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PS5 exclusives drove me to buy Xbox Series X — here’s why

Thirty7ven

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Where are these articles but Xbox to PlayStation? From Xbox 1, 360, Xbox One to now, where are they?
 

MonarchJT

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Total addressable market for netflix is over an order of magnitude larger than it is for console+PC games. Right now it's 18million subscribers on Gamepass (many of whom are using those $1 for 3 monhs trials like me) versus 203 million on Netflix.



It's not hard to calculate how unsustainable Gamepass currently is.

Microsoft just bought Zenimax/Bethesda for $7.5B.
At the same time they now have to pay the salaries, hardware and software license renewals, rents, etc. for all the 2300 employees working on those studios. And then on Microsoft's own studios there are another ~450 people working at 343 Industries, 200 on Coalition, 200 on Obsidian, 120 on Ninja Theory, 200 on Rare, 100 on Forza's Turn 10, 200 on Playground and around 300 distributed by their smaller studios like Double Fine.
So head count on Microsoft's XBox Games Studios totals around 4000 employees.

At an average of ~125K/year per employee (and I'm probably being super generous here), Microsoft now has around ~$500M / year of expenditure. Plus the money they need to spend on marketing all the games that are made, which in movies usually amounts to 50% of production costs but let's be generous and assume it's only 33%, so total expenditure on all of Microsoft's game development is ~$750M/year.


On the 18M subscriptions of Gamepass at $120/year, that renders them $2.1B/year. Take away the $750M/year they need to spend on 1st-party games and they get $1.35B/year.
If all that Gamepass had to offer were 1st party exclusives (that they "offer" on day one so few people actually buy those games), then they would go without making money on Gamepass for over 5 years.


But Gamepass doesn't just offer 1st party games. So now we need to subtract all the money they spend on the 3rd party exclusives which are actually the bulk of the 200 games that are included on the service (over 160 from what I see). Some games have to be expensive to keep on Gamepass, like ARK, Control, Outer Worlds, No Man's Sky, etc.
How much to we think each of these games are costing Microsoft every year to "offer" on the Gamepass subscription? Average $0.5 / year per Gamepass client (more if it's a AAA, less for Indies I imagine)? So $9M per title on 160 titles, that alone is $1.4B/year.

So on their current price scheme, Gamepass is making $2.1B/year on subscriptions. Take away $750M/year on 1st parties and $1.4B /year on Gamepass 3rd parties, and the service is losing $100M / year. And this is right after they invested $7.5B in Zenimax, are probably subsidizing every 9th gen console being sold and had to pay hundreds of millions on their R&D.



There's just no way Gamepass is sustainable, and increasing the number of subscribers will most probably increase the money they need to spend on including 3rd party games in the service. The only way for Gamepass to become a sustainable business is if they tier the offerings and charge a lot more money for the premium titles than they do now.
The point is gamepass will grow at least x2.5 x3 times this gen do the same calculation with 5/6b budget and you will get it
If it fails to grow fast on the other hand it will fail miserably
 
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Gods&Monsters

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May 11, 2018
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I've been on this forum for a couple months now (though I glanced at the site a lot longer).

Anytime I see an xbox praise threads, the thread turns nasty pretty quickly from a particular subset of gamers. When it's a PS praise thread... Everyone applauds and pats eachother on the back.

It's really depressing that to have a decent chat/debate/criticism about xbox without fanboy wars.... Your limited to the main xbox thread.

Welcome to GAF, if your not a Sony fanboy then get ready to be treated like shit.

Your also not allowed to say anything bad about Playstation or you get banned
Playstation cant have any critism
If you praise Xbox then prepare for a swarm of bellends to come in
This is 100% not true. I own all the consoles and all the services besides PSNow and I can guarantee you that Xbox fans are the most aggressive of them all. They have this huge persecution complex against Sony and it distorts their world view. Everything is an attack for them. Your post and Mr Xbox is just another proof of this.

I'm a lifelong Xbox owner and I don't know where it went wrong for them. Like a cult and you can't reason with them. They all repeat each other. It's scary.

And you see plenty of shit against Sony and their "cinematic" games and the 70$ price even in this thread. Just open your eyes and it's everywhere. Victim complex at work again.
 
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Gods&Monsters

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May 11, 2018
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Why doesn't the same argument pop up for ps+ and the collection. As far as I'm aware, if you stop your sub you lose access to all those games.

