Privileged By Kyle Korver - Jazz's Korver reflects on racism, white privilege

BraveOne

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Feb 2, 2017
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Your study has shown that white males suffer other kinds of discrimination and disadvantages, considering that women with a criminal record are largely preferred over men, even white ones.
Women have a higher chance of getting more senior jobs, I've known that for a while, I came across this article on LinkedIn last week that even confirmed it

No, I have explained the notion of "stereotype" to you because quite obviously you're unable to make that distinction. Racism is focused on race, stereotyped can be any preconception that people have towards certain demographics. What your study showed, is that black people are just as likely to fall prone to these stereotypes as white people.
The study shows that Black people suffer more from racial stereotypes than white people. That's is why the Criminal record cross analysis comes into play. Being white and a criminal still puts you further than being black and no record. Because of racial stereotypes, something white people don't have to deal with - they're privileged

No, that's not a privilege, that's how it should be. Being treated fairly and equally is not a special right.
Being treated equally is something that does not happen natively, it depends on who you are and a huge part of that does come down to race
 
Dec 15, 2011
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Dude you calling out people over victimhood is drive in movie level of projection.
"Downplaying blatant bigotry is ok when I do it about my own display of bigotry.

Furthermore, not only will I downplay my bigotry I'll throw in my usual effort to deflect by calling you names and belittling you whenever I'm challenged.

You'll never see me show accountability for my own poor behaviour or displays of prejudice and hypocrisy though. I'll just retreat into snarky non-sequiturs and then exit the thread for a few days or weeks, then return and carry on as before."
 
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MacReady13

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Jun 22, 2018
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I can't understand how society is today. Honestly, I'm just so over this bullshit. Blaming white people for having a perceived privilege over black people! This just further puts a divide in between the races, and further perpetuates a bullshit theory today that says white people the world over have it easier than any other race.

I live in Australia (Melbourne to be exact) and that type of bullshit is starting to permeate down here as well. People want to constantly play the victim. They find it hard to move on but love the comfort of feeling like people are caring for them and paying them attention. Just please stop this victim blaming bullshit. It doesn't work. The majority of society sees through it and isn't falling for this crap.
 

strange headache

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The study shows that Black people suffer more from racial stereotypes than white people. That's is why the Criminal record cross analysis comes into play. Being white and a criminal still puts you further than being black and no record. Because of racial stereotypes, something white people don't have to deal with - they're privileged
Your study clearly shows that different people suffer different kinds of discrimination and negative stereotypes. You've just cherry picked racial discrimination, because of your selective reading bias. Point is that nobody is free from discriminatory behavior and nobody is truly without preconceived stereotypes, be it white or black people.

Being "further than others" in some regards does not change the fact that you still encounter discrimination. If white people don't have to deal with racial stereotypes, they have to deal with others, such as your preconceived notions that they are privileged. You're merely perpetuating that which you are so decidedly opposed against by perpetuating the stereotype of "white privilege". By considering white people privileged by default, you're prone to the same discriminatory behavior as the racists you are railing against, simply because you stopped judging people solely based on merit.

Being treated equally is something that does not happen natively, it depends on who you are and a huge part of that does come down to race
Being treated equally is something that is derived from the legal, political and social framework of a society and the equal application of the law. Work on that instead of parading around this silly pseudo-notion that ultimately solves nothing at all but only creates more social strife and division.
 
Dec 15, 2011
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Being treated equally is something that is derived from the legal, political and social framework of a society and the equal application of the law. Work on that instead of parading around this silly pseudo-notion that ultimately solves nothing at all but only creates more social strife and division.
This is it.
No technicalities, no special cases, no nuance. Just this.
 

matt404au

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Apr 25, 2009
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Discrimination is not white privilege, because it is not a privilege to not be discriminated against, on the contrary, it should be the default. The person receiving the job offer is not "privileged", but the person not receiving an offer is discriminated against. That's a big difference.

