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PR: COLECO to release Chameleon, console that focuses on new cartridge games

Bboy AJ

My dog was murdered by a 3.5mm audio port and I will not rest until the standard is dead
So happy to see Nico here. One of my brothers who is unafraid to call out a scam. Or a massive delusion.

Mike Kennedy, go beg for a bank for money. You have no goodwill toward crowd funding. Accept the risks of a bank loan. Put your house up as collateral or whatever it takes, if you're so sure. Don't try to fleece us.
 

Khaz

Member
Nintendo AV output is not standard. They have no advantage of using it in a prototype: it's difficult to source and it's impossible to use in the end product because patents. RCA, (mini) DIN, Scart or even soldering cables directly on the board, are all much more efficient for prototyping.

The have been sketchy from the beginning and continue to be sketchy. All they had to do do stop the rumours is to open the shell and say "look". We won't care if it's ugly, or a mess of wires and chips dangling around. On the opposite, it will show that something is done on the hardware side.

Right now they have nothing. Or more precisely, they have a game made for SNES hardware, Tiny Knight, and an empty console shell. They are at exactly the same spot than six months ago when they failed their Indiegogo.
 

Mega

Banned
Nintendo AV output is not standard. They have no advantage of using it in a prototype: it's difficult to source and it's impossible to use in the end product because patents. RCA, (mini) DIN, Scart or even soldering cables directly on the board, are all much more efficient for prototyping.

Yeah, now that I'm looking at the SNES cable and the freaking SNES controller (and game port!)... that's too many coincidences. I have to wonder WTF is going on that they can't do anything without raising serious suspicion. An affordable custom-made console would be using the non-ptoprietary inputs Khaz mentioned... and probably mini DIN or USB for the controller.

Bleah. This is so frustrating. Mike better explain this shit fast. I wonder if it's just a cheap SNES emulator clone stuffed inside the shell.
 

Rich!

Member
They will be fine as long as there are a few other Dreamwriters out there.

real talk: it's gonna fail hard. and rightfully so.
 

Chittagong

Gold Member
Coleco seems to have a singular vision of becoming the first console manufaturer ever to go out of business twice. For symmetry, they will make Jaguar the first console to be discontinued twice.
 

Tempy

don't ask me for codes
Coleco seems to have a singular vision of becoming the first console manufaturer ever to go out of business twice. For symmetry, they will make Jaguar the first console to be discontinued twice.

I highly doubt this "Coleco" will get in any trouble. They only deal with licenses, and it's other companies which get the financial risk. The Colecovision Flashback for instance is made by AtGames. And in this case it's the RetroVGS people who put up the money for the Coleco Chameleon.
 

Kyari

Member
Kickstarter Reward #1 $135: 1500 Available. Early Bird Standard Retail Coleco Chameleon. Save 10%. Includes black Coleco Chameleon system, one Coleco Chameleon USB controller, HDMI cable, AC Adapter + pack-in game.

To reiterate, we will be opening up the Chameleon for the Kickstarter campaign. Look for the next Kickstarter Reward tomorrow morning at 8:30 AM ET.


How they got from Mike's previous iron clad $349 for the RetroVGS to $150 is staggeringly confusing. Its absolutely a better price point, but I'm still not going to touch this thing after the Retro VGS Shenanigans. I suspect its not being made in the GOOD OLD U S OF A anymore though at that price point.

Interesting that its HDMI cable as standard given that there is clearly no HDMI Output on the Not-A-Snes Prototype at Toy Fair ...
 
D

Deleted member 74300

Unconfirmed Member
Now hold on! You guys make it seem like the return of the SNES is a bad thing!
 

Shizuka

Member
3SjCDtydAP1WVECdoJymMRCt0muYm8-qeelx_K3FEe90BHplKn9d_Z1MonaDXcJIAYisq33CbzZlRRoldEH5T1r5aWXbbfae0uGhmGofbN-_6VN1IPyGJi2_pLTWzo0Mz36yw7_fPBKjAtUuvuBZzzVcUG6Q8hs=w500-h281-nc
 

clem84

Gold Member
Keep in mind there's no evidence of this being smoke and mirrors or a scam or anything bad yet, just one guy speculating that it's a SNES in that box rather than a custom FPGA device running a SNES core like the company is claiming.

Looking at the pics and the "evidence" so far, that's kind of how I feel too. Complete speculation. We just don't know yet.