I constantly hear this argument used against gamepass but people have no issue with it for ps+, ps collection, and things like Spotify, Netflix, disney+ etc. Just seems rather odd that across other platforms and media there's no issue but 90% of Sony fans are dead against gamepass because 'I don't like renting'. I can guarantee that these people have media subs for other things.
Not really, once you redeem them on PS+ they stay on your account forever so if you resubscribe in 3 months they will still be there. It's like Gold but the games are way better and it's only 30$ or less a year on Cdkeys. I still have all my games from Ps3 and Vita that I can play at my own pace whenever I want.

With Gamepass, some games leave the service before you're done and then you're stuck buying it. Might as well just buy it for cheap. I don't see value in that so I don't bother starting games there (the 20% off is a joke when you can get it at 60% off elsewhere).
 
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FritzJ92

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You'll get accused of lying by saying people are switching bc of gamepass. Exact same thing happened to me on here for saying I'm switching. They even said I created a fake account just to try and garner sales on neogaf for MS.
IDK people only want to see through one lense... GamePass is the most successful gaming subscription service... MANY others have tried and started before SM, and haven't even gotten close to what GamePass has achieved... its a good deal, especially for an adult like myself that wants to play a lot of games, but never get the time to commit 20-30 hours into one game. I love that I can play a lot of different games based on my mood, and know that i didn't spend a lot of money on them.
 

FritzJ92

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This is 100% not true. I own all the consoles and all the services besides PSNow and I can guarantee you that Xbox fans are the most aggressive of them all. They have this huge persecution complex against Sony and it distorts their world view. Everything is an attack for them. Your post and Mr Xbox is just another proof of this.

I'm a lifelong Xbox owner and I don't know where it went wrong for them. Like a cult and you can't reason for them. They all repeat each other. It's scary.

And you see plenty of shit against Sony and their "cinematic" games and the 70$ price even in this thread. Just open your eyes and it's everywhere. Victim complex at work again.
I dont engage in console wars here, but this is definitely the pot calling the kettle black... need I remind you how much BS was spread before the launch of the PS5 by Sony fans?
 

Krisprolls

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IDK people only want to see through one lense... GamePass is the most successful gaming subscription service... MANY others have tried and started before SM, and haven't even gotten close to what GamePass has achieved... its a good deal, especially for an adult like myself that wants to play a lot of games, but never get the time to commit 20-30 hours into one game. I love that I can play a lot of different games based on my mood, and know that i didn't spend a lot of money on them.

They have achieved zero with Game Pass until now. They're just starting the service, it's the first phase where you bleed money and try to add as many subscribers as possible. We'll only know if they're successful in a few years from now. Anybody can have 20 million subscribers when subscriptions are basically free like they were for xbox Live Gold subscribers (well, it was $1 iirc).

I'd say Playstation Now is a better subscription service, if only because it has great Sony games and not mostly 70 metacritic rated games like the competition.

Don't get mistaken by browsing only US gaming forums : very few people care about Xbox or Game Pass outside the US, one country in the world among 200 (a major one though, for sure). Here in Europe, everybody only talks about Playstation or sometimes Nintendo.
 
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FritzJ92

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They have achieved zero with Game Pass until now. They're just starting the service, it's the first phase where you bleed money and try to add as many subscribers as possible. We'll only know if they're successful in a few years from now. Anybody can have 20 million subscribers when subscriptions are basically free like they were for xbox Live Gold subscribers.

I'd say Playstation Now is a better subscription service, if only because it has great Sony games and not mostly 70 metacritic rated fillers like the competition.

Don't get mistaken by browsing only US gaming forums, as a brand, Xbox is still last place and nobody cares about it outside the US, one country in the world among 200. Here in Europe, nobody cares about Game Pass, everybody only talks about Playstation or sometimes Nintendo.
Thanks for your anecdotal evidence which doesn't mean anything.
If anybody can get 20 million subscribers please explain why [insert every gaming subscription company] doesn't have 20 million subscribers.

Here, in this thread is an article of someone who is predominantly playing on their Xbox when they were/are a PS5 fanboy because of GamePass, and yet you boldly claim that it hasn't achieved anything... take the fanboy lenses off, you've said nothing but opinion, and personal statements, I appreciate your input, but don't ignore the facts.
 

