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Drama Clickbait PS4 Games are Interactive Movies (let's hash this low level bait out)

DForce

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There is lots of games nowadays that go for the cinematic presentation over solid gameplay, that's not a Sony "exclusive", nevertheless Sony first party output since the ps3 days is laser focused on the premium presentation side of the spectrum.
The "false statement" about the gameplay is your own sacred opinion, noone is going to take it away from you, but you should also consider that users who enjoy scenarios with more complex end deep gameplay, might find what games like GoW or Uncharted have to offer lacking.
For heavens sake someone in here actually draw a comparison between God of War and games like DMC and Bayonetta, making it sound like the latter ones are button mashers :messenger_face_screaming:
Sony what a lot of triple A developers are doing.

The "false statement" about the gameplay is your own sacred opinion, noone is going to take it away from you, but you should also consider that users who enjoy scenarios with more complex end deep gameplay, might find what games like GoW or Uncharted have to offer lacking.
It's a false statement if you're simply just wrong.

You keep replying to my post, but you still haven't explained in dept why.

The reason why you're not doing it is because you can't.


So, explain why or just don't bother debating this topic.
 

Croatoan

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They aren't movies but they are extremely samey feeling to me. IDK, i feel like after uncharted 3 everything became sorta similar to uncharted (third person action game with similar camera positions).

There are a couple of exceptions of coarse.
 
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Danjin44

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They aren't movies but they are extremely samey feeling to me. IDK, i feel like after uncharted 3 everything became sorta similar to uncharted (third person action game with similar camera positions).
Actually Uncharted games are not over the shoulder unless you are aiming. Also both games like God Hand, Vanquish and RE4 have over shoulder camera it doesn’t mean they play the same.
 

Croatoan

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Actually Uncharted games are not over the shoulder unless you are aiming. Also both games like God Hand, Vanquish and RE4 have over shoulder camera it doesn’t mean they play the same.
I am just saying these games all felt the same for some reason to me. They did not play exactly the same though.

The last of us
Uncharted 4
Days gone
God of War
Horizon

I would love to see a few FPS games like the PS3 era.

Also, it hurts that Sony never made their own battle royal :( .
 
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Zaffo

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Sony what a lot of triple A developers are doing.



It's a false statement if you're simply just wrong.

You keep replying to my post, but you still haven't explained in dept why.

The reason why you're not doing it is because you can't.


So, explain why or just don't bother debating this topic.

What should i explain exactly?
Why something "isn't" there?
Those game are all formulaic and straightforward triple A mainstream games that shine thanks to their cinematic presentation, i can't talk about what i don't see, that should be on you since you see all this complexity.

I can talk you about proper character action games, fighting games, rts, grand strategy, space sims, management sims, crpg, fps and so on and so forth, since i actually love getting into obscure and demanding systems in a game, the burden of the proving that there is depth in those sony first party games is on you, since i cannot prove that something doesn't exist.
 
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Senhua

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Why we cannot call the game which mainly designed with the story been center of it and then do gameplay around that center : "movie game"?
All the gameplay loop is designed just for story, thats way been called story driven games by the maker itself and usually once you done it once, you done with it forever.
And yes this not just for Sony western first party games but almost all AAA western single player games these days.
 
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Danjin44

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I am just saying these games all felt the same for some reason to me. They did not play exactly the same though.

The last of us
Uncharted 4
Days gone
God of War
Horizon
99% of Japanese games are in third person, are you telling me they all feel the same because they have same type of camera angel? I'm sorry but thats very shallow way looking at games.
 
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MiguelItUp

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Like others have said, this does just sound like a bizarre fanboy argument, or something. To be honest, this is the first time I've read such a thing. If you REALLY wanted to, you could probably say ANY game that's very story driven (cinematics, cutscenes, etc.) is an "interactive movie", which I think is still ridiculous.

For the record, I think the only games I could even jokingly label as an interactive movies, would have to be Until Dawn, or David Cage games. :messenger_winking_tongue:
 
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DForce

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What should i explain exactly?
Why something "isn't" there?
Those game are all formulaic and straightforward triple A mainstream games that shine thanks to their cinematic presentation, i can't talk about what i don't see, that should be on you since you see all this complexity.

I can talk you about proper character action games, fighting games, rts, grand strategy, space sims, management sims, crpg, fps and so on and so forth, since i actually love getting into obscure and demanding systems in a game, the burden of the proving that there is depth in those sony first party games is on you, since i cannot prove that something doesn't exist.
I offered proof with no counter argument.

People said Gears and Halo have more gameplay elements. I used these two games because the people who call Sony games movies do not put those two games in the same category.