Plenty of valid criticism could be leveled at the RetroVGS and now possibly the Chameleon. That being said, I can't shake the feeling of how badly some people want to see this thing fail.

I didn't contribute to the RetroVGS campaign because I felt there were too many unknows and also the price wasn't right. But I still liked the idea. Let's just wait for the campaign to be launched and for everything to be revealed before passing judgment.
 

Vamphuntr

Member
The discussion on Atariage seems pretty convincing. They are speculating it's a SNES mini because of the proprietary plug. Also apparently the "prototype" unit power led isn't even working. And they are hiding the SNES flashcart in a Jaguar cart shell with electrical tape.

135-150$ is a much better price but you have to wonder how they even managed to get a custom SNES FPGA core (on top of the rest) for that price if it's the real deal. The only one available so far requires a chip that cost 50$ according to atariage.

Oh man it seems their weird PR is back on track

http://atariage.com/forums/topic/247145-coleco-chameleon-hardware-speculations/page-34#entry3440083

Kevtris believes it's a lie once again

http://atariage.com/forums/topic/247145-coleco-chameleon-hardware-speculations/page-34#entry3440133
 

Rich!

Member
If anything, I'm happy that this project has led me to being aware of Kevtris' FPGA console project. Now that is something worth waiting for.
 
Just had a thought; maybe they realized the superiority of the RGB Scart cable!

41PIvCQyf%2BL._SX300_.jpg


Someone please take pics of the rear of the screen as well.

Nope, the cord is a 3-in-1 meaning it's just RCA.

Also, notice how the rear of the unit is so beautifully sculpted with electrical tape. I think "Mike" might be changing his name to "Mikelangelo"

rvgs_021316_back2.jpg
 
Plenty of valid criticism could be leveled at the RetroVGS and now possibly the Chameleon. That being said, I can't shake the feeling of how badly some people want to see this thing fail.


I just don't want to be lied to. So far this group/people/whatever either are habitual liars, or really suck at their job of creating a piece of hardware and getting people hyped for it.

I mean c'mon, using an SNES controller, SNES video out, and a SNES flashcart (per smarter people than I) as your prototype doesn't seem shady as shit?
 

dallow_bg

nods at old men
Looking at the pics and the "evidence" so far, that's kind of how I feel too. Complete speculation. We just don't know yet.

It's pretty obvious to me.

Just look at how the SNES JR PCB fits inside a Jaguar shell.
It's exactly the same as the "prototype" and the bit extending from the back is what they covered in black electrical tape.
The open cartridge slot picture from the Toy Fair show's it's the standard SNES slot.

(all pics from the Atariage thread)


"prototype" (they also just deleted this picture today from their Facebook)
Here's Piko's PCB which of course fits into the prototype since it's a standard SNES game.

Side by side.

EDIT: Ah, I see mick posts here and you posted a link to your shots already. :)

I posted some pics at atariage to show the fitment of the snes mini in a jag top shell. they cut some of the plastic off from the inside of the shell though to make a better fit, which im not going to do.

http://imgur.com/a/SOhhK
 
Nobody wants the project to fail out of spite---what folks do want is for the well to not get pissed in, as the exotic computing hardware communal well is FAR from deep and bountiful(history and circumstance has really not been overflowing with boons here) such that each poorly wrought project that only stands to burn general enthusiast folks, as opposed to true believers needing an intervention at best, out from the lot of it will do real damage to the scene where credibility and trust are at an astounding premium.

The fact that the people behind it, again, have decided to wed themselves to the school of thought where they leverage just enough advanced knowledge to tick up the intrigue and tantalize those not on their level/air of authority while drawing pointedly immediate concern from those either roughly near said level or far above them given the world just doesn't contain THAT many people with the sort of skillsets at the fringe of the frayed horizons of tech here---it just speaks volumes especially given the stint of time since the VGS debacle.

I can draw no other conclusion that the sense of and actual earnestness of this project just wasn't there from the start given how it has derailed since---when The Natami Project was more "real" than your odd/maybe FPGA somehow project, that's cause for a long look in a damn mirror and just walking away alone.
 
A scam is taking the money and running with it, knowingly that you have no intention of holding up your end of the bargain. Mike, despite all evidence to the contrary, sadly seems to think he can make this happen if he can just convince people to give him their money. Even if he has to use smoke and mirrors to get that money.