Krisprolls

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If anybody can get 20 million subscribers please explain why [insert every gaming subscription company] doesn't have 20 million subscribers.

Here, in this thread is an article of someone who is predominantly playing on their Xbox when they were/are a PS5 fanboy because of GamePass, and yet you boldly claim that it hasn't achieved anything... take the fanboy lenses off, you've said nothing but opinion, and personal statements, I appreciate your input, but don't ignore the facts.

The answer is "Because they didn't give it for free" obviously... If Netflix was $1 they'd have tons more subscribers.

Giving things for free isn't an achievement. They spent money, that's what they do right now, and that's what they should do in this first phase. It worked with Netflix, and failed with a lot of subscription models. We'll know in a few years if they're successful, when subscription price will be a lot higher than $1 and they'll try to be hugely profitable, because just being slightly profitable will never be acceptable for MS when they earn so much money elsewhere. You'll be the one who pays for this huge profit, don't forget that.

I already said I thought Game Pass was a nice option for casual gamers (who don't care about playing a specific game) or for people who lack money. I used to be a PC subscriber by the way...

For all the other people, I don't think a subscription model is great : gaming is cheap overall, you just prefer playing the games you want when you want, the best games usually. And they're not on Game Pass.
 
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FritzJ92

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The answer is "Because they didn't give it for free" obviously... If Netflix was $1 they'd have tons more subscribers.

Giving things for free isn't an achievement. They spent money, that's what they do right now, and that's what they should do in this first phase. It worked with Netflix, and failed with a lot of subscription models. We'll know in a few years if they're successful, when subscription price will be a lot higher than $1 and they'll try to be hugely profitable, because just being slightly profitable will never be acceptable for MS when they earn so much money elsewhere. You'll be the one who pays for this huge profit, don't forget that.

I already said I thought Game Pass was a nice option for casual gamers (who don't care about playing a specific game) or for people who lack money. I used to be a PC subscriber by the way...

For all the other people, I don't think a subscription model is great : gaming is cheap overall, you just prefer playing the games you want when you want, the best games usually. And they're not on Game Pass.
GamePass isn't a dollar, and when people say that its pretty much my key to exit the conversation. Let me know when I can get it for a dollar.
 
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Hatsuma

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What I'm at loss on, is that a lot of the industry is heading towards $70 games. You already have examples of this via 3rd party. CoD and NBA 2k21 are already there. And sold fantastically. As the generation goes along and more publishers release exclusively to PS5 and Series, $70 is going to be here. Do you think GTA 6 will only be $60?

What always confuses me about the GP argument against Playstation, and this is majority to blame on Sony, is that the only only advertised advantage of GP over Now is day and date first party. Otherwise they are two similar services offering older titles in bulk.
 
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I'd imagine almost everyone that posts on this forum has all of the consoles. All three of them offer unique things, which I think is great. If you don't see the benefit of Gamepass, Sony's boundary-pushing exclusives, and Nintendo's portable versatility, you're being willfully ignorant.
 
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mxbison

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$70 isn't even much considering all the content you get nowadays in games. Most of them are actually way too long.

People are so fucking entitled.
 

MonarchJT

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They have achieved zero with Game Pass until now. They're just starting the service, it's the first phase where you bleed money and try to add as many subscribers as possible. We'll only know if they're successful in a few years from now. Anybody can have 20 million subscribers when subscriptions are basically free like they were for xbox Live Gold subscribers (well, it was $1 iirc).

I'd say Playstation Now is a better subscription service, if only because it has great Sony games and not mostly 70 metacritic rated games like the competition.

Don't get mistaken by browsing only US gaming forums : very few people care about Xbox or Game Pass outside the US, one country in the world among 200 (a major one though, for sure). Here in Europe, everybody only talks about Playstation or sometimes Nintendo.
absolutely wrong. basically on all point. Pc users and xbox users know very well the service also outside the US. Psnow is practically ignored by the Playstation usersbase itself, the service launched in 2014, today have around 2.2m users on a base of 114m of ps4 console (we should add ps5 to that) at the same time Gamepass launch was in 2017-end of 2019 on pc, today have 18+m (should be 20+m as we talking) on a base of around 50m console (we should add series consoles to that) . It doesn't take a degree to understand that what people enjoying and what not. The urban legend on the 1 $ usersbase will sooner or later disappear, making posts like your milestones in some acceptance of gamepass success.