Furthermore, the study you've posted does not refer to racism to explain these inequalities, but several other factors, such as perceived stereotypes regardless of race:



In fact, the word "racism" isn't even mentioned once in the whole study and for good reason. The presumed stereotype that unemployed people are more prone to crime than employed ones and that black people commit worse crimes than white ones, is a common stereotype held across all of american society. This is evidenced by the fact that such common misconceptions are also at play when it comes to male and female employment seekers with a criminal past:



This cannot be explained by racism against black people alone, as it is a commonly held belief, even among black people, that women are generally less violent and commit less severe crimes or are more law-obedient, than males. Not to mention that males with a criminal past are treated less advantageous than women with a criminal past, which completely flies in the face of the notion of "white male privilege".

Moreover, white men with a criminal record are less likely to receive a response than black women with a criminal record:



This can only mean that skin-color is neither the main deciding factor, not the only deciding factor when it comes to employment discrimination. If racism were that prevalent, we would otherwise not observe these differences and not have a preference towards black women compared to white males in that regard.

In essence, what this study shows is that discrimination is not always the result of racism, but a complex mix of commonly held stereotyped that are shared among the general population regardless of race and gender. Simply shouting "white privilege" ain't cutting it in order to get to the root causes of social inequality.
Missed you baby
 

matt404au

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White Privileged is birthed from Discrimination, the two go hand in hand. It's a privilege to live in American and not somehow be discriminated against because of the colour of your skin. The person's who got the job offer got it because they benefited from not suffering all the perceived stereotypes they the others did. That is a privilege that was only afforded to the white applicants.




You've just described racism in your attempt to not describe racism, this studies core was to look at inequality, and the research showed that racism is still alive through the misconception employers have about race



You've described racism so well but can't fathom to actually say it. It's a privilege for white people to not have to deal with negative stereotypes, stereotypes that even you admit exist but you can't be moved to call it what it really is.
When you say that a particular group of people is disadvantaged because of an irrelevant, immutable characteristic, and demonstrate why and how with quantifiable evidence, you inspire me to want to help that group.

When you complain about another group of people doing well and assert that it’s because of an irrelevant, immutable characteristic without quantifiable evidence, then demand that society effectively rob them to pay you, you inspire me to tell you to take a hike.
 

ipukespiders

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False. Most black men marry the mothers of their children or are very involved in their children's lives. A small percentage have no involvement... Even anecdotally, I see black men involved in the lives of their children... And so do they...

Single parent households doesn't equal absent from their children's lives.
Do you know how the numbers break down?
Married
Not married but still living in the same home
Living elsewhere, but still involved
Not involved
 

highrider

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Sorry brothers, not trying to deny anyone’s experience or perception, but I’ve run out of fucks to give, especially from the mega-wealthy virtue signalers. I’ve got my own problems.
 

Whitesnake

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Jan 31, 2018
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Sorry brothers, not trying to deny anyone’s experience or perception, but I’ve run out of fucks to give, especially from the mega-wealthy virtue signalers. I’ve got my own problems.
But.. but... if you don’t blindly support their narrative, you’re just as bad as the KKK!

For real, it’s pretty hard to respect Korver’s opinions on what working class people should be doing when he sits on a throne of money. He makes 7 mil a year, and the guy who he thinks was profiled makes 5 mil a year. Those dudes don’t have any right to tell working class people how they should live. Normal people have prblems and commitments that millionaires do not.
 

Durask

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One question I've never been able to get an answer I would be happy with.

What is the end game of wokeness?
Or, more accurately, how to the woke envision their ideal society?
 

DeafTourette

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You eat at strip clubs? :messenger_grimmacing_:messenger_medmask:
Dude... The best ones are actually rated A by the food inspector office. Best lemon pepper wings in Atlanta are at Magic City.

ETA, if you ever come to Atlanta, I'll show you the best places for food. I don't go to strip clubs anymore (religion) but you don't have to be afraid to eat at one. Just avoid the hole in the wall ones... I can give you a list of the ones to patronize.
 