That is the point.

Gears and Halo have used similar linear structure in their storymode campaigns, same with a lot of other triple A titles.

But Sony is suppose to be unique and be more "laser focused"?

No, that simply doesn't hold water.


In Gears you have cutscenes.


In between those cutscenes, you're walking to your next destination which is filled with dialog. You frequently stop to fight enemies in a boxed section, similar to the Last of Us.



Rinse and repeat throughout the game.

There's also boss fights at the end of these sections.

And people want to tell me TLOU has far less gameplay than Gears?

It's a complete joke.

Comparing the two it's clear that people are using it as an insult rather than being completely rational.
 
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Senhua

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I am just saying these games all felt the same for some reason to me. They did not play exactly the same though.

The last of us
Uncharted 4
Days gone
God of War
Horizon

I would love to see a few FPS games like the PS3 era.

Also, it hurts that Sony never made their own battle royal :( .
They been made with the same design principle :
- Thinking "What story we will tell in this game" first and foremost
- And design the gameplay only to accommodate that story
- So this kind of games usually have a shallow or serviceable gameplay which just to serve to bridge between cutscenes
- There are several exception like: Kojima's games as the gameplay aspect have a same portion as the story but for western AAA dev usually thats it
 
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Danjin44

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They been made with the same design principle :
- Thinking "What story we will tell in this game" first and foremost
- And design the gameplay only to accommodate that story
- So this kind of games usually have a shallow or serviceable gameplay which just to serve to bridge between cutscenes
- There are several exception like: Kojima's games as the gameplay aspect have a same portion as the story but for western AAA dev usually thats it
Thats usually how western developers make their game for most part. For game like Astral Chain developers mostly focus on gameplay of you controlling two character at once and then story came afterwards.
 

Spukc

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Thats usually how western developers make their game for most part. For game like Astral Chain developers mostly focus on gameplay of you controlling two character at once and then story came afterwards.
First thing that reminded me off was that never released sonic game (crackers)
That turned out into knuckles chaotix
 

Yoshi

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Saying this about all Sony games or exclusively about Sony games is bullshit of course, but Sony does focus pretty strongly on games where the main focus is on narrative and film-like presentation. As much as I hate GTA5, it is not a fair comparison to make, because GTA - as most Rockstar games - is focussed primarily on creating a world that seems real and to build a sandbox within. In the end, even though I do not like the more movie-ish games (by Sony or otherwise), noting a game is made with a similar mindset as a movie is not a criticism per se, but just an observation on its aims. That is, unless it is used to console warmonger. But everything people say to console warmonger is plain bullshit, anyway.
 
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Zaffo

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I offered proof with no counter argument.

People said Gears and Halo have more gameplay elements. I used these two games because the people who call Sony games movies do not put those two games in the same category.

That is the point.

Gears and Halo have used similar linear structure in their storymode campaigns, same with a lot of other triple A titles.

But Sony is suppose to be unique and be more "laser focused"?

No, that simply doesn't hold water.


In Gears you have cutscenes.


In between those cutscenes, you're walking to your next destination which is filled with dialog. You frequently stop to fight enemies in a boxed section, similar to the Last of Us.



Rinse and repeat throughout the game.

There's also boss fights at the end of these sections.

And people want to tell me TLOU has far less gameplay than Gears?

It's a complete joke.

Comparing the two it's clear that people are using it as an insult rather than being completely rational.
You cannot approach this argument with broad strokes saying that all those games have cutscenes, fights, and boss battles, by that logic every game is the same because you just push buttons in front of a monitor.
It's a matter of what does the gameplay feels like, how much depth there is to it, how fun and rewarding is to engage with those systems and so on and so forth.

In your standard triple A cinematic experience the gameplay is often barebone in service of moving the player and the story forward, without creating point of attrition that would make for a break in the flow of the presentation, and that's usually the case in most of Sony first party output.
 
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Saying this about all Sony games or exclusively about Sony games is bullshit of course, but Sony does focus pretty strongly on games where the main focus is on narrative and film-like presentation. As much as I hate GTA5, it is not a fair comparison to make, because GTA - as most Rockstar games - is focussed primarily on creating a world that seems real and to build a sandbox within. In the end, even though I do not like the more movie-ish games (by Sony or otherwise), noting a game is made with a similar mindset as a movie is not a criticism per se, but just an observation on its aims. That is, unless it is used to console warmonger. But everything people say to console warmonger is plain bullshit, anyway.
GTA V's campaign is full of cut-scenes, scripted events and attempts to be like movies, though. It's open world is more there to contextualize the story than to be enjoyed divorced from the story.
 