But don't worry i'm sure smarter sony is seeing gamepass success and moving about it. Soon as we are already seeing many more exclusives will be released on pc and I expect a marketing re-launch ( or even better a complete rebrand) of Psnow very much more like GP than it is now, all of this during the ps5 gen. It's just a matter of time. And finally with Sony will be the last step before the acceptance by all of such a service and above all on economic feasibility of it.
 
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As long as Sony makes game of the year after game of the year while MS releases 70 rated games, they will be able to ask for more money and Xbox will stay in last place.

It's not about quantity, it's about quality, we don't have time to play Game Pass filler. And I don't think we need a daily Game Pass reminder thread from the usual suspects, we know about Game Pass after the 100th thread, thanks.

People usually prefer Sony games, it's time to deal with it.
This comment hasn't aged well.
Destruction AllStars is rated 63 on metacritic
 

Verydeadpool

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Funny u say this looks like I'll never buy an Xbox after playing on ps5. And I can't wait for VR ps5

Ms just buzz word company's that they buy and expect people to jump in afraid that dose does not work for me not after playing last of us 2 ghosts of Tashima and god of war and Astro bot and I can't wait to see what the other are up to.

Halo seems to be the biggest game coming to Xbox and maybe an exclusive Skyrim game but tbh those games have had their days now make something new. And don't say the new game coming from Tom remember he hyped up fallout 76 FFS guys a joke.

Got a great few years ahead of us on ps5 and then the new VR and naughty dog are up to something no doubt will be spectacular
 

Loope

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This is 100% not true. I own all the consoles and all the services besides PSNow and I can guarantee you that Xbox fans are the most aggressive of them all. They have this huge persecution complex against Sony and it distorts their world view. Everything is an attack for them. Your post and Mr Xbox is just another proof of this.

I'm a lifelong Xbox owner and I don't know where it went wrong for them. Like a cult and you can't reason for them. They all repeat each other. It's scary.

And you see plenty of shit against Sony and their "cinematic" games and the 70$ price even in this thread. Just open your eyes and it's everywhere. Victim complex at work again.
That's just a lie. I only own a pc. Call it what you want, there isn't a single thread about xbox and nintendo that isn't trampled on the very first pages. Just check the one about BOTW and another one of these articles (which, granted, are stupid.)
 
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This is 100% not true. I own all the consoles and all the services besides PSNow and I can guarantee you that Xbox fans are the most aggressive of them all. They have this huge persecution complex against Sony and it distorts their world view. Everything is an attack for them. Your post and Mr Xbox is just another proof of this.

I'm a lifelong Xbox owner and I don't know where it went wrong for them. Like a cult and you can't reason for them. They all repeat each other. It's scary.

And you see plenty of shit against Sony and their "cinematic" games and the 70$ price even in this thread. Just open your eyes and it's everywhere. Victim complex at work again.

This is one of the best.


Surprised that he was active till middle of the last year
 

Rheon

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Kind of weird how all these articles about switching from PS5 to XSX keep popping up and it's never the other way around.

Smells like shill marketing, but that's just me.
 

Loope

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Where are these articles but Xbox to PlayStation? From Xbox 1, 360, Xbox One to now, where are they?
People already moved on the previous generation? I'm not being funny, the Xone/PS4 generation i suppose, many of the market share MS won with the X360 shifted again to Sony.
 

Soodanim

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Kind of weird how all these articles about switching from PS5 to XSX keep popping up and it's never the other way around.

Smells like shill marketing, but that's just me.
These articles are hardly world breaking, but at least there’s some sort of reasoning behind it. If you want to go with the narrative that Sony are ‘winning’, there’s not going to be much to an article titled “I switched from Xbox to PS5, here’s why” with the article being “It’s better”.
Not really, once you redeem them on PS+ they stay on your account forever so if you resubscribe in 3 months they will still be there. It's like Gold but the games are way better and it's only 30$ or less a year on Cdkeys. I still have all my games from Ps3 and Vita that I can play at my own pace whenever I want.

With Gamepass, some games leave the service before you're done and then you're stuck buying it. Might as well just buy it for cheap. I don't see value in that so I don't bother starting games there (the 20% off is a joke when you can get it at 60% off elsewhere).
I always assumed Gamepass did it the same way as PS+. That’s disappointing. I always loved the PS+ approach when I had a sub on PS3, and there were plenty of games i only got round to long after they weren’t the active game.