Thats just me taking as positive a view as possible on an increasingly awful looking situation. The flip side is it is all just a scam, one that is laughable in its length and inept execution.
this is how I feel.
 

Cheerilee

Member
So is this just the SNES architecture with a new plastic coating or what?

The hardware was drastically revised to lower costs.

The new hardware clearly isn't ready.

The new hardware was slated to be shown.

One of the system's games already has a fully-functional SNES port.

They jammed an SNES into a Jaguar shell, and jammed the SNES cart into a Jag cart shell. They're going to blow some PR smoke about how "We've only got one game working for now, but this is roughly how it's going to look when it's finished."

Seriously guys, this kind of thing is nothing new.

OK9KAxa.jpg
 

dallow_bg

nods at old men
The hardware was drastically revised to lower costs.

The new hardware clearly isn't ready.

The new hardware was slated to be shown.

One of the system's games already has a fully-functional SNES port.

They jammed an SNES into a Jaguar shell, and jammed the SNES cart into a Jag cart shell. They're going to blow some PR smoke about how "We've only got one game working for now, but this is roughly how it's going to look when it's finished."

Seriously guys, this kind of thing is nothing new.

http://i.imgur.com/OK9KAxa.jpg[img][/QUOTE]

Except for them repeatedly stating that they were going to show off an actual working prototype and are now claiming they wrote a fully working custom FGPA core for SNES which even Kevtris stated is nigh impossible.

This isn't PR smoke. They have no PR.
 

Glowsquid

Member
That was a twist alright.

As amusing as it's been watching this from the sidelines, I'm almost sad for this Mike Kennedy guy : he seems to be someone too attached to his dream of MAKING HIS OWN CONSOLE to realize nobody wants a gimped system in a Jaguar shell to own an handful of neo-retro games on ~cartridges~


i'm an idiot: what does a fgpa do exxactly and why is it apparently so important for these things?
 
That was a twist alright.

As amusing as it's been watching this from the sidelines, I'm almost sad for this Mike Kennedy guy : he seems to be someone too attached to his dream of MAKING HIS OWN CONSOLE to realize nobody wants a gimped system in a Jaguar shell to own an handful of neo-retro games on ~cartridges~


i'm an idiot: what does a fgpa do exxactly and why is it apparently so important for these things?

Don't let your guard down. That's how people get scammed on a crowdfunding site. He knows damn well what people want, that's why he always has plans to bring this great device to the market. Then he shows up to a fucking professional expo with a SNES shoved in a Jag case and refuses to open it. It is definitely funny to watch, but imagine if you were a backer and this is his 6 months later update.

An FPGA is supposedly a miracle device that actually exists. Seriously, it's amazing it isn't used in more applications because it's some real sci-fi shit.

It's a special chip that can reconfigure itself to have whatever kind of chip architecture you want. Yes, and this does exist, it's a real thing. It's used in a few gaming applications like Amiga emulation and even in some SNES Everdrives where they act like special cartridge chips.

The possibilities are great, but I hear (I could be wrong) they're not more widely used because they're not easy to program, up until recently they were extremely expensive (and still aren't cheap) plus- why not just use a proven chip that works?

For classic gaming, the promise of an FPGA is that you can get as close to 100% accurate emulation as possible. Because you can change the architecture and get the chip to behave literally exactly as the original hardware.
 

Vamphuntr

Member
The hardware was drastically revised to lower costs.

The new hardware clearly isn't ready.

The new hardware was slated to be shown.

One of the system's games already has a fully-functional SNES port.

They jammed an SNES into a Jaguar shell, and jammed the SNES cart into a Jag cart shell. They're going to blow some PR smoke about how "We've only got one game working for now, but this is roughly how it's going to look when it's finished."

Seriously guys, this kind of thing is nothing new.

[.img]http://i.imgur.com/OK9KAxa.jpg[/img]

I would say it's not a very similar scenario for two reasons. I doubt anyone has any issues with MS having games played on a devkit instead of the final hardware at gaming conventions because we know MS has the manpower and funding required to actually produce and release a console. They have a track record both as hardware and software maker.

Secondly, there is a big difference between showing up with a PC (devkit of your expected hardware) and a complete board of another console hidden with duct tape pretending it's your own novel creation. The latter is basically amateur hour especially when you are crowdfunding your console and your previous crowdfunding campaign was a disaster.