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Senhua

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Thats usually how western developers make their game for most part. For game like Astral Chain developers mostly focus on gameplay of you controlling two character at once and then story came afterwards.
Yup I agree: MHW - Astral Chain - Mario - Zelda - Etc is on the other side of the line as they mainly created the gameplay first and then do the story around it.
Because the constrait of budget and difference cultural taste (asian prefer stylish gameplay while west more with story and realism) very few games utilized both AFAIK like NierA and Kojima's game.
 

DForce

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You cannot approach this argument with broad strokes saying that all those games have cutscenes, fights, and boss battles, by that logic every game is the same because you just push buttons in front of a monitor.
It's a matter of what does the gameplay feels like, how much depth there is to it, how fun and rewarding is to engage with those systems and so on and so forth.

In your standard triple A cinematic experience the gameplay is often barebone in service of moving the player and the story forward, without creating point of attrition that would make for a break in the flow of the presentation, and that's usually the case in most of Sony first party output.
Yet you say this.

Give it a rest op, those games are good but not for the gameplay part, and that's fine.

I clearly said the structure is similar.

You don't fight during those walking sections.

You don't fight during those cutscenes.

You fight when you're in those so called "boxed areas"

I'm still waiting for you to explain why and you still not doing it. You're just arguing for the sake of arguing and you simply cannot explain your position.


In your standard triple A cinematic experience the gameplay is often barebone in service of moving the player and the story forward, without creating point of attrition that would make for a break in the flow of the presentation, and that's usually the case in most of Sony first party output.
That's the case for games in general.


I can give you many examples.
 
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Spukc

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GTA V's campaign is full of cut-scenes, scripted events and attempts to be like movies, though. It's open world is more there to contextualize the story than to be enjoyed divorced from the story.
Every damn GTA game i played.
Was me just roaming the world.
For hours and hours.
Story is def NOT the main thing in gta.
It's the most immersive open world game for a reason.
Why else do you think Gta5 is still in monthly best selling lists?

And that gta online is such a cash cow?
Story?
Haha no the main star in gta is the world.
Not the story.
 
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Zaffo

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That's the case for games in general.

I can give you many examples.
That's the case for most triple A games, i can give you thousand of examples of games that are all about the gameplay and might even come without a story, so what gives?
 

DForce

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That's the case for most triple A games, i can give you thousand of examples of games that are all about the gameplay and might even come without a story, so what gives?
If you consider last of us lacking gameplay and too laser focused on gameplay, then you have to put all the games that I list in the same category.

But no, you're not willing to do that.
 
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Bryank75

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There is lots of games nowadays that go for the cinematic presentation over solid gameplay, that's not a Sony "exclusive", nevertheless Sony first party output since the ps3 days is laser focused on the premium presentation side of the spectrum.
The "false statement" about the gameplay is your own sacred opinion, noone is going to take it away from you, but you should also consider that users who enjoy scenarios with more complex end deep gameplay, might find what games like GoW or Uncharted have to offer lacking.
For heavens sake someone in here actually draw a comparison between God of War and games like DMC and Bayonetta, making it sound like the latter ones are button mashers :messenger_face_screaming:
Who would do such a thing? Damn them!
 

Tekkenfan

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Why we cannot call the game which mainly designed with the story been center of it and then do gameplay around that center : "movie game"?
All the gameplay loop is designed just for story, thats way been called story driven games by the maker itself and usually once you done it once, you done with it forever.
And yes this not just for Sony western first party games but almost all AAA western single player games these days.
So MGS, Silent Hill, Zelda and Basiclly every JRPG ever? So much hypocrisy in your post.
Again it seems this whole war against PlayStation's 1st party and especially Naughty Dog's games boils down to "Japan is based they design sexy characters and even though they have just as many cutscenes as the West they are fun REAL games"
"West is bad they make movie games and ugly characters and 90% cutscenes and 10% boring OTS action"
 

Shifty

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Just about every single player campaign is story focused.
I disagree. Look at Nintendo franchises- Mario and Zelda have been coasting with 'save the princess' since the NES, and Metroid is all about the solitary exploration with 'aliens bad' as a backing.

Call of Duty is all about clicking on the men until they die with a military movie in the background to facilitate it. Gears, as I mentioned before, is the same. You buy it for the shooting and get a reasonably entertaining ride to go along with it.

And character action games like DMC and Bayonetta have stories that are actually half decent, but ultimately secondary to the cool stuff the player does between cutscenes.

What I'm not saying is how Gears and Halo more gameplay heavy than the Last of Us. I've seen no argument or good examples other than people just saying, "It just is."