I don’t know if Gamepass has a wider selection or not, but it is a minus of the service.
 

Thirty7ven

Sony make cringe trainers.
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People already moved on the previous generation? I'm not being funny, the Xone/PS4 generation i suppose, many of the market share MS won with the X360 shifted again to Sony.

The market is the market, but I’m talking marketing, you know, the one that rhymes with ka-ching!
 

Loope

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The market is the market, but I’m talking marketing, you know, the one that rhymes with ka-ching!
I know, but what i'm saying is that there isn't many people doing the opposite articles because i would suppose many are already on Sony environment. This is just one or two guys saying they like Gamepass, but do it in a way that reeks of platform wars. If they did an article with a headline: "Why Sony exclusives made me move from xbox to sony", people would just think that it's normal, there isn't a big shift.

Anyway, this kind of articles are stupid, if i already own a PS5, why not complement it, instead of just leave it all behind? It makes no sense.
 

turtlepowa

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These articles are hardly world breaking, but at least there’s some sort of reasoning behind it. If you want to go with the narrative that Sony are ‘winning’, there’s not going to be much to an article titled “I switched from Xbox to PS5, here’s why” with the article being “It’s better”.

I always assumed Gamepass did it the same way as PS+. That’s disappointing. I always loved the PS+ approach when I had a sub on PS3, and there were plenty of games i only got round to long after they weren’t the active game.

I don’t know if Gamepass has a wider selection or not, but it is a minus of the service.
As far as i know Microsoft games stay forever in it and they announce very early when games leave. I don't have a problem with that. If there is a game that i really like, i will just play it in time. It's not like they only stay 1 month, they are usually there for several months. And with games rotating there is always something interesting in there.
 

FrankWza

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If anybody can get 20 million subscribers please explain why [insert every gaming subscription company] doesn't have 20 million subscribers.
Because they charge a premium for their service. When it’s given away with ps plus and every first party game is promised day one you would see a jump pretty quickly. Again though, gp I s built on a promise. The gold price hike is a sign of that. By the time all these free subs are up there will be a premium cost as you’ll see some first party games come out for x.
GamePass isn't a dollar, and when people say that its pretty much my key to exit the conversation. Let me know when I can get it for a dollar.
You’re leaving because it’s true and it puts everything into perspective. All you have to do is prepay gold which is pretty much a necessity. There’s probably about 5 or 6 other deals happening at any given time. Unless you don’t want to use the multiplayer components of forza, gears and halo or half the games available on gp? Or you can look in the x ot. Everyone there is always sharing deals ;)
Do you think Microsoft was going to raise the price of gold for no reason? Hahaha
 

Bojanglez

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Right now Gamepass is decent, no denying it. But let's not get giddy, it is mostly full of Indies and older B-tier games, I like this because I like to play those kind of games occasionally. I think PS Now is probably as good of a deal as Gamepass right now in terms of the quality of experiences it offers for the price you pay. However, if you are the latest and greatest games then you simply have to buy them, because MS doesn't (yet) provide first party games at a cadence and quality that allows them to be mentioned as part of any Gamepass value.

I see their plan though and if the price remains the same and the games start to come then great, I'll be even happier, but I'll still end up buying £70 games from other publishers on other platforms if they are of good enough quality (which they often are).
 

FritzJ92

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$70 isn't even much considering all the content you get nowadays in games. Most of them are actually way too long.

People are so fucking entitled.
For US its not alot, but many countries als incurred a spike and its pretty high in some countries.
 

sainraja

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This is 100% not true. I own all the consoles and all the services besides PSNow and I can guarantee you that Xbox fans are the most aggressive of them all. They have this huge persecution complex against Sony and it distorts their world view. Everything is an attack for them. Your post and Mr Xbox is just another proof of this.

I'm a lifelong Xbox owner and I don't know where it went wrong for them. Like a cult and you can't reason for them. They all repeat each other. It's scary.

And you see plenty of shit against Sony and their "cinematic" games and the 70$ price even in this thread. Just open your eyes and it's everywhere. Victim complex at work again.
Yeah, I think the Xbox only people are definitely the more aggressive of them all.
 
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FritzJ92

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Because they charge a premium for their service. When it’s given away with ps plus and every first party game is promised day one you would see a jump pretty quickly. Again though, gp I s built on a promise. The gold price hike is a sign of that. By the time all these free subs are up there will be a premium cost as you’ll see some first party games come out for x.