It would be much simpler for them to team up with the people behind the Retron 5 or Retrofreak and make a special Coleco emubox in a jaguar shell release with Colecovision support on top of the rest and make PCB or flashcarts for their cartridges games compatible with one of the slot.

I don't think there is malicious intent behind their deception. Mike seems a passionate retrogamer and really wants to make his dream hardware but I think it's starting to cloud his judgment a bit.

He and the other on the team have a tendency to double down when challenged on the project and they usually end up losing face badly. Just today on their FB page they were presenting the hardware shown at the Toy Fair as a custom system they wrote a SNES FPGA core for. They started replying to naysayers that it wasn't a SNES in there until someone used the picture where you see the SNES plug and cables and the duct tape from behind and they had to quickly take the picture down from their FB page.

When you present features that are bound to attract enthusiasts that spend years tearing down and building hardware you need to deliver or else they will see through your deception.

They are supposed to reveal the board of the console for the Kickstarter. It will make or break it. If they lose face again the project will be done.

If they can deliver an FPGA SNES core on top of the other cores and all this for 150$ it will be a really impressive feat and victory for them.

Apparently, the only SNES FPGA core that is fully functional so far is from a Japanese enthusiast with a chip costing 50$ on top of the board according to Atariage.If they can beat that good for them.
 

brainpann

Member
Quick question-

Why are they insisting on using Atari Jaguar casing mold for this? In this day and age of 3D printing, they cant come up with something better or at least something new? Let me just say, id be equally upset if they used the mold for any other retro system.
 
Quick question-

Why are they insisting on using Atari Jaguar casing mold for this? In this day and age of 3D printing, they cant come up with something better or at least something new? Let me just say, id be equally upset if they used the mold for any other retro system.

Because Mike Kennedy (the head of this project) thought buying the old molds means you're half way finished with making a new game console.

It started when the tooling company that made the Atari Jaguar wanted to sell the molds and found out the market for thousand pound paperweights is pretty slim, so Mike bought them real cheap. He did a few runs of clear case Jag replacement shells but then had this idea to make a game console. The consistent sticking point he'll always argue is that "using the Jag molds is saving us up to $500,000 in tooling costs!" And hence, his quest for a game console was born.

Also, for those who don't know, right after Jag production ceased, the molds were repurposed to make a dental camera. In order to do this, they deleted the rear panel. But that means Mike has a hole in the back of his console (maybe his head too) that he'll have to make new tooling to cover up. Or just 3D print. Or just cover with electrical tape. Also, he'll need to make a new front panel since he wants USB ports there and because there's a big Atari logo in the middle he'll need to cover up.
 

Secret Owl

Neo Member
Which is just a rip off of a xbox 360 controller.

Yes. The fine people at xbox woke up one day and said "what if we created a controller with two sticks, four faces buttons, an 8-way directional pad, start/select equivalents, two index-finger triggers, and two shoulder buttons?"

And that's when it all began.
 
Because Mike Kennedy (the head of this project) thought buying the old molds means you're half way finished with making a new game console.

It started when the tooling company that made the Atari Jaguar wanted to sell the molds and found out the market for thousand pound paperweights is pretty slim, so Mike bought them real cheap. He did a few runs of clear case Jag replacement shells but then had this idea to make a game console. The consistent sticking point he'll always argue is that "using the Jag molds is saving us up to $500,000 in tooling costs!" And hence, his quest for a game console was born.

Also, for those who don't know, right after Jag production ceased, the molds were repurposed to make a dental camera. In order to do this, they deleted the rear panel. But that means Mike has a hole in the back of his console (maybe his head too) that he'll have to make new tooling to cover up. Or just 3D print. Or just cover with electrical tape. Also, he'll need to make a new front panel since he wants USB ports there and because there's a big Atari logo in the middle he'll need to cover up.

Harsh but probably true.
 
Alright guys, stop me if you heard this joke before...

A guy walks into a toy fair to show off his prototype.

vlcsnap_2016_02_13_10h02m27s59.png


Turns out it's just a SNES stuffed in a Jag shell and a cartridge with an Everdrive held on the back with electrical tape.


Then he says:
rvgs_021316_update.png


Good one! Right?!

Chameleon indeed.

SNES PCB inside of a Jaguar shell with a Colecovision branding. Dr. Frankenstein would be proud.
 
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