I compared games and they offer similar structures, but people still fail to prove how TLOU is somehow different.
I mean where TLoU is concerned, I'd take the first game's shooting mechanics as my prime example. They're purposefully floaty and hard to use because that makes sense for a character trying to fight off hordes of fungal zombies and hostile survivors: It's a high-pressure situation that would cause someone's hands to shake.

But floaty aiming isn't particularly fun as a game mechanic. It's a concession for the sake of story and immersion, which attempts to create fun by putting you in the character's shoes rather than by making the shooting feel really good to do on a gamepad. It's that school of design which I would characterize as focusing on story over gameplay.

Take RE2 Remake as a counterexample- the game shares some elements with TLoU in its undead enemies, limited resources and ammo crafting mechanic, and it uses a campaign to drive the story.

But unlike TLoU, the gameplay in RE2 never takes a backseat to the storytelling. Characters aim and shoot with pinpoint accuracy given enough time for the reticle to focus, so the game balances that with erratic enemy movement and tight level design. The focus is less on fighting your character's nerves, and more about fighting your own nerves while being good at aiming and spacing in a cramped environment. Wasted bullets and lost health happen because you fucked up, not because the aiming mechanic itself is trying to make you miss for the sake of added tension.

So where TLoU represents its themes by designing core mechanics that serve immersion and ground you in its world, RE2 does that by building a tight gameplay core and designing encounters that test it in specific ways. Story on one side, gameplay on the other.

Ultimately the interactive movie / walking simulator thing is a meme, but much like a stereotype or caricature it's not without some kind of basis. Sony have gone big on games that put their storytelling first this gen, so folks are having fun with the idea.

Seems like fair game if people are intent on continuing the ever-farcical console war tbh :messenger_winking:

They've shown and talked about the larger game arenas in TLOU 2. Even going as far to say in a new interview they're trying to avoid the open world trap where the story loses urgency because you can just do some random other thing. It was hard to believe my son mattered in Fallout 4 while I'm building settlements and planting crops. Though what Druckman said about emphasizing the urgency of certain story points does lend itself to what you're saying he's saying it BECAUSE of the openness of the game and positing it as a solution to that dissonance created when you aren't paying attention to something urgent because you're in a game and don't have to.


Did you mean to quote a different post?
 
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D_Dark

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Uncharted games break their own rules *for* the player. Evidence can be found on Mother's basements video of Uncharted. God of War 4 is considered an improvement over the original games because of story not gameplay, not because of the poorly managed camera, the atrocious repetitive enemy designs. Evidence on Mathewmatosis God of War video. No, it's the cutscenes, dialogs and story that elevates it above.

Halo puts it's gameplay at the forefront. A compilation of Halo cutscenes against Uncharted or God of War's cutscnes should put the ps games ahead. And let's not forget the forced walking segments. Every single game from this gen has forced walking sections.

Sony does make outliers though, Horizon Zero Dawn is the outlier. But, it is also the most derivative soulless game I've played in a long while. No sense on geography, writing is an atrocious teenage garbage, lore is good, don't confuse lore with story please. Loot system was shit, not enough weapon variety, repetitive encounters. No physics on grass, fckn Alloy's legs clipping through grass.

Ah! yea. Sony games are shit.
 
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ROMhack

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This doesn't bother me personally as they do typically make sure the player has some control on the game as it happens. I think I'll always prefer cutscenes though because you can actually tell a proper story and give better context that way. For example, the prison scenes in Uncharted IV.

If anything about modern game design annoys me it's the growing number of games which insist on having a character having a conversation whilst engaging in a huge action set-piece. It's a Western thing generally but has been in a few Japanese games recently. For example, Astral Chain.

Thats usually how western developers make their game for most part. For game like Astral Chain developers mostly focus on gameplay of you controlling two character at once and then story came afterwards.
I don't think you'll agree but see second paragraph above. Would love to know your thoughts :)
 
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Bathtub Fart

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I think the criticism comes more from a sentiment that Sony exclusives would be better as movies. Most games I've played feel like the game is hindering their vision and holds it back. If I start to feel like that in a game I'll usually stop playing it and watch it as a movie via a Let's Play.
 

Tekkenfan

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I disagree. Look at Nintendo franchises- Mario and Zelda have been coasting with 'save the princess' since the NES, and Metroid is all about the solitary exploration with 'aliens bad' as a backing
BS if Zelda had no story focus then why is the opening 1-2 hours of Twilight Princess filled with it?
I hate people who dismiss FPS ad point and the enemy die games, it's a gross simplification and an insult to any game designer, Doom 2 is still one of the GOAT and is still fun to this day.
 
