard for that GAAS money will either largely fail, or see success... which will lead to the demise of their singleplayer games.
At least traditional games are also receiving more investment. It is GaaS that is simply seeing more. Curious if Bungie acquisition $ makes up a decent part of that chart.
 

SpokkX

Member
3 live service games fy22

So that must be

- The show 22
- Gran turismo 7 (why was it not on the slide)
- Destruction all stars?? (This would not count??)

.. or TLOU factions
 
Helldivers 2
With so many new, unannounced games scheduled to launch in the next few months, this makes me thing Sony might actually have a big PlayStation Showcase sooner than September.

They will have to order pre-orders soon for the big games (TLOU Remake, ND MP game, Helldivers 2), initiate and execute marketing campaigns, and spread out the release dates of those games from each other. Very tough to do all that if the holds the showcase in September 2022.
 

GhostOfTsu

Member
Elden Ring had more concurrent players than GoW had sales and is possibly the largest platform sales wise for that game, Are you sure whoever was providing you with these GoW steam #1 sales stats didn't screw up and used their region top ten instead of the global top 10?
People really need to stop comparing every game to Elden Ring. It was a once-in-a-lifetime release. Yes it was a big success on PC but most games will never see those kind of sales. As an example, Deathloop and Ghostwire came out Day 1 on PC/PS5 and they both flopped on Steam.

The 3 weeks in a row at #1 for GOW was widely reported and we had a thread about it too. The estimates at the time were about 2 millions sold and we believed it because it was charting so high on Steam. It was actually selling 200k or less per week 🤡


 
3 live service games fy22

So that must be

- The show 22
- Gran turismo 7 (why was it not on the slide)
- Destruction all stars?? (This would not count??)

.. or TLOU factions
  • The Show 22 released in April 2022. If The Show 2023 releases in April 2023, that wouldn't be in FY 22.
  • They are also not counting Gran Turismo 7 as a live-service GaaS game.
  • Destruction All Stars won't count.
So that leaves us with:
  1. Naughty Dog's Multiplayer Game in the TLOU 2 universe.
  2. Something new like Helldivers 2 from Arrowhead.
Both could be / should be day one PC releases so that would also explain the increased $300 million forecasts from PC this FY.
 
People really need to stop comparing every game to Elden Ring. It was a once-in-a-lifetime release. Yes it was a big success on PC but most games will never see those kind of sales. As an example, Deathloop and Ghostwire came out Day 1 on PC/PS5 and they both flopped on Steam.

The 3 weeks in a row at #1 for GOW was widely reported and we had a thread about it too. The estimates at the time were about 2 millions sold and we believed it because it was charting so high on Steam. It was actually selling 200k or less per week 🤡


Yeah you are right. I also thought GoW must have crossed the 2-3 million mark. But it seems like it was selling 200-300K per week when it was charting at #1. But now I stand corrected.

I don't think it has anything to do with quality of the game (we all know GoW is 10/10) or anything to do with the commercial success of the game (because it topped the sales charts for many weeks).

I think it just tells us that games that top the weekly Steam charts, for example, usually may not be selling as much -- except for a few edge cases like Elden Ring or CP 2077.
 

kyliethicc

Member
With so many new, unannounced games scheduled to launch in the next few months, this makes me thing Sony might actually have a big PlayStation Showcase sooner than September.

They will have to order pre-orders soon for the big games (TLOU Remake, ND MP game, Helldivers 2), initiate and execute marketing campaigns, and spread out the release dates of those games from each other. Very tough to do all that if the holds the showcase in September 2022.
They can just announce everything in September. Release the games between October and March.

Apex Legends was a total shadow drop. Huge hit.

You don’t really need to do months of marketing for a multiplayer game.
 
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