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Lionel Richie

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Got to say, it's pretty amazing to see the strong reactions. I enjoyed the reading, didn't feel much like he was tiptoeing around a huge taboo too much. There was some of that, but it's usually worse in stuff like this. Don't necessarily agree with everything and other chunks of it I'm not sure how would be applicable to my social interactions but I respect his opinion. He certainly lived through more shit happening people around him than I did. It's nice seeing the world view of people who actually have stuff to share even if that's not how I view the world.

More than anything, I though it was a very mild read. Don't get the somewhat awkward perhaps excessive sanctification going on just as I obviously don't understand people thinking he said KILL WHITEY in bold. Social media fucked up any conversation forever.
 
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DeafTourette

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It is important. But I can see why some would want to say otherwise. Nobody wants to be responsible adults anymore.
He can do what he wants. Nothing illegal about being at a strip club. Irresponsible? Yes, because he had a back to back. But in the grand scheme... Not important because he probably was going to just fly there on his own dime... But got caught up in something he didn't plan on that was later DROPPED ...
 

ViceUniverse

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So you admit if he was responsible, none of this would have happened to him? I don't see how you just look past that.
He actually is responsible because he wasn't acting excessive at the club, he was action normal (hopefully).

What's irresponsible is that he still went with a game played that night, and one the next day. But that is basketball related, not guy at a strip club related.

As long as he was cool at the club, there's no irresponsible behavior to warrant the attention of the police.
 
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And you cant make that claim only I can
Anyone who understands love knows that empathy is a large element of it.
Your lack of empathy for anyone that doesn't align with your views is one of your defining traits.
That you have engineered dishonest snark in order for you to more comfortably push your bullying rhetoric of "I am right because I say I am" is the self-defeating evidence that disproves your claim.

You do not show or demonstrate love.
Your dishonest and demeaning rhetoric has shown you to be someone who uses arrogance and agenda to drive conversation.
These are not the tools of love. Nor are they the tools of integrity or credibility.

And, whilst you claim to preach love, let's not forget how you endorsed a comment that wished for another commentator and their family to be "slaughtered like cattle". (1, 2)
 
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switchback27

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He actually is responsible because he wasn't acting excessive at the club, he was action normal (hopefully).

What's irresponsible is that he still went with a game played that night, and one the next day. But that is basketball related, not guy at a strip club related.

As long as he was cool at the club, there's no irresponsible behavior to warrant the attention of the police.
Exactly. I thought that when Korver wrote that sentence, I'm relatively certain he felt that way because he's a co-employee, someone you work with together to reach a common goal (in their case, an NBA title). If your company is rushing to meet a deadline and your co-worker is not at work the next day because he was arrested after being out and about somewhere late at night, I'd respond with two statements:

1. What the fuck?
2. Fuck, we're gonna have to do his part too. Goddammit.

Reaction 2 is not because the co-worker is black, white, Mongolian, or Egyptian, but because he's putting unnecessary stress on me and other co-workers through his irresponsibility. Now, if I were to discover later that my co-worker is an innocent victim of an undue arrest (which I believe the case with Thabo), then I would feel kinda bad that I blamed the dude, but the fact remains that the rest of us had to pick up the slack. The best I can do is say, "sorry for blaming ya" and then we drop the matter.

Now, I don't encounter as many situations involving race as Korver or any other NBA player, so that probably influences the lens that he remembers that situation through. However, I would not have come to the conclusion that my initial reaction was race-based; Korver thought differently. I can respect him sharing his thoughts, but I disagree with his self-analysis regarding where his conclusion came from.

As for his final statement, I agree with exactly half of it--it's always time to listen, but I will not shut up. Sharing thoughts and having them come into collision is how we work out differences and find better ways.
 

Saruhashi

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The guy is entitled to his opinion obviously but wouldn't he be making some serious money? 7 million a year?

Fuck, lads, I'd break down in tears right now if I even won 50k on the lottery.