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Bryank75

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Uncharted games break their own rules *for* the player. Evidence can be found on Mother's basements video of Uncharted. God of War 4 is considered an improvement over the original games because of story not gameplay, not because of the poorly managed camera, the atrocious repetitive enemy designs. Evidence on Mathewmatosis God of War video. No, it's the cutscenes, dialogs and story that elevates it above.

Halo puts it's gameplay at the forefront. A compilation of Halo cutscenes against Uncharted or God of War's cutscnes should put the ps games ahead. And let's not forget the forced walking segments. Every single game from this gen has forced walking sections.

Sony does make outliers though, Horizon Zero Dawn is the outlier. But, it is also the most derivative soulless game I've played in a long while. No sense on geography, writing is an atrocious teenage garbage, lore is good, don't confuse lore with story please. Loot system was shit, not enough weapon variety, repetitive encounters. No physics on grass, fckn Alloy's legs clipping through grass.

Ah! yea. Sony games are shit.
Same writer as The Witcher... but you must think that Witcher 3 is great!

No mention of Spider-man...... cause I mean that would mean SSOD would be impicated.

No mention of Bloodborne cause that would be against your narrative.

Camera???? Have you played Sekiro... still a fantastic game but it has way more camera issues.

Uncharted is a game based on the PULP genre, it is meant to suspend reality to let you win in dramatic fashion.

Halo hasn't been good since Bungie left, they were the magic, not the brand. Sorry but it's the hard truth.

'No physics on grass' lol...just stop.
 

Danjin44

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This doesn't bother me personally as they do typically make sure the player has some control on the game as it happens. I think I'll always prefer cutscenes though because you can actually tell a proper story and give better context that way. For example, the prison scenes in Uncharted IV.

If anything about modern game design annoys me it's the growing number of games which insist on having a character having a conversation whilst engaging in a huge action set-piece. It's a Western thing generally but has been in a few Japanese games recently. For example, Astral Chain.



I don't think you'll agree but see second paragraph above. Would love to know your thoughts :)
Are you talking about other characters talking while you are fighting enemies? That usually problem when have Japanese voices I can't read subtitles why busy fighting.
 

D_Dark

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No mention of Bloodborne cause that would be against your narrative.
Because it's outsourced, not made by Sony owned studio.

Same writer as The Witcher... but you must think that Witcher 3 is great!
Wasn't the lead there, and Witcher 3 writing is fine even though the overall story and a bunch of plot points fell off towards the end.

Camera???? Have you played Sekiro... still a fantastic game but it has way more camera issues.
It's not just an issue, it's the fact that the game needs three different indicators to tell you of an enemies position so you can fight properly is pathetic.

Agreed on Halo. But that wasn't the point of the argument.

Uncharted is a game based on the PULP genre, it is meant to suspend reality to let you win in dramatic fashion.
You can still do that without breaking rules. Tomb Raider 2013 & Rise don't break any rules they set and they work fine infact better.

'No physics on grass' lol...just stop.
Highlights the lack of care, clipping on grass is something that shouldn't be happening this gen considering it wasn't happening last gen. Priority is pretty pictures and not an immersive dynamic world.

You seem to not put any effort in thinking about the game. Fine you like the game, but don't be dismissing my complaints like they are nothing.

And No. Just because other games have faults doesn't excuse your game for having them. Having them worse.
 
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Bryank75

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I disagree. Look at Nintendo franchises- Mario and Zelda have been coasting with 'save the princess' since the NES, and Metroid is all about the solitary exploration with 'aliens bad' as a backing.

Call of Duty is all about clicking on the men until they die with a military movie in the background to facilitate it. Gears, as I mentioned before, is the same. You buy it for the shooting and get a reasonably entertaining ride to go along with it.

And character action games like DMC and Bayonetta have stories that are actually half decent, but ultimately secondary to the cool stuff the player does between cutscenes.


I mean where TLoU is concerned, I'd take the first game's shooting mechanics as my prime example. They're purposefully floaty and hard to use because that makes sense for a character trying to fight off hordes of fungal zombies and hostile survivors: It's a high-pressure situation that would cause someone's hands to shake.

But floaty aiming isn't particularly fun as a game mechanic. It's a concession for the sake of story and immersion, which attempts to create fun by putting you in the character's shoes rather than by making the shooting feel really good to do on a gamepad. It's that school of design which I would characterize as focusing on story over gameplay.