You’re leaving because it’s true and it puts everything into perspective. All you have to do is prepay gold which is pretty much a necessity. There’s probably about 5 or 6 other deals happening at any given time. Unless you don’t want to use the multiplayer components of forza, gears and halo or half the games available on gp? Or you can look in the x ot. Everyone there is always sharing deals ;)
Do you think Microsoft was going to raise the price of gold for no reason? Hahaha
1. So MS has a jump in subscribers because they are offering a better service right now, its pretty much what you said.
2. No I'm not going back and forth with that logic. MS offered a trial of GamePass for $1. Sony offered a free week of PSNow, I've tried it twice for free. Are you saying PSNow would have more subscribers if Sony trial was 3 weeks longer and was $1 more?
Also, if you have to "Prepay Gold," how the heck are you still spending only a dollar? (This is why I don't engage when someone says the $1 comment).
 
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Il Comodino

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so you dont like shooters, racers, adventure games, fligh sims, wrpgs etc. What games excite you? What games are “relevant”...asking out of interest
I didn't say I don't like those game categories, I said I don't like those titles.
 

Umbral

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Do you want to tell us about all of the other bad decisions you’ve made?
 
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FrankWza

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1. So MS has a jump in subscribers because they are offering a better service right now, its pretty much what you said.
2. No I'm not going back and forth with that logic. MS offered a trial of GamePass for $1. Sony offered a free week of PSNow, I've tried it twice for free. Are you saying PSNow would have more subscribers if Sony trial was 3 weeks longer and was $1 more?
Also, if you have to "Prepay Gold," how the heck are you still spending only a dollar? (This is why I don't engage when someone says the $1 comment).
1. No, they subbed because of the discount. And it’s a promise of a better service. WHEN exclusives begin trickling in. At that point, these 3 year for $1 subs are up and you’ll have to sub at the new price. I said, if Sony put out the same service and offered all their exclusives day one and you could add 3 years to your ps plus for $1 you would see a similar or probably greater jump. Since Sony has exclusives. They actually have more exclusives being delayed this year than Microsoft announced at all.
2. You’re getting an Xbox without gold? Hmm...I wonder how many people who own an Xbox don’t want to play multiplayer? I wonder why Microsoft buckled under the pressure after they doubled the price ? Was it the cries of a few, or many?
 
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Bernkastel

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Total addressable market for netflix is over an order of magnitude larger than it is for console+PC games. Right now it's 18million subscribers on Gamepass (many of whom are using those $1 for 3 monhs trials like me) versus 203 million on Netflix.



It's not hard to calculate how unsustainable Gamepass currently is.

Microsoft just bought Zenimax/Bethesda for $7.5B.
At the same time they now have to pay the salaries, hardware and software license renewals, rents, etc. for all the 2300 employees working on those studios. And then on Microsoft's own studios there are another ~450 people working at 343 Industries, 200 on Coalition, 200 on Obsidian, 120 on Ninja Theory, 200 on Rare, 100 on Forza's Turn 10, 200 on Playground and around 300 distributed by their smaller studios like Double Fine.
So head count on Microsoft's XBox Games Studios totals around 4000 employees.

At an average of ~125K/year per employee (and I'm probably being super generous here), Microsoft now has around ~$500M / year of expenditure. Plus the money they need to spend on marketing all the games that are made, which in movies usually amounts to 50% of production costs but let's be generous and assume it's only 33%, so total expenditure on all of Microsoft's game development is ~$750M/year.


On the 18M subscriptions of Gamepass at $120/year, that renders them $2.1B/year. Take away the $750M/year they need to spend on 1st-party games and they get $1.35B/year.
If all that Gamepass had to offer were 1st party exclusives (that they "offer" on day one so few people actually buy those games), then they would go without making money on Gamepass for over 5 years.


But Gamepass doesn't just offer 1st party games. So now we need to subtract all the money they spend on the 3rd party exclusives which are actually the bulk of the 200 games that are included on the service (over 160 from what I see). Some games have to be expensive to keep on Gamepass, like ARK, Control, Outer Worlds, No Man's Sky, etc.
How much to we think each of these games are costing Microsoft every year to "offer" on the Gamepass subscription? Average $0.5 / year per Gamepass client (more if it's a AAA, less for Indies I imagine)? So $9M per title on 160 titles, that alone is $1.4B/year.