So I feel a little indifferent about some rich dude lecturing me about "privilege".
I'd gladly bear his burden of guilt if he wants to give me a share of his salary.
Otherwise I have more important shit to worry about and none of it makes me feel particularly privileged.

It always just feels like when I hear about "privilege" I am hearing it from rich cunts.
Or, at least, I am hearing it from cunts who are far richer than me.

It's always some celebrity or some little rich college prick who's telling me all about it.
Is it some kind of way for them to distract from their ACTUAL privilege of being rich?

To hell with white privilege and male privilege I want some of that financial privilege!
Like, fuck, if someone wants to throw a few hundred grand my way I'll gladly feel as guilty as a guilty man can feel.
Otherwise, you can fuck right off.

Oh wow, a high profile celebrity acknowledged his privilege?
Who'd have thought such a person would have privilege?
I wonder if I'd feel privileged too, with millions of dollars in the bank...
 

Jon Neu

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Jan 21, 2018
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"Please, see how much of a good person I am by hating on myself and the evil white society for the TERRIBLE things that happen to these poor multimillionaire human beans".

Kyle Korver.
 
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"Please, see how much of a good person I am by hating on myself and the evil white society for the TERRIBLE things that happen to these poor multimillionaire human beans".

Kyle Korver.
Pretending he wrote this only about the problems "millionaires" face is intentionally disingenuous. He is talking about a problem that affects those at all levels of society.
 

Jon Neu

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don't understand people thinking he said KILL WHITEY in bold.
What he is saying is "everything bad that happens to black people, is white people's fault".

And that white people as a whole, should repent, feel ashamed and hold everybody accountable (meaning you have to confront and bully other white people when you perceived they are being racist, and this type of people thinks EVERYTHING is racist).

Pretending he wrote this only about the problems "millionaires" face is intentionally disingenuous. He is talking about a problem that affects those at all levels of society.
Obviously, but it's even more funnier when he mentions NBA players as some kind of poor defensesless people against the evil white society that he is part of.
 
May 22, 2018
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Obviously, but it's even more funnier when he mentions NBA players as some kind of poor defenseless people against the evil white society that he is part of.
Why should they be protected any less than you or me? Why should their experiences mean any less than yours or mine? Because they are rich? Because that is fucking ridiculous.


These are mostly people who come from humble origins. They are very familiar with the struggles that occur at the lower levels of society. They did not sprout out of the ground and into the world with untold millions and fame. Almost every single one of them had to earn what they have and a lot of them came from nothing. They faced the same problems as everyone else and more.


You are sitting here acting as if they were always in positions of power and wealth and that is not even remotely true. Just because they are rich now does not mean their experiences from when they were poor any less meaningful or insightful. Where they are now should have no bearing on their opinions or world views. It should matter where they came from.
 
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Jon Neu

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Why should they be protected any less than you or me? Why should their experiences mean any less than yours or mine? Because they are rich? That is fucking stupid.
The hell are you talking about? They are much more protected than you and me.

They are very familiar with the struggles that occur at the lower levels of society. They did not sprout out of the ground and into the world with untold millions and fame. Almost every single one of them had to earn what they have and a lot of them came from nothing. They faced the same problems as everyone else.
Yeah, I'm aware they have the same mentality of blaming the evil white male for their problems instead of holding themselves and the black community responsibles for their own actions.

You are sitting here acting as if they were always in positions of power and wealth and that is not even remotely true. Just because they are rich now does not mean their experiences from when they were poor any less meaningful or insightful. Where they are now should have no bearing on their opinions or world views. It should matter where they came from.
This are physical freaks we are talking about. They had a position of power very early in their lives by just how big and much powerful than anybody else they were.

I guess that's what your people call a "privilege". So they should feel bad for how genetically privileged they have been all their lives.
 

betrayal

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Why should they be protected any less than you or me? Why should their experiences mean any less than yours or mine? Because they are rich? Because that is fucking ridiculous.
If you encounter racist people, you call them out and the racists will be punished. That's how our social and our system of justice works.