Take RE2 Remake as a counterexample- the game shares some elements with TLoU in its undead enemies, limited resources and ammo crafting mechanic, and it uses a campaign to drive the story.

But unlike TLoU, the gameplay in RE2 never takes a backseat to the storytelling. Characters aim and shoot with pinpoint accuracy given enough time for the reticle to focus, so the game balances that with erratic enemy movement and tight level design. The focus is less on fighting your character's nerves, and more about fighting your own nerves while being good at aiming and spacing in a cramped environment. Wasted bullets and lost health happen because you fucked up, not because the aiming mechanic itself is trying to make you miss for the sake of added tension.

So where TLoU represents its themes by designing core mechanics that serve immersion and ground you in its world, RE2 does that by building a tight gameplay core and designing encounters that test it in specific ways. Story on one side, gameplay on the other.

Ultimately the interactive movie / walking simulator thing is a meme, but much like a stereotype or caricature it's not without some kind of basis. Sony have gone big on games that put their storytelling first this gen, so folks are having fun with the idea.

Seems like fair game if people are intent on continuing the ever-farcical console war tbh :messenger_winking:




Did you mean to quote a different post?
Trained policeman vs a teen and a survivor with limited experience with guns. It makes sense.

But I mean, you must love the pinpoint accuracy of Uncharted.... oh no, there is another problem with that gameplay.... what is it now?

All of the PlayStation games are very different from Studio to studio and to use these broad strokes is pathetic.
You might as well call the whole industry shit and give up on gaming. I mean I really like the Witcher 3 and the gameplay was just about passable, I'd rate even mediocre PS games miles ahead of it in play-ability.
 

DForce

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I disagree. Look at Nintendo franchises- Mario and Zelda have been coasting with 'save the princess' since the NES, and Metroid is all about the solitary exploration with 'aliens bad' as a backing.

Call of Duty is all about clicking on the men until they die with a military movie in the background to facilitate it. Gears, as I mentioned before, is the same. You buy it for the shooting and get a reasonably entertaining ride to go along with it.

And character action games like DMC and Bayonetta have stories that are actually half decent, but ultimately secondary to the cool stuff the player does between cutscenes.
Why does link go to the past?

Where is link going on his journey?

Why is Samus go to planet Zebes?


They don't make these worlds just for the purpose of having a player just play the level, it's generally a story behind it.

This doesn't happen all the time, but that's generally how art is made.

I mean where TLoU is concerned, I'd take the first game's shooting mechanics as my prime example. They're purposefully floaty and hard to use because that makes sense for a character trying to fight off hordes of fungal zombies and hostile survivors: It's a high-pressure situation that would cause someone's hands to shake.

But floaty aiming isn't particularly fun as a game mechanic. It's a concession for the sake of story and immersion, which attempts to create fun by putting you in the character's shoes rather than by making the shooting feel really good to do on a gamepad. It's that school of design which I would characterize as focusing on story over gameplay.
The mechanic is design to be realistic. If it were not "floaty" then it would be much easier to aim your shot at an enemy. I would totally hate this during multiplayer because many guns would appear broken.

This can be be sightly changed when you upgrade your weapon or sway through singleplayer\multiplayer, though.

ut unlike TLoU, the gameplay in RE2 never takes a backseat to the storytelling. Characters aim and shoot with pinpoint accuracy given enough time for the reticle to focus, so the game balances that with erratic enemy movement and tight level design. The focus is less on fighting your character's nerves, and more about fighting your own nerves while being good at aiming and spacing in a cramped environment. Wasted bullets and lost health happen because you fucked up, not because the aiming mechanic itself is trying to make you miss for the sake of added tension.

So where TLoU represents its themes by designing core mechanics that serve immersion and ground you in its world, RE2 does that by building a tight gameplay core and designing encounters that test it in specific ways. Story on one side, gameplay on the other.

Ultimately the 'walking simulator' thing is a meme, but much like a stereotype or caricature it's not without some kind of basis. Sony have gone big on games that put their storytelling first this gen, so folks are having fun with the idea.

Seems like fair game if people are intent on continuing the ever-farcical console war tbh
Yes, your hand doesn't wobble in RE2, but your accuracy changes after every shot. The corsair gets bigger after a single shot of the handgun, which make it harder to have complete accuracy after every shot.

I grew up playing games like Counter Strike and controlling your aim was key and it kept players from running, and gunning people down at a high rate. It actually took some skill to engage in battle.

That's just me personally though.
 

ROMhack

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Are you talking about other characters talking while you are fighting enemies? That usually problem when have Japanese voices I can't read subtitles why busy fighting.
Yep that. I usually have English voices on myself but they always talk at a normal, room volume level.

