PS4 PRO 4K native games (will update the list everytime there is a new game)

Exactly this. It's extremely misleading advertising that led them to believe X1S is more powerful and can play 4K games.

Edit:
Maybe I should create a blog that keeps track of this sort of stuff more universally. Just lack the time to keep it updated.
I don't think it's misleading at all, even on these forums we had people overstating the importance of the UHD drive in the XB1-S, a console game that hardly does 720p 60fps and it's pretty much a 900p console at 30fps, as if media was ever more important than games on a console... Anybody who failed to understand the primary virtues of a games console should not be buying one in the first place. UHD drive, HDR, 4k streaming in no way implies 4k gaming. All you have to do is read......

I think sometimes people just have to learn to read, you don't need to be a tech guy to understand that XB1-S won't do 4k games, if he was not clear he should have asked like anybody buying a new product. I'm sure the kid had friends with the system too or he would have seen one at bestbuy etc...and know for sure the console does not do 4k. At this point, I just don't see how anyone can be fooled into buying something like XB1-S thinking it's a 4k games console. I'm sorry, the blame is on the buyer here.....
 
I don't think it's misleading at all, even on these forums we had people overstating the importance of the UHD drive in the XB1-S, a console game that hardly does 720p 60fps and it's pretty much a 900p console at 30fps, as if media was ever more important than games on a console... Anybody who failed to understand the primary virtues of a games console should not be buying one in the first place. UHD drive, HDR, 4k streaming in no way implies 4k gaming. All you have to do is read......

I think sometimes people just have to learn to read, you don't need to be a tech guy to understand that XB1-S won't do 4k games, if he was not clear he should have asked like anybody buying a new product. I'm sure the kid had friends with the system too or he would have seen one at bestbuy etc...and know for sure the console does not do 4k. At this point, I just don't see how anyone can be fooled into buying something like XB1-S thinking it's a 4k games console. I'm sorry, the blame is on the buyer here.....
Agree wholeheartedly. And you're correct people don't fucking read, they never read, trust me because of my job I'd know. MS wasn't fooling anyone and it was all pretty plain and simple.
 
Exactly this. It's extremely misleading advertising that led them to believe X1S is more powerful and can play 4K games.

Edit:
Maybe I should create a blog that keeps track of this sort of stuff more universally. Just lack the time to keep it updated.
The thing that also confuses people is that people think XB1S 4k upscaling is the same as PS4 Pro upscaling when it's entirely different.
That's why Sony should call it uprendering instead to clear the confusion that it's not the traditional stretching upscaling
 
The upscaling of the PS4 Pro isn't really any different from the Xbox One S. The point is, the Pro needs way less of it, because the true picture is much closer to the final size, up to no scaling required at all.

Checkerboard isn't upscaling, it is a clever technology to almost cut rendering cost in half, allowing to target higher resolution than would be possible without, up to full 4K. It has only very subtle negative effects and is much better than rendering half the resolution and scaling it up.

The One (S) can do it, too, it does so with Rainbow 6 Siege to reach 1080p (AFAIK), but unlike the Pro it does that only with software, while the Pro has extra Hardware dedicated to speed up this process and others.
 
Farming Simulator 17 received a Pro patch, including native 4K among other modes. Here is the official developer's statement in German, but there is a twofoldly shocking translation from a banned-from-GAF site:
PS4 Pro players are able to chose from three different settings for Farming Simulator 17. The first is Ultra HD, which displays the game in 4K. Next it is HD, which only has a resolution of 1080p, but has a framerate of 60 fps with improved draw distance. Finally there is Quad HD, which runs 60 fps at a resolution of 1440p.
Options are nice. :]
 
Even rendering a single polygon with a basic texture at a higher resolution yields dramatically different results than rendering at a lower resolution and upscaling. The edges of the polygon will be much cleaner rendered at 4K with little or no visible aliasing in motion.

Try drawing a triangle on graph paper by filling in complete squares inside a 3x3 grid. Now do it again in a 6x6 grid. That's the difference between 1080p and 4K. Upscaling would just stretch or smear the 3x3 grid representation across the larger area, not produce cleaner diagonal edges.
Thanks for this explanation, makes sense.
 
And another one with zero supersampling on 1080p displays. :(

In fact, it has not a single benefit for 1080p Pro users over the base PS4. It runs absolutely the same, frame by frame, pixel by pixel, while it could offer 4xSSAA without any performance hit. It's such a terrible shame, but that is for another thread.
 
- Diablo III: Reaper of Souls - Ultimate Evil Edition (Native 4K (dynamic resolution: 2160p in normal scenes, 1080p in heavy scenes)@60FPS / improved ambient occlusion + enhanced bloom)
But it's just not true! 2160p is only happening in certain very calm areas without monsters. In normal scenes, it runs around 1800p to 1700p. It's great, but not "native 4K".
 
Well Bound is also on the list... Though personally I don't think they qualify for Native 4k.
Agreed.
Bound is basically rendered in 1080p 8xMSAA, which is resolved into 4k 2xMSAA.

Definition of native currently pretty much means a opaque and main lighting pass done in target resolution. (Rasterization of geometry and shading.)
If we would add transparency or secondary lighting fx to definition, very few games would fit, even on PC.

This will become more interesting as rendering tech will evolve. (variable resolution, texture space shading etc.)
 
Agreed.
Bound is basically rendered in 1080p 8xMSAA, which is resolved into 4k 2xMSAA.

Definition of native currently pretty much means a opaque and main lighting pass done in target resolution. (Rasterization of geometry and shading.)
If we would add transparency or secondary lighting fx to definition, very few games would fit, even on PC.

This will become more interesting as rendering tech will evolve. (variable resolution, texture space shading etc.)
If they were able to achieve that much MSAA they have enough resources to pull off native 4k, alternatively they opted for it this way instead which gives results like a native 4k would or more and fitting what the devs wanted for their design choices.
 
If they were able to achieve that much MSAA they have enough resources to pull off native 4k, alternatively they opted for it this way instead which gives results like a native 4k would or more and fitting what the devs wanted for their design choices.
8xMSAA is cheap when compared to quadrupling texturing/shading in framebuffer which would be the cost of the 4x pixel count. (depends a lot on case, but I wouldn't be surprised if it costs up to twice as much.)

Bound has a lot of very low frequency surfaces and lot of cubes and edges, it made sense for the game instead of ~1600p and upscale, which might have been similar in terms of cost.
 
Playing TLOU on my new 4K TV in 60fps mode and I was sure this had to be native 4K. Image was perfect with just a tiny & rare hint of shimmering at some distant complex visuals. I mean, you have to be looking for it. And I can't see any pixels at all with exception of microscopic pixel step on a distant electrical wire but again, you really have to look for it.

I read now that it's actually 1800p in 60fps mode so, pretty high, but not native 4K.
Playing it in 30fps mode and it's native 4K but I see no difference in pixel crawl or general image quality (shadows are smoother tho). And 60fps mode is anyhows way, way preferable due to smoothnes/temporal-resolution.

4K resolution should be more than good enough until 2030+ or so when we have more computer power then what we know to do with it.
 
That's just about what Digital Foundry have said all along, 4K is high enough to allow for some compromises while still looking superb. But it surely depends on screen size and viewing distance.