If there is permanent racism in everybody's (non-white) life and we have a social and justice system that punishes racism, then why do we rarely hear about things like that. Shouldn't there be like thousands of lawsuits on a daily basis? I mean seriously, it's easy nowadays to record something or have a witness and take it to court.
But we don't see any of this. Even in social media there's more racism towards white people than all other PoC combined.


These are mostly people who come from humble origins. They are very familiar with the struggles that occur at the lower levels of society. They did not sprout out of the ground and into the world with untold millions and fame. Almost every single one of them had to earn what they have and a lot of them came from nothing. They faced the same problems as everyone else.
If they face the same problems, why are their results in life are so different compared to other people's life? Why's the majority of people cheering these guys white, if the majority is racist at the same time?
 
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Yeah, I'm aware they have the same mentality of blaming the evil white male for their problems instead of holding themselves and the black community responsibles for their own actions.
I keep seeing this being said over and over in this thread and yet it doesn't seem to occur to any of you that the same could easily be said about the white community holding itself accountable. But no its the Black community thats in the wrong without question for some reason. And nobody seems to see the irony or hypocrisy in that attitude.

And I say this as a white guy btw just to be clear.

This are physical freaks we are talking about. They had a position of power very early in their lives by just how big and much powerful than anybody else they were.

I guess that's what your people call a "privilege". So they should feel bad for how genetically privileged they have been all their lives.
Thats not how "privilege" works sorry. In fact them being minorities as well as being incredibly physically imposing actually puts them at risk of even greater discrimination and danger because people are more likely to incorrectly assume they are dangerous due to their physical attributes.

If you encounter racist people, you call them out and the racists will be punished. That's how our social and our system of justice works.

If there is permanent racism in everybody's (non-white) life and we have a social and justice system that punishes racism, then why do we rarely hear about things like that. Shouldn't there be like thousands of lawsuits on a daily basis? I mean seriously, it's easy nowadays to record something or have a witness and take it to court.
This happens all the time though? In just the last 2 years we have numerous stories about people being caught on video being racist as hell and losing their jobs etc etc. Thats not even mentioning the numerous videos and reports of excessive force and police brutality that we regularly see reported in the news in recent years.


So no its not "rare" its pretty damn common at this point. Though I guess that depends what your definition of common is.
 
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Jon Neu

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I keep seeing this being said over and over in this thread and yet it doesn't seem to occur to any of you that the same could easily be said about the white community holding itself accountable. But no its the Black community thats in the wrong without question for some reason. And nobody seems to see the irony or hypocrisy in that attitude.
Sorry dude, false equivalency. Is the black community and it's "allies" the one trying to blame all their problems on white people. They are the ones demanding other people to do shit for them so they feel better.

Thats not how "privilege" works sorry
Hahahaha

It's so funny to see you talk like you are an expert on "how privilege works". You are so full of your own made up shit you even believe it.

In fact them being minorities as well as being incredibly physically imposing actually puts them at risk of even greater discrimination and danger because people are more likely to incorrectly assume they are dangerous due to their physical attributes.
Oh, the neverending song of the poor minorities. It never ceases to bring tears to my eyes.

If they are big and strong, they are victims. If they are small and weak, they are victims. If they are average, they are victims.

Fucking white people!
 
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Sorry dude, false equivalency. Is the black community and it's "allies" the one trying to blame all their problems on white people. They are the ones demanding other people to do shit for them so they feel better.
So if I am understanding you correctly

Minorities asking white people to hold themselves accountable = racist and not okay at all in any way whatsoever

White people telling minorities to hold themselves accountable = Totally not racist at all and its absolutely fine


Am I getting that right?

Hahahaha

It's so funny to see you talk like you are an expert on "how privilege works". You are so full of your own made up shit you even believe it.
Expert? Absolutely not. Not even close. I am someone who benefits from white privilege so I am by no means an expert on not having it, but I have had it explained to me enough and seen it explained to others enough to know the basics.