I desperately want them to emote like they're in battle because it kinda breaks the tone.
 
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Stuart360

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Story campaigns have had cutscenes for like 15 years now, some of them with long cutscenes. As more of a single player gamer these days, i love them. I would of bought most of them if i had a PS4.
From what i have seen, its not the story heavy campaigns people have a problem with, but more that a lot of Sony's games are like the same game with a new coat of paint.
I think thats a genuine problem some people have with PS4 exclusives, although like i said i would probably of bought all of them if i had a PS4.
 

Bryank75

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Because it's outsourced, not made by Sony owned studio.


Wasn't the lead there, and Witcher 3 writing is fine even though the overall story and a bunch of plot points fell off towards the end.


It's not just an issue, it's the fact that the game needs three different indicators to tell you of an enemies position so you can fight properly is pathetic.

Agreed on Halo. But that wasn't the point of the argument.


You can still do that without breaking rules. Tomb Raider 2013 & Rise don't break any rules they set and they work fine infact better.


Highlights the lack of care, clipping on grass is something that shouldn't be happening this gen considering it wasn't happening last gen. Priority is pretty pictures and not an immersive dynamic world.

You seem to not put any effort in thinking about the game. Fine you like the game, but don't be dismissing my complaints like they are nothing.

And No. Just because other games have faults doesn't excuse your game for having them. Having them worse.
Sounds like you are amplifying the problems simply because they are on a platform you don't like.
Several game of the years, beating Rockstar twice... once with TLOU and again with GOW shows that these games are at the pinnacle of the art.
I don't see this level of nitpicking with GTA, RDR, Witcher, Souls or any other multiplat and that is the point.... it's all just nitpicking.

'oh, I don't like indicators' therefore it's a bad game!

I couldn't even hold myself to get through Tomb Raider, so I don't think it did anything better, the bow was a poor mans TLOU bow.


The entire Souls series was created out of a joint Sony and From project and again Bloodborne was an evolution of that.

The main point is they are all very different studios and very different games, the only thread that connects them is that they make PS exclusives and that is why they are attacked. I think it must be admitted.

The hate for Sony is strong.
 

Danjin44

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Yep that. I usually have English voices on myself but they always talk at a normal, room volume level.

I desperately want them to emote like they're in battle because it kinda breaks the tone.
I somewhat agree with that, especially when you have epic battle music on, while other characters talking like they are not middle of the battle.
 
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There is more to it, obviously. But I didn't really want to write a master's thesis in a forum post.

Take your example of Doom '16 or Half Life 2. The level structure is almost identical to the Uncharted formula. But the reason it never feels like an "interactive movie", is because control is never taken away from the player. Even during story segments. You are always playing and not watching.

The word "Playing" being paramount to a "Game".

I also want to point out that calling a game an "Interactive movie" isn't an insult or a bad thing. It's just to point out that some games rely more on the player watching and experiencing a story, than traditional 100% gameplay. It's also fine that some people like it and some don't.
Obviously people don't have to like, hate, or care at all for the games labelled "interactive movies". But I honestly don't think the label makes any sense, I owned a Sega CD back in the days, so I am well too aware of actual interactive movies type games.

Games like uncharted, god of war, the last of us, etc. All have their main hooks in gameplay, just like Doom 2016 and Half-Life etc. Having a 2 to 3 minutes cut scene from time to time doesn't make a game a movie anymore than long loading time (where you don't control the character either). Doom has a couple of instances where you don't control either, they are there stricly for exposition as well, they literally serve no purpose other than telling you "why" you have to risk your life getting to the next marker on the map.

In halflife (all of them as far as I can remember) will lock you in a room to immerse you in the story, I am fairly sure that jumping around in these important times doesn't do anything good for immersion in their world, I say this as a huge fan of the series.

Last time I played a COD game (sp) or a battle field game (so) they both had the same structure, most open world titles (all those I know of anyway) reproduce it in one way or another as well, this is in their case why I hate modern open world games, they put too much efforts controlling the player in the sand box.
 

Blade2.0

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It's called interactive entertainment. But no, I'd say Asura's Wrath has been the most interactive movie a game has ever been, and besides until dawn (which wanted to be like something like grim Fandango) none of Sony's other properties are anywhere near that kind of level of hands off gameplay mechanics. A toddler could beat Asura's wrath with enough trying. But I'd like to see that toddler kill the valkryie in GoW.
 
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Mochilador

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The "prestige" cinematic games definitely are more "movies" than games. Just look at any of the behind the scenes stuff and how they're more proud about the time spend int the motion capture volume than the gameplay. Walk down a corridor with an over-the-shoulder camera, in between cutscenes that are so long that they make your controller idle out and shutoff.