So on their current price scheme, Gamepass is making $2.1B/year on subscriptions. Take away $750M/year on 1st parties and $1.4B /year on Gamepass 3rd parties, and the service is losing $100M / year. And this is right after they invested $7.5B in Zenimax, are probably subsidizing every 9th gen console being sold and had to pay hundreds of millions on their R&D.



There's just no way Gamepass is sustainable, and increasing the number of subscribers will most probably increase the money they need to spend on including 3rd party games in the service. The only way for Gamepass to become a sustainable business is if they tier the offerings and charge a lot more money for the premium titles than they do now.
You talk like those games are exclusive to Game Pass and there is no other way to get them. Bethesda alone can make all their money back from PC sales alone. Also, Xbox division makes 12 billion a year. Unlike Netflix, they don't get all their money from one subscription. They bought Github for 7.5 billion and LinkedIn for 26 billion, and still not desperate to "get money back". These are assets that they own and will help them in the long run.
 

Bernkastel

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Kind of weird how all these articles about switching from PS5 to XSX keep popping up and it's never the other way around.

Smells like shill marketing, but that's just me.
Actually there are more articles on them then why someone prefers Xbox. And we make threads out of them too.
 

ToTTenTranz

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You talk like those games are exclusive to Game Pass and there is no other way to get them. Bethesda alone can make all their money back from PC sales alone.
They can a long as not that many people pay for the service. Do you expect to have a lot of people paying for gamepass and buying the bethesda games at the same time?
Or do you think gamepass PC users won't get bethesda games?
 
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Termite

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People seem upset by this, but I'm the exact same as the guy in the OP. I live in NA now but my PS account is european and I can't stomach 80 euros for the first party games I want. It's just robbery. It's over $95 UDS (which is what I get paid in).

So I'm going to get an XSX instead. I already got gamepass for $160 for 3 years and have been using it on my laptop - it's great. The second I can find an XSX I'm on that too. As I never had an XB1 there's a ton of games I missed out on, and the back-compat is great.

In two years when a bunch of the Sony exclusives are half-price I'll pick up a PS5. But I can't justify it right now vs the price of getting an XSX. And this is coming from someone who spent over 4,000 euros on the PS4 over the past 7 years. However even then I almost never paid 70 euros for a game - even that was pushing it. There comes a breaking point, and 80 euros for a single game is it for me.
 

NickFire

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People seem upset by this, but I'm the exact same as the guy in the OP. I live in NA now but my PS account is european and I can't stomach 80 euros for the first party games I want. It's just robbery. It's over $95 UDS (which is what I get paid in).

So I'm going to get an XSX instead. I already got gamepass for $160 for 3 years and have been using it on my laptop - it's great. The second I can find an XSX I'm on that too. As I never had an XB1 there's a ton of games I missed out on, and the back-compat is great.

In two years when a bunch of the Sony exclusives are half-price I'll pick up a PS5. But I can't justify it right now vs the price of getting an XSX. And this is coming from someone who spent over 4,000 euros on the PS4 over the past 7 years. However even then I almost never paid 70 euros for a game - even that was pushing it. There comes a breaking point, and 80 euros for a single game is it for me.
I think the framing is the issue. If the framing was I like Series X better because I don't want to buy games, people would be less jumpy. But its framed instead as PS5 exclusives do, which is pure click bait and getting the intended reaction.
 

Termite

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I think the framing is the issue. If the framing was I like Series X better because I don't want to buy games, people would be less jumpy. But its framed instead as PS5 exclusives do, which is pure click bait and getting the intended reaction.
Oh, the title is pure bullshit, yeah... but in this clickbait era I barely read titles any more lol. I didn't even notice it.

PS exclusives are the best in the industry, imo. They're just too damn expensive on release day.

And it's not about not wanting to buy games, it's about not wanting to buy at the prices in the UK / EU when the competition (Nintendo AND MS) have way more affordable options.
 