Oh, the neverending song of the poor minorities. It never ceases to bring tears to my eyes.

If they are big and strong, they are victims. If they are small and weak, they are victims. If they are average, they are victims.

Fucking white people!
I can't tell if you are joking or you are just being intentionally dense at this point.
 

Jon Neu

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So if I am understanding you correctly

Minorities asking white people to hold themselves accountable = racist and not okay at all in any way whatsoever

White people telling minorities to hold themselves accountable = Totally not racist at all and its absolutely fine


Am I getting that right?
Sorry, sometimes I forget I'm dealing with the SJW type of "logical" brain.

I'll explain it to you in a very easy way:

-Minorities asking white people to hold themselves accountable for everything bad that happens to everyone who is not white = entitled racists that just want to exploit society for their own ego.

-White people telling that everybody should feel accountable for themselves instead of blaming and asking other people to solve your problems = actual normal way of conducting your way through life with out creating a fake enemy to blame everything on him while you demand a position of power ironically by claiming that you are an eternal victim.

I hope you can understand it now.

I can't tell if you are joking or you are just being intentionally dense at this point.
Expert? Absolutely not. Not even close. I am someone who benefits from white privilege so I am by no means an expert on not having it, but I have had it explained to me enough and seen it explained to others enough to know the basics.
You are just an informatized vehicle of irony.

My fucking God.
 

TheGreatYosh

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Jul 19, 2018
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Look I'm just laughing at what a pathetic piece of cowardly shit this Korver guy is. It's just funny to me.

I assume the other guy was banned for saying black people are "too uncivilized to act human" which I have not said.

You've been banned more than me, kiddo. Hit the alert if you're feeling lucky.
He’s trying to scare you into toeing the line. Also, he’s trying to signal to a mod that you should be banned too. He’s so lame.
 
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Sorry, sometimes I forget I'm dealing with the SJW type of "logical" brain.

I'll explain it to you in a very easy way:

-Minorities asking white people to hold themselves accountable for everything bad that happens to everyone who is not white = entitled racists that just want to exploit society for their own ego.

-White people telling that everybody should feel accountable for themselves instead of blaming and asking other people to solve your problems = actual normal way of conducting your way through life with out creating a fake enemy to blame everything on him while you demand a position of power ironically by claiming that you are an eternal victim.


And on that incredibly tone deaf and hypocritical note I think I am done here lol
 
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betrayal

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This happens all the time though? In just the last 2 years we have numerous stories about people being caught on video being racist as hell and losing their jobs etc etc. Thats not even mentioning the numerous videos and reports of excessive force and police brutality that we regularly see reported in the news in recent years.

So no its not "rare" its pretty damn common at this point. Though I guess that depends what your definition of common is.
"Numerous" is what? A two-digit number?

There are more than 100 million PoC / non-white people in the US and according to you everybody experiences racism on a regular basis. If only 10% of the PoC report harassment once per year via social media or take it to court, then we would have an average of ~27397 documented incidents every single day.

Of course I'm not saying there's no racism. There are many racist assholes out their that need to get called out, educated and punished for their stupidity. But exaggerating the problem by the factor 10.000 or higher seems a bit excessive. Picturing problems bigger than they are may be a good way to get votes and followers, but only until people start to think for themselves. Last time that happened was the November 8, 2016. Not because Trump was smarter, but because people finally re-discovered their brains and their capacity of thinking. And you don't need a crystal ball to see, that the exact same thing will happen again in 2020. Stupidity is not a right, even if some democrats would like it that way.

And don't start again with police brutality against blacks etc.. This myth was already refuted countless times by statistics and police reports and you know that. If you forgot, just check google or older threads here on GAF.
 
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And don't start again with police brutality against blacks etc.. This myth was already refuted countless times by statistics and police reports and you know that. If you forgot, just check google or older threads here on GAF.
The fact you think police brutality against minorities is a "myth" tells me all I need to know.