You can't lump stuff like Witcher, GTA5, Horizon, Days Gone into that since they're open world games that don't fall into the linear corridor trap the other stuff does. (I would've included RDR2 there but it's just boring most of the time).
Fucking nailed it. Some devs treat their games like movies and don't even talk about gameplay.
Instead of talking about gameplay changes, they talk about how emotional was the cut scene that they made it.
 

sol_bad

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It's a game with a focus on the Hollywood story with very basic gameplay concepts disguised with animation techniques to make it more flashy.
If TLOU is basic, wtf is Manhunt and Splintercell? Baby games? Your sentence is said in a negative light.

They been made with the same design principle :
- Thinking "What story we will tell in this game" first and foremost
- And design the gameplay only to accommodate that story
- So this kind of games usually have a shallow or serviceable gameplay which just to serve to bridge between cutscenes
- There are several exception like: Kojima's games as the gameplay aspect have a same portion as the story but for western AAA dev usually thats it
I think I would prefer a game to be designed around a story, it's characters and the world it's set in. If you have a strong story, characters and world, you have a basis to build your game play mechanics from. I'd rather that than a game designed by committee and upper management where they design game play mechanics for maximum monetary gain.

And why do people keep saying things like "basic came play" as if to prove the games are designed to be movies. Platformers have the simplest and most basic game play out there but are still loved and have no negative thoughts towards them.

Do people really want to call Uncharted 4 cinematic with basic game play and in the same breath mention Gears of War 5? Really?
Correct me if I am wrong but doesn't Gears 5 still rely on a flat plane for combat? There is no elevation to the combat arenas right? And even if there is elevation all you can do is look down at your enemies and shoot them? Does Gear 5 have a stealth system that is implemented into the core game play or is it separate "stealth sections". If stealth is in the core loop, if you get spotted stealth killing an enemy do the enemies stay alert until they are all dead or do they return to a passive state if you hide long enough?
Uncharted 4 is designed with elevation and stealth mind, nearly every combat arena gives you the ability to take advantage of these 2 concepts. You could draw an enemies attention to one side of a building and then circle the opposite direction for a stealth take down. If you are in an elevated position you can either shoot an enemy to give away your position, jump at them for a melee take down or you can climb down quietly for a stealth take down. If you get spotted you can run away and hide until they go back to patrolling. You can use your rope to swing to a better position, you can shoot and melee attack from your rope. The game really does give you a lot of creative freedom in how to tackle each combat arena, much more than duck behind cover and shoot or draw attention with robot.
 
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Klayzer

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Be kind to the salty fanboys people, they've had a rough last few years, and the next 12 months are going to be agony as Sony has an embarrassment of riches left to release.

You're arguing with people who want to tell you that several multi-million selling, many time GOTY winning (not just nominees, but winners) titles are not "real" games... their assertions start off flying in the face of historical fact and they have no persuasive argument to prop up their contrarianism with
I like and buy Xbox products, but the diehards on this board are living in absolute fantasy world. It seems to causes them physical pain when Sony's exclusives are being discussed.
 
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Story campaigns have had cutscenes for like 15 years now, some of them with long cutscenes. As more of a single player gamer these days, i love them. I would of bought most of them if i had a PS4.
From what i have seen, its not the story heavy campaigns people have a problem with, but more that a lot of Sony's games are like the same game with a new coat of paint.
I think thats a genuine problem some people have with PS4 exclusives, although like i said i would probably of bought all of them if i had a PS4.
Video game cut-scenes are older than 2004 lol.

 
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Klayzer

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It's funny how when Detroit went to PC there was a frenzy to play it and loads of positivity.

Again recently when PSNow went to PC, the same people were tripping over themselves saying how great GOW was and that the service was brilliant and had no lag.

I mean there is so much bias behind these hyperbolic statement s that they are impossible to take seriously and are just an annoyance and negative distraction from gaming actually progressing in a positive way.
Its reverse trolling to strike back for Xbox games going to pc. Now any PS4 games announced for PSNow will have the obligatory "I don't have buy a PS4 to play its games anymore" from the well known anti-Sony crowd on this board.
 
Aug 28, 2019
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Its reverse trolling to strike back for Xbox games going to pc. Now any PS4 games announced for PSNow will have the obligatory "I don't have buy a PS4 to play its games anymore" from the well known anti-Sony crowd on this board.
It's a weird troll considering you're streaming them at 720p. I wish Sony 1st party titles really went to PC tbh.
 
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