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Hobbygaming

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Game pass is the greatest thing to happen to gaming. Whether you know it now or fight resistance until you finally cave. It's pretty inevitable.
The greatest thing to happen to gaming IMO is 3D. Gamepass never clicked with me
 

Bernkastel

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They can a long as not that many people pay for the service. Do you expect to have a lot of people paying for gamepass and buying the bethesda games at the same time?
Or do you think gamepass PC users won't get bethesda games?
So you expect Game Pass numbers to stay the same down but actual sales will become negligible?
Right now Game Pass actually boosts sales, Gears 5 sold more than 4. More people get to try out a game and then buy it. Things don't stay in Game Pass permanently like Netflix so most people actually buy games they liked. There is no Game Pass on Steam, and PC sales alone can make profit for Bethesda. There has been no trend to of game sells going down due to Game Pass. Game Pass PC has its audience but that never impacted sells.
If Game Pass gains enough subs that they make as much or even more profit alone, that they already made without it, then I don't know what is the problem.
I am pretty sure the guys at Microsoft are smarter and know how to run business better than some guy on the internet who thinks they will only make a fifth of the revenue they had through 18 million Game Pass subs only(and suddenly every other form of revenue disappears).
Xbox Game Studios can sustain Bethesda on its own with their current revenue even if no one buys Bethesda games. Actvision Blizzard has 9000+ employees and they still make less than Xbox Game Studios.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Video_game_publisher
 
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Hobbygaming

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I have gamepass too, mine sucks full of old games. You must have extra special gamepass.
I don't know if you're joking or not but this was my experience with Gamepass. The games I was interested in I'd already owned and then there's the whole inevitable change of quality that'll come

I also prefer owning physical discs
 

ToTTenTranz

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So you expect Game Pass numbers to stay the same down but actual sales will become negligible?
Right now Game Pass actually boosts sales, Gears 5 sold more than 4.
This is wrong info and data shows the exact opposite of your claims. Gears 4 sold almost 5x more than Gears 5, and Gears 3 before it sold 20x (twenty times) more.

Gears 5 was the most played Gears ever thanks to Gamepass, and at the same time its sales were terrible thanks to Gamepass.
As analyst Daniel Ahmad notes, Gears of War 4 sold 4.5 times better in its launch week, and Gears of War 3 – at the height of the Xbox 360’s success and before digital distribution was a major factor – sold 20 times better.

The moment a xbox+PC game goes into gamepass at release date, its sales numbers are as good as gone.
You can also check how bad the Gears 5 sales were on the PC by looking at its Steam numbers of concurrent players. I doubt the game sold more than 75K units on Steam, and on the Microsoft Store it might be one tenth of that.

It happened Gears 5, it will happen to all of Microsoft's 1st party games. Bethesda titles included.
There's no eating the cake and keeping it too.

Gamepass in its current form isn't sustainable, much less with Microsoft offering 3 months of it for 1€ which is how I already got 6 months of the subscription.
I think the sooner people realize they won't get this free meal forever, the better.
Microsoft won't deserve the hate they'll get when they inevitably need to change their pricing structure for Gamepass.
 
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The Hamburglar

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This is wrong info and data shows the exact opposite of your claims. Gears 4 sold almost 5x more than Gears 5, and Gears 3 before it sold 20x (twenty times) more.

Gears 5 was the most played Gears ever thanks to Gamepass, and at the same time its sales were terrible thanks to Gamepass.


The moment a xbox+PC game goes into gamepass at release date, its sales numbers are as good as gone.
You can also check how bad the Gears 5 sales were on the PC by looking at its Steam numbers of concurrent players. I doubt the game sold more than 75K units on Steam, and on the Microsoft Store it might be one tenth of that.

It happened Gears 5, it will happen to all of Microsoft's 1st party games. Bethesda titles included.
There's no eating the cake and keeping it too.

Gamepass in its current form isn't sustainable, much less with Microsoft offering 3 months of it for 1€ which is how I already got 6 months of the subscription.
I think the sooner people realize they won't get this free meal forever, the better.
Microsoft won't deserve the hate they'll get when they inevitably need to change their pricing structure for Gamepass.

Many websites that track game sales reported it sold terribly. And you could grab game pass for 1$ when gears 5 launched.

The game sold poorly and without game pass it still would have sold less than gears 4z
 

assurdum

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They are always Sony fanboy but when a new generation starts became punctually Xbox fanboy. Said that is not like you are forced to buy exclusive at launch. They are incredibly cheap if you waiting a bit for the PSN plus discounts, so I really don't get some argumentations. But sure if you prefer a rent service to have all the games at launch cheaply, take it. Just hope they will never touch from the catalogue some of your favourite games because you can't have it back. I never been a great fan of rent subscription models